What's wrong with Sharia?

[QUOTE="SaudiFury"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]you are just hiding your answers and the truth about sharia in taqiyya.

8.lolwut q5:33.

Riverwolf007

every time someone says "hey here is a clear black and white text saying it's cool to have sex with young girls before their first menstruation" or "here is one that says slay your enemies and your enemies are anyone not muslum" or any one of the hundreds of other things that are offensive to anyone that respects human rights the answer every time is "oh, well that does not count anymore, or it's a mistranslation or it's this or it's that and the actual meaning is the opposite of what it says there in black and white."

religious deception is built into and inseparable from islam.

as far as being at war so that taqiyya is an acceptible practice twenty bucks says you can find at least one hundred imams giving sermons on youtube claiming that there is a war going on which makes it completely acceptable to say anything you need to say to forward the cause.

all this works like a charm because westerners see a religion and say "omg! it's a religion! protect it!" when really islam is a political ideology dolled up to look like a religion.

if westerners understood both the political aspect and the precepts of taqiyya you would have a much more difficult time spreading the ideology so it makes it acceptable to do and say anything you need to say or do to protect it.

wat

Islam is a religion centered on the belief that Muhammad is the last prophet and have attained divine revelation from God, commanding him of the Five Pillars and Quran. That's it, anything else is theological development (hadith, the forbidden and hated, sunnah, hasanat from certain deeds and say'at from others), some of it is absurd, some of it is objectional, but that has nothing to do with Islam.

You don't have to grow a beard, you don't have to enforce it on other people, you don't have to establish it politically or financially (but there are some things that are forbidden such as interest "riba", hence, Islamic banks [most are bs]).

The problem with Sharia is the same problem with Islam or any religion.

Humans (governments) took a concept that's good and intelligent and turned it into something barbaric and stupid.

In real Islam you're not even allowed to kill a tree during time of war.

But they murder innocent people and say "I did this for Islam."

Or they cut off hand for stealing bread and say "This is Sharia."

Just like in America everybody say "oh we're Christian, our Lord Jesus Christ blah blah" but then support bombing third-world countries.

All hypocrits.

Nowhere in the Koran you see anything about the size of your beard, or headscarves for women.

In the Koran one of the first things it says is "This is a complete book, we did not add anything afterwards."

But you go to muslim countries, they add other books and regulations and say "This is Islam too." No it's not. You added that.

Saudi Arabia is "Muslim" like the West is "Christian" in other words it's not.

In Saudi they make you put on burka.

In America they make you take off burka.

Where is freedom? Nowhere.

What business is it of anybody what I put on my head or what clothes I wear?

Freedom is only anarchy.

And not the fake communist anarchy where the whole "community" decides how you gonna live.

America is the closest to freedom in the world but the politicians will soon fix that.

I miss and love "old" America.

New America is copy of Saudi Arabia with different customs.

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

Taqiya huh.... so were at war? are we a married couple? or are we trying to settle a dispute? For the record i'm not a big fan of Sharia law on the state level at all. and i am Muslim. and for many of the same reasons that Foxhound_Fox has been saying. SaudiFury

every time someone says "hey here is a clear black and white text saying it's cool to have sex with young girls before their first menstruation" or "here is one that says slay your enemies and your enemies are anyone not muslum" or any one of the hundreds of other things that are offensive to anyone that respects human rights the answer every time is "oh, well that does not count anymore, or it's a mistranslation or it's this or it's that and the actual meaning is the opposite of what it says there in black and white."

religious deception is built into and inseparable from islam.

as far as being at war so that taqiyya is an acceptible practice twenty bucks says you can find at least one hundred imams giving sermons on youtube claiming that there is a war going on which makes it completely acceptable to say anything you need to say to forward the cause.

all this works like a charm because westerners see a religion and say "omg! it's a religion! protect it!" when really islam is a political ideology dolled up to look like a religion.

if westerners understood both the political aspect and the precepts of taqiyya you would have a much more difficult time spreading the ideology so it makes it acceptable to do and say anything you need to say or do to protect it.

wat

Islam is a religion centered on the belief that Muhammad is the last prophet and have attained divine revelation from God, commanding him of the Five Pillars. That's it, anything else is theological development (hadith, the forbidden and hated, sunnah, hasanat from certain deeds and say'at from others), some of it is absurd, some of it is objectional, but that has nothing to do with Islam.

