Sleeping Dogs: Yet Another Overhyped, Badly Coded Game!

In theory, at least, there should be a lot to like about Sleeping Dogs. In reality, however, the melee combat system is so badly coded it ruins the game. I have been thoroughly frustrated by how sluggish and unresponsive the game is to the button presses. In one glaring incident, I pressed the X button three times for three punches only to have my character stand motionless until he was attacked by two opponents, then punched the air three times after the health was significantly depleted, not responding to the gamepad input until after the opponents attacked. The same thing happens when pressing the Y button to evade attacks. The button press registers too slowly to have any affect. For a game that is so heavily dependent on melee action, the controller lag time is appalling.

The bigger mystery is, how can such a badly coded game be so highly rated by so many users? Are the user reviews being constantly skewed by shills for the game makers?

Or could it simply be a problem on your end? Controller connection dropping out, or battery being low dead, etc. Nobody is talking about this probably because nobody is experiencing this, or at least its not a prevailent problem.

I put in 20 hours into the game, and didnt have any issues with controller input. The combat is not as fluid as I'd like it to be, but it's not buggy in any sense of the word.

What console did you play it on? Can you try reinstalling the game?

Like others have stated, I never encountered such input lag and that's with a good thirty hours plus of time spent in the game.

As to coding, it has some rough edges but overall I found it to be a relatively polished open-world experience and worthy of every last bit of critical praise.

Got nothing of what you mention, I playied it on the PC, and to me it was way more then what was promised, and one of my favorite games of the gen (note that I usually hate that type of game).

So I too assume it is a problem on your end.

I do find the complaints about hand to hand combat pretty moot, since I can find no game in the same genre able to outdo it. But yeah, it still is clubky, the specific genre needs a pretty huge overall allround. But I don't expect anything pushing it further farwards then sleeping dogs, for a very long time.

Actually guys, there is a problem with your character being unresponsive for a period of time. It happened to me 3 times already (never in combat tho)

There was one time that I had to quit the game because nothing was responsive in the game except the directional buttons, start and select. X square cirlce triangle bumper buttons or analogue didnt work at all. I waited about 10 minutes for it to kick into gear but never did.

But other than that problem it's a solid game and one of my favorties this gen.

In theory, at least, there should be a lot to like about Sleeping Dogs. In reality, however, the melee combat system is so badly coded it ruins the game. I have been thoroughly frustrated by how sluggish and unresponsive the game is to the button presses. In one glaring incident, I pressed the X button three times for three punches only to have my character stand motionless until he was attacked by two opponents, then punched the air three times after the health was significantly depleted, not responding to the gamepad input until after the opponents attacked. The same thing happens when pressing the Y button to evade attacks. The button press registers too slowly to have any affect. For a game that is so heavily dependent on melee action, the controller lag time is appalling.

The bigger mystery is, how can such a badly coded game be so highly rated by so many users? Are the user reviews being constantly skewed by shills for the game makers?

capaho

PC version played fantastic for me. Have no experience with the console counterpart though

[QUOTE="capaho"]

In theory, at least, there should be a lot to like about Sleeping Dogs. In reality, however, the melee combat system is so badly coded it ruins the game. I have been thoroughly frustrated by how sluggish and unresponsive the game is to the button presses. In one glaring incident, I pressed the X button three times for three punches only to have my character stand motionless until he was attacked by two opponents, then punched the air three times after the health was significantly depleted, not responding to the gamepad input until after the opponents attacked. The same thing happens when pressing the Y button to evade attacks. The button press registers too slowly to have any affect. For a game that is so heavily dependent on melee action, the controller lag time is appalling.

The bigger mystery is, how can such a badly coded game be so highly rated by so many users? Are the user reviews being constantly skewed by shills for the game makers?

Toxic-Seahorse

Or could it simply be a problem on your end? Controller connection dropping out, or battery being low dead, etc. Nobody is talking about this probably because nobody is experiencing this, or at least its not a prevailent problem.

