Devs React to DX 12 Doubling Xbox One GPU Speed

I dont know if Xbox uses directX 11 right now, but stil a interesting comment from the dev Brad Wardell:

some guy asks - "so do u think with directx12 will make battlefield 4 on Xbox one run on ultra? Or just significantly better?"

Wardell replys- "no idea what it'll do specifically. Depends on how CPU bound it is. Most games I've looked at are core bound."

and then he tweets: "One way to look at the XBox One with DirectX 11 is it has 8 cores but only 1 of them does dx work. With dx12, all 8 do."

Same guys who said Dx12 games will likely run 2x faster but also that his opinon is that PS4 has better hw.

https://twitter.com/draginol

Hopefully dx12, or whatever MS is working on to improve Xbox, will remove performance difference between the platforms so we all can play the same games :)

No i am not a moron or naive to believe that an API will make a GPU jump 4 generations in performance,because DX 12 will reduce CPU over head,those hardware makers are like always running hype for MS like in many other instances they have.

DX12 wasn't in development before the X1,PS4 or mantle you blind biased fanboy..

Please link me to it,If MS was working on DX12 for years it would be ready by now period.

We’ve spoken to several sources with additional information on the topic who have told us that Microsoft’s interest in developing a new API is a recent phenomenon, and that the new DirectX (likely DirectX 12) will substantially duplicate the capabilities of AMD’s Mantle.

http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/177407-microsoft-hints-that-directx-12-will-imitate-and-destroy-amds-mantle

lol..

And to think that i already posted this here just a few post up...lol MS Dx12 API is a response to Mantle and Mantle is an API to emulate console API like the one the PS3 uses for years.

That mean that both are PR right.? Then i guess it comes down to specs and what games have show until now..

18 CU 1.84TF

12 CU 1.31 TF

Tomb Raider 60 FPS on PS4

Tomb Raider 30 FPS on X1

Ghost 1080p on PS4'

Ghost 720p on X1

BF4 900p 10 FPS faster on PS4

720p 10 FPS slower on X1

AC4 1080p on PS4 better AA

900p on X1 worse AA

MGS5 1080p 60 FPS on PS4 with dynamic clouds

720p 60 FPS on X1 without dynamic clouds.

When the xbox one catch the PS4 or beat it reply to me,meanwhile the xbox one is under power and keep getting owned in multiplatforms...

First of all The Witcher 3 was a 2014 game dude,it was suppose to come in a few months and now 1 year,the game was delay to 2015,so probably it got leak how the game was running it has happen before,and yes you can lock a resolution 1 year before you games comes out..

The order was confirm to be 1920x800p in summer 2013 more than 1 year before release,some 16 to 17 months before launch,so i don't know why that actually surprise you,other xbox one leaks date to early 2012 like online require and all that crap.

Yeah i clearly know sh**,lets see i have months saying that the PS4 will outperform the xbox one based on pure speaks alone,back then i was actually conservative,and i claimed as much as 20 FPS difference in games,but at the same resolution,or claimed the xbox one would have to lower quality to have frame parity.

Fast forward to launch and the gap was actually bigger than i ever predicted,not only some games double the xbox one resolution wise,some have resolution and frames advantage to like BF4,or cases like Tomb Raider that the gap is as big as the gap between the 7770 and 7950,i know what i am talking about,as of now MS is behind sony tool wise,yeah they will deliver better API,by that time sony ones will be even better,so while you wait for a promise i see what is real now.

The xbox one GPU is not strong enough and the xbox one ESRAM is a problem,the PS4 is stronger,straight forward in design,and is true HSA and hUMA which the xbox one isn't,so yeah that is the reason for the huge gap,everything is line up well.

I tell you this if the xbox one had GDDR5 and not ESRAM it would be fully HSA and hUMA compliant,not only that it would be doing 1080p now in the same games the PS4 would but a little slower or with lower quality but would be 1080p,the 7770 and 7790 both can do 1080p one faster than the other but both can,hell the 7770 does 1080p in Tomb Raider in ultra at 29 FPS that is the same speed as the xbox one basically.

