Dragon Age Origins is so grossly overrated its not even funny (series spoilers)

Why do fanboys hold this game to high standards? Its far from the 9.5, Gamespot gave it.

Inconsistant writing, cliched two dimesnional characters that may be clones of other bioware characters, horrible art design,unfocused plot, one of the most cliched and generic plots in existance, unbalanced combat system, and it no way progresses the genre.

If this is what RPG elitists truly wanted, than I move on.

Lets talk story. This is one of, if not the most generic, WRPG stories. Its basically Lord of the Rings with gore and a bad attitude. Unlike Mass Effect and Jade Empire, which had more inspired plots and universes, DAO's is generic fantasy tripe. Kill the orcs who want to burn everything. And unlike the more intellegent Reapers of ME, there is really no substance to the Darkspawn until Awakenings. Nothing...all they want to do is kill and burn. Then enter Loghain, an idiotic and poorly written villian....his motives are so idiotic and unrealistic its not even funny. Yeah, lets betray the king when he has a chance to win...then take power and concentrate on a entity thats not a threat than the one that is one, while killing the ones that can stop the threat. No where near Jon Irenicus or Master Li quality...Bioware villians that were actually well written. Then the typical Bioware midgame, the 4 planets/locations section, is even more unfocused than past Bioware games. Unlike KOTOR and ME1, which you can see the main conflict in all the planets you go to, in DAO, the midgame is divorced from the main plot other than the plot coupons you get for completing the quests. Some plotlines are great, the elves vs werewolves quest was well done...then you have the dwarven quest...a long borefest into the deep roads with a very underdeveloped conflict between two dwarven nobles.

The characters are pretty poor as well. Leliana is an excellent character however, and she is by far the most three dimensional character of the cast. I am glad she will play a very important role in the future. Wynne and Shale were great too, and Morrigan could be better in later installments, however, the rest of the cast is so one dimensional its not even funny. They are also clones of other Bioware characters. How is Oghren not like Black Whirlwind? How is Zervan not an elven HK-47? Alistair is like Carth and Kaiden...the goody male lead. As much as I like Leliana, she is very similiar to Dawn Star. Then there is the approval/disapproval system that does not work. If they dissprove of an action, don't bring them in the party. And lets not forget how divorced they are from the plot...as only Alistair and Morrigan play key roles in the plot. also, their depth is wasted. Its basically "wanna hear about my past?" instead of being involved in a characters story like KOTOR, or ME2, or DAII.

The gameplay is also busted. Sure there is a lot of "depth"...but there is a lot of garbage and unbalance. There are way too many trash skills and abilities, and way too many overpowered abilities. And the Mage is way overpowered to a point where it is boring to play the other classes. Then there is the "I win" skills...Mana Clash is basically saying "die" to a spellcaster and they die, well most of them...it will devestate a boss however. So much for enemy spellcasters, usually the most dangerous enemies in the game. In Awakenings, there are instant kill skills making the game even more unbalanced. The fights are mostly boring as well...so much for tactics if all the fights are the same, especially in the long slogs of the Mage Tower and the Deep Roads. The Fade section is extremely atrocious. The highlight of DAO's combat is the boss fights, or the more unique fights (same with DAII).

I would actually rank DAO and DAII the same.....highly flawed Bioware games that do not hold a candle to the past classics. In fact, DAO and Baldur's Gate II should not be used in the same sentence. DAO is no where near the greatness that is BGII, and each BGII clone produced only ensures that BGII will not be surpassed. However, I actually enjoyed DAII more. Why? Because it was willing to take risks and not play it safe. It was willing to tell a very unconventional and complex story and actually push boundaries with the dialogue, personality,and friendship/rivalry system. Instead of being Origins II, it did its own thing. It is also FAR better written than DAOand had more complex, more three dimensional characters that do not rely on strict personalities. DAII was rushed out the door and was 6 months too early. The world design was atrocious and still kept the unbalance flaws of DAO (but now for the 2H warrior).

