When whites are a minority by 2044, what will happen in America?

Right. This is coming from the guy who said the material I posted directly from a CRT course wasn't CRT. There is really no point in posting links for you because you will flat out deny every source that goes against your narrative.

You don't understand climatology either. I'd hate to tell you but you're not an expert on every field you discuss here. Regardless imagine mentioning climate change over the corrupt political leaders and genocidal maniacs.

We werent wrong. That wasnt CRT, CRT is a LEGAL course taught to law students.

I am no climatologist. But Climate Changes impact on the climate is well... stuff you learn in grade school, and it is NOT superceded by more advanced stuff either. Nay the more advanced stuff only builds upon it.

I literally mentioned that in the post you responded to.

Other people brought up issues like Internal strife due to having borders and boundries not written by the people who made them. But you are forgetting we have been messing things up for them in many other ways too.

A recent notable way we are messing up for them is climate change. Draughts, Heatwaves, storms and so much more. The Climate Change we are contributing to, is having severe consequences for these countries.

Likewise, it is well known that resource rich countries tend to end up extremely stratified.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/resource-curse.asp

Quoting myself is weird. Yet I find myself doing it a lot... weird.

I don't think anything bad or good will happen when whites become a minority.

I actually don't see this a matter of race, but a Matter of local middle class not having economical security to have more children and immigration filling the gaps.

The only issue i should pay a lot of attention if i was an American are:

1. Select and attract highly educated immigration.

2. Actively pursue increasing the education level of the illegal immigration you couldn't stop from entering your country.

3. Introduce more pro natalist policies to also allow the local population (regardless of their race) to rise kids. Specially more affordable university which is one of the big problems in USA.

Regardless of the race of each person, this will help the country.

You were wrong. I literally posted course material directly from a text book. And yes it was a college course. The point if it was to show what was being taught in the book was also being brought into grade school. Regardless It's like talking to a wall so just stay on topic.

I actually brought up internal strife and yet other posters somehow blamed all that on us as well. Regardless at what point is any accountability taken into consideration? It's a constant argument I hear from leftist that just about every world issue is our fault.

You do know the present is just the culmination of the past, right? Europe and the US had their hand stirring just about every internal conflict of the past century. That cannot be waved away by wishy-washy mantras of personal responsibility.

That's how world powers become world powers. Every great nation In existence has had someone attempt to either conquer them, destroy them or just use them for their resources. Some make it some don't.

But no one owes anyone anything. As we speak China is building Africa's infrastructure and placing a debt on them they will never be able to repay. Do you expect China will forgive that debt out of the kindness of their own heart? If they had a great leader they would use their vast resources and build up their own nation. That however never happened.

What do you think we are doing in third world countries right now? You think we've stopped our open and covert actions?

We only get to hear about it when our soldiers die, like those four who died in Tongo Tongo a few years back.

But no one owes anyone anything.

You can't shit in batter and then complain the cake tastes like shit.

It wasn't CRT and it was you who brought up the CRT stuff in this topic to begin with. Funny how you immediately backtracked. Still credit is due where it is due, thanks for trying to stick on topic.

Pay attention to what people are saying. Nobody is blaming only us. But we have contributed a fair share towards the strife we see in those regions even today. You mention accountability, all I am seeing is you trying to avoid our accountability. We sabotaged those regions, and we continue to do so even today. This doesnt mean all blame lies solely on us, and nobody is saying that. But the excuses you throw to rationalize our shitty behaviour, are just that excuses. We were in the wrong to do that.

Why dont you listen to others and learn something for once? Rather than continuing your tribalistic us vs them black and white thinking in every goddamn thread? For starters, look up the Sykes-Picot Agreement, The Berlin Conference.

How is this thread not locked?

It was a quote from a book written by Derrick Bell. For **** sake if you want to keep digging yourself deeper have at it.

We sabotaged those regions? We did? I wasn't there were you? And aren't you from like Sweden? Your people haven't done shit since the viking age. Do you know how utterly ridiculous you sound? If your nation isn't trying to get ahead they will fall behind. If it's not the US, it's Russia or China. What do you want western nations to do exactly? Forget the people they can't take care of in their own nation and send it to third world countries? Bring them over and pander to their values and culture? What exactly?

