Republicans in TX pass 10 commandments in school bill.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#151 Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

Bring it up. It makes you look like the clown.

Minorities can and are still targeted. I don't know where you live, I'm betting white suburb. Poverty is the biggest reason for criminal activity. If you're stating that specific minorities commit more then you just contradicted your statement against inequality.

Nah , watching you all struggle with the most basic question will never get old.

You have no concept of reality. Do you think police go into neighborhoods looking for non white people to arrest? Is that honestly how you think the average interaction works?

Poverty doesn't really answer why 13% of one demographic would commit over half the " violent crime" every year. This is what happens when you glorify victimhood culture. Those that do it feel justified in doing it because they are told they have no choice.

You do enjoy sweeping generalizations not based on fact.

Such a simplistic view you have. That isn't even remotely close to what I said.

What is the poverty rate for minorities? I think for myself. I'm not spoon food what to think by far right extremist politicians or talking heads. You'd do well to try that sometime.

It's not a generalization I've watched it in this forum repetaedly

Well why don't you be more specific ?

Depends. Asians have the lowest poverty rate in the country. That kind of kills the " systemic racism " narrative. Native Americans are also the most impoverished ethnic group in the US yet somehow are not over represented when it comes to crime. I base my views off FBI statistics and personal experience, not politicians.

Avatar image for LJS9502_basic
LJS9502_basic

178860

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#152 LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 178860 Posts

@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

You do enjoy sweeping generalizations not based on fact.

Such a simplistic view you have. That isn't even remotely close to what I said.

What is the poverty rate for minorities? I think for myself. I'm not spoon food what to think by far right extremist politicians or talking heads. You'd do well to try that sometime.

It's not a generalization I've watched it in this forum repetaedly

Well why don't you be more specific ?

Depends. Asians have the lowest poverty rate in the country. That kind of kills the " systemic racism " narrative. Native Americans are also the most impoverished ethnic group in the US yet somehow are not over represented when it comes to crime. I base my views off FBI statistics and personal experience, not politicians.

It is a generalization. Very few people here gave you a definition.

At what point did I say police went looking for anyone? Your making up assumptions because you have an uneducated viewpoint on the subject and rather than educate yourself, you post nonsense.

Systematic racism does not mean you treat all races the same. Simplistic understanding....again.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#153  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

You do enjoy sweeping generalizations not based on fact.

Such a simplistic view you have. That isn't even remotely close to what I said.

What is the poverty rate for minorities? I think for myself. I'm not spoon food what to think by far right extremist politicians or talking heads. You'd do well to try that sometime.

It's not a generalization I've watched it in this forum repetaedly

Well why don't you be more specific ?

Depends. Asians have the lowest poverty rate in the country. That kind of kills the " systemic racism " narrative. Native Americans are also the most impoverished ethnic group in the US yet somehow are not over represented when it comes to crime. I base my views off FBI statistics and personal experience, not politicians.

It is a generalization. Very few people here gave you a definition.

At what point did I say police went looking for anyone? Your making up assumptions because you have an uneducated viewpoint on the subject and rather than educate yourself, you post nonsense.

Systematic racism does not mean you treat all races the same. Simplistic understanding....again.

Because they couldn't. That's the point 🤣

You haven't said anything which something you do often. You can post for pages and never make a point. Why not challenge my statement instead of posting vague nonsense?

I never said it did, wtf are you talking about? Systemic racism means our institutions were built to put people of certain races at a disadvantage. My point is while that may have been true decades ago it no longer is and I couldn't justify teaching that trash to children without acknowledging the distinct advantages minorities now have.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#154  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

I couldn't justify teaching that trash to children

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library

And I can literally keep going for pages. Many peer reviewed data.

You can't justify teaching facts to children? Intradesting. Lets put up the 10 commandments instead.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#155  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

I couldn't justify teaching that trash to children

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library

And I can literally keep going for pages. Many peer reviewed data.

You can't justify teaching facts to children? Intradesting. Lets put up the 10 commandments instead.

And not a single study mentions cultural failures are accountability. Sorry those aren't facts. Mentioning a study about " negative stereotype's" than failing to analyze why those stereotypes exist.

A study on police killings that ignores the correlation between violent crime and deadly run ins with the police.

Trash on top of trash. No I can't justify teaching children to be victims.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#156  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts

@silentchief said:
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

I couldn't justify teaching that trash to children

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library

And I can literally keep going for pages. Many peer reviewed data.

You can't justify teaching facts to children? Intradesting. Lets put up the 10 commandments instead.

No I can't justify teaching children to be victims.

That's a straw-man. I can justify teaching them most of the things from those lists. Facts are facts.

Avatar image for Vaasman
Vaasman

15584

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#157 Vaasman
Member since 2008 • 15584 Posts

Maybe I don't know enough about religious practice but isn't displaying a copy of the 10 commandments idolatry which is against the 10 commandments?

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#158 Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

I couldn't justify teaching that trash to children

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library

And I can literally keep going for pages. Many peer reviewed data.

You can't justify teaching facts to children? Intradesting. Lets put up the 10 commandments instead.

No I can't justify teaching children to be victims.

That's a straw-man. I can justify teaching them most of the things from those lists. Facts are facts.

Studies aren't facts, matter of fact most are False.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#159  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

Studies aren't facts,

Refute the ones I posted. Specifically.

Systemic Racism is real. Should we also not teach about vaccines or climate change, most of them are supported by studies.

@silentchief said:

matter of fact most are False.

You just said studies aren't a fact then used one as a fact. Lmao, in the same sentence.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#160 Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia:

Refute the ones I posted. Specifically.

Systemic Racism is real. Should we also not teach about vaccines or climate change, most of them are supported by studies.

Those are trash studies. Relying on surveys of people who claimed they faced discrimination? Mentioning micgroagression? I would need something that shows it effects minorities on a mass scale. Systemic Racism against minorities isn't a reality in the present. Matter of fact they currently have an advantage.

@zaryia:

You just said studies aren't a fact then used one as a fact. Lmao, in the same sentence.

Just playing by your rules the reality is most are unreliable.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#161  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

@zaryia:

Refute the ones I posted. Specifically.

Systemic Racism is real. Should we also not teach about vaccines or climate change, most of them are supported by studies.

Those are trash studies.

Your opinion means absolutely nothing. I can link dozens more. There's quite a few papers on systemic racism. You're just simply objectively wrong on this issue.

@silentchief said:

Just playing by your rules the reality is most are unreliable.

Just like with Covid, Abortion, Climate Change, Vaccines, SEL, and now System Racism I'll use several peer reviewed studies to prove someone is objectively wrong. More than enough and from reputable papers/sources that there is no doubt, all while the other side provides absolutely zilch. These specific examples can't even be called a "debate".

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#162  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia:

Your opinion means absolutely nothing. I can link dozens more. There's quite a few papers on systemic racism. You're just simply objectively wrong on this issue.

You can link dozens more of trash agenda driven studies. It won't change the fact that none of them have any credibility

@zaryia:

Just like with Covid, Abortion, Climate Change, Vaccines, SEL, and now System Racism I'll use several peer reviewed studies to prove someone is objectively wrong. More than enough and from reputable papers/sources that there is no doubt, all while the other side provides absolutely zilch. These specific examples can't even be called a "debate".