Arath_1

I have two gamepads and tried both with the same results. It could be an issue related specifically to the Xbox version, or perhaps specific builds of the Xbox version, but there is definitely a fatal lag time with the button presses during melee fights in which there are a lot of opponents attacking at once.

No, the bigger mystery is, how can you have an experience nobody else has had and blame it on the game?

Toxic-Seahorse

Others have reported the same problem.

[QUOTE="Arath_1"]

Or could it simply be a problem on your end? Controller connection dropping out, or battery being low dead, etc. Nobody is talking about this probably because nobody is experiencing this, or at least its not a prevailent problem.

capaho

I have two gamepads and tried both with the same results. It could be an issue related specifically to the Xbox version, or perhaps specific builds of the Xbox version, but there is definitely a fatal lag time with the button presses during melee fights in which there are a lot of opponents attacking at once.

Why would you think there are different builds of the XBOX version?

Incidentally, I played the XBOX version extensively and never encountered the problem so no, there is no definitive evidence backing up your claim.

I even Googled it to see if anything comes up and nothing did.

[QUOTE="Toxic-Seahorse"]

No, the bigger mystery is, how can you have an experience nobody else has had and blame it on the game?

capaho

Others have reported the same problem.

Link?

Sounds like you need a new controller bro.

Make a thread on the official boards. If this is a known issue then it needs to be brought to their attention.

If you've installed the game on HDD then delete it and install it again.

[QUOTE="Arath_1"]

Or could it simply be a problem on your end? Controller connection dropping out, or battery being low dead, etc. Nobody is talking about this probably because nobody is experiencing this, or at least its not a prevailent problem.

capaho

I have two gamepads and tried both with the same results. It could be an issue related specifically to the Xbox version, or perhaps specific builds of the Xbox version, but there is definitely a fatal lag time with the button presses during melee fights in which there are a lot of opponents attacking at once.

Never experienced any problems.

Link?

Grammaton-Cleric

http://www.gamespot.com/sleeping-dogs/user-reviews/798771/platform/xbox360/

Why would you think there are different builds of the XBOX version?

Incidentally, I played the XBOX version extensively and never encountered the problem so no, there is no definitive evidence backing up your claim.

I even Googled it to see if anything comes up and nothing did.

Grammaton-Cleric

I think there are different builds because I am a software developer and that's the way it works. Early releases of games almost always have glitches that are fixed by update patches that get incorporated into newer builds that are released later, unless a game sells so poorly there don't need to be any supplemental releases. I have the Asian release of Sleeping Dogs with Cantonese subtitles, so it's not possible for it to be the same build as the one distributed for the U.S. market. Newer Xbox 360s also have hardware revisions that older boxes like mine don't have, so that could also be a factor. It's rather obvious to me that the coding for the melee fighting system is broken in the release that I have.

Make a thread on the official boards. If this is a known issue then it needs to be brought to their attention.

If you've installed the game on HDD then delete it and install it again.

S0lidSnake

I did uninstall the game from the HDD and tried playing it directly from the disc but the problem was worse. I also have a problem in some of the fights where there are a large number of opponents with multiple opponents glowing red simultaneously, making it impossible to defend against all of them at once by pressing the Y button.

I think I'm going to return this Xbox 360 version of the game and exchange it for the PS 3 version. Hopefully that one will function well enough to play the game without wanting to throw the gamepad into the TV screen.

[QUOTE="Grammaton-Cleric"]

Why would you think there are different builds of the XBOX version?

Incidentally, I played the XBOX version extensively and never encountered the problem so no, there is no definitive evidence backing up your claim.

I even Googled it to see if anything comes up and nothing did.

capaho

I think there are different builds because I am a software developer and that's the way it works. Early releases of games almost always have glitches that are fixed by update patches that get incorporated into newer builds that are released later, unless a game sells so poorly there don't need to be any supplemental releases. I have the Asian release of Sleeping Dogs with Cantonese subtitles, so it's not possible for it to be the same build as the one distributed for the U.S. market. Newer Xbox 360s also have hardware revisions that older boxes like mine don't have, so that could also be a factor. It's rather obvious to me that the coding for the melee fighting system is broken in the release that I have.