I was talking about us as civilizations.

Wow, you are flat out defending imperialism too now... yikes yikes yikes. Nations can do well for themselves without trampling on others.

OBVIOUSLY what I want us to do is no longer covertly and openly put people in other nations in bad positions. What is done is done, but the fact of the matter is, we continue to do it even today. Nobody brought up repartions other than you. At the very least, we should own up to our past mistakes. Not try to rationalize them which is what you are doing.

And Sweden was a great military power in the 18th century. Not very familiar with eastern european history I take it? I mean, you already demonstrated a lack of knowledge in african and middle eastern history.

I wasn't there at the signing of the Constitution but we are still bound by it because the institution of The United States of America is still extant.

Just because we as a country are responsible doesn't mean each individual is. And as long as the USA persists, it will be obligatorily bound by its contracts and past actions.

This really is a straw man argument. Don't go there.

When visiting with my Japanese-American friend, I take my shoes off at the door because I'm not an asshole.

It's sad when people consider simple politeness as pandering.

One thing I have noticed in a few posters here is never-ending paranoia. About everything. All the time. That's got to bad for a person.

I do that in my own house because I don't like disgusting carpets.

You don't see the point. Let's take Japan for an example. Do you know there are bars in Japan that you are not allowed to go into if you are not Japanese?

Would you ever go to Japan and talk about how racist that is? I would respect their culture and go to another bar.

Any great nation throughout civilization conquered. I'm not defending it it's just a fact.

Nations do that to get ahead. It's sad but it's the way of the world. Do you think if the US stopped Russia and China would do the same?

I can't find a single list that has Sweden in the top 5 powers of the 18th century. I know my history , we apparently just have different definitions of the word " great".

So your answer is to lower ourselves to their level, and not have higher standards?

Call me crazy but I'd like to be better than that.

"Oh some bars don't allow gaijin in? Well that sucks; but here in the US we allow anyone in, which is why we are better." See how good that feels?

Maybe the US should actually act as good as we think we are. We aren't awesome simply because we are the US and it's some sort of genetic supremacy; we are awesome because of our values, legal system, political system, and so on and so forth (at least on paper).

We should strive for those ideals, work to improve. We shouldn't rest on them as simply some vague concept we get to reference.

*And yes, I've been to Japan, been denied entry. Had some Japanese bouncer hold up his arms in an X and say "No gaijin! No gaijin!" It sucks. But I wouldn't use that as an excuse to do the same in a million years.

I have actually complained about that very thing on this forum, many years ago. I'm sure it's in my post history if you feel like looking it up. Japan is downright racist, but they're paying the price for their hegemony as their populace ages.

With modern birthrates in developed nations, immigration is vital. Think of it as hoarding people as a resource. We need those workers. We need that tax base.

China has a billion more people than we do. They're not many years from fully developing most of their country. It's soon not going to matter that we got a running head-start, a billion + people is a hell of a pool to pull from. I wonder how many Einsteins or Oppenheimers they might find in that stack?

Our economic model...it could be better, but it will work in a pinch. Our population stats? Shit.

You may have but do you hear the media talking about it? Do you ever hear about China, Japan or India trying to be more inclusive? Lol fuuuck no. They are proud of their culture.

Westerners don't have that pride anymore. It's been hijacked into something negative

As for are population problem this is an issue in many wealthier countries. Wealthier people aren't having as many kids and when they do they usually start late. Kids are expensive and people have put material wealth and leisure over the responsibility of raising a family.

You don't hear about it because this isn't Japan or China. If you haven't noticed, our news is pretty US-centric.

American Culture is an amalgam, and a celebration of such, and always has been. There's no reason you can't be neighborly with someone who believes in more gods than you or celebrates different holidays.

"It does me no harm for my neighbor to believe in many gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg" - Thomas Jefferson

So that leaves the options of immigration or decay. Which is preferable?

@br0kenrabbit:

You don't hear about it because this isn't Japan or China. If you haven't noticed, our news is pretty US-centric.

You don't hear about it because it's not happening. Want proof? Watch their movies. They are the equivalent of what the US did in the 50's and 60's and outward celebration of their culture. Do you see Bollywood or Chinese movies aiming for diversity and inclusion?