You don't have to grow a beard, you don't have to enforce it on other people, you don't have to establish it politically or financially (but there are some things that are forbidden such as interest "riba", hence, Islamic banks [most are bs]).

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]look man, i'm not trying to offend anyone but it's completly obvious that it is taqiyya.

every time someone says "hey here is a clear black and white text saying it's cool to have sex with young girls before their first menstruation" or "here is one that says slay your enemies and your enemies are anyone not muslum" or any one of the hundreds of other things that are offensive to anyone that respects human rights the answer every time is "oh, well that does not count anymore, or it's a mistranslation or it's this or it's that and the actual meaning is the opposite of what it says there in black and white."

religious deception is built into and inseparable from islam.

as far as being at war so that taqiyya is an acceptible practice twenty bucks says you can find at least one hundred imams giving sermons on youtube claiming that there is a war going on which makes it completely acceptable to say anything you need to say to forward the cause.

all this works like a charm because westerners see a religion and say "omg! it's a religion! protect it!" when really islam is a political ideology dolled up to look like a religion.

if westerners understood both the political aspect and the precepts of taqiyya you would have a much more difficult time spreading the ideology so it makes it acceptable to do and say anything you need to say or do to protect it.

wat

Islam is a religion centered on the belief that Muhammad is the last prophet and have attained divine revelation from God, commanding him of the Five Pillars. That's it, anything else is theological development (hadith, the forbidden and hated, sunnah, hasanat from certain deeds and say'at from others), some of it is absurd, some of it is objectional, but that has nothing to do with Islam.

You don't have to grow a beard, you don't have to enforce it on other people, you don't have to establish it politically or financially (but there are some things that are forbidden such as interest "riba", hence, Islamic banks [most are bs]).

The problem with Sharia is the same problem with Islam or any religion.

Humans (governments) took a concept that's good and intelligent and turned it into something barbaric and stupid.

In real Islam you're not even allowed to kill a tree during time of war.

But they murder innocent people and say "I did this for Islam."

Or they cut off hand for stealing bread and say "This is Sharia."

Just like in America everybody say "oh we're Christian, our Lord Jesus Christ blah blah" but then support bombing third-world countries.

All hypocrits.

Nowhere in the Koran you see anything about the size of your beard, or headscarves for women.

In the Koran one of the first things it says is "This is a complete book, we did not add anything afterwards."

But you go to muslim countries, they add other books and regulations and say "This is Islam too." No it's not. You added that.

Saudi Arabia is "Muslim" like the West is "Christian" in other words it's not.

In Saudi they make you put on burka.

In America they make you take off burka.

Where is freedom? Nowhere.

What business is it of anybody what I put on my head or what clothes I wear?

Freedom is only anarchy.

And not the fake communist anarchy where the whole "community" decides how you gonna live.

America is the closest to freedom in the world but the politicians will soon fix that.

I miss and love "old" America.

New America is copy of Saudi Arabia with different customs.

ZombieKiller7

My EXACT sentiments! How did we get here... a better question however, how do we get out of it. :P

@Frame-Dagger - Yes, that is correct, Muslims believe that anyone who enters Islam in any given stage will be under God's mercy.

[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]

The problem with Sharia is the same problem with Islam or any religion.

Humans (governments) took a concept that's good and intelligent and turned it into something barbaric and stupid.

In real Islam you're not even allowed to kill a tree during time of war.

But they murder innocent people and say "I did this for Islam."

Or they cut off hand for stealing bread and say "This is Sharia."

Just like in America everybody say "oh we're Christian, our Lord Jesus Christ blah blah" but then support bombing third-world countries.