Sleeping Dogs has been out for a little over a month so I have serious doubts there has been a new pressing with patched glitches.

Most games get patched via online anyway so despite your alleged expertise, you seem to be gravely misinformed regarding the nature of retail software.

Also, that link you gave me was a ridiculous user review that was not only borderline incoherent but also failed to address the specific issue you mentioned. That user clearly didn't understand how to play the game (among other things) and decided to slander it instead.

That's not evidence; that's a diatribe.

And with all respect, the fact that you would rate this game a 1/10 makes your opinion on this or any other software-related matter extremely suspect.

Superman 64 is a 1/10.

Sleeping Dogs is not.

Never had that problem with mine.

Sleeping Dogs has been out for a little over a month so I have serious doubts there has been a new pressing with patched glitches.

Most games get patched via online anyway so despite your alleged expertise, you seem to be gravely misinformed regarding the nature of retail software.

Also, that link you gave me was a ridiculous user review that was not only borderline incoherent but also failed to address the specific issue you mentioned. That user clearly didn't understand how to play the game (among other things) and decided to slander it instead.

That's not evidence; that's a diatribe.

And with all respect, the fact that you would rate this game a 1/10 makes your opinion on this or any other software-related matter extremely suspect.

Superman 64 is a 1/10.

Sleeping Dogs is not.

Grammaton-Cleric

Always so pointlessly antagonistic. It would be much easier to take you seriously if you were a little wiser and a lot less opinionated.

You're really wrong: 1. This game got almost zero hype before its launch. 2. Just because 1 or 2 people has issue doesn't mean it a badly coded game. I played the PS3 version and has never encountered any serious bugs at all save 1 or 2 small glitches. It's one of the most polished games this gen from my expericence. TC should bring your copy back to store where you purchased it and exchanged for another copy. Zensword

Perhaps my use of the term overhyped was confusing. I was referring to the favorable reviews and extremely high user ratings. I would be in agreement if the melee fighting system weren't so frustratingly broken in the Xbox 360 version I have. It's good to hear that the PS 3 version doesn't have any serious glitches, I think I'll exchange my Xbox copy for a PS 3 copy.

After doing some experimenting and trying different approaches on some of the same fights I have come to realize that the melee fighting system is not broken but is functioning as designed. The problem is that it is a screwball design. A significant portion of the fights appear to be fixed in the programming as the same sequences will repeat in the same fights regardless of user input. The unresponsive buttons also appear to be part of the design. The melee fighting system is essentially just cheap gimmickry intended to make the "fights" seem more than they really are. In fact, they are not fights at all.

For example, the Y button must be pressed within a fraction of a second of an opponent glowing red to successfully deflect the attack. If the button is pressed too early or too late, no further button presses will register until after the glowing opponent pummels you and significantly reduces your health. See red, press yellow. There is no way to defend yourself if you don't time the button press precisely. It's not so much a realistic fight as yet another annoying hand-eye coordination test masquerading as a game.

The problem for me is that I'm not fond of melee fighting but I thought I could tolerate it in this game in order to enjoy the open world adventure. Unfortunately, the game's melee fighting system is so absurd only a hardcore melee aficionado can appreciate it.

As for me, if I can't shoot it or blow it up, I'm not interested in the fight. Despite my fondness for open world games, I just can't get into it in Sleeping Dogs because the contrived melee fighting is just too big of an annoyance.

Always so pointlessly antagonistic. It would be much easier to take you seriously if you were a little wiser and a lot less opinionated.

capaho

That post wasn't antagonistic, merely honest.

You've made some assertions and clearly lack the ability to back them up. You also rated this game a 1/10 which is hyperbolically low and immediately places your analytical and deconstruction skills into question.