Again you can link dozens of bias studies with no counter studies all you want, it doesn't change the fact that they have little to know credibility. Your reputable papers as you call them are mostly just Junk.

Racism exist just not the way you think it does.

Avatar image for Maroxad
Maroxad

23963

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#163  Edited By Maroxad
Member since 2007 • 23963 Posts

@zaryia smh, he is not only arguing using feelings and anecdotes, against your facts. But he is flat out attacking the notion of empiricism itself.

The guy became a living incarnate of the GTA's satire of conservatives.

@silentchief said:

Studies aren't facts, matter of fact most are False.

Having actually read that study...

  • False Positives: Yes, if a Single Study says something, take it with a grain of salt. However, you probably noticed that your opponents dont cite a single study, no they cite multiple. Systemic Racism finds positives in not a singular study. But is repeatedly backed up by newer studies.
  • Bias: Several of these studies have large sample sizes. Greatly reducing risk of bias. Furthermore, Virtually every study comes to the same conclusion. So the risk of selective reporting is really small. Same goes for the risk of sampling bias.
  • Testing by Several Independant Teams: Systemic Racism in the US, has been investigated by pretty much every legal and sociological institute in the US.

It really doesn't support your argument at all.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#164  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

@zaryia:

Your opinion means absolutely nothing. I can link dozens more. There's quite a few papers on systemic racism. You're just simply objectively wrong on this issue.

You can link dozens more of trash agenda driven studies. It won't change the fact that none of them have any credibility

This is arm-chair garbage. You can't just say the above and poof it's magically true. Prove the ones I linked were fake.

@silentchief said:

Again you can link dozens of bias studies with no counter studies all you want, it doesn't change the fact that they have little to know credibility.

This is arm-chair garbage. You can't just say the above and poof it's magically true. Prove the ones I linked were fake.

@silentchief said:

just not the way you think it does.

Yes it does.

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library
  • The impact of racism on the future health of adults: protocol for a prospective cohort study | BMC Public Health | Full Text (biomedcentral.com)
  • How Structural Racism Works — Racist Policies as a Root Cause of U.S. Racial Health Inequities | NEJM
  • Addressing bias and knowledge gaps regarding race and ethnicity in neonatology manuscript review | Journal of Perinatology (nature.com)

(I can keep going btw).

Saying racism doesn't exist (against minorities) is like saying Covid is a nothingburger, Vaccines don't work, Climate Change is fake, the Earth is flat, Jan 6th was a peaceful protest, Abortion isn't a vital healthcare procedure, Trump won 2020, and SEL doesn't work.

But hey, saying facts aren't facts and then wanting to put up the 10 commandments is.....lol?

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#165 Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:

@zaryia:

Your opinion means absolutely nothing. I can link dozens more. There's quite a few papers on systemic racism. You're just simply objectively wrong on this issue.

You can link dozens more of trash agenda driven studies. It won't change the fact that none of them have any credibility

This is arm-chair garbage. You can't just say the above and poof it's magically true. Prove the ones I linked were fake.

@silentchief said:

Again you can link dozens of bias studies with no counter studies all you want, it doesn't change the fact that they have little to know credibility.

This is arm-chair garbage. You can't just say the above and poof it's magically true. Prove the ones I linked were fake.

@silentchief said:

just not the way you think it does.

Yes it does.

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library
  • The impact of racism on the future health of adults: protocol for a prospective cohort study | BMC Public Health | Full Text (biomedcentral.com)
  • How Structural Racism Works — Racist Policies as a Root Cause of U.S. Racial Health Inequities | NEJM
  • Addressing bias and knowledge gaps regarding race and ethnicity in neonatology manuscript review | Journal of Perinatology (nature.com)

(I can keep going btw).

Saying racism doesn't exist (against minorities) is like saying Covid is a nothingburger, Vaccines don't work, Climate Change is fake, the Earth is flat, Jan 6th was a peaceful protest, Abortion isn't a vital healthcare procedure, Trump won 2020, and SEL doesn't work.

But hey, saying facts aren't facts and then wanting to put up the 10 commandments is.....lol?

You can continue to spam the sane worthless studies all you want. It's also not an arm chair theory that most studies are False.

Racism exist period. It doesn't exist in a way where most personal failures should be blamed on the system.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#166  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@Maroxad said:

@zaryia smh, he is not only arguing using feelings and anecdotes, against your facts. But he is flat out attacking the notion of empiricism itself.

The guy became a living incarnate of the GTA's satire of conservatives.

@silentchief said:

Studies aren't facts, matter of fact most are False.

Having actually read that study...

  • False Positives: Yes, if a Single Study says something, take it with a grain of salt. However, you probably noticed that your opponents dont cite a single study, no they cite multiple. Systemic Racism finds positives in not a singular study. But is repeatedly backed up by newer studies.
  • Bias: Several of these studies have large sample sizes. Greatly reducing risk of bias. Furthermore, Virtually every study comes to the same conclusion. So the risk of selective reporting is really small. Same goes for the risk of sampling bias.
  • Testing by Several Independant Teams: Systemic Racism in the US, has been investigated by pretty much every legal and sociological institute in the US.

It really doesn't support your argument at all.

Studies aren't facts as a I have already proven.

We can't provide counter studies because they don't exist. That should be telling in itself. Using " personal surveys" as evidence isn't reliable data.

Avatar image for LJS9502_basic
LJS9502_basic

178860

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#167 LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 178860 Posts

@silentchief said:

You can continue to spam the sane worthless studies all you want. It's also not an arm chair theory that most studies are False.

Racism exist period. It doesn't exist in a way where most personal failures should be blamed on the system.

Doesn't sound like you understood your link TBH.

Systemic racism exists. It's not hard even for someone that hasn't done a study to see if they don't go into it with bias as you're doing.

Heck I'll give you a simple action, banning books about race, refusing to teach the history of race relations. This is done at government levels and thus, systematic.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#168  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:

You can continue to spam the sane worthless studies all you want. It's also not an arm chair theory that most studies are False.

Racism exist period. It doesn't exist in a way where most personal failures should be blamed on the system.

Doesn't sound like you understood your link TBH.

Systemic racism exists. It's not hard even for someone that hasn't done a study to see if they don't go into it with bias as you're doing.

Heck I'll give you a simple action, banning books about race, refusing to teach the history of race relations. This is done at government levels and thus, systematic.

I did actually. It simply states that most studies are unreliable.

Considering their isn't a single attempt at a counter study that would confirm there is bias.

Except they still teach about all of those things. The things the left continually says are banned in schools are not banned. DEI programs are done at the Government level would you consider that systemic racism?

Avatar image for Maroxad
Maroxad

23963

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#169 Maroxad
Member since 2007 • 23963 Posts

@silentchief said:

Studies aren't facts as a I have already proven.

We can't provide counter studies because they don't exist. That should be telling in itself. Using " person surveys" as evidence isn't reliable data.

You didn't prove anything.