@br0kenrabb

American Culture is an amalgam, and a celebration of such, and always has been. There's no reason you can't be neighborly with someone who believes in more gods than you or celebrates different holidays.

"It does me no harm for my neighbor to believe in many gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg" - Thomas Jefferson

Yet you have people that are offended by our own flag. When the MAGA slogan came about there was a large portion of the country that asked " when was America ever great"..,? It's hard to build a unified nation with that mindset

@br0kenrabb

So that leaves the options of immigration or decay. Which is preferable?

We're screwed either way. Higher educated and wealthier immigrants will still have less children. The poor ones will have more children with no viable skills to improve our economy.

I don't watch Bollywood or Chinese movies, and I fail to see what Indian or Chinese policies have do to with our immigration polices other than a far stretching excuse for...something. Idk.

If you were a black woman in the 50's or 60's, that time so many right-wingers seem to be aching for, do you think you would call America great? When you could be lawfully imprisoned for taking a front seat on the bus?

You seem to think the white perspective is the only viable perspective. Stop dwelling on fear and pride and start actually reading some history. This fake version of the 50's and 60's the right wing seems to want to revert back to never existed.

The local high school here in my town was blown up capping two years of race riots that resulted in national guard deployment. Google 'The Clinton 12'.

Was America great then? FYI, this isn't ancient history, it was 1958. Many of those students are still with us.

While farmer Juan may not be of much benefit to you personally, if his kids get an education they may go on to cure the type of cancer you develop.

You have such a short-sighted and immediate view of everything, don't you?

@br0kenrabbit: exactly, i am myself that. My Great grand father was a farmer called Jose. He could not read or write even in Spanish.

My grandfather, finished primary school, my dad became an electric engineer. My two brothers are software engineer, and even though i am only a business major, I have other skills like being fluent in 4 languages (including Chinese).

Time changes people, sadly you do need generations, which is why you need to give priority to more educated immigrants so that the system is not overhwelmed.

Also, as a person who has lived in east asia for a long time. Eastern asians do value cultural diversity. At least the intellectual elites do. The average joe not so much though. At least here in China. But that is a result of year of hyper nationalistic propaganda, that you need a couple more neurons than average to see through.

Don't worry, we're pretty down with that shit, too.

The type of patriotism many people love to display reminds me of a High School Spirit Rally in the gym. It's hollow, pointless and gaudy but so many people eat that shit up.

While most nations at some point have been involved in conquest. Most nations are not great because of Conquests. India is historically speaking one of the most important nations in history. But aside from Ashoka's attempts, India has for most of its history not really been a nation but a large group of communities, those guys never did much in the way of conquest. In fact the concept of a Indian nation is a very modern concept. Despite their lack of imperial ambitions, India is significant throughout history.

To make your argument even worse. The 3 countries that have imperial ambitions today, 2 of them have mediocre standards of living. USA is at 17th, which is pretty good, but then you get to Russia at 52 and China at 85. The nations with the highest HDIs are the Nordic Countries, Netherlands, Hong Kong, Ireland and a bunch of other countries not really known for their imperial ambitions. It is clear you do not need to trample at other countries to do well.

You do realize that a country can be screwed by the US, CHina and Russia simultaneously. In fact this is a very common occurance. Where a nation gets torn apart by competing US and Chinese imperial interests. Your buh Russia and China excuse.

You have a strange definition then. Since it is not just me, look at this list. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_modern_great_powers Again, seems to me like you have a poor grasp of history.

Edit: Reading your conversation with Brokenrabbit 3 things have been made abundantly clear.

1. You seem awfully happy stooping down to America stooping down to Russia and China's level. So much for your american pride that you are willing to go down to the low and petty level of america being a parasite.

2. You seem to have a very narrow view of american culture. Which has always been extremely diverse. And a rose tinted view of history. Many of America's greatest cultural contributions came explicitly from the mingling of varoius cultural groups? Rock was born this way.

3. Afraid of the poorly educated not doing well? Why don't you provide universal education and other social programs to increase social mobility. Maybe the son of farmer Fabian can reach his doctoral ambitions if his ambitions arent shot in the foot by the lack of social welfare.