The problem with DAO is it plays it safe, unlike better games such as The Witcher and NWN2: Mask of the Betrayer, which not only had great storyteling, but was willing to take risks and be unique. Its also amazing how those games that came out two years prior LOOK better than DAO. And they ARE better.

tl;dr but going by the title it was better than the second story wise and combat wise

Yet you act like ME series is the god of RPGS. When it also has clich story and samy character personalites from other games. I can understand you not liking DAO but jeez dude relax.

Not really. Dragon Age Origins is one of the best RPGs of the decade. A nice mix between the classic and the modern. Dragon Age 2 is pure unadulterated trash. And it's funny that you mention KOTOR and ME considering they are the weakest Bioware games, besides every Bioware game follows the same structures and cliches if you get past the different settings.

tl;dr but going by the title it was better than the second story wise and combat wise

TheEpicGoat

I love your threads

TL;DR version anyone?navyguy21

man, i say overrated and underrated topics should be banned, their soooo redudant, look everything is going to be overrated to someone and underrated to someone else. You didn't like dragon age origins, alright i get it, but still this is suited for a blog and not system wars because your talking about ONE game and not SYSTEMS. The mods need to get on their hustle and stop these blog suited topics. I come here to be entertained by system fanboys and fanatics.

Yet you act like ME series is the god of RPGS. When it also has clich story and samy character personalites from other games. I can understand you not liking DAO but jeez dude relax.

finalfantasy94

Not really. Dragon Age Origins is one of the best RPGs of the decade. A nice mix between the classic and the modern. Dragon Age 2 is pure unadulterated trash.ampiva

The problem with DAO is it plays it safe, unlike better games such as The Witcher and NWN2: Mask of the Betrayer, which not only had great storyteling, but was willing to take risks and be unique. Its also amazing how those games that came out two years prior LOOK better than DAO. And they ARE better.

Well that's a cool opinion you have there.

But I disagree. DA:O probably the best RPG I've played in the past 10 or so years.

No duh? There's a reason why people call Bioware games waifu simulators, you know... The only reason that people hold Dragon Age: Origins above Dragon Age 2 is because the romanceable companions were actually appealing. Only a paedophile would have liked Merril or Tali-loving biodrones, Isabela was ulgy as sin, Anders was a douchebag in the end, and Fernis was just okay.

You're right about one thing, Baldurs gate is far better than Origins. The rest I don't agree with, especially with DA2 even being ON PAR with Origins. HoolaHoopMan

[QUOTE="navyguy21"]TL;DR version anyone?Vaasman

The problem with DAO is it plays it safe, unlike better games such as The Witcher and NWN2: Mask of the Betrayer, which not only had great storyteling, but was willing to take risks and be unique. Its also amazing how those games that came out two years prior LOOK better than DAO. And they ARE better.

First time playing DA:O = OMG THIS GAME IS SO FREAKIN' AWESOME!

1/4th of the way done = Still pretty cool!

2/4th of the way done = Ok this really isn't that fun

3/4ths of the way done = Ok this is just getting f'ing ridiculous

Finally finished = OMG I STILL HAVE AWAKENINGS TO PLAY. NOOOOO!!!...hey this isn't as bad.

Plays DA2 demo = WTF IS THIS S***.

Started out great, ended up being a boring PoS.

TL;DR version anyone?navyguy21

[QUOTE="Vaasman"]

[QUOTE="navyguy21"]TC is a Bioware employee.

navyguy21

No duh? There's a reason why people call Bioware games waifu simulators, you know... The only reason that people hold Dragon Age: Origins above Dragon Age 2 is because the romanceable companions were actually appealing. Only a paedophile would have liked Merril or Tali-loving biodrones, Isabela was ulgy as sin, Anders was a douchebag in the end, and Fernis was just okay.

DerpyMcDerp

Just because Bioware has a reasonably unhealthy following, that in no way makes these games romance simulators.