All hypocrits.

Nowhere in the Koran you see anything about the size of your beard, or headscarves for women.

In the Koran one of the first things it says is "This is a complete book, we did not add anything afterwards."

But you go to muslim countries, they add other books and regulations and say "This is Islam too." No it's not. You added that.

Saudi Arabia is "Muslim" like the West is "Christian" in other words it's not.

In Saudi they make you put on burka.

In America they make you take off burka.

Where is freedom? Nowhere.

What business is it of anybody what I put on my head or what clothes I wear?

Freedom is only anarchy.

And not the fake communist anarchy where the whole "community" decides how you gonna live.

America is the closest to freedom in the world but the politicians will soon fix that.

I miss and love "old" America.

New America is copy of Saudi Arabia with different customs.

My EXACT sentiments! How did we get here... a better question however, how do we get out of it. :P

@Frame-Dagger - Yes, that is correct, Muslims believe that anyone who enters Islam in any given stage will be under God's mercy.

heres one thing : from wiki "Muslim theology equates apostasy to treason, and in most interpretations of sharia, the penalty for apostasy is death"

fun.

[QUOTE="Victorious_Fize"]

[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]

The problem with Sharia is the same problem with Islam or any religion.

Humans (governments) took a concept that's good and intelligent and turned it into something barbaric and stupid.

In real Islam you're not even allowed to kill a tree during time of war.

But they murder innocent people and say "I did this for Islam."

Or they cut off hand for stealing bread and say "This is Sharia."

Just like in America everybody say "oh we're Christian, our Lord Jesus Christ blah blah" but then support bombing third-world countries.

All hypocrits.

Nowhere in the Koran you see anything about the size of your beard, or headscarves for women.

In the Koran one of the first things it says is "This is a complete book, we did not add anything afterwards."

But you go to muslim countries, they add other books and regulations and say "This is Islam too." No it's not. You added that.

Saudi Arabia is "Muslim" like the West is "Christian" in other words it's not.

In Saudi they make you put on burka.

In America they make you take off burka.

Where is freedom? Nowhere.

What business is it of anybody what I put on my head or what clothes I wear?

Freedom is only anarchy.

And not the fake communist anarchy where the whole "community" decides how you gonna live.

America is the closest to freedom in the world but the politicians will soon fix that.

I miss and love "old" America.

New America is copy of Saudi Arabia with different customs.

Frame_Dragger

My EXACT sentiments! How did we get here... a better question however, how do we get out of it. :P

@Frame-Dagger - Yes, that is correct, Muslims believe that anyone who enters Islam in any given stage will be under God's mercy.

Sharia is not and should not be imposed on anyone that does not want it. Sharia (The Way) is for Muslim communities and countries that desire to live and explore a lifestyle that is in accordance with Islamic idealism (the closest to it being achieved was in anceint times from the 7th-13th century, where Turks, Persians, and Arabs of all were united under a Caliphates banner, then came the Ottoman Empire, that instilled a systematic multiconfessionalism similar to Rome) from observance of influential people in Islam (namely, the prophet Muhammad). The abandon of Orthodox Judaism, while not surprising, is one of the saddest things I know of Judaism. True beautiful Middle Eastern Jewish culture should never be replaced by suits and ideologies, I hope it prevails again one day. :)

Also:

Saudi Arabia: does everything maintain power.

Iran: does everything for Shia prevalence.

This question should not be that hard to answer.

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="Victorious_Fize"]

My EXACT sentiments! How did we get here... a better question however, how do we get out of it. :P

@Frame-Dagger - Yes, that is correct, Muslims believe that anyone who enters Islam in any given stage will be under God's mercy.

