Face it. Blu-Ray is NEEDED! ***edited with new dev comments***

I saw a bunch of blu-ray is not needed threads so I will bump this one with real devs not speculation. Here we see pgr4 devs saying dvd is too small.

"You won't see different times of day per city because this involves recreating all the textures again (one for day and one for night). Whilst this wasn't a problem for our dev team, it was a problem fitting all this data onto a single DVD." It goes on to say:"No full-on day cycles then, but some lighting tints to help set the mood."

So this feature that bizarre creations wanted and had implemented in the game was droppeddue to space constraints of dvd-9. I am sure with blu-ray that feature would be there along with more cars/tracks/audio ect.

BrooklynBomber

let's see if GT5 does these things...;)

if they don't you can choose your excuse

1. kaz blows as a developer

2. "teh cell" is too weak

3.bluray isn't even big enough.

[QUOTE="Zeliard9"]

Why don't people realize that David Jaffe with his "controversial" quote has it 100% right? Blu-Ray will undoubtedly help in the future, as games (and gaming) get bigger and bigger, and more technologically advanced. It's simple math.

But it isn't needed or necessary at this time, when games like Crysis and Mass Effect are considered top-of-the-line for this generation and somehow fit on one DVD, the latter being an exceptionally large game in content and the former the most technologically advanced game to date.

Jaffe said not including Blu-Ray would come back to bite him in the ass in 4 years, and 4 years ain't right now. In fact, the next Xbox might be out by then, since Microsoft has their consoles on 5-year cycles.

BrooklynBomber

The 360 came out in 2005 and in 2007 devs are having problems so if the next xbox does not hit till 2009/10 then dvd will seriouly hinder devs in 08,09,10 for sure.

no devs are having probs with the 360... you're thinking of the ps3...

which is why games on the ps3 don't look as good at the 360's...:)

[QUOTE="wavebrid"]face it it was never needed in the begginging :|BrooklynBomber

How many devs have to say dvd is holding them back before you say it is needed then ??

Bizarre never even said that...

but if i were give a benchmark, it would have to be more than one out of the hundreds of dev teams out there...;)

[QUOTE="BrooklynBomber"][QUOTE="Zeliard9"]

Why don't people realize that David Jaffe with his "controversial" quote has it 100% right? Blu-Ray will undoubtedly help in the future, as games (and gaming) get bigger and bigger, and more technologically advanced. It's simple math.

But it isn't needed or necessary at this time, when games like Crysis and Mass Effect are considered top-of-the-line for this generation and somehow fit on one DVD, the latter being an exceptionally large game in content and the former the most technologically advanced game to date.

Jaffe said not including Blu-Ray would come back to bite him in the ass in 4 years, and 4 years ain't right now. In fact, the next Xbox might be out by then, since Microsoft has their consoles on 5-year cycles.

tango90101

The 360 came out in 2005 and in 2007 devs are having problems so if the next xbox does not hit till 2009/10 then dvd will seriouly hinder devs in 08,09,10 for sure.

no devs are having probs with the 360... you're thinking of the ps3...

which is why games on the ps3 don't look as good at the 360's...:)

Yeah, because Killzone 2 looks nowhere NEAR as good as Gears of War. /sarcasm

[QUOTE="tango90101"][QUOTE="BrooklynBomber"][QUOTE="Zeliard9"]

Why don't people realize that David Jaffe with his "controversial" quote has it 100% right? Blu-Ray will undoubtedly help in the future, as games (and gaming) get bigger and bigger, and more technologically advanced. It's simple math.

But it isn't needed or necessary at this time, when games like Crysis and Mass Effect are considered top-of-the-line for this generation and somehow fit on one DVD, the latter being an exceptionally large game in content and the former the most technologically advanced game to date.