That said, you are correct that studies are not facts in of themselves, they evidence and from this evidence we can derive facts. This is how academia, including what is taught in school, operates. In academia, researchers derive conclusions from evidence, they do not look for narratives and try to justify them. As it happens. There is an overwhelming amount of evidence from multiple papers across research institutes throughout the entire country, all arriving to the same conclusion using different methodologies.

Do you not realize what a massive red flag "We can't provide counter studies because they don't exist." is? That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without it. We have provided plenty of evidence through our links, you have provided a few anecdotes at best. But you mostly just bury your head in the sand.

Now, tell me. Why do you want academia to stray from academic methods? Personally, I want kids to be taught the most accurate information they can in school. Regardless of whether I agree or disagree with the conclusions.

Avatar image for Maroxad
Maroxad

23963

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#170  Edited By Maroxad
Member since 2007 • 23963 Posts
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:

You can continue to spam the sane worthless studies all you want. It's also not an arm chair theory that most studies are False.

Racism exist period. It doesn't exist in a way where most personal failures should be blamed on the system.

Doesn't sound like you understood your link TBH.

Systemic racism exists. It's not hard even for someone that hasn't done a study to see if they don't go into it with bias as you're doing.

Heck I'll give you a simple action, banning books about race, refusing to teach the history of race relations. This is done at government levels and thus, systematic.

I did actually. It simply states that most studies are unreliable.

Considering their isn't a single attempt at a counter study that would confirm there is bias.

Except they still teach about all of those things. The things the left continually says are banned in schools are not banned. DEI programs are done at the Government level would you consider that systemic racism?

No it doesn't. The study concludes that most studies have false conclusions, but the study itself is about the why's and what studies are at risk. The paper is also nearly 2 decades old, and the scientific method has seen developments since then. None of the stuff mentioned in the study, applies to any of Zaryia's links. So the study doesnt apply at all.

However, being false doesn't mean they can't still be useful. Approximations get better over time with better instruments. And some can be more wrong than others. If virtually every study comes to the same conclusion. Then, said conclusion is extremely likely to be true.

I get that scientific literacy pretty uncommon, and unless you have a background in STEM like me and LJS, it is unlikely one is scientifically literate. But at least be honest with yourself.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#171  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:
@Maroxad said:

@zaryia smh, he is not only arguing using feelings and anecdotes, against your facts. But he is flat out attacking the notion of empiricism itself.

The guy became a living incarnate of the GTA's satire of conservatives.

@silentchief said:

Studies aren't facts, matter of fact most are False.

Having actually read that study...

  • False Positives: Yes, if a Single Study says something, take it with a grain of salt. However, you probably noticed that your opponents dont cite a single study, no they cite multiple. Systemic Racism finds positives in not a singular study. But is repeatedly backed up by newer studies.
  • Bias: Several of these studies have large sample sizes. Greatly reducing risk of bias. Furthermore, Virtually every study comes to the same conclusion. So the risk of selective reporting is really small. Same goes for the risk of sampling bias.
  • Testing by Several Independant Teams: Systemic Racism in the US, has been investigated by pretty much every legal and sociological institute in the US.

It really doesn't support your argument at all.

Studies aren't facts as a I have already proven.

This isn't a real debate tactic when there's a large amount of studies showing the same thing.

With this logic SargentD can tell me Vaccines are fake, Climate change is fake, Covid is fake, SEL is fake, etc. When I refute him with dozens of studies he can just post what you posted.

You have to actually all of refute the links.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#172  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:
@Maroxad said:

@zaryia smh, he is not only arguing using feelings and anecdotes, against your facts. But he is flat out attacking the notion of empiricism itself.

The guy became a living incarnate of the GTA's satire of conservatives.

@silentchief said:

Studies aren't facts, matter of fact most are False.

Having actually read that study...

  • False Positives: Yes, if a Single Study says something, take it with a grain of salt. However, you probably noticed that your opponents dont cite a single study, no they cite multiple. Systemic Racism finds positives in not a singular study. But is repeatedly backed up by newer studies.
  • Bias: Several of these studies have large sample sizes. Greatly reducing risk of bias. Furthermore, Virtually every study comes to the same conclusion. So the risk of selective reporting is really small. Same goes for the risk of sampling bias.
  • Testing by Several Independant Teams: Systemic Racism in the US, has been investigated by pretty much every legal and sociological institute in the US.

It really doesn't support your argument at all.

Studies aren't facts as a I have already proven.

This isn't a real debate tactic when there's a large amount of studies showing the same thing.

With this logic SargentD can tell me Vaccines are fake, Climate change is fake, Covid is fake, SEL is fake, etc. When I refute him with dozens of studies he can just post what you posted.

You have to actually all of refute the links.

I can look at the individual studies.

" personal surveys" are not a reliable. One of the surveys based it's data off the fact " more black people said they experienced Racism, including microagressons( a bullshit term leftist snowflakes came up with). 🤣

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#173  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@Maroxad said:
@silentchief said:
@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:

You can continue to spam the sane worthless studies all you want. It's also not an arm chair theory that most studies are False.

Racism exist period. It doesn't exist in a way where most personal failures should be blamed on the system.

Doesn't sound like you understood your link TBH.

Systemic racism exists. It's not hard even for someone that hasn't done a study to see if they don't go into it with bias as you're doing.

Heck I'll give you a simple action, banning books about race, refusing to teach the history of race relations. This is done at government levels and thus, systematic.

I did actually. It simply states that most studies are unreliable.

Considering their isn't a single attempt at a counter study that would confirm there is bias.

Except they still teach about all of those things. The things the left continually says are banned in schools are not banned. DEI programs are done at the Government level would you consider that systemic racism?

No it doesn't. The study concludes that most studies have false conclusions, but the study itself is about the why's and what studies are at risk. The paper is also nearly 2 decades old, and the scientific method has seen developments since then. None of the stuff mentioned in the study, applies to any of Zaryia's links. So the study doesnt apply at all.

However, being false doesn't mean they can't still be useful. Approximations get better over time with better instruments. And some can be more wrong than others. If virtually every study comes to the same conclusion. Then, said conclusion is extremely likely to be true.

I get that scientific literacy pretty uncommon, and unless you have a background in STEM like me and LJS, it is unlikely one is scientifically literate. But at least be honest with yourself.

If they have false conclusions that would mean they are unreliable.

Again I read some of the studies he posted. Using a personal survey " as data" isn't reliable. That tells me that more black people feel like they experienced racism it doesn't tell me that racism was actually present.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#174 Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts

@silentchief said:

I can look at the individual studies.

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library
  • The impact of racism on the future health of adults: protocol for a prospective cohort study | BMC Public Health | Full Text (biomedcentral.com)
  • How Structural Racism Works — Racist Policies as a Root Cause of U.S. Racial Health Inequities | NEJM
  • Addressing bias and knowledge gaps regarding race and ethnicity in neonatology manuscript review | Journal of Perinatology (nature.com)

Refute each one with counter citation, directly stating how it's wrong.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#175  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia: I told you the flaws in several of them. A survey isn't reliable data. That simply tells me blacks are more likely to feel like they experienced racism. Not that it was the actual cause.