Victorious_Fize

Sharia is not and should not be imposed on anyone that does not want it. Sharia (The Way) is for Muslim communities and countries that desire to live and explore a lifestyle that is in accordance with Islamic idealism (the closest to it being achieved was in anceint times from the 7th-13th century, where Turks, Persians, and Arabs of all were united under a Caliphates banner, then came the Ottoman Empire, that instilled a systematic multiconfessionalism similar to Rome) from observance of influential people in Islam (namely, the prophet Muhammad). The abandon of Orthodox Judaism, while not surprising, is one of the saddest things I know of Judaism. True beautiful Middle Eastern Jewish culture should never be replaced by suits and ideologies, I hope it prevails again one day. :)

Also:

Saudi Arabia: does everything maintain power.

Iran: does everything for Shia prevalence.

Oh, and I agree with your asessment of the Suadi and Iranian governments.

[QUOTE="SaudiFury"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]you are just hiding your answers and the truth about sharia in taqiyya.

8.lolwut q5:33.

Riverwolf007

every time someone says "hey here is a clear black and white text saying it's cool to have sex with young girls before their first menstruation" or "here is one that says slay your enemies and your enemies are anyone not muslum" or any one of the hundreds of other things that are offensive to anyone that respects human rights the answer every time is "oh, well that does not count anymore, or it's a mistranslation or it's this or it's that and the actual meaning is the opposite of what it says there in black and white."

religious deception is built into and inseparable from islam.

as far as being at war so that taqiyya is an acceptible practice twenty bucks says you can find at least one hundred imams giving sermons on youtube claiming that there is a war going on which makes it completely acceptable to say anything you need to say to forward the cause.

all this works like a charm because westerners see a religion and say "omg! it's a religion! protect it!" when really islam is a political ideology dolled up to look like a religion.

if westerners understood the political aspect and how taqiyya allows it to be hidden you would have a much more difficult time spreading the ideology so it makes it acceptable to do and say anything you need to say or do to protect it.

To the likes of you, Taqiyya is your get out of jail free card. "but what you said is not the same as the fundamentalist is saying. must mean your strategically lying to me!" that's all i see you doing with it the. and i've seen it used before as well. I could help you out on the side of the street after Friday prayer you'd likely turn around and say it relates to Taqiyya somehow. You don't even know what the **** Taiqyya is, nor it's history, nor the rules associated with it. All you know is "lying" and hence now you have your - like i said before - get out of jail free card. It's an "I win, you lose no matter what, because anything you could say in rebuttal is an obvious practice of Taqiyya"

and there are many many interpretations in religion, not just Islam. The things you said in your quotations, an Imam in Kazakhstan, Saudi, Indonesia, and the USA are each gonna have different opinions on those matters.

but wait... i'm practicing Taqiyya....

so nevermind, let me waste no more breath on this BS. wait... that must mean i'm telling the truth. :|

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

lol, where do you want to start?

1: death sentence for ridiculing the big mo?

2: lopping off body parts?

3: beating your wife?

4: death sentence for apostates?

5: jihad?

6: whipping/stoning unmarried fornicators?

7: executing homosexuals?

8: crucifixion?

yeah, lets bring all that back.

pfft, what's wrong with sharia? you gotta be kidding me.

Nayef_shroof

2: You only get "your body parts lopped off" when you commit crimes of significance, such as stealing something of high value (Result being your hand cut off), or if you murder/rape someone (Punishment being, if proven overwhelmingly guilty, death)

3: Its against sharia law to abuse your wife. It is said that if she exact high handedness upon the husband and he decides to hit her, he cannot cause any bruises, bleeding, are injuries to sensitive areas of the body. It is also one of the largest sins to commit in sharia

4: That is not allowed...In older times (Centuries ago), apostasy was considered a form of treason, and treason was punishable by death, not apostasy.

5: Jihad means the inner struggle, so I dont understand what your talking about...

6: There is no stoning, just whipping

7: Homosexuals are punished when they display blatant acts of homosexuality in public, meaning that homosexuals can be homosexuals in private and face the consequences in the after-life. The punishment is appointed for the judge to decide.

8: lolwut?

Yeah totally yo, for realz. Let's go back to the middle ages. I hate human progress. It sucks.