Jaffe said not including Blu-Ray would come back to bite him in the ass in 4 years, and 4 years ain't right now. In fact, the next Xbox might be out by then, since Microsoft has their consoles on 5-year cycles.

subject117

The 360 came out in 2005 and in 2007 devs are having problems so if the next xbox does not hit till 2009/10 then dvd will seriouly hinder devs in 08,09,10 for sure.

no devs are having probs with the 360... you're thinking of the ps3...

which is why games on the ps3 don't look as good at the 360's...:)

Yeah, because Killzone 2 looks nowhere NEAR as good as Gears of War. /sarcasm

1: Its not out yet so you dont know how it will really look.

2: Graphics dont make a good game, they just build on it.

3: The first killzone was trash.

[QUOTE="subject117"][QUOTE="tango90101"][QUOTE="BrooklynBomber"][QUOTE="Zeliard9"]

Why don't people realize that David Jaffe with his "controversial" quote has it 100% right? Blu-Ray will undoubtedly help in the future, as games (and gaming) get bigger and bigger, and more technologically advanced. It's simple math.

But it isn't needed or necessary at this time, when games like Crysis and Mass Effect are considered top-of-the-line for this generation and somehow fit on one DVD, the latter being an exceptionally large game in content and the former the most technologically advanced game to date.

Jaffe said not including Blu-Ray would come back to bite him in the ass in 4 years, and 4 years ain't right now. In fact, the next Xbox might be out by then, since Microsoft has their consoles on 5-year cycles.

dudy80

The 360 came out in 2005 and in 2007 devs are having problems so if the next xbox does not hit till 2009/10 then dvd will seriouly hinder devs in 08,09,10 for sure.

no devs are having probs with the 360... you're thinking of the ps3...

which is why games on the ps3 don't look as good at the 360's...:)

Yeah, because Killzone 2 looks nowhere NEAR as good as Gears of War. /sarcasm

1: Its not out yet so you dont know how it will really look.

2: Graphics dont make a good game, they just build on it.

3: The first killzone was trash.

1. The part in the video looked amazing.

2: My point was in reference to saying "games on the ps3 don't look as good at the 360's...:)", which is obviously false.

3: Yes, which is actually an entirely different game than 2!

[QUOTE="BrooklynBomber"]

[QUOTE="wavebrid"]face it it was never needed in the begginging :|tango90101

How many devs have to say dvd is holding them back before you say it is needed then ??

Bizarre never even said that...

but if i were give a benchmark, it would have to be more than one out of the hundreds of dev teams out there...;)

Did you even read just the 1st page there are many devs saying dvd is not enough and that the lack of the standard hard drive is holding them back on the 360.

[QUOTE="subject117"][QUOTE="tango90101"][QUOTE="BrooklynBomber"][QUOTE="Zeliard9"]

Why don't people realize that David Jaffe with his "controversial" quote has it 100% right? Blu-Ray will undoubtedly help in the future, as games (and gaming) get bigger and bigger, and more technologically advanced. It's simple math.

But it isn't needed or necessary at this time, when games like Crysis and Mass Effect are considered top-of-the-line for this generation and somehow fit on one DVD, the latter being an exceptionally large game in content and the former the most technologically advanced game to date.

Jaffe said not including Blu-Ray would come back to bite him in the ass in 4 years, and 4 years ain't right now. In fact, the next Xbox might be out by then, since Microsoft has their consoles on 5-year cycles.

dudy80

The 360 came out in 2005 and in 2007 devs are having problems so if the next xbox does not hit till 2009/10 then dvd will seriouly hinder devs in 08,09,10 for sure.

no devs are having probs with the 360... you're thinking of the ps3...

which is why games on the ps3 don't look as good at the 360's...:)

Yeah, because Killzone 2 looks nowhere NEAR as good as Gears of War. /sarcasm

1: Its not out yet so you dont know how it will really look.

2: Graphics dont make a good game, they just build on it.

