@Wormkid_64: I'm not condoning blocking used games from consoles. The way the companies go about trying to stop piracy and used-game sales is not the right way - and in most cases only makes the situation worse. But I'm also not going to condone something that's screwing up the industry. There should be something similar to PC games: Retailers won't buy/sell used copies, but gamers are still able to sell them directly to other gamers. That way your "rights" are intact and buy new copies is the industry standard. And finally, yes the companies are providing a service to their customers. But people who buy used games or get pirated copies are NOT customers. If you aren't paying for a service that isn't free you aren't a customer and the company has a right to stop you from stealing their product. Oh, and there are many products out there that have disclaimers on them saying: "not to be resold etc etc" - so this isn't just unique to console games.

@Wormkid_64: The hundreds of developers that have closed over the last 5+ years begs to differ. Just because some companies manage to make a bucket load of money doesn't mean all do. And you can't argue that they make better quality games - just look at CoD. It's practically the same game every year just like all those sports titles that are still floating around. It doesn't come down to the quality of the game - it comes down to how much the companies are willing to screw over the consumers, and how willing the consumer is to let themselves be screwed over. As for "must have day one" - you do realise that used games are available day one or day two. If not by then there will be more used copies by the end of the week. This is why there is such an emphasis on pre-purchasing games - so that consumers don't go to the store during th first week and happen to find a used copy for cheaper.

@SadPSPAddict: You were asking for differences between used cars and used games. Your last post basically answered that for yourself. If you "know exactly what games you want" wouldn't that remove the need to sell games you have, but don't like - since you should already know whether you like the game before you buy it - going by that logic. Buying used isn't always a good thing. You wouldn't buy second-hand toilet paper. But your point seems to be that people should have a right to sell their material goods. I somewhat agree - but not if it is detrimental to the industry those goods belong to. Anyway, what about PC games? Retailers won't buy them and you can't buy used copies. People don't seem to have a problem with that.

But you could also say that DLC is a way to make money off used/pirated games and as an incentive to buy new copies (DLC might not work with pirated copies). Games not working properly on release is because the game is rushed out. This happens for a number of reasons: - Publishers force a date for the game to be released and will release it then regardless of how finished the game is. The company knows the game will sell well regardless of how well it works. And will only patch it when it starts effecting their profits. - The company is running out of funds and need to release the game so they can start earning money - and in the meantime they can be fixing/finishing the game. All these can be tied back to the gamers/users: - Some customers will buy the game regardless. - Some "customers" pirated or bought used copies of a previous game meaning the developers have a smaller budget for the next game. -

@Ted_Breakfast: I'm not saying that prices would instantly drop if people stopped buying used or pirated games. But it's reasonable to say that prices are high in the first place as a result of it. That is not the only reason of course - but it does contribute. I can honestly say that I have never seen a used game sell for anything close to what I have gotten for my used games. During my time in Australia I have never gotten more than $15 for a used game, yet I have never seen a used game sell for less than triple that price. When I was living in England I sold a bunch of games all in perfect condition, yet the highest I got for any of the games was a few pounds. Not sure about the prices of used games in England but I can guess they sell for more than a tenner (or at the very least 5 quid). That's still a huge profit the retailer is making. I personally never buy used games (for a number of reasons), and I have only ever sold games as trade-ins for new games (and even then I felt I was being ripped off).

@SadPSPAddict: When you buy a car you keep it for a while (at least a year would be a reasonable estimate). So when a new car comes out the people who want those cars will have to buy a brand new one or wait a few YEARS until used copies become available. With games - during the first WEEK after a game is released a single copy of a game could have been sold to several people, but the developers/publishers only made money off the first sale. The people who bought that copy second-hand were potential customers for buying brand new. The difference is that car manufacturers are going to make a bigger profit from new sales than what games companies are, so the used sales don't matter as much. Those same car companies could also charge for repairs and insurance etc - just imagine game devs charging for a game fixing patch. Yes, there are people on here claiming that they only bought a game because it was used, and then went on to buy new copies of future games. But you are more likely to find that people are going to buy a new copy of a game, but see a cheaper version next to it so end up getting that used copy.

@WCK619: Customer, Gamer, User, whatever you want to call it. If gamers weren't pirating games or buying used copies then gaming companies wouldn't have a need to introduce all these things in an attempt to get people to buy new. Yes, the companies are going about it wrong, but they wouldn't need to go about it in any way if it wasn't for the gamer or retailers screwing them over.

@saboys: But then the price of used games would go up since the retailers rely on those sales to keep them in business. In Australia the price of a used game is almost as high as the price of a new game. In fact, the price of a used game in Aus is more expensive than a new game in the US. And Americans think they're the ones getting screw. Pah!

@killa32130: It's both the companies and the customers. For example: You start off with people pirating a game; The game doesn't earn enough money so the companies increase the price; some people can't afford it and other are just too greedy to pay the increased amount so we end up with more people pirating or buy cheaper copies (second-hand). It's a vicious cycle and both parties involved only keep making it worse by their actions. For example: People pirate a game so the companies introduce DRM which then leads to potential customers downloading a hack DRM-free copy. You could blame the companies for using the DRM or you could blame the users for pirating it in the first place. Most people on here are putting the blame on the companies. I'm just trying to point out that customers are just as guilty.

@TroubleMaker411: Agreed - a lot of games aren't worth the price of the disc they are printed on. A lot of the times it's just poor game-making and yes, the developer should learn one way or another that they need to put out quality products if they want to stay afloat. But it could be argued that because developers are only making money in the first few months after release (thanks to used-game sales taking up the market-share after that point), companies are having to rush out their next title in order to keep the company in business. Not all companies are like that - because they earn enough from one game to support the development of another game. Blizzard for example. WoW alone could support the developers while they take their time developing Diablo, Starcraft and other titles. It's not all the customers fault and it's not all the companies fault. They're both to blame but the way each side handles things is only making things worse.