[QUOTE="mayceV"]if you want pschology, then You should remember that Human being only do things that benift them. so a lex talionis is less attractive then say a direct fine of 50,000 (also as I said stealing has to have 2 reliable witnesses under oath that witnessed the direct theft. So lopping hands off is nearly impossible unless the theft is stupid or in extreme need and if he is in extreme need then the lopping of hands isn't allowed punishment isn't allowed as long as the stolen goods is only to satisfy a human need ( food, water, cloth for a tent, blanket or something) and it has to have a minimal value not for say stealing a table or a pair of head phones. that is then brought down to tazir level. Also, as a state level which is for anything other than murder or battery its a completely normal system a court system with witnesses and a judge, that can be built upon to suit needs meaning getting help for a psycho is possible under Sharia. It isn't black and white and it is extremely flexible. Also the punishment decided under lex talionis cannot exceed the crime meaning unless he chopped your hand off you can't do the same to him. there is equal punishment for everyone. Not like hamurabi where slaves got the shaft. But again the idea of lex talionis is losing popularity and can be removed without going against the Quran.Frame_Dragger

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="mayceV"]if you want pschology, then You should remember that Human being only do things that benift them. so a lex talionis is less attractive then say a direct fine of 50,000 (also as I said stealing has to have 2 reliable witnesses under oath that witnessed the direct theft. So lopping hands off is nearly impossible unless the theft is stupid or in extreme need and if he is in extreme need then the lopping of hands isn't allowed punishment isn't allowed as long as the stolen goods is only to satisfy a human need ( food, water, cloth for a tent, blanket or something) and it has to have a minimal value not for say stealing a table or a pair of head phones. that is then brought down to tazir level. Also, as a state level which is for anything other than murder or battery its a completely normal system a court system with witnesses and a judge, that can be built upon to suit needs meaning getting help for a psycho is possible under Sharia. It isn't black and white and it is extremely flexible. Also the punishment decided under lex talionis cannot exceed the crime meaning unless he chopped your hand off you can't do the same to him. there is equal punishment for everyone. Not like hamurabi where slaves got the shaft. But again the idea of lex talionis is losing popularity and can be removed without going against the Quran.mayceV

[QUOTE="mayceV"][QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"] This is philosophy, not psychology. Frame_Dragger

[QUOTE="Nayef_shroof"]

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"] lol, speaking of the middle ages, it was the Islamic empires that were progressing for humanity while europe was in a state of barbarity... I dont understand what the problem is? I myself wouldn't like Sharia law to be imposed, but im just trying to elaborate on specifics. 2: For you to be proven guilty to th[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

[QUOTE="Nayef_shroof"]

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

lol, where do you want to start?

1: death sentence for ridiculing the big mo?

2: lopping off body parts?

3: beating your wife?

4: death sentence for apostates?

5: jihad?

6: whipping/stoning unmarried fornicators?

7: executing homosexuals?

8: crucifixion?

yeah, lets bring all that back.

pfft, what's wrong with sharia? you gotta be kidding me.

SpartanMSU

2: You only get "your body parts lopped off" when you commit crimes of significance, such as stealing something of high value (Result being your hand cut off), or if you murder/rape someone (Punishment being, if proven overwhelmingly guilty, death)

3: Its against sharia law to abuse your wife. It is said that if she exact high handedness upon the husband and he decides to hit her, he cannot cause any bruises, bleeding, are injuries to sensitive areas of the body. It is also one of the largest sins to commit in sharia

4: That is not allowed...In older times (Centuries ago), apostasy was considered a form of treason, and treason was punishable by death, not apostasy.

5: Jihad means the inner struggle, so I dont understand what your talking about...

6: There is no stoning, just whipping

7: Homosexuals are punished when they display blatant acts of homosexuality in public, meaning that homosexuals can be homosexuals in private and face the consequences in the after-life. The punishment is appointed for the judge to decide.

8: lolwut?