These MAGA types are some of the least patriotic people I have ever seen. If you look past their hollow mantras ("America is #1"), you will find a group of people so ashamed of their country they are willing to go and censor their history under the pretense of it containing CRT. They have so little faith in their way of life that they see any deviation from their perceived norms as a threat to it, and they romanticize the past (especially the 50s), accepting fiction over reality. Are they that ashamed of their country and history they are willing to not just deny a good chunk of it, but also censor it for everyone else?

Did you ever play Persona 4? This is how they sound like to me,

I have a lot of respect for Germany. They do not hold back one bit when teaching their country's history. Unlike these self proclaimed patriots who are in complete denial over the country they pretend to love.

Edit: Had technical issues with spoiler block.

I find it completely fucked up just talking about this. It's proof that we still care about "race" when we 1. shouldn't, and 2. there are no different races. A slightly different shade of brown is not a different race, you fucking morons.

Hopefully, we'll stop dividing us sooner rather than later, but it's gonna take a very long time. If we as a human race even survive that long..

Honestly, if you are thinking about this type of shit..... get a better hobby idk. Go do something useful instead of fear mongering about ethnic population percentages in America. You are making America worse. So by that logic maybe America will be a better, friendlier place by 2044.

America has never, and will never belong to a skin color. Get fucked.

Frankly, if you think your skin color makes you a different race then you are just wrong. Maybe it's not your fault for thinking like that, but it's never too late to start acting like a decent human being.

Sadly, as long as people keep accepting the concept of race, race will continue to manifest :(

Even as it is absolute hogwash scientifically speaking.

Race is stupid, and makes people ignore the massive diversity within groups of people. Are these racialists seriously trying to tell me all these people are from one homogenous group?

@Maroxad:

While most nations at some point have been involved in conquest. Most nations are not great because of Conquests. India is historically speaking one of the most important nations in history. But aside from Ashoka's attempts, India has for most of its history not really been a nation but a large group of communities, those guys never did much in the way of conquest. In fact the concept of a Indian nation is a very modern concept. Despite their lack of imperial ambitions, India is significant throughout history.

The greatest nations throughout history were involved in conquest . Stop denying basic fact because it feels bad.

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/reboot/these-5-powers-were-greatest-empires-all-time-174308

@Maroxad:

To make your argument even worse. The 3 countries that have imperial ambitions today, 2 of them have mediocre standards of living. USA is at 17th, which is pretty good, but then you get to Russia at 52 and China at 85. The nations with the highest HDIs are the Nordic Countries, Netherlands, Hong Kong, Ireland and a bunch of other countries not really known for their imperial ambitions. It is clear you do not need to trample at other countries to do well.

That's because the two that have mediocre standards were losing to the US. It's also because of communism.

I always get a kick when people talk about how successful Nordic Countries are. Alot of leftist bring them up because of their strong socio economic policies. Alot of far right people bring them up as proof that America would be better off without diversity. Regardless Nordic Countries do have a unified identity. Hong Kong is a result of British rule( one of the biggest empires in history). And Ireland benefits from being in the EU.

@Maroxad:

You have a strange definition then. Since it is not just me, look at this list.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_modern_great_powersAgain, seems to me like you have a poor grasp of history.

Remember when you talked about posting links that hurt your argument? Congrats! Look at all the Empires on that list that are on there because of Conquests!

@Maroxad:

1. You seem awfully happy stooping down to America stooping down to Russia and China's level. So much for your american pride that you are willing to go down to the low and petty level of america being a parasite.

For someone who constantly bitches about me jumping to conclusions you have made some terribly false assumptions.

For one America is far from parasite. We give far more to other countries then they give to us. Honestly I would rather America rely on its own people and it's own resources. NATO would be all but useless if it weren't for us. And Nato probably wouldn't need to exist if it weren't for Russia and China.

@Maroxad:

2. You seem to have a very narrow view of american culture. Which has always been extremely diverse. And a rose tinted view of history. Many of America's greatest cultural contributions came explicitly from the mingling of varoius cultural groups? Rock was born this way.

Why do you say that? My point is America doesn't need to spend a second apologizing. And not all culture groups are a net positive.