Origins is a fun game but I would agree that the story is very cliche. Leliana is a terrible character, however. I was disappointed to see her return in DA2. Either way, both Dragon Age games pale in comparison to Baldur's Gate 2, or even Icewind Dale, or Planescape Torment. They're better than the Neverwinter Nights games, however.DJ_Lae

[QUOTE="navyguy21"][QUOTE="Vaasman"]Oh ok, that kind of thread huh?Vaasman

No duh? There's a reason why people call Bioware games waifu simulators, you know... The only reason that people hold Dragon Age: Origins above Dragon Age 2 is because the romanceable companions were actually appealing. Only a paedophile would have liked Merril or Tali-loving biodrones, Isabela was ulgy as sin, Anders was a douchebag in the end, and Fernis was just okay.

DerpyMcDerp

Just because Bioware has a reasonably unhealthy following, that in no way makes these games romance simulators.

[QUOTE="navyguy21"][QUOTE="Vaasman"]Oh ok, that kind of thread huh?Vaasman

No duh? There's a reason why people call Bioware games waifu simulators, you know... The only reason that people hold Dragon Age: Origins above Dragon Age 2 is because the romanceable companions were actually appealing. Only a paedophile would have liked Merril or Tali-loving biodrones, Isabela was ulgy as sin, Anders was a douchebag in the end, and Fernis was just okay.

DerpyMcDerp

Just because Bioware has a reasonably unhealthy following, that in no way makes these games romance simulators.

DAII's writng and storytelling is superior, there is just no question about this. I like the first KOTOR much better than the second, but I think the second game is the better written game.

texasgoldrush

[QUOTE="navyguy21"][QUOTE="Vaasman"]TC is a Bioware employee.

texasgoldrush

Just ask Peter molynuex if a developer would trash there previous games to hype up there next game.

P.M Developement cycle of hatered.

-Fable will be the best game ever, it will have realtime growing grass.

-Ok well fable sucked I admit it but Fable II will be so much better!

- Fable II? Oh yeah that crap-fest...but you haven't seen Fable III yet!

*future P.M guestimate*

-Fable? Well I guess you haven't heard about Milo....I also have a bridge I would like to sell you.

[QUOTE="TheEpicGoat"]

tl;dr but going by the title it was better than the second story wise and combat wise

texasgoldrush

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"]

DAII's writng and storytelling is superior, there is just no question about this. I like the first KOTOR much better than the second, but I think the second game is the better written game.

I love your threads

hakanakumono

tl;dr but going by the title it was better than the second story wise and combat wise

its better than DAII overall.

[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]

I love your threads

I'm not a big fan of BioWare games. I tried KotOR and ended up hating it even though I liked the story because the gameplay was terrible... And I wanted to go the dark side too :(

Mass Effect is the only one I consider decent. It's not because of the story (which is cliche) but because of the vast amount of permutations and how each choice affects the gameplay and story in the sequels. ME is definitely not the "GOD OF RPG" but still, a decent game.

Dragon Age... looks so drab and ugly. I don't think I have seen an uglier art st-yle than the DA games. I also find it funny that all the females have super large mammary glands ;)

[QUOTE="jasonharris48"]

[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]

I love your threads

texasgoldrush

DA's story was better than DAII's. It had a strong, clear objective from the beginning, there were several ongoing conflicts (as opposed to DA2's "templars hate mages"), the world feels large and has plenty of extras to run around looking for. There is absolutely no excuse for how much the same three tired scenarios are recycled. I did like the characters more in DA2 (even if Anders was downright terrible). A voiced protagonist is definitely a step up, but when restricting players to a single class is two steps down.