You also thought to mention your supposed programming knowledge yet you clearly know nothing about retail builds or how they work, evidenced by your nonsensical comments earlier.

If your little feathers become ruffled because people challenge and outright refute your proposals then you'd better keep your opinions to yourself.

Here, you will be challenged on your opinions, especially when said opinion is incredibly divergent.

After doing some experimenting and trying different approaches on some of the same fights I have come to realize that the melee fighting system is not broken but is functioning as designed. The problem is that it is a screwball design. A significant portion of the fights appear to be fixed in the programming as the same sequences will repeat in the same fights regardless of user input. The unresponsive buttons also appear to be part of the design. The melee fighting system is essentially just cheap gimmickry intended to make the "fights" seem more than they really are. In fact, they are not fights at all.

For example, the Y button must be pressed within a fraction of a second of an opponent glowing red to successfully deflect the attack. If the button is pressed too early or too late, no further button presses will register until after the glowing opponent pummels you and significantly reduces your health. See red, press yellow. There is no way to defend yourself if you don't time the button press precisely. It's not so much a realistic fight as yet another annoying hand-eye coordination test masquerading as a game.

The problem for me is that I'm not fond of melee fighting but I thought I could tolerate it in this game in order to enjoy the open world adventure. Unfortunately, the game's melee fighting system is so absurd only a hardcore melee aficionado can appreciate it.

As for me, if I can't shoot it or blow it up, I'm not interested in the fight. Despite my fondness for open world games, I just can't get into it in Sleeping Dogs because the contrived melee fighting is just too big of an annoyance.

capaho

Your original post and subsequent defense of that position was that this was a poorly coded game rife with glitches. You even went so far as to claim others were having similar problems, though when pressed to back that up you delivered unconvincing support.

Then about a dozen people refuted your comments. You stood fast and continued to attack the coding or claim it was an imbedded glitch in different retail builds of the same game. (Which dont exist)

Now you simply claim the combat is poor.

Let's address your attacks:

"The problem is that it is a screwball design. A significant portion of the fights appear to be fixed in the programming as the same sequences will repeat in the same fights regardless of user input. The unresponsive buttons also appear to be part of the design. The melee fighting system is essentially just cheap gimmickry intended to make the "fights" seem more than they really are. In fact, they are not fights at all."

It's difficult to follow your claim here as your point is jumbled but it appears that you are suggesting that the fighting engine which you claim is unresponsive forces certain events to unfold regardless of player choice.

This is of course untrue. The combat engine, especially as it opens up and grants the player additional moves, allows you great flexibility in how to take down the opposition. Some enemies must be handled different based on their type but that is hardly a removal of player agency. Despite your claim, these fights are very much open and can be addressed any number of ways depending on environment, weapons, and player creativity.

"For example, the Y button must be pressed within a fraction of a second of an opponent glowing red to successfully deflect the attack. If the button is pressed too early or too late, no further button presses will register until after the glowing opponent pummels you and significantly reduces your health. See red, press yellow. There is no way to defend yourself if you don't time the button press precisely. It's not so much a realistic fight as yet another annoying hand-eye coordination test masquerading as a game."

The red prompt gives you three distinct choices: counter, attack or move. Countering is the easiest choice and the timing to successfully implement a counter is actually far more forgiving than you claim. However, there is a penalty for using a counter too early, resulting in a moment where enemies can strike you without reprisal. It is worth noting that one of the skill tress allows the counter recovery time to become significantly shortened. Regardless, the countering system, similar to the one seen in the Arkham games, is perfectly serviceable but is also only one of three options for dealing with oncoming enemy assaults.

"The problem for me is that I'm not fond of melee fighting but I thought I could tolerate it in this game in order to enjoy the open world adventure. Unfortunately, the game's melee fighting system is so absurd only a hardcore melee aficionado can appreciate it."