3: The first killzone was trash.

wow you contradict yourself, you said games on ps3 dont look good compare to the 360 and talk about graphics dont make a good game

uncharted for me look better than gears, yeah i know is not out yet

some dev. say dirt will look better on the ps3

1) you are right is not out yet, it could look like the stage demo, worse or even better

2) graphics is not everithing but is a great advantage: halo, half life, metal gear, gears of war, god of war,cod,unreal t , gt , gta final fantasy, many people love this series and all of those have good graphics. what about resident evil 4 won afew game of theyear awards.upcoming bioshock, assassin creed, mass effect, uncharted, cod 4 this future games have goty material not only because of the gameplay but the graphics too

3) the first killzone is not that bad, the only reason people bash it so much is because was hyped and have a lot of bug. Besides the company has no experienced in making gaming at that time

this is why i feel MS is the dumbest console maker here. yes sony has done some fairly stupid things but MS is limiting their game devs. and i'm not just talking about nex gen formate you don't even need BD or HD-DVD what they forgot to add was an HDD. a large cheap HDD thats standardized wouldn't take away most of the problems devs have with 360. but for some reason MS, who put an HDD in the xbox, felt that they shouldn't in the 360 and not only that they make it so that if you don't have one you have to sell out nearly $100 just to get one becuase they want to make money off everything rather than allowing 3rd party ones be compatibleRagashahs

Putting a Core version out there with no HDD was definitely a really dumb move, and I do think Microsoft is regretting that. It might've sold more consoles, but it does limit game development to an extent and can give your system a poor reputation. I think that's inarguable.

I read an interview with Shane Kim where he said that it's extremely unlikely that they'd ever put an "360 Hard Drive Needed" sticker on a game since they want to give every 360 owner a chance to enjoy it - highly unlikely that a game would ever absolutely require it. And that, I'm afraid, puts an unfortunate limit on developers.

They should've started phasing the Core version out a long time ago. Probably too late now, but they still should.

Blu-Ray is needed. Lemmings am in damage control.

Tis' a good night for Cows.

no its NOT needed i dont want a movie format on a games console. Xbox doesnt have a new movie format and nither does the wii and they get the job done just fine.

trying to find a excuse for the blu-ray being needed is ridiculous

beerm_basic

TC made a well done post, I have to say.

I was never against Blu-Ray even though I dont have a PS3. I believe in more space for devs

You cows can do your Group Hug and all, but until a multiplat game comes out on the PS3 and 360 where the PS3 game comes on ONE Blu-Ray disk and the 360 game comes out on TWO or more disks, you have NO PROOF that Blu-Ray is absolutely needed for Next-Gen gaming.

Rule #1 in System Wars - NEVER trust a developer's comments as "truth". These guys are freakin' making games for these systems. Of course they are going to say positive stuff about the hardware and bash the other guys. Why would Factor 5 come out and say ANYTHING negative about the PS3??? They wouldn't. If you believe everything these guys say, you aren't being very objective.

Microsoft doesnt even care about the format war.

They are only backing HD-DVD to slow Blu-Ray down in time for them to eslablish digital streaming like the 1080i movies you can download off live. They could care less what format wins as long as they have more time to refine that technique....thats where there money will be made....and frankly it is a smart move.

Some people can't stop and look more than a year or two ahead of them. But when your favorite console maker is known for short lifespans, why should you?TekkenMaster606

Like... how many consoles have microsoft made?... yes I thought so.

You cows can do your Group Hug and all, but until a multiplat game comes out on the PS3 and 360 where the PS3 game comes on ONE Blu-Ray disk and the 360 game comes out on TWO or more disks, you have NO PROOF that Blu-Ray is absolutely needed for Next-Gen gaming.

Rule #1 in System Wars - NEVER trust a developer's comments as "truth". These guys are freakin' making games for these systems. Of course they are going to say positive stuff about the hardware and bash the other guys. Why would Factor 5 come out and say ANYTHING negative about the PS3??? They wouldn't. If you believe everything these guys say, you aren't being very objective.