@Maroxad:

3. Afraid of the poorly educated not doing well? Why don't you provide universal education and other social programs to increase social mobility. Maybe the son of farmer Fabian can reach his doctoral ambitions if his ambitions arent shot in the foot by the lack of social welfare.

My plan would be to give more scholarships in degrees that are actually effective and force companies that need those people to pay for them. As of now universities offer to many degrees that are worthless and the tax payer doesn't need to be responsible for paying for Kara's Gender studies degree.

@The_Deepblue: "I’m a far right guy, and I’ll tell you that the majority race in any country gets preferential treatment. The ethics of that is another discussion. However, being a white minority is much different. You’re the bane of other races’ existences. You’re the reason they have higher poverty rates. You raped and enslaved their ancestors. This is all from their perspective, of course. They have long memories, and they don’t forgive. It’s somehow my fault that white people had slaves hundreds of years ago.

Now, what will being minority white look like? I fear it’ll be something like South Africa. Would you want to be white in South Africa right now, where recently there have been people running for political office who literally want whites eradicated completely from that country?

When whites are the majority, minorities still get programs such as Affirmative Action in schools and in the workplace and the entire media speaking up for their rights. Do you think whites will get that as a minority? Affirmative Action in South Africa does not benefit whites, though they are only around nine percent of the population and many are suffering from poverty, being assaulted and being murdered.

The good thing about whites becoming a minority is that the ill treatment towards us will cause many of us to have a strong racial consciousness. Perhaps we will stop pursuing empty materialistic lives, trying to keep up the veneer of middle to upper middle class success. Perhaps whites will become close-knit communities again and return to hailing traditional values. Gotta look on the bright side."

Wow! At least you are a f***ton more honest than a lot of far right people in this country.

Consider though that Affirmative Action only happens because minorities ban together and fight for it, and people like you fight against it every step of the way.

@silentchief

1. Great by what standard? Because several of those while they were military powers, were hardly ideal for the average citizen living in them. The British Empire was great not because of conquest, but because unlike other empires, they focused on Trade. But even that came down crashing in the end. As economies change. The industrial revolution had a tremendous impact on economies. And with innovation being the key resource. The need to oppress others and trample over them became unnecessary.

2. The EU is not an empire, so your argument with Ireland immediately falls flat (what were you even going with this?). Hong Kong's success is not because of its involvement with the british empire, but how intelligently run it is. As for the nordic countries, we are talking about objective standards of living, objective measurements.

3. Me: *Links a wikipedia article noting military powers, not countries with high standards of living, to post how sweden was at one point a great military power*

You: "Remember when you talked about posting links that hurt your argument? Congrats! Look at all the Empires on that list that are on there because of Conquests!"

Me: *facedesk*

So desperate for a back at ya, smh.

4. By parasite that also includes any Empire. It is extremely exploitative and has been really damaging for the host countries. Especially when we then draw their borders for them and set them up in a way that we doom them to fail.

5. If America does things that have caused blatant harm to certain communities they should certainly own up to it. But apologizing actually takes strength, something which is often lacking among your average person.

6. While what you argue for in terms of education is good in theory. In practice allowing the rich and powerful to dictate what forms of education are and are not available to the public is a terrible idea if you think about it for more than a minute.

Countries can do EXTREMELY well for themselves without war, conflict and bullying other nations. Especially in the modern era where our economies are very interconnected. There is no excuse for continued imperialism by the US. It is all done for greed nothing else. Other countries do fine, even better than the US does and do so without bullying smaller countries.

That estimate, of course, assumes Latinos still want to be classified as their own race and not Caucasian. However, a majority of Latinos do identify as Caucasian, a.k.a. "white" according to the last poll. So, if that trend continues, "white people" will always be in the majority.

Sigh... I remember the days when we were all just called "Americans" and this nonsense wasn't an issue.

@Maroxad:

1. Great by what standard? Because several of those while they were military powers, were hardly ideal for the average citizen living in them. The British Empire was great not because of conquest, but because unlike other empires, they focused on Trade. But even that came down crashing in the end. As economies change. The industrial revolution had a tremendous impact on economies. And with innovation being the key resource. The need to oppress others and trample over them became unnecessary.