The real problem is you purchased a game without bothering to understand what you were getting into. The crux of Sleeping Dogs is melee combat and that was made very clear from the outset. As to the difficulty or absurdity of the combat, most people seem to have adapted to it just fine, so again your criticism reeks of myopic dislike rather than any type of broader universal truth. I've played countless games with melee engines far less forgiving than Sleeping Dogs so again, maybe the problem is simply you.

"As for me, if I can't shoot it or blow it up, I'm not interested in the fight. Despite my fondness for open world games, I just can't get into it in Sleeping Dogs because the contrived melee fighting is just too big of an annoyance."

And here's the real point of this whole thread.

You simply don't like the game, which is fine. However, rather than simply state that Sleeping Dogs isn't for you, you first tried to attack it as technically inferior (Which is clearly untrue) and now you have levied some vapid attacks on the combat. Not only is your analysis woefully incomplete and appears to be predicated on a relatively short amount of playtime but what you offer as proof of your position clearly denotes somebody looking to deride the experience.

You obviously had no interest in learning how to play this game properly so why bother expending so much time slandering it to people who, unlike you, took the time to learn the nuances of the engine and enjoyed the experience?

Did you think that after investing 30 hours of fun into the game that I would read your hollow arguments and reconsider, deciding that time was wasted?

What you were doing was transparent from the outset: you were looking to bash this game. You hate it, others dont, and you wanted to spread that hate.

My advice: Move on. Sleeping Dogs just isn't your type of game.

That post wasn't antagonistic, merely honest.

You've made some assertions and clearly lack the ability to back them up. You also rated this game a 1/10 which is hyperbolically low and immediately places your analytical and deconstruction skills into question.

You also thought to mention your supposed programming knowledge yet you clearly know nothing about retail builds or how they work, evidenced by your nonsensical comments earlier.

If your little feathers become ruffled because people challenge and outright refute your proposals then you'd better keep your opinions to yourself.

Here, you will be challenged on your opinions, especially when said opinion is incredibly divergent.

Grammaton-Cleric

You merely post contradiction peppered with personal attacks without offering anything that is positive or constructive. That's antagonism.

I rated Sleeping Dogs 1/10 because 0/10 wasn't an option. I have posted comments based on my experiences with the game and my subsequent perceptions. Few things annoy me more than wasting money on a game that turns out to be nothing more than a promising concept poorly implemeted. I think Sleeping Dogs uses cheap programming tricks to make it appear to be more than it is. My experiences and perceptions are mine, that's all.There is nothing to be proven or disproven about anything I've said. Understand?

Its not a bad game really. Just another victim of the stupid gaming community hyping it up the ass and ruining it for me :(

Its just True Crime Streets of China.

Which is ok. Just not the best game ever made like a lot thought it was going to because of a few clips.

I played on the xbox 360 version and had no problems at all.

played ten minutes of the demo until I got bored.. thought it was nothing special to be honest..

Its not a bad game really. Just another victim of the stupid gaming community hyping it up the ass and ruining it for me :(

Ilovegames1992

I dont even know how to respond to this post. You hate that other people like a game and that love somehow ruined it for you.

Maybe the problem isn't the hype, maybe the problem is you.

After doing some experimenting and trying different approaches on some of the same fights I have come to realize that the melee fighting system is not broken but is functioning as designed. The problem is that it is a screwball design. A significant portion of the fights appear to be fixed in the programming as the same sequences will repeat in the same fights regardless of user input. The unresponsive buttons also appear to be part of the design. The melee fighting system is essentially just cheap gimmickry intended to make the "fights" seem more than they really are. In fact, they are not fights at all.

For example, the Y button must be pressed within a fraction of a second of an opponent glowing red to successfully deflect the attack. If the button is pressed too early or too late, no further button presses will register until after the glowing opponent pummels you and significantly reduces your health. See red, press yellow. There is no way to defend yourself if you don't time the button press precisely. It's not so much a realistic fight as yet another annoying hand-eye coordination test masquerading as a game.

The problem for me is that I'm not fond of melee fighting but I thought I could tolerate it in this game in order to enjoy the open world adventure. Unfortunately, the game's melee fighting system is so absurd only a hardcore melee aficionado can appreciate it.

