[QUOTE="frazzle00"]

[QUOTE="Stranger_4"]Yes it doesnt give you 100% gender quality which btw no civilization on earth yet does and has not done yet since time..

If you think that restricting females to not show their skins(this is not punishable but a sin for a women to show her skin) and not giving equal share in property is a major offence to gender equality then well you are entitled to your opinion..

Islam gives you freedom of religion, it cannot be helped if people have misinterpretated it..

Stranger_4

1) Name me a Christian country that punishes its rape victims.

2) Name me a Christian country where women are NOT allowed to drive.

3) Name me a Christian country where letting women vote is just a recent event.

For that matter name me any Non-muslim country where the above 3 points holds true.

2) It's just one country.:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

3) Just a recent event? Dear God are we going to ultra-cheery pick now.:lol:

1) The articles that I provided about rape victims in Pakistan are clearly not examples of false accusation.

2) If it is just one country, it should be simple for you to find a counter-example.

3) According to Famiking, Kuwait is a moderate Muslim country and they only allowed their women to vote in 2005. When did Pakistan allow their women to vote?

4) Enjoy this article. http://news.sg.msn.com/regional/article.aspx?cp-documentid=2855346. Now you know why I strongly suspect that Aisha was indeed 9.

[QUOTE="BumFluff122"]

[QUOTE="Stranger_4"]

*looks at sig*

You are not poor.:|

Stranger_4

Why should you be good to the world and nature when it wasnt good to you?

So are you trying to say that money, looks and religion are the only things in life worth living for? What about the joys found in knowledge? In reading novels? In enjoying nature? In being with family and loved ones? Are you as shallow as you are bigotted?

[QUOTE="frazzle00"]

[QUOTE="BumFluff122"]

On a side note it shouldn't matter if she was 12 or 13. The reason being that during this age the age most people lived to was in their 30's. Jews and Muslims all married girls as young as this so they could take care of their children and not die before their children reach the age of 12 or 13 when they could go out on their own.

Edit: There are many beliefs that even Mary was the age between 12 and 14.

Stranger_4

That is all true. And the fact that this is illegal now is a great weapon in an athiest's arsenal. You would think that prophets of God or chosen ones would be more enlightened.

This is not about that, it's about logic and looking at the bigger picture. But your statement just proves that this is not worth it especially not arguing with you.

I don't consider this a game. All the opinions I have voiced in this thread are genuinely my own. I was just pointing out an issue that many athiest use when arguing against the existence of God. I am all for logic and looking at the bigger picture. It is you who is not. Didn't you just say that science is irrelevant? Didn't you just say that it's "logical" that athiest are more likely to rape a woman? If this is your idea of logic, I don't want any part of it.

[QUOTE="frazzle00"]

[QUOTE="Stranger_4"]I dont need to show any proof, some things are general logic.

Stranger_4

So I guess you won't mind if we all say that we think that the accusations that Islam doesn't give you freedom of religion or gender equality are true due to "general logic"?

If you think that restricting females to not show their skins(this is not punishable but a sin for a women to show her skin) and not giving equal share in property is a major offence to gender equality then well you are entitled to your opinion..

Islam gives you freedom of religion, it cannot be helped if people have misinterpretated it..

1) Name me a Christian country that punishes its rape victims.

2) Name me a Christian country where women are NOT allowed to drive.

3) Name me a Christian country where letting women vote is just a recent event.

For that matter name me any Non-muslim country where the above 3 points holds true.

[QUOTE="frazzle00"]

[QUOTE="Stranger_4"]So who said that a religious guy wont rape?:|

Well most of the murders done in religions name are done in good intentions from the murderer, unfortunately he is just a brainwashed illeterate but still doesnt change the fact that he has good intentions..

Stranger_4

So are you telling me that 9-11 was done in good intentions?

Need I say more?

[QUOTE="frazzle00"]

So how would you call it? I have provided evidence that in Pakistan women who have been raped are in danger of being punished for premarital sex (WTF!!), and not the rapists. Can you really blame us for seeing it that way?

Stranger_4

You have provided plenty of proof to the contrary. Go read your posts again.

[QUOTE="frazzle00"]

[QUOTE="Stranger_4"]There was nothing legal or illegal at that time regarding this issue and it was normal for young girls to marry so even if assuming her to be 13 years old, he didnt do anything illegal or against the culture. And a 13 year old is sexually adult.

Well yes but I dont follow that, I do make friends with females. You dont have to perfectly follow your religion for God is all-forgiving.

Yes I know but you are failing to realise the risk cuz you havent read his history.

Hmm well I am biased but certainly not as much as you..

Stranger_4

1) In most Muslim countries today marrying a 13 year old girl is illegal. Why is this the case, if as you say it is culturally acceptable? Don't forget that Muhammad is God's prophet. He should have known better.

2) Well isn't it convenient that YOU CAN pick and choose what to follow. Do women in Pakistan have that luxury? Can they for example say well I am not going to follow the Quran's instructions when it comes to modesty, and I'll wear a tank top and mini skirt today?

3) I know enough about his history. He took a calculated risk and won.

4) ROFLOL. That my friend is another example of irony :P.

Well actually yes she can wear a mini skirt in pakistan but she will be so heavily gazed by people that she'll not wear it tomorrow lol.

ok.

ok.

1) I have already provided links to hadith that say she was 6 when she was married and 9 when the marriage was consumated. Just look at the wikipedia article on Aisha. You however don't want to accept that. Can you prove that the hadith I have provided are weaker than yours :P?

2) If a Muslim woman in Pakistan wears a tank top and mini skirt when she goes out, I doubt she'll make it back home in one piece if your opinion of women can be generalized to the Pakistani populace.

[QUOTE="SpruceCaboose"]

[QUOTE="Stranger_4"]Are you trying to say that it doesnt lead to more rapes? Are you trying to say that it doesnt make more people desperate? No one is going to just go crazy at the very sight of some female skin but the temptations that would graudally be build by that would certainly lead to a greater chance of rape!

I never denied that women dont get prosecuted in pakistan. It's mostly in the illeterate societies and it's extremely dumb and narrow minded people who dont understand that religion should evolve with different times..

Stranger_4

And to the other posters, this thing doesnt need any prood, it's basic phychology!

That's why you should look for proof. What you have said is rubbish, and not basic psychology. Studies have been made into why rapes occur and it is the general consensus that sex is not the driving force. Rather it is the issue of power. By taking away a woman's right to choose and physically (and emotionally) violating her, a rapist gains an immense amount of power over the woman, and the gratification they get from that is what motivates them to rape some more. After all if sex was the only cause for rape, than rape would not exist in countries where prostitution is legal.

On a side note it shouldn't matter if she was 12 or 13. The reason being that during this age the age most people lived to was in their 30's. Jews and Muslims all married girls as young as this so they could take care of their children and not die before their children reach the age of 12 or 13 when they could go out on their own.

Edit: There are many beliefs that even Mary was the age between 12 and 14.

BumFluff122

That is all true. And the fact that this is illegal now is a great weapon in an athiest's arsenal. You would think that prophets of God or chosen ones would be more enlightened.

[QUOTE="frazzle00"]

2) Provide proof that there is causal link between atheism and sexual violence. Do you even know what that means?

Stranger_4

So I guess you won't mind if we all say that we think that the accusations that Islam doesn't give you freedom of religion or gender equality are true due to "general logic"?