REVENGEotSITH

So why would Mark Rein of Epic state that DVD-9 is currently limiting their development on UT 3 on 360 and some maps may not make it on the final build due to DVD-9?

Don't bother to reply, because you have NOTHING to counter what the man stated.

Goin to add this to my favorites..i know for sure more devlelopers is goin to come out and praise blue ray...ps3gen

Hmmm.... Let me "see the future" for you - those developers are going to be working on games for the PS3 when they say these things....

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

LEMMINGS DONT TRY TO SPIN THIS

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

LEMMINGS DONT TRY TO SPIN THIS

G10mgs4

There is no spin - just show me a multiplat game that came on ONE disk for the PS3 and TWO disks for the 360 and I'll believe everything you said.

Oh, you can't.

[QUOTE="G10mgs4"]

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

LEMMINGS DONT TRY TO SPIN THIS

REVENGEotSITH

There is no spin - just show me a multiplat game that came on ONE disk for the PS3 and TWO disks for the 360 and I'll believe everything you said.

Oh, you can't.

i forgot the games name but it was annouced last week stating that the pc and 360 version would be on multiple disk and the ps3 version would be on 1 dick. im sure someone here will find it for you

as for that heres somthing for you

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

[QUOTE="REVENGEotSITH"][QUOTE="G10mgs4"]

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

LEMMINGS DONT TRY TO SPIN THIS

G10mgs4

There is no spin - just show me a multiplat game that came on ONE disk for the PS3 and TWO disks for the 360 and I'll believe everything you said.

Oh, you can't.

i forgot the games name but it was annouced last week stating that the pc and 360 version would be on multiple disk and the ps3 version would be on 1 dick. im sure someone here will find it for you

as for that heres somthing for you

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

Hahahaha I guess gaming is a distant second on your mind tonight.... :lol:

Game On...

MS and Nintendo have been involved in the gaming biz a lot longer than SOny , so I couldn't care if Sony or some uneducated cow thinks it is needed.Fruity_Fantasy

Wowie. Wowzer. Oh, my, gawd. Nuff said.

no its NOT needed i dont want a movie format on a games console. Xbox doesnt have a new movie format and nither does the wii and they get the job done just fine.

trying to find a excuse for the blu-ray being needed is ridiculous

beerm_basic

DVD is a movie format.

REPENT!11! All is lost! A vague comment by someone from Epic now ensures that NO GOOD GAMES CAN EVER BE MADE ON THE 360 NOW!!! WOE TO THE CONQUERED!!! I shall now shed TEARS OF BLOOD!!! Tis the end of times!! All I ever knew is a lie!

*tosses 360, the games, the controllers, his PS2, his DS, his HDTV, and his cellphone out the window* :cry:

this has possibly been said in this thread, but

isnt it funny how the majority of those quotes are from devs that have never touched a 360?

and the ones that are developing for the 360 dont exactly say that its needed.... they dont even say they are having problems fitting it in..

this has possibly been said in this thread, but

isnt it funny how the majority of those quotes are from devs that have never touched a 360?

and the ones that are developing for the 360 dont exactly say that its needed.... they dont even say they are having problems fitting it in..

supermechakirby

Mark Rein from Epic has already stated that the 360 version of UT 3 may have to omit some maps due to DVD-9. It doesn't get more clearer that that.

And Factor 5 did have 360 dev kits with them before making the choice to go with PS3 since they stated it suited their needs for a next gen game, though that had to do more with processing power than storage media.

How is it that your Super computer Console and 360 have issues with regular DVDS. On the PC, We were using plain old CDs just fine until about a year or 2 ago, infact alot of games still a burned on to one or 2 CDs. It seems like consoles always need more space than PCs. The sims 2 fits on one DVD. C&C 3 i'm pretty sure is one DVD, and it has 90 minutes of live action cutscenes. Age of empires 3 is 3 CDS, which would be roughly 2.1 GB, or one DVD ( a CD holds 700Mb). Also, PC can read Dual layer DVDs, for twice the data storage and the new DVD 18, which has 4 layers of data, 2 per side.