If someone is passed up on a promotion the person " surveyed could cite racism " and the study would count that. We don't know if that was the actual reason though.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#176  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

@zaryia: I told you the flaws in several of them.

I gave you 10 links and can heavily expand the list. You gave me one baseless opinion one of them.

Surveys used in peer reviewed studies are not always inherently flawed, unless you can tell me what went wrong in the methodology page. Prove it for that one in particular, and then get to work for the other 9 links. You're still 0/10.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#177  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:

@zaryia: I told you the flaws in several of them.

I gave you 10 links and can heavily expand the list. You gave me 1 opinion one of them.

Surveys used in peer reviewed studies are no inherently flawed, unless you can tell me what went wrong in the methodology page. Prove it for that one in particular, and then get to work for the other 9 links. You're still 0/10.

I didn't give you an opinion it's a fact.

The Harvard study uses personal surveys as proof of racism. All that accurately concludes is " blacks are more likely to feel like they experienced racism. For an example if a black associate was passed on a job promotion they can cite racism as the cause. But the study doesnt dive deeper to see if that was the actual cause. They cite the opinion of the one surveyed as " proof of racism". You see no flaw in that methodology?

The police killings survey is another example where it completely ignores the per capita rate in which certain demographics commit violent crime. It ignores the link between violent crime and deadly run ins with the police.

These are just two examples I see from two of the studies. You will need to acknowledge both these studies are severely flawed before I waste my time diving deeper into the others.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#178  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@Maroxad said:
@silentchief said:

Studies aren't facts as a I have already proven.

We can't provide counter studies because they don't exist. That should be telling in itself. Using " person surveys" as evidence isn't reliable data.

You didn't prove anything.

That said, you are correct that studies are not facts in of themselves, they evidence and from this evidence we can derive facts. This is how academia, including what is taught in school, operates. In academia, researchers derive conclusions from evidence, they do not look for narratives and try to justify them. As it happens. There is an overwhelming amount of evidence from multiple papers across research institutes throughout the entire country, all arriving to the same conclusion using different methodologies.

Do you not realize what a massive red flag "We can't provide counter studies because they don't exist." is? That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without it. We have provided plenty of evidence through our links, you have provided a few anecdotes at best. But you mostly just bury your head in the sand.

Now, tell me. Why do you want academia to stray from academic methods? Personally, I want kids to be taught the most accurate information they can in school. Regardless of whether I agree or disagree with the conclusions.

You need to look how thst evidence is provided. Is it reliable evidence?

I want academia to be open and support studies from different viewpoints. That is not how we currently operate. You can be black balled from your community for even attempting certain counter studies. That in itself is concerning.

Avatar image for LJS9502_basic
LJS9502_basic

178860

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#179  Edited By LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 178860 Posts
@silentchief said:

You need to look how thst evidence is provided. Is it reliable evidence?

I want academia to be open and support studies from different viewpoints. That is not how we currently operate. You can be black balled from your community for even attempting certain counter studies. That in itself is concerning.

Why are your opinions emotion based?

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#180  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:

@zaryia: I told you the flaws in several of them.

I gave you 10 links and can heavily expand the list. You gave me 1 opinion one of them.

Surveys used in peer reviewed studies are no inherently flawed, unless you can tell me what went wrong in the methodology page. Prove it for that one in particular, and then get to work for the other 9 links. You're still 0/10.

I didn't give you an opinion

You're literally giving me your opinion on the study. Surveys aren't inherently false, and for this particular one you would have to cite what's incorrect in the methodology page.

@silentchief said:

The police killings survey

It ignores the link between violent crime and deadly run ins with the police.

It's not a survey. Don't gas light. Also you're wrong,

Table 2provides odds ratios (OR), 95% confidence intervals, and significance thresholds from multilevel binary logit estimates. ORs greater than one represent a positive association, while ORs less than one represent a negative association with each behavioral outcome. For example, between 2013 and 2021, the odds of victims exhibiting signs of mental illness during encounters havedeclinedby around 10% each year (OR = .908; p< .001). Conversely, odds of victims being armed (OR = 1.070) or fleeing the scene (OR = 1.116) haveincreasedeach year (p< .001). The age of the victim is also a significant predictor of each outcome (p< .001). Older age predicts greater odds of exhibiting mental illness (OR = 1.017) and being armed at the scene (OR = 1.014), but lower odds of fleeing the scene (OR = .966). Relative to female victims, male victims also have significantly greater odds of being armed (OR = 1.699; p< .001) and fleeing the scene (OR = 1.418; p< .05).

The bottom of Table 2 displays coefficients by race. Relative to their White peers, Black victims have 60% lower odds of exhibiting mental illness (OR = .402; p < .001), 17% lower odds of being armed at the scene (OR = .826; p < .01), but 28% greater odds of fleeing the scene (OR = 1.279; p < .01). Hispanic victims also have 45% lower odds of exhibiting mental illness relative to Whites (OR = .545; p < .001), but otherwise are comparable. When comparing Hispanic and Black victims, Hispanic victims have 35% greater odds of exhibiting mental illness (p < .01), 18% lower odds of fleeing the scene (p < .05), but similar odds of being armed (not shown). These racial patterns hold regardless of the year of the encounter, age of victim, gender of victim, and the geographical clustering of encounters.Figures 1 through 3 plot racial differences in behaviors as average marginal probabilities, with covariates held at their respective means. Figure 1 shows that White victims have a 32% predicted probability of exhibiting mental illness, while Black and Hispanic victims have respective probabilities of 16% and 21%. In Figure 2, White victims have an 80% predicted probability of being armed, while Black and Hispanic victims have respective probabilities of 77% and 78%. Finally, Figure 3 shows that Black victims have the highest average probability of fleeing the scene at 33%, followed by Hispanic (29%) and White (28%) victims.

In a nationwide database of police killings between 2013 and 2021, I found that Black victims of police killings were overrepresented, and their White peers underrepresented, relative to the general US population. I also found that Black victims were less likely than their White peers to exhibit signs of mental illness or be armed at the scene of their killings, and more likely to flee the scene. Hispanics were less likely than Whites to exhibit signs of mental illness, but no more or less likely to be armed or flee. All the above patterns persisted even after accounting for heterogeneity by state, zip code, and neighborhood type in which fatal encounters occurred.This study provides rigorous and compelling evidence of systemic racism in police killings across the United States. Data for this study encompassed all 50 states and the Washington, D.C. area; over 4,000 five-digit zip codes; and a mix of suburban, urban, and rural neighborhoods. Despite such geographic heterogeneity, White victims appeared to pose greater threats to the safety of police officers than Black or Hispanic victims, yet also were underrepresented in police killings relative to the general US population.