2. The EU is not an empire, so your argument with Ireland immediately falls flat (what were you even going with this?). Hong Kong's success is not because of its involvement with the british empire, but how intelligently run it is. As for the nordic countries, we are talking about objective standards of living, objective measurements.

3. Me: *Links a wikipedia article noting military powers, not countries with high standards of living, to post how sweden was at one point a great military power*

You: "Remember when you talked about posting links that hurt your argument? Congrats! Look at all the Empires on that list that are on there because of Conquests!"

Me: *facedesk*

So desperate for a gotcha, you just end up keeping making yourself look worse and worse... which would be the case if you hadnt hit rock bottom a while back.

4. By parasite that also includes any Empire. It is extremely exploitative and has been really damaging for the host countries. Especially when we then draw their borders for them and set them up in a way that we doom them to fail.

5. If America does things that have caused blatant harm to certain communities they should certainly own up to it. But apol ogizing actually takes strength, something which is often lacking among your average person.

6. While what you argue for in terms of education is good in theory. In practice allowing the rich and powerful to dictate what forms of education are and are not available to the public is a terrible idea if you think about it for more than a minute.

You seem woefully unaware of how economies of the 21st century work. It is no longer about empires and material resources. Countries can do EXTREMELY well for themselves without war and conflict. As demonstrated by the fact that the entire top 10 is dominated by non-empirial natoins. Only germany has had an imperial past, and that country's modern day success certainly has very little to do with its imperial past. Instead of investing in bullying other nations, they invested in their own people. And today they are reaping the rewards of that.

1. By any standard. Take Rome for an example. For all their barbaric ways the place looked like Disneyland in comparison to other civilizations at the time. The oppression and trampling is usually at the early stages of an empire before it gathers land and resources. It's not something that should persist through its entire existence.

2. Jesus christ you know shit about history. Do little research on " The Troubles" . Ireland would be a third world shit hole if it weren't for EU intervention. You mean the Hong Kong run by British rule and not the communist of China? Ohh go figure!

3. Again are definition of great varies. They got their ass kicked by the Russians and at no point were they the most powerful nation in the world. Keep posting one blunder after the next though in your desperate attempt to prove me wrong.

4. Most those countries were war torn shitholes to begin with. I would love for you to point to an example where warring tribes figured it out on their own. Although I'm all for letting those countries figure it out now.

5. I know you love pathetic virtue signaling but I find it cringe inducing. No citizens of these nations has any reason to apologize. It would mean nothing anyway.

6. They already do. Is it better for one to get a degree in worthless bullshit that does nothing but put them in massive debt and offers then no practical skills?

And you are completely clueless. Those nations are able to exist in piece and be successful without trampling others because the US exist. Do you honestly think if it weren't for us that things would be as they are now? If the US wasn't in the position it's been in the past 150 years China would take all of Asia and Russia would control all of Eastern Europe. Those Nordic countries for all their high standard of living would get trounced in a matter of months if that.

1. You are aware economies have shifted a LOT since the classical era right? It happened during the industrial revolution. Also of the societies you listed, I can assure you, people were not too well off in say, the Mongolian Empire. It's entire economy and social structure depended on eternal conquest and growth. The US's standard of living doesnt make it even in the top 10, it comes in 17th place.

2. I am talking about the Republic of Ireland... The Troubles happened in Northern Ireland, with a bit spilling over into other regions. This take is nearly as bad as your "Angela Merkel is not right wing" take.

3. Great Military Power is an objective term we use for countries with the ability to influence other nations.

4. We made things worse, and then we carved up their territory in horrible ways. Things were left for the worse after we trampled on them.

5. Adults are able to own up to their mistakes, children don't.

6. The subjects that are valuable depends entirely on supply vs demand. Not everyone is looking for a good paying job. Many may choose to study something just out of curiousity. Knowledge being its own reward and far more satisfying than material wealth.

You would be wrong. Russia isnt nearly as threatening as you seem to think they are. Finland were able to fend them off back when they were a superpower and even today Ukraine is winning a decisive victory against them. And Ukraine's army while determined, was just modernizing. If a modernizing army could fend them off, just imagine what they would do against a fully modern army (like say... ANY of the Nordic Countries). I think you are vastly overstating the US's own importance, especially militarily. Nobody is threatened by Russia, maybe things are different in the US, but over here we basically treat them as a joke. All bark, no bite.