Yeah totally yo, for realz. Let's go back to the middle ages. I hate human progress. It sucks.

[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]

The problem with Sharia is the same problem with Islam or any religion.

Humans (governments) took a concept that's good and intelligent and turned it into something barbaric and stupid.

In real Islam you're not even allowed to kill a tree during time of war.

But they murder innocent people and say "I did this for Islam."

Or they cut off hand for stealing bread and say "This is Sharia."

Just like in America everybody say "oh we're Christian, our Lord Jesus Christ blah blah" but then support bombing third-world countries.

All hypocrits.

Nowhere in the Koran you see anything about the size of your beard, or headscarves for women.

In the Koran one of the first things it says is "This is a complete book, we did not add anything afterwards."

But you go to muslim countries, they add other books and regulations and say "This is Islam too." No it's not. You added that.

Saudi Arabia is "Muslim" like the West is "Christian" in other words it's not.

In Saudi they make you put on burka.

In America they make you take off burka.

Where is freedom? Nowhere.

What business is it of anybody what I put on my head or what clothes I wear?

Freedom is only anarchy.

And not the fake communist anarchy where the whole "community" decides how you gonna live.

America is the closest to freedom in the world but the politicians will soon fix that.

I miss and love "old" America.

New America is copy of Saudi Arabia with different customs.

My EXACT sentiments! How did we get here... a better question however, how do we get out of it. :P

@Frame-Dagger - Yes, that is correct, Muslims believe that anyone who enters Islam in any given stage will be under God's mercy.

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="Victorious_fize"]

My EXACT sentiments! How did we get here... a better question however, how do we get out of it. :P

@Frame-Dagger - Yes, that is correct, Muslims believe that anyone who enters Islam in any given stage will be under God's mercy.

MayceV

Really? "If a man (in a battle) is attacking a kafir with a spear, and it has reached his throat, and at that moment he says 'There is no god but God', the Muslim must immediately withdraw his spear" (Hadith...I don't know which).

All someone needs to become a Muslim is Shahadah; if someone states, witnessed and truly means it when they declare, "'ashhadu ʾan lā ʾilaha ʾilla Allah, wa ʾashhadu ʾanna Muhammadan rasulu Allah." That is the MOMENT they become Muslim. It is the moment that harming that person is an act of kufr, and while they may not be a very good Muslim having not observed the pillars, etc... he's still a Muslim. Your own view of when to convert is fine, but Muhammed disagreed with you about the status of one who converts before death; it's not your mercy or judgement being sought, but god's.

I don't believe this, obviously, being agnostic and not of your faith, but it's not exactly unclear. If a person has an epiphany before death and makes a true declaration, who are you to judge? Scholars have since decided on what is a truly SINCERE shahadah, but that is all about people and not the Quran or god. You could be condemned on earth, and after death you're still judged by?... riiiiight. You could be praised on earth for sincerity, but then judged after death to be... exaaactly.

There's a fine greek word for what you're doing in your fist statement: Hubris.

Frame_Dragger

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"]LJS9502_basic

edit: Fixed... in fact EVERYONE had been misquoted, and you weren't even involved. I think the GS boards sometimes forget to take their medications.

In a sense there is nothing wrong with Sharia. For its time it was a valid way of organizing society during and following the rise of Muhammad. The question is, as always, if it remains relevant to today's needs. As a Christian I prefer Jesus and St. Paul's method of approaching issues, i.e. "leave unto Caesar what is Caesar's." The laws of the land are just that, the laws of the land. THe laws that each and every individual follows (not the letter of the laws, but the attitude of the spirit of the laws, "christian behavior") is determined by religion. THis appears to be an innovation in Christianity that prevents its morals from oppressing the state (despite what haters would say) and allows it to thrive and continue. Jesus made it clear when he said that "my kingdom is not of this world." When you combine the state and religion, or law and religion, all you get is a mess where religion and the law both suffer. Sharia is a tight connection between religion and the law, and thus opposing the law is like opposing religion, and often times changes in society require changes in law. See where I am going here? Sharia is "bad" precisely because it sets out to combine two things that the West has wisely separated for centuries. This division was never present in Islam and hence the current struggles in the middle east. Thats not to say that the Catholic church has not resisted its loss of physical power, but then again it is precisely this addiction to power and "divine right" that make the state and religion a potent and dangerous mix.