Put another way, the threshold for being perceived as dangerous, and thereby falling victim to lethal police force, appears to be higher for White civilians relative to their Black or Hispanic peers. These findings are consistent with the notion of systemic pro-White/anti-Black racism in policing nationwide.This study has broader implications for policing, policymaking, and public health. First, current findings are supportive of campaigns to diversify and retrain police officers in efforts to curb racial disparities in the use of lethal police force. For example, other studies have found that Black and Hispanic officers tend to use less force and make fewer stops or arrests, relative to their White peers, especially in majority-Black or Hispanic neighborhoods (Ba et al., 2021; Legewie & Fagan, 2016). The present study suggests that Black and Hispanic officers may be more understanding of the skepticism and fear that POC civilians express toward police officers, given the racist legacies of policing in our country (Alexander, 2010; Gruber, 2021). Thus, police officers—especially White officers—should be better trained on how to anticipate and manage, without lethal force, Black and Hispanic civilians who express hostility or trepidation toward them.

@silentchief said:

You will need to acknowledge both these studies are severely flawed

Two peer reviewed studies are not deeply flawed because a random person on a gaming forum said so. That's asinine.

@silentchief said:

before I waste my time diving deeper into the others.

You're just going to say some fake bullshit about them not counting like you did with the above 2. Wasting everyone's time, again.

You need to provide counter citation in the form of a peer reviewed study for each. If it wasn't peer reviewed. But then you still need high fact citation. Good luck.

Avatar image for Maroxad
Maroxad

23963

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#181  Edited By Maroxad
Member since 2007 • 23963 Posts
@silentchief said:

You need to look how thst evidence is provided. Is it reliable evidence?

I want academia to be open and support studies from different viewpoints. That is not how we currently operate. You can be black balled from your community for even attempting certain counter studies. That in itself is concerning.

Yes it is, on their own, none of them would be sufficient, but put together, all provide a very strong body of evidence. Much better than the feelings based arguments you provide. Which ammounts to less than nothing.

If you really want to see studies to support your agenda, you can always fund them yourself. As long as they are done in good faith and adhere to academic standards, I would welcome them. However, the way you phrase this, implies that you don't want studies, you want propaganda pieces masquerading as studies. Science doesnt start with conclusions. Propaganda does.

And the Harvard study involves reports of discrimination. And the methodology was done scientifically. So it counts. Certainly beats your conspiracy theories and victimhood mentality.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#182  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@Maroxad said:
@silentchief said:

You need to look how thst evidence is provided. Is it reliable evidence?

I want academia to be open and support studies from different viewpoints. That is not how we currently operate. You can be black balled from your community for even attempting certain counter studies. That in itself is concerning.

Yes it is, on their own, none of them would be sufficient, but put together, all provide a very strong body of evidence. Much better than the feelings based arguments you provide. Which ammounts to less than nothing.

If you really want to see studies to support your agenda, you can always fund them yourself. As long as they are done in good faith and adhere to academic standards, I would welcome them. However, the way you phrase this, implies that you don't want studies, you want propaganda pieces masquerading as studies. Science doesnt start with conclusions. Propaganda does.

And the Harvard study involves reports of discrimination. And the methodology was done scientifically. So it counts. Certainly beats your conspiracy theories and victimhood mentality.

But it isn't certainly not in the examples I provided. Nothing about my arguments is based off feelings. Matter of fact several studies he posted are using " feelings " as evidence.

I shouldn't have to fund a study myself, they should be easily accessible, this isn't happening though. When you look at certain fields of study the agenda is identical. Their are no counter studies which should be common practice

Yes, but how is that proof of racism? Again the only thing that proves is " blacks are more likely to " reports discrimination". That is no surprise to me nor anyone. But did they actually investigate the reports to see if they were valid? Is their proof that what they felt was discrimination was in fact because off racism? They don't dive into that and make no effort to do so.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#183  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia:

It's not a survey.Don't gas light. Also you're wrong,

That was a typo. Meant to say study. The Harvard study did use surveys . No I wasn't wrong about them completely ignoring per a capita crime numbers of certain demographics.

It than spends the majority of the study focusing on " perceived mental illness". No mention of how certain cultures may deal with the police while being approached. Their findings also directly contradict FBI data.

Put another way, the threshold for being perceived as dangerous, and thereby falling victim to lethal police force, appears to be higher for White civilians relative to their Black or Hispanic peers

Geee, that wouldn't have anything to do with the fact blacks are vastly over represented in violent crime would it? They don't care though let's just call it RAAAACIST!

@zaryia:

Two peer reviewed studies are not deeply flawed because a random person on a gaming forum said so. That's asinine.

I gave my reasoning for it and it's valid.

@zaryia:

You're just going to say some fake bullshit about them not counting like you did with the above 2. Wasting everyone's time, again.

You need to provide counter citation in the form of a peer reviewed study for each. If it wasn't peer reviewed. But then you still need high fact citation. Good luck

Nah if there's valid data that's actually given with proper context then I will acknowledge it.

Again you want a counter study but they don't fund counter studies because it doesnt fit the agenda.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#184 Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:

You need to look how thst evidence is provided. Is it reliable evidence?

I want academia to be open and support studies from different viewpoints. That is not how we currently operate. You can be black balled from your community for even attempting certain counter studies. That in itself is concerning.

Why are your opinions emotion based?

Their not emotion based at all.

I like to look at things in context.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#185  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

Nah

Saying "Nah" in response to 10 sources to my claim is taking an L.

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library
  • The impact of racism on the future health of adults: protocol for a prospective cohort study | BMC Public Health | Full Text (biomedcentral.com)
  • How Structural Racism Works — Racist Policies as a Root Cause of U.S. Racial Health Inequities | NEJM
  • Addressing bias and knowledge gaps regarding race and ethnicity in neonatology manuscript review | Journal of Perinatology (nature.com)

You lose this debate unless every source is refuted, directly, with equal level citation. You're struggling here.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#186  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:

Nah

Saying "Nah" in response to 10 sources to my claim is taking an L.

  • Systemic racism: individuals and interactions, institutions and society | Cognitive Research: Principles and Implications | Full Text (springeropen.com)
  • Studies find evidence of systemic racial discrimination across multiple domains in the United States – Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies
  • Systemic Racism in Police Killings: New Evidence From the Mapping Police Violence Database, 2013–2021 - Reed T. DeAngelis, 2021 (sagepub.com)
  • Diagnosing and Treating Systemic Racism | NEJM
  • Marijuana’s racist history shows the need for comprehensive drug reform (brookings.edu)
  • Systemic-Racism-and-SUDs.pdf (marylandmacs.org)
  • The boundaries of confusion: Gerrymandering and racial disparities in state House and congressional district line congruity - Niven - 2022 - Social Science Quarterly - Wiley Online Library
  • The impact of racism on the future health of adults: protocol for a prospective cohort study | BMC Public Health | Full Text (biomedcentral.com)
  • How Structural Racism Works — Racist Policies as a Root Cause of U.S. Racial Health Inequities | NEJM
  • Addressing bias and knowledge gaps regarding race and ethnicity in neonatology manuscript review | Journal of Perinatology (nature.com)

You lose this debate unless every source is refuted, directly, with equal level citation. You're struggling here.

Reposting the same shit without acknowledging any of its flaws is a waste if time. We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down. The reality is if you suck in this day and age its your fault nobody else's. Reports of discrimination is not proof of racism.