As for me, if I can't shoot it or blow it up, I'm not interested in the fight. Despite my fondness for open world games, I just can't get into it in Sleeping Dogs because the contrived melee fighting is just too big of an annoyance.

capaho

I think the problem is that you are trying to button mash through the game. I am also not big on melee games, and have tried to button mash through games like God of War, Batman Arkham games and practically everything with a melee engine. Needless to say, button mashing can only get you so far.

With Sleeping Dogs, it became clear to me that mashing Y whenever i was surrounded by guys was not a good idea. The game penalizes you for pressing Y too early, and leaves Wei vulnerable to attacks for a few seconds. This is by design and not an example of poor coding. It's there to keep people from button mashing through the game.

Yes, the counter window is small and I guess leaving the guys red even after the counter window expires is probably not a good design choice. I suppose it should've been like Batman games where the counter signal disappears if you miss the counter window. But again, it's something that you learn early on in the game and well, yes it does reward reflexes as well your enemy awareness. Most games are about reflexes and learning the game mechanics so to complain about something as basic as that is kind of unfair.

Like I stated earlier, the game's combat isn't as fluid as I'd like it to be. I went in expecting something similar to Batman games, and Wei simply isn't as agile as Batman which I guess is understandable. I am not a hardcore melee aficianado, that would be guys who love games like Bayonetta and DMC. I can promise you that the Sleeping Dogs melee engine is as basic as it gets. Maybe you need give the game another shot. Go in with an open mind this time, try to learn the combat, remember to time your punches and kicks instead of simply mashing in the combo sequence. The biggest thing I learned half way through the game was that you need to wait until Wei has thrown a punch before you throw another punch or a kick. You aren't used to melee games and that's fine. Simply go to the kung fu instructor in the game, and practice there. I can promise you things will click in just a few minutes. Think of it like playing a racing sim or a sports sim the first time, you cant expect to learn it straight away.

Lastly, It's really not contrived. lol it's the simplest combat engine i've seen in a video game this gen. They even give you five or six free kills with the enviornment interaction kills.

Just give it another shot.

I think the problem is that you are trying to button mash through the game. I am also not big on melee games, and have tried to button mash through games like God of War, Batman Arkham games and practically everything with a melee engine. Needless to say, button mashing can only get you so far.

With Sleeping Dogs, it became clear to me that mashing Y whenever i was surrounded by guys was not a good idea. The game penalizes you for pressing Y too early, and leaves Wei vulnerable to attacks for a few seconds. This is by design and not an example of poor coding. It's there to keep people from button mashing through the game.

Yes, the counter window is small and I guess leaving the guys red even after the counter window expires is probably not a good design choice. I suppose it should've been like Batman games where the counter signal disappears if you miss the counter window. But again, it's something that you learn early on in the game and well, yes it does reward reflexes as well your enemy awareness. Most games are about reflexes and learning the game mechanics so to complain about something as basic as that is kind of unfair.

Like I stated earlier, the game's combat isn't as fluid as I'd like it to be. I went in expecting something similar to Batman games, and Wei simply isn't as agile as Batman which I guess is understandable. I am not a hardcore melee aficianado, that would be guys who love games like Bayonetta and DMC. I can promise you that the Sleeping Dogs melee engine is as basic as it gets. Maybe you need give the game another shot. Go in with an open mind this time, try to learn the combat, remember to time your punches and kicks instead of simply mashing in the combo sequence. The biggest thing I learned half way through the game was that you need to wait until Wei has thrown a punch before you throw another punch or a kick. You aren't used to melee games and that's fine. Simply go to the kung fu instructor in the game, and practice there. I can promise you things will click in just a few minutes. Think of it like playing a racing sim or a sports sim the first time, you cant expect to learn it straight away.

Lastly, It's really not contrived. lol it's the simplest combat engine i've seen in a video game this gen. They even give you five or six free kills with the enviornment interaction kills.