This question should not be that hard to answer.

DroidPhysX

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

This question should not be that hard to answer.

HoolaHoopMan

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

This question should not be that hard to answer.

Victorious_Fize

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

This question should not be that hard to answer.

Victorious_Fize

[QUOTE="Victorious_Fize"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] Take a good look at women's role in Muslim societies. They're anything but equal. HoolaHoopMan

^ are you implying Saudi Arabia is actually Islamic and does not utilize the religion in a hypocritical sense to capture the demographic for Al Saud to stay in charge?

You're first example, Saudi Arabia. Do I really need to elaborate or will you actually try and defend their laws restricting women? HoolaHoopMan

Oh this will be good.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]You're first example, Saudi Arabia. Do I really need to elaborate or will you actually try and defend their laws restricting women? airshocker

Oh this will be good.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="Victorious_Fize"] Care to name a few? You know, to examine the countries and all.Victorious_Fize

^ are you implying Saudi Arabia is actually Islamic and does not utilize the religion in a hypocritical sense to capture the demographic for Al Saud to stay in charge?

[QUOTE="zAhMaDz"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] Take a good look at women's role in Muslim societies. They're anything but equal. HoolaHoopMan

Umm, how does time devalue something again? Especially if it's a social aspect and many approve of it? Avicenna's work (midcine, 9th century) was used up until the 18th century.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="Victorious_Fize"] Care to name a few? You know, to examine the countries and all.Victorious_Fize

^ are you implying Saudi Arabia is actually Islamic and does not utilize the religion in a hypocritical sense to capture the demographic for Al Saud to stay in charge?

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="zAhMaDz"] Saudi Arabia =/= IslamzAhMaDz

Its a large part, yes. Nothing is ever black and white, and most times culture and Religion go hand in hand. Its naive to think that Islam doesn't have a hand in their out dated sexist laws.

Umm, how does time devalue something again? Especially if it's a social aspect and many approve of it? Avicenna's work (midcine, 9th century) was used up until the 18th century.

Victorious_Fize

You're straying away from the subject. We're not discussing the history of gender inequality in Muslim countries, just that they exist. Do you disagree that they do?

[QUOTE="zAhMaDz"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] I didn't say it was. He told me to mention an example of a Muslim country that has large gender inequalities, I did. HoolaHoopMan

Its a large part, yes. Nothing is ever black and white, and most times culture and Religion go hand in hand. Its naive to think that Islam doesn't have a hand in their out dated sexist laws.

So you think Islam has more influence on these sexist laws (which completely contradict sayings of Muhammad as well as the Quran) rather than the fact that society in Saudi Arabia has long been patriarchal?

zAhMaDz

Can't we be realistic and say both? Islam does have an effect on Saudi Arabia, to an extremely large extent. Like I said, its naive to think otherwise. Its a theocracy.

Should of asked "name a muslim country that defends womens rights?" And then said: "That country =/= islam"DroidPhysX

Oh that's easy....well...um...Turkey?

Oh that's easy....well...um...Turkey?

HoolaHoopMan

Turkish women are gorgeous. That was a very pleasant visit for me.

[QUOTE="zAhMaDz"]

So you think Islam has more influence on these sexist laws (which completely contradict sayings of Muhammad as well as the Quran) rather than the fact that society in Saudi Arabia has long been patriarchal?

HoolaHoopMan

Can't we be realistic and say both? Islam does have an effect on Saudi Arabia, to an extremely large extent. Like I said, its naive to think otherwise. Its a theocracy.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

Oh that's easy....well...um...Turkey?

airshocker

Turkish women are gorgeous. That was a very pleasant visit for me.