Avatar image for LJS9502_basic
LJS9502_basic

178860

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#187 LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 178860 Posts

@silentchief said:

Reposting the same shit without acknowledging any of its flaws is a waste if time. We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down. The reality is if you suck in this day and age its your fault nobody else's. Reports of discrimination is not proof of racism.

LOL. Discrimination is the act of making distinctions between people based on the groups, classes, or other categories to which they belong or are perceived to belong that are disadvantageous. --Amnesty International. October 13, 2020. Discrimination occurs when a person is unable to enjoy his or her human rights or other legal rights on an equal basis with others because of an unjustified distinction made in policy, law or treatment.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#188  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

Reposting the same shit

I'm going to keep fucking reposting it until you refute them all with citation. In fact, you know what I'll post completely different ones this time to show you how bad you're getting obliterated here.

  • Frontiers | Racism and Structural Violence: Interconnected Threats to Health Equity (frontiersin.org)
  • Structural integrity: Recognizing, measuring, and addressing systemic racism and its health impacts - eClinicalMedicine (thelancet.com)
  • OSF Preprints | Systemic racial disparities in funding rates at the National Science Foundation
  • Race and Redistricting | Annual Review of Political Science (annualreviews.org)

  • Racial and Economic Foundations of Municipal Redistricting | Social Problems | Oxford Academic (oup.com)

That's 13 now.

This literally reminds me of climate change debates were I'd post 10+ studies and the climate denier would respond with the same dumb bullshit you are. Absolutely getting creamed with no tangible response. Systemic Racism is objectively a real thing.

@silentchief said:

We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down.

Stupid Tuckeresque straw-man. Just because I agree with the fact systemic racism exists (because it does) doesn't mean I think all white people are evil and trying to bring down "brown" people. It's fine to debate how pervasive it is, but to say it isn't real is nuts.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#189  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:

Reposting the same shit without acknowledging any of its flaws is a waste if time. We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down. The reality is if you suck in this day and age its your fault nobody else's. Reports of discrimination is not proof of racism.

LOL. Discrimination is the act of making distinctions between people based on the groups, classes, or other categories to which they belong or are perceived to belong that are disadvantageous. --Amnesty International. October 13, 2020. Discrimination occurs when a person is unable to enjoy his or her human rights or other legal rights on an equal basis with

others because of an unjustified distinction made in policy, law or treatment.

Yup. I have no clue why he even posted this.

Discrimination Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster

: prejudiced or prejudicial outlook, action, or treatment

racial discrimination

.....Oh god now we're going to get into a war against Dictionaries again. Pretty sure the same poster got into it against dictionaries for the word "ban" and "gender". Lmao.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#190 Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia said:
@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:

Reposting the same shit without acknowledging any of its flaws is a waste if time. We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down. The reality is if you suck in this day and age its your fault nobody else's. Reports of discrimination is not proof of racism.

LOL. Discrimination is the act of making distinctions between people based on the groups, classes, or other categories to which they belong or are perceived to belong that are disadvantageous. --Amnesty International. October 13, 2020. Discrimination occurs when a person is unable to enjoy his or her human rights or other legal rights on an equal basis with

others because of an unjustified distinction made in policy, law or treatment.

Yup. I have no clue why he even posted this.

Discrimination Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster

: prejudiced or prejudicial outlook, action, or treatment

racial discrimination

.....Oh god now we're going to get into a war against Dictionaries again. Pretty sure the same poster got into it against dictionaries for the word "ban" and "gender". Lmao.

I'm literally talking about the very study you posted , follow along for **** sake 🤣.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#191  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:

Reposting the same shit

I'm going to keep fucking reposting it until you refute them all with citation. In fact, you know what I'll post completely different ones this time to show you how bad you're getting obliterated here.

  • Frontiers | Racism and Structural Violence: Interconnected Threats to Health Equity (frontiersin.org)
  • Structural integrity: Recognizing, measuring, and addressing systemic racism and its health impacts - eClinicalMedicine (thelancet.com)
  • OSF Preprints | Systemic racial disparities in funding rates at the National Science Foundation
  • Race and Redistricting | Annual Review of Political Science (annualreviews.org)

  • Racial and Economic Foundations of Municipal Redistricting | Social Problems | Oxford Academic (oup.com)

That's 13 now.

This literally reminds me of climate change debates were I'd post 10+ studies and the climate denier would respond with the same dumb bullshit you are. Absolutely getting creamed with no tangible response. Systemic Racism is objectively a real thing.

@silentchief said:

We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down.

Stupid Tuckeresque straw-man. Just because I agree with the fact systemic racism exists (because it does) doesn't mean I think all white people are evil and trying to bring down "brown" people. It's fine to debate how pervasive it is, but to say it isn't real is nuts.

Lol keep posting it it won't change the fact they are trash studies.

Here's a quote from one you just posted.

. As a collective of women of color, anti-racist health scholars we unequivocally assert that America is, and has always been, a racist country.

Bahaha. Do you honestly think anyone should take this trash seriously?

Avatar image for Maroxad
Maroxad

23963

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#192  Edited By Maroxad
Member since 2007 • 23963 Posts
@silentchief said:

Reposting the same shit without acknowledging any of its flaws is a waste if time. We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down. The reality is if you suck in this day and age its your fault nobody else's. Reports of discrimination is not proof of racism.

First of all, unless you are in mathematics, you do not deal with proofs. You deal with evidence. I get this is a very common mistake among laypersons, but it kinda bothers me how people such as yourself are trying to tell us how to do our job, yet you continue to make amateur mistakes like this.

And second, reports of discrimination is very strong evidence. Correlation doesnt equate to causation, but reports are like this are a smoking gun. It is a good indication that there is explicit discriminiation going on. Either way, we have mountains of evidence for,

  • Court rulings
  • Stop and Frisk
  • Reports of Systemic Discrimination
  • Politicians actively censoring historically accurate history because of their feelings
  • Urban Planning explicitly detrimental to people of certain races

Whereas you have nothing but emotional appeals and racist dogwhistles.

The Court rulings in particular is where this is probably shown the strongest, here is a quote from this Harvard Law School study

In addition to being overrepresented relative to their share of the state population, Black and Latinx people are less likely than White people to have their cases resolved through less severe dispositions such as pretrial probation or continuances without finding (CWOFs). Among those sentenced to incarceration, Black and Latinx people sentenced to incarceration receive longer sentences than their White counterparts, with Black people receiving sentences that are an average of 168 days longer and Latinx people receiving sentences that are an average of 148 days longer.

Good luck trying to dogwhistle yourself out of this one. You tried to do that earlier in this thread (post 149) and you failed. But you need to address the actual court rulings themselves, there is no excuse for what we see here.

I am not a scientist, I am an engineer, but I do know someone who has a full scientific background, @horgen. And I am pretty sure he would agree, that your blatant dismissal of studies and academic evidence (especially because of who conducted the studies), is as anti-scientific as it gets.

Edit: And now you are literally dismissing a study because it came from a minority. Might as well add Genetic fallacies to all the other logical fallacies you commit. In your long list of logical fallacies you use to justify your denial, what is one more?