Just give it another shot.

S0lidSnake

Thanks for the feedback. I haven't yet given up on Sleeping Dogs, I'm still playing it, actually.

I like the open world aspect and the missions, it's the stupid melee fighting system that spoils the game for me overall. It was the timing factor of the Y button that made me think initially that button presses weren't registering. After I started repeating the same fights trying different tactics I started to recognize the predetermined patterns in the programming and realized the fighting was working as designed. It's just absolutely not the type of fighting I can enjoy. Disabling character control briefly to channel the fight in a specific direction is a cheat on the game maker's side, IMHO. It's a cheap trick to prolong a game without having to invest in more complex coding.

I also realized that if you haven't been awarded the appropriate fighting techniques and haven't found enough shrines to boost your health significantly there are certain fights that you won't be able to complete successfully, which will kill off any enthusiam for the game in the early going for all but the most ardent melee enthusiasts.

Controls responsiveness = inconsistent in this game, but it's not too bad. There's some poor cantonese, a ridiculously exaggerated but all the more loveable setting, and hours of free-roam fun. It's really the game's setting, atmosphere, and decent combat that hold staying power.

Don't see how it was or is overhyped. I don't see any repetitive television commercials or people telling each other that this will redefine the sandbox subgenre. Seriously, people seem to be content with the game and its review scores--which clearly reflect the decent quality of the game. Oh, and if you feel like you fell for a trap, you probably didn't realize that the game went through major revisions following its original announcement as a True Crime title. The most anyone could have expected was a decent game. Dunno what you might have fell for, but your notion of it being overhyped could well be all in your head.

Yikes.

was about to get it the other day, but decided in the end to get Saints Row: The Third instead, figured I'd wait until sleeping dogs goes down in price to give it a shotlamprey263

Saints Row: The Third is wicked fun. It's one of my all time favorites.

Controls responsiveness = inconsistent in this game, but it's not too bad. There's some poor cantonese, a ridiculously exaggerated but all the more loveable setting, and hours of free-roam fun. It's really the game's setting, atmosphere, and decent combat that hold staying power.

Don't see how it was or is overhyped. I don't see any repetitive television commercials or people telling each other that this will redefine the sandbox subgenre. Seriously, people seem to be content with the game and its review scores--which clearly reflect the decent quality of the game. Oh, and if you feel like you fell for a trap, you probably didn't realize that the game went through major revisions following its original announcement as a True Crime title. The most anyone could have expected was a decent game. Dunno what you might have fell for, but your notion of it being overhyped could well be all in your head.

Yikes.

r4v3gl0ry

Once again, perhaps my choice of the word overhyped was a mistake. I was referring specifically to the online reviews and user ratings relative to the annoying melee fighting system.

You merely post contradiction peppered with personal attacks without offering anything that is positive or constructive. That's antagonism.

I rated Sleeping Dogs 1/10 because 0/10 wasn't an option. I have posted comments based on my experiences with the game and my subsequent perceptions. Few things annoy me more than wasting money on a game that turns out to be nothing more than a promising concept poorly implemeted. I think Sleeping Dogs uses cheap programming tricks to make it appear to be more than it is. My experiences and perceptions are mine, that's all.There is nothing to be proven or disproven about anything I've said. Understand?

capaho

I post contradictions because that is what one does when refuting an argument.

Also, there were no personal attacks in anything I wrote and I openly challenge you to specifically cite them. There is a world of difference between attacking an individual and attacking their position and the logic and methodology they employ.

I do question the analytical skills of anyone who would call of game of this quality a 1/10, especially when that person refuses to logically justify that score. It's unfortunate that you and people of your ilk think that opinion alone is justification but the reality is that an opinion must be defended or it is by default - utterly worthless. What you think and perceive is meaningless without some form of support and before you waste my time with yet another diatribe about how I am being antagonistic you should remember that you made the decision to post your opinion on a public board. If you weren't prepared to defend your opinion you should have kept it to yourself.