[QUOTE="DJ_Lae"]Origins is a fun game but I would agree that the story is very cliche. Leliana is a terrible character, however. I was disappointed to see her return in DA2. Either way, both Dragon Age games pale in comparison to Baldur's Gate 2, or even Icewind Dale, or Planescape Torment. They're better than the Neverwinter Nights games, however.texasgoldrush

DA's story was better than DAII's. It had a strong, clear objective from the beginning, there were several ongoing conflicts (as opposed to DA2's "templars hate mages"), the world feels large and has plenty of extras to run around looking for. There is absolutely no excuse for how much the same three tired scenarios are recycled. I did like the characters more in DA2 (even if Anders was downright terrible). A voiced protagonist is definitely a step up, but when restricting players to a single class is two steps down.

felipebo

[QUOTE="Vaasman"]

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"]

DAII's writng and storytelling is superior, there is just no question about this. I like the first KOTOR much better than the second, but I think the second game is the better written game.

texasgoldrush

The villain in the 3rd chapter isn't even a man at all so where you get this human nature mumbo jumbo from when he doesn't think the same way as people do, is beyond me.

As far as the choices go the only thing they really affect is your party, which is cool in it's own way but doesn't hold the significance you felt in DAO. The world doesn't change like in Fable, and you don't change politics or plotline like in DAO. No matter what choices you make the same characters will make the same decisions in the same way throughout the plot and ending. Without delving too far into spoiler territory, I'll just say that unlike ME1 or DAO, I can't change the outcome of the final battle or the outcome of the plotline in any tangible way. Every fight I have in one save, I am going to have in another.

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="DJ_Lae"]Origins is a fun game but I would agree that the story is very cliche. Leliana is a terrible character, however. I was disappointed to see her return in DA2. Either way, both Dragon Age games pale in comparison to Baldur's Gate 2, or even Icewind Dale, or Planescape Torment. They're better than the Neverwinter Nights games, however.DarkLink77

I agree with most of your points about DA: O, but I fear that you are missing the bigger picture here:

BioWare has never been great. Ever.

It's a common myth, a farce, a **** encrusted rusty lie passed down from generation to generation, a web of laughable suggestions intimating that this at best middling development studio is somehow king of the RPG genre. The best BioWare games have ever been is good; that is, fun and engaging, but never masterpieces.

Yes, that goes for Baldur's Gate. Yes, that goes for NWN. Yes, that goes for Mass Effect.

They are a sometimes solid and often very poor studio whose hype to quality ratio is as ****ed as any other major dev I can think of, besides Rockstar, maybe.

The only thing NWN2 oc has over dao was the level design, which didn't have dungeons that makes no sense (such as the skeleton level in the werewolves lair which served no purpose, except being trash mobs to kill time), and D&D system imo.

I liked DA:O but not as much as some others did. The gameplay felt meh to me; the story and characters were pretty good though (I'd give it no more than an 8 ). Still haven't played DA2 yet but I will eventually...

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="Vaasman"]I never played Kotor 2 but DA2 is in no way an objectively better story than DA1. Maybe to a slim portion of the fanbase will appreciate the multitude of storylines going on but a lot of people are just going to be put off by the lack of a clear antagonist or the fact that they scaled back a lot on the scale of the character's decisions.

The villain in the 3rd chapter isn't even a man at all so where you get this human nature mumbo jumbo from when he doesn't think the same way as people do, is beyond me.

As far as the choices go the only thing they really affect is your party, which is cool in it's own way but doesn't hold the significance you felt in DAO. The world doesn't change like in Fable, and you don't change politics or plotline like in DAO. No matter what choices you make the same characters will make the same decisions in the same way throughout the plot and ending. Without delving too far into spoiler territory, I'll just say that unlike ME1 or DAO, I can't change the outcome of the final battle or the outcome of the plotline in any tangible way. Every fight I have in one save, I am going to have in another.

Its funny that you are praising DA2's story for every flaw it has.Its like someone accidentally knocking over a bucket of paint onto a canvas and you calling it a masterpiece. The whole game is just built around occurrences in Kirkwall. Hawke had no purpose after Act1. He got the cash to move up to hightown and that was that. Androvinus

Actually he does....its given by the player. Case in point...rivalry version of Isabela's questioning beliefs.....do you answer her "I help people to gain power and influence" or do I answer her "Helping people is its own reward" Its just like the Identity quest in The Witcher which you as the player define Geralt's new worldview. The Arishok meeting is a huge moment in establishing motive for Hawke when Arishok asks about how Hawke deals wirh the "weakness" of Kirkwall.