Avatar image for tjandmia
tjandmia

3741

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#193 tjandmia
Member since 2017 • 3741 Posts

@silentchief: the country was literally founded by white slaveowners. We can quibble over what “the country” means, but it’s pretty clear that racism is everywhere.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#194  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

Bahaha. Do you honestly think anyone should take this trash seriously?

Most of Americans? (60%)

‘A country on fire’: New poll finds America polarized over culture, race and ‘woke’ (yahoo.com)

@silentchiefsaid:

Lol keep posting it it won't change the fact they are trash studies.

Garbage opinion. Provide counter studies.

You have to actually refute them all of my 13 studies with data through citation. I'll give you a few specific examples of what you need to refute for some of them or show a study that simply has conflicting data:

One,

Table 2provides odds ratios (OR), 95% confidence intervals, and significance thresholds from multilevel binary logit estimates. ORs greater than one represent a positive association, while ORs less than one represent a negative association with each behavioral outcome. For example, between 2013 and 2021, the odds of victims exhibiting signs of mental illness during encounters havedeclinedby around 10% each year (OR = .908; p< .001). Conversely, odds of victims being armed (OR = 1.070) or fleeing the scene (OR = 1.116) haveincreasedeach year (p< .001). The age of the victim is also a significant predictor of each outcome (p< .001). Older age predicts greater odds of exhibiting mental illness (OR = 1.017) and being armed at the scene (OR = 1.014), but lower odds of fleeing the scene (OR = .966). Relative to female victims, male victims also have significantly greater odds of being armed (OR = 1.699; p< .001) and fleeing the scene (OR = 1.418; p< .05).

The bottom of Table 2 displays coefficients by race. Relative to their White peers, Black victims have 60% lower odds of exhibiting mental illness (OR = .402; p < .001), 17% lower odds of being armed at the scene (OR = .826; p < .01), but 28% greater odds of fleeing the scene (OR = 1.279; p < .01). Hispanic victims also have 45% lower odds of exhibiting mental illness relative to Whites (OR = .545; p < .001), but otherwise are comparable. When comparing Hispanic and Black victims, Hispanic victims have 35% greater odds of exhibiting mental illness (p < .01), 18% lower odds of fleeing the scene (p < .05), but similar odds of being armed (not shown). These racial patterns hold regardless of the year of the encounter, age of victim, gender of victim, and the geographical clustering of encounters.Figures 1 through 3 plot racial differences in behaviors as average marginal probabilities, with covariates held at their respective means. Figure 1 shows that White victims have a 32% predicted probability of exhibiting mental illness, while Black and Hispanic victims have respective probabilities of 16% and 21%. In Figure 2, White victims have an 80% predicted probability of being armed, while Black and Hispanic victims have respective probabilities of 77% and 78%. Finally, Figure 3 shows that Black victims have the highest average probability of fleeing the scene at 33%, followed by Hispanic (29%) and White (28%) victims.

In a nationwide database of police killings between 2013 and 2021, I found that Black victims of police killings were overrepresented, and their White peers underrepresented, relative to the general US population. I also found that Black victims were less likely than their White peers to exhibit signs of mental illness or be armed at the scene of their killings, and more likely to flee the scene. Hispanics were less likely than Whites to exhibit signs of mental illness, but no more or less likely to be armed or flee. All the above patterns persisted even after accounting for heterogeneity by state, zip code, and neighborhood type in which fatal encounters occurred.This study provides rigorous and compelling evidence of systemic racism in police killings across the United States. Data for this study encompassed all 50 states and the Washington, D.C. area; over 4,000 five-digit zip codes; and a mix of suburban, urban, and rural neighborhoods. Despite such geographic heterogeneity, White victims appeared to pose greater threats to the safety of police officers than Black or Hispanic victims, yet also were underrepresented in police killings relative to the general US population.

Put another way, the threshold for being perceived as dangerous, and thereby falling victim to lethal police force, appears to be higher for White civilians relative to their Black or Hispanic peers. These findings are consistent with the notion of systemic pro-White/anti-Black racism in policing nationwide.This study has broader implications for policing, policymaking, and public health. First, current findings are supportive of campaigns to diversify and retrain police officers in efforts to curb racial disparities in the use of lethal police force. For example, other studies have found that Black and Hispanic officers tend to use less force and make fewer stops or arrests, relative to their White peers, especially in majority-Black or Hispanic neighborhoods (Ba et al., 2021; Legewie & Fagan, 2016). The present study suggests that Black and Hispanic officers may be more understanding of the skepticism and fear that POC civilians express toward police officers, given the racist legacies of policing in our country (Alexander, 2010; Gruber, 2021). Thus, police officers—especially White officers—should be better trained on how to anticipate and manage, without lethal force, Black and Hispanic civilians who express hostility or trepidation toward them.

Two,

The relationship between U.S. House of Representatives districts and state House of Representatives districts varies widely across the nation and within individual states.1 In Iowa, every state House district is entirely nested within one U.S. House district, meaning there are no unnecessary overlaps between districts at the state and federal levels. In the districts in place from 2012 to 2022 in South Carolina, by contrast, U.S. House districts unnecessarily overlap with a number that varies between 1 and 17 state House districts.2

Congressional districts that coincide with state legislative districts make it easier for voters to cast informed ballots, facilitate political mobilization and coordination among parties and candidates, and encourage cooperation among officeholders (e.g., Bibby and Maisel 2002; Carson et al. 2011, 2012). Conversely, voters in congressional districts that unnecessarily overlap with many state House districts share the same federal and state representation with fewer of their neighbors, a circumstance associated with less responsive government performance (Bowen 2014; Stashko 2020).

Here, we proffer the unnecessary overlap of congressional and state House districts as an indicator of gerrymandering and measure whether such overlaps are imposed in a racially disparate fashion. We find, in both bivariate and multivariate analysis, that race strongly affects the imposition of unnecessary overlaps. This suggests the drawing of incongruent district boundaries may represent a racially disparate burden on representation imposed by mapmakers.

Three,

Figure 2.