I also noticed you completely ignored my other post that effectively shreds your arguments and offers a specific rationale as to why your analysis of the game is flawed.

Feel free to respond as you have positioned yourself as an expert (I make no such claim as it pertains to programming) and by all means elaborate on the "cheap programming tricks" you suggest are rife within this game.

I post contradictions because that is what one does when refuting an argument.

Also, there were no personal attacks in anything I wrote and I openly challenge you to specifically cite them. There is a world of difference between attacking an individual and attacking their position and the logic and methodology they employ.

I do question the analytical skills of anyone who would call of game of this quality a 1/10, especially when that person refuses to logically justify that score. It's unfortunate that you and people of your ilk think that opinion alone is justification but the reality is that an opinion must be defended or it is by default - utterly worthless. What you think and perceive is meaningless without some form of support and before you waste my time with yet another diatribe about how I am being antagonistic you should remember that you made the decision to post your opinion on a public board. If you weren't prepared to defend your opinion you should have kept it to yourself.

I also noticed you completely ignored my other post that effectively shreds your arguments and offers a specific rationale as to why your analysis of the game is flawed.

Feel free to respond as you have positioned yourself as an expert (I make no such claim as it pertains to programming) and by all means elaborate on the "cheap programming tricks" you suggest are rife within this game.

Grammaton-Cleric

Sigh! I never really know how to respond to your comments in a way that you will understand.

There is value in the game in that the open world exploration is fun and the missions are exciting enough, per se. I gave the game a 1/10 because the absurd melee fighting system wrecks the game. You may not agree with it, but that's why I did it. It has nothing to do with anlytical skills. It's an expression of disgust over ruining what should have been a thoroughly enjoyable game. Square Enix blew it on this one and they deserve to be bashed until they release a patch that fixes it.

Otherwise, I ignore most of your comments because they aren't relevant. You didn't shred any of my arguments because I didn't make any. It's my subjective assessment of the game based on my experiences with it, there is nothing to debate.

I am pleased to report that I have finally mastered the melee fighting system. The secret is simply to get a car or truck and run them all down. I haven't tried it on a main mission yet, but it works for the drug busts and the random thug encounters.

I am pleased to report that I have finally mastered the melee fighting system. The secret is simply to get a car or truck and run them all down. I haven't tried it on a main mission yet, but it works for the drug busts and the random thug encounters.

capaho

You're kidding, right?

Here's a question I have for you. Have you visited the dojang and learned how to deal with each kind of attacker in the game? Have you learned any new moves whatsoever? I honestly don't see why you are not learning how to counter properly either, for that matter. This is going to hurt you and I don't care if it does, because I'm just being honest and truthful, but you haven't mastered the melee combat system whatsoever. In fact, the technique that you described is cowardly, at best. I, on the other hand, had NO PROBLEM with the game's combat system. Melee the Y button to death is going to get you NOWHERE and unfortunately, you haven't digested this fact at all. What a freaking shame. All you're doing is running away from the combat system, not embracing it.

[QUOTE="capaho"]

I am pleased to report that I have finally mastered the melee fighting system. The secret is simply to get a car or truck and run them all down. I haven't tried it on a main mission yet, but it works for the drug busts and the random thug encounters.

Metamania

You're kidding, right?

Here's a question I have for you. Have you visited the dojang and learned how to deal with each kind of attacker in the game? Have you learned any new moves whatsoever? I honestly don't see why you are not learning how to counter properly either, for that matter. This is going to hurt you and I don't care if it does, because I'm just being honest and truthful, but you haven't mastered the melee combat system whatsoever. In fact, the technique that you described is cowardly, at best. I, on the other hand, had NO PROBLEM with the game's combat system. Melee the Y button to death is going to get you NOWHERE and unfortunately, you haven't digested this fact at all. What a freaking shame. All you're doing is running away from the combat system, not embracing it.

I think he was being sarcastic.

I think he was being sarcastic.

S0lidSnake