[QUOTE="Vaasman"]

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] because its not a typical video game story. The antagonist is really a concept...mans nature for conflict. Instead of a man vs man story is a man vs nature story. Its too bad gamers don't appreciate a story like this. Actually, I think the characters decisions in DAII are better. Instead of being world changing like in most WRPGs, they have a far more affect on the lives Hawke comes across. His decisions can improve or destroy peoples lives. I am tired of playing God characters which they are the only ones that can impact the story. in DAII, you are one decison maker among many in the story. The world affetcs your choices more than your choices affect the world. It was the same way with the Witcher.texasgoldrush

The villain in the 3rd chapter isn't even a man at all so where you get this human nature mumbo jumbo from when he doesn't think the same way as people do, is beyond me.

As far as the choices go the only thing they really affect is your party, which is cool in it's own way but doesn't hold the significance you felt in DAO. The world doesn't change like in Fable, and you don't change politics or plotline like in DAO. No matter what choices you make the same characters will make the same decisions in the same way throughout the plot and ending. Without delving too far into spoiler territory, I'll just say that unlike ME1 or DAO, I can't change the outcome of the final battle or the outcome of the plotline in any tangible way. Every fight I have in one save, I am going to have in another.

I'm referring to the Qunari conflict. The story is divided by 3 slideshows into 4 sections, the 3rd being the one where you fight off the Qunari insurrection, which has absolutely nothing to do with what you are talking about.

And I think it's funny you mentioned the flashcards. Go look at your mailtrunk after each chapter in DA2 and tell me what you see after beating the sidequests. At least in DAO when I make a decision it changes the gameplay. Side with the elves? Fight werewolves. side with wolves? Fight treants. Right of annulment? Templars join you in the fighting, or vice-versa. Save the forge? Lots of golems.

Not to mention that choosing your background was also a big part of DAO whereas in DA2 it makes no difference to anyone what sex or class you choose, and you can't choose your race or place in society at all.

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="Vaasman"]Trying to look at the games conflict from a philospohical angle is not going to change the fact that the game's plot is essentially 5 DLC's tied into one game. Each chapter has one conflict and each chapter is relatively unrelated to the rest, other than the fact that they take place in the same city with the same protagonist, and are loosely tied together with references to eachother. There is no discussion of pseudo-philosophy on the nature of man and the inevitability of conflict.

The villain in the 3rd chapter isn't even a man at all so where you get this human nature mumbo jumbo from when he doesn't think the same way as people do, is beyond me.

As far as the choices go the only thing they really affect is your party, which is cool in it's own way but doesn't hold the significance you felt in DAO. The world doesn't change like in Fable, and you don't change politics or plotline like in DAO. No matter what choices you make the same characters will make the same decisions in the same way throughout the plot and ending. Without delving too far into spoiler territory, I'll just say that unlike ME1 or DAO, I can't change the outcome of the final battle or the outcome of the plotline in any tangible way. Every fight I have in one save, I am going to have in another.

I'm referring to the Qunari conflict. The story is divided by 3 slideshows into 4 sections, the 3rd being the one where you fight off the Qunari insurrection, which has absolutely nothing to do with what you are talking about.

And I think it's funny you mentioned the flashcards. Go look at your mailtrunk after each chapter in DA2 and tell me what you see after beating the sidequests. At least in DAO when I make a decision it changes the gameplay. Side with the elves? Fight werewolves. side with wolves? Fight treants. Right of annulment? Templars join you in the fighting, or vice-versa. Save the forge? Lots of golems.

Not to mention that choosing your background was also a big part of DAO whereas in DA2 it makes no difference to anyone what sex or class you choose, and you can't choose your race at all.