In 2019, racial disparities in funding rates corresponded to hundreds of awards in surplus to white PIs and hundreds of awards in deficit to other groups. Each box represents 10 proposals. Light gray boxes are unsuccessful proposals; colored boxes are funded proposals (awards). The black outlines represent 27.4% of the proposals submitted by each group, where 27.4% is the overall funding rate in 2019. For each group, the number of awards above (surplus) or below (deficit) this threshold is in bold. This graphic does not include proposals by multiracial PIs or PIs who did not provide their race or ethnicity.Source data: Data S1 in the accompanying data repository (https://doi.org/10.5061/dryad.2fqz612rt).The relative contributions of proposals by PIs from each group remain unchanged despite shifts in the number of pro-posals submitted by each group over time. Submissions by white PIs comprise the majority of proposals throughout the study period (Figure 1–figure supplement 2). In 2019, the competitive pool of proposals included 20,400 submissions by white PIs (66% among proposals from PIs who identified their race); 9,241 by Asian PIs (29%); 1,549 by Hispanic or Latino PIs (5%); 929 by Black/AA PIs (3%); 99 by AI/AN PIs (0.3%); and 47 by NH/PI PIs (0.2%) (Figure 2). Groups with fewer proposals experiencedthe greatest year-to-year variability in relative funding rates.These persistent funding rate disparities are realized as large differences in the absolute number of proposals awarded to PIs in each group. For example, of the 41,024 proposals considered in 2019, the NSF selected 11,243 for funding, or 27.4%. Proposals by white PIs were funded above this overall rate at 31.3%, yielding 6,389 awards (Figure 2). If pro-posals by white PIs had been funded instead at the overall rate of 27.4%, only 5,591 proposals would have been awarded. Thus, an “award surplus” of 798 awards was made to white PIs above the overall funding rate in 2019. In contrast, proposals submitted by the next largest racial group, Asian PIs, were funded at a 22.7% rate, yielding 2,073 awards. If the funding rate for proposals by Asian PIs had been equal to the overall rate, one would instead expect Chen CY, Kahanamoku SS, Tripati A, Alegado RA, Morris VR, Andrade K, Hosbey J(2022)eLife.11:e83071. doi: https://doi.org/10.7554/eLife.8307152,505 awards, or 432 additional awards. We refer to the number of awards required to bridge such gaps in funding rate as the “award deficit

I can do this for each but it's getting too spammy.

You're deliberately ignoring the data sets which need to be proven incorrect. They are drawing their conclusions directly from the results.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#195 Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:
@zaryia said:
@LJS9502_basic said:
@silentchief said:

Reposting the same shit without acknowledging any of its flaws is a waste if time. We get it. You think the evil white man is keeping the brown people down. The reality is if you suck in this day and age its your fault nobody else's. Reports of discrimination is not proof of racism.

LOL. Discrimination is the act of making distinctions between people based on the groups, classes, or other categories to which they belong or are perceived to belong that are disadvantageous. --Amnesty International. October 13, 2020. Discrimination occurs when a person is unable to enjoy his or her human rights or other legal rights on an equal basis with

.....Oh god now we're going to get into a war against Dictionaries again. Pretty sure the same poster got into it against dictionaries for the word "ban" and "gender". Lmao.

I'm literally talking about the very study you posted , follow along for **** sake 🤣.

How is racial discrimination not racism or are we going to get into a nothing burger semantics spat again.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#196 Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts

@zaryia:

Most of Americans? (60%)

That link shows most americans do care about the culture war which directly refutes your past claims, but it certainly doesn't mean the trash study you posted by activist should be taken seriously.

@zaryia:

Garbage opinion. Provide counter studies.

Their are no counter studies! That's the point I've made to you repeatedly! They wouldn't allow anyone to do a counter study so instead you get trash studies from activist so gullible idiots can take it as fact.

@zaryia:

You're deliberately ignoring the data sets which need to be proven incorrect. They are drawing their conclusions directly from the results.

Not at all. I told you specifically what was wrong with the previous studies. Let's look at the ones you just posted.

In a nationwide database of police killings between 2013 and 2021, I found that Black victims of police killings were overrepresented, and their White peers underrepresented, relative to the general US population

No shit Sherlock. Because blacks commit a disproportionate amount of crime in relative to the rest of the population. How do they manage to leave that out the entire study?

Your second is gerrymandering bullshit which the left does often and did More than the right in the midterms. I see no outrage from you however when the left does it.

I don't know specifically what your 3rd link is referring too. But if we want to talk about funding let's use scholarships.

Would you consider this racism?

Just over 30 percent of all white students received scholarship grants based on need, compared to 52.9 percent of all black undergraduates.

If we look only those students attending four-year colleges and universities on a full-time basis, we find that 35.1 percent of white students and 26.9 percent of black students received merit-based grants. Nearly 40 percent of white students and 70.6 percent of black students received need-based financial aid.

Avatar image for silentchief
Silentchief

7001

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#197  Edited By Silentchief
Member since 2021 • 7001 Posts
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:
@zaryia said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

LOL. Discrimination is the act of making distinctions between people based on the groups, classes, or other categories to which they belong or are perceived to belong that are disadvantageous. --Amnesty International. October 13, 2020. Discrimination occurs when a person is unable to enjoy his or her human rights or other legal rights on an equal basis with

.....Oh god now we're going to get into a war against Dictionaries again. Pretty sure the same poster got into it against dictionaries for the word "ban" and "gender". Lmao.

I'm literally talking about the very study you posted , follow along for **** sake 🤣.

How is racial discrimination not racism or are we going to get into a nothing burger semantics spat again.

I'm not sure how you're struggling with this especially after my example? Let's try this again.

If a black employee is past up on a promotion or was fired , they have the right to claim " racial discrimination ". However we need proof that was the " ACTUAL REASON" they were past up on their promotion or fired.

A discrimination claim isn't proof that discrimination actually took place especially in this day and age.

Avatar image for Maroxad
Maroxad

23963

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#198 Maroxad
Member since 2007 • 23963 Posts

@silentchief said:
@zaryia said:
@silentchief said:
@zaryia said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

LOL. Discrimination is the act of making distinctions between people based on the groups, classes, or other categories to which they belong or are perceived to belong that are disadvantageous. --Amnesty International. October 13, 2020. Discrimination occurs when a person is unable to enjoy his or her human rights or other legal rights on an equal basis with

.....Oh god now we're going to get into a war against Dictionaries again. Pretty sure the same poster got into it against dictionaries for the word "ban" and "gender". Lmao.

I'm literally talking about the very study you posted , follow along for **** sake 🤣.

How is racial discrimination not racism or are we going to get into a nothing burger semantics spat again.

I'm not sure how you're struggling with this especially after my example? Let's try this again.

If a black employee is past up on a promotion or was fired , they have the right to claim " racial discrimination ". However we need proof that was the " ACTUAL REASON" they were past up on their promotion or fired.

A discrimination claim isn't proof that discrimination actually took place especially in this day and age.

Since it is obvious you are not listening to the overwhelming evidence provided by everyone else.

What, if anything, would change your mind?

Avatar image for mattbbpl
mattbbpl

23048

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#199 mattbbpl
Member since 2006 • 23048 Posts

@Maroxad: The last time I asked him that question, he ignored it when I gave him exactly what he asked for.

It's a waste of time.

Avatar image for zaryia
Zaryia

21607

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#200  Edited By Zaryia
Member since 2016 • 21607 Posts
@silentchief said:

Their are no counter studies

I know, because there isn't any counter data since it's mostly true. I googled before posting them to make sure I didn't make claims that were majorly contested or up in the air among the majority of research.

Take the L. One side has ALL the citation and the other side has ZERO citation. It doesn't get more one sided than this, and can barely even be called a real "debate".

This is NO different than evolution, climate change, vaccine, sel, 2020 election, or flat earth "debates".

@silentchief said:

Your second is gerrymandering bullshit which the left does often

So because Democrats gerrymander too, racial gerrymandering doesn't exist? In the face of overwhelming and uncontested evidence?

What the fucking shit? Yeah I'm calling it, we're done. This isn't even a real debate or even a simple argument at this point. It's mindless blabber to get the last post in.