Get over it, US imperialism is a net negative. But don't take my word for it,

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/05/993754397/poll-much-of-the-world-sees-the-u-s-as-a-threat-to-democracy

I still can't believe someone is actually defending imperialism.

@Maroxad:

You would be wrong. Russia isnt nearly as threatening as you seem to think they are. Finland were able to fend them off back when they were a superpower and even today Ukraine is winning a decisive war against them. And Ukraine's army while determined, was just modernizing. If a modernizing army could fend them off, just imagine what they would do against a fully modern army (like say... ANY of the Nordic Countries). I think you are vastly overstating the US's own importance, especially militarily. US does far more keeping China at bay via trade deals, not by exploiting poor countries.

Get over it, US imperialism is a net negative.

Well the war has certainly shown some chinks in their armor. But you can also thank the US for that as well. They are a shell of their former selves. Regardless they are a nuclear power and they don't use that power because we keep them in check. And I hope we only have to keep China at bay with trade deals because if they were to use their military the US is the only one that could do a thing about it.

No it's really not. You are ignoring what Russia and China would be. Or Maybe it would be Nazi Germany and the Empire of Japan. The US isn't perfect but they have done more good then harm.

Some Chinks in their armor? The invasion has confirmed what was basically common knowledge over here. Russia is all bark no bite. Their Army is a cardboard army. Over here in europe Russia has been a laughing stock for decades now.

China is a a threat. But Imperialism is not the solution. Trade is. Giving people outs from Chinese dependency is the solution here.

Nazi Germany fell primarily due to the Soviet Union, not the US. With or without the US, Nazi Germany would have fallen, only difference is, it would have fallen later.

But they are a nuclear power kept in check by another nuclear power( US)

That's great as long as things stay civilized. But they don't have 2.8 million soldiers for nothing.

True but Japan was preoccupied with the US. If they weren't many historoians believe the allies would have been screwed.

Skin color doesn't matter.

Why is this thread open?

Tribalism will be our downfall...

@The_Deepblue: you need way more help than I can give you

@goldenelementxl: The fact that there are several race baiting thread on this board is especially disturbing, especially after the terror attack.

And the fact that there are people who still believe that race is anything other than a social construct is beyond tragic.

You are aware that that the EU has hundreds of nukes of its own right? Don't get me wrong, while US involvement in NATO makes us safer, that does NOT excuse US imperialism in Africa and the Middle East.

Also Russian nuclear threat is nowhere near as likely as you think. In order for Putin to be able to launch Nukes, he will need the consent of his oligarchs. And as it happens, his Oligarchs feel extremely mixed in terms of the war. And a nuclear launch is going to meet far less support than an invasion already does. A nuclear launch will very much sap into the profits that keep those people in power. Nothing less than a full on invasion into Russia itself will result in a nuclear launch being plausible.

Our ancestors took steps to bring equality to everyone. All you have to do is read the Delectation of independence. You also

have to consider in that period of time the whole world was racist even Africa.

I think imperialism is the wrong word. I get what you're going for but the US doesn't stay in those worlds long. And those countries tend to get their own government. Influence, certainly. But that's not exactly imperialism. Imperialism is more like the British Empire used to be.

While you can argue the word isnt exactly correct, I still find the US to engage in rather exploitative realtions with countries in these continents (and subcontinents).

But most of the blame for these regions troubles do not fall on the US, but rather, Europe. When we carved up the regions to suit our own needs, dividing the countries not by people, but by resources. Which has caused so much suffering in the long term.

And then there are the regime changes. Replacing democratically elected leaders with religious fanatics for more resources...

Either way, SilentChief seems to blame these countries failings mostly on them. When it was us europeans are the ones who set them up in conditions that doomed them to fail, to begin with. And attempts for these people to modernize has been curbed, over our greed.

Edit: Removed some pictures because the US isnt entirely to blame for that.

I certainly am not taking his side in the discussion. Just disagreed with imperialism. I'd be okay with the US scaling back some of the money we give out to other countries routinely. I'm not talking about helping Ukraine though. That is where I agree with it.

Curious where do you think these countries would be without European intervention ?