Blu-ray sort of requires it self. It uses a very slow 2x reader, which means data has to burned one two three times on to one disc in order to make load times bearable.

At the end of the day when its all said and done some game on Blu Ray must stand up and be worlds better than a game on DVD 9. More space is great for devs and the comments are what they are, but a game still has to crush DVD9 in order for the average person to truly believe blu ray is needed. So far Sony does not have that game and so no matter how many comments come out most people still don't buy it because they don't have any blu ray games that show so much better than a game on DVD9.

The TC's topic is great and the commnets and links are excellent. Too bad no blu ray game is out yet thatscreams its superiority over a 360 game. There's no damage control in saying that. The game just doesn't exist. At the end of the day a talentred developer, even if he struggles with the limitations each and every platform has will find a way to make a great product. So keep posting links to interviews about this, that and the other. I will be playing Madden, Bioshock, Halo 3, and Mass Effect while you wait for the blu ray game that finally justifies the words the devs say. Call us when that is released.

[QUOTE="REVENGEotSITH"][QUOTE="G10mgs4"]

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

LEMMINGS DONT TRY TO SPIN THIS

G10mgs4

There is no spin - just show me a multiplat game that came on ONE disk for the PS3 and TWO disks for the 360 and I'll believe everything you said.

Oh, you can't.

i forgot the games name but it was annouced last week stating that the pc and 360 version would be on multiple disk and the ps3 version would be on 1 dick. im sure someone here will find it for you

as for that heres somthing for you

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/gottips3/Untitled.jpg

Ummm - I'm not going to touch this comment (above) with fear of being banned, but I think it speaks for itself.... He wrote it - not me. Not "corrected" or anything like that, so don't ban me...

Who knew a "maybe" comment would go so far.LTomlinson21

MS and Nintendo have been involved in the gaming biz a lot longer than SOny , so I couldn't care if Sony or some uneducated cow thinks it is needed.Fruity_Fantasy

[QUOTE="Fruity_Fantasy"]MS and Nintendo have been involved in the gaming biz a lot longer than SOny , so I couldn't care if Sony or some uneducated cow thinks it is needed.OhhSnap50893

Atari says hello....oh and Microsoft DOES make PC games, have done for far longer than Sony.

Yes soon blu ray will be critical.stuart69

exactly. 10 months from PS3's launch and it's already making a huge difference.

MS and Nintendo have been involved in the gaming biz a lot longer than SOny , so I couldn't care if Sony or some uneducated cow thinks it is needed.Fruity_Fantasy

man..., just think how GeoW, Halo 3, Blue Dragon, and Bioshock in Blue-Ray.. tsk tsk tsk..

devs should really port those games tothe PS3........jk, no flame please!

LoL, Hideo Kojima stating MGS4 not being enough for Blue-Ray . Just think how huge Zone of the Enders 3 is going to be..

1080p isn't needed. 720p isn't needed. Rumble isn't needed. Analog sticks aren't needed. 5.1 audio isn't needed. complex physics, stunning graphics, etc... none of those things are needed.

You can make great games without those things, remember Snes and Atari?

Now, when you have those things, and you make them avaliable to developers, they WILL put them to good use, or maybe some of them won't and will prefer to make a 2D game in the middle of the freaking 7th generation and still the game can be just as successful and criticaly acclaimed as those multimilion multiyear MGS/Halo mega productions.

It's about giving the developers tools. How they use, and how successful they are using them is up to their efforts and imagination.

lordxymor

very well said...

[QUOTE="Fruity_Fantasy"]MS and Nintendo have been involved in the gaming biz a lot longer than SOny , so I couldn't care if Sony or some uneducated cow thinks it is needed.coldkill19

Uh, his statement was structured better than yours. Lookatall the spacesyou left out.