Performance of these GPU's are well know they are out there on PC,one is stronger period there is no secret sauce hidden GPU or magical API that can fix the xbox one disadvantage,and if you knew at least a thing or 2 about GPU you would know that to...Keep waiting for parity..

There are 2 different kind of people to the morons who believe MisterXmedia and those who doesn't..lol

So says someone who doesn't know anything about software development.

Cows...

1-Yeah and MS has lie tons and tons again about performance of their products they just want you to buy them.

2-Bunch or crap.

3-There was benchmarks for GCN on PC all over the net relative to the power of the xbox one.

You most get this MS lie period they already say games would speak for them self on launch,and they did the games were behind performance wise,now if the xbox one was so powerful they would have no need to Over Clock sony didn't.

Nor have the need to kill a reservation which Developers are asking for since before launch,because the GPU was weak,some companies learn the hard way MS is one.

People had been complaining since 2012 on forums when the first leaks of always online,kinect included and DRM to block second hand games.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/next-xbox-to-play-blu-rays-block-used-games-report/1100-6349165/

Since January 2012 the rumors about blocking used games came out and people have been fighting about it online did MS listen.? No they waited until people got in arms in E3 2013 to backtrack,the same happen with the 10% reservation for Kinect which was hurting games even more,Activision asked MS to kill it and MS didn't want to,10% reservation isn't enough to bring Ghost to 1080p on xbox one but maybe close to 900p or 900p with a few drops,instead they have to go all the way down to 720p.

Now MS want to pretend that the xbox one has some kind of magic power that will be free once DX 12 arrive,by the way the claims of 4 generation of hardware was based for all hardware and not just the xbox one,so MS is now pretending that something will change in an effort to trick some suckers into thinking the console is as strong as the PS4.

Anything and everything the xbox one does by API can be done on PS4 period,both have GPU from the same family there is no Xenos vs RSX this time,is GCN vs GCN and the PS4 has the stronger GCN there is no way around this,the PS4 is a reduce 7870 the xbox one a reduce 7790 the outcome of that fight is well known..

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/857?vs=776

Forget about pixie dust and magic sauces this is ^^ the real deal.

I tell you what the thing is with MisterC,MisterX and all of them,they are trolls and those who believe them are morons and that combination goes hand and hand pretty well,so to believe stupid theories what better than a true moron.

And this is the problem in this case in particular MisterX and C which i am 100% sure is the same person,is exploiting poor xbox one fanboys,now xbox fans are use to have good graphics or have the lead since the xbox brand started,back then it was easy the xbox came after the PS2 by almost 2 years,on the PS3 vs xbox 360 case the xbox 360 was easier to code to + enjoyed a 1 year head start in development time vs a very hard to code console,+ the xbox 360 had a stronger GPU even that the PS3 had a stronger CPU which can run GPU task,but the results was good for 360 fans because almost all multiplatforms were superior on 360,and even that first party exclusive look better on Sony Ps3,at least they have something.

Now they have nothing so they hold tied to anything that make the xbox one look stronger,but in reality Mister X is just trolling you people.

16ROP work like 64 ROP...lol

If you only had the slightest idea about GPU you would be putting down those article as well.

Yeah he knows...lol...

That is because all you have there is crazy xbox one fans who can't just admit that MS fu** up this gen and that their vision really was Kinect kinect kinect with TV TV TV and sport sport sport ... Oh and Call duty call of duty call of duty...

MS 2013 conference was as bad as sony 2006 one $600 dollars,at least the PS3 was worth those dollars even if it was as a stand alone Blu-ray player which was $400 less than a stand alone one,the xbox one is just plainly over priced that conference most have make J Allard cry...lol

The x box one version of DX is not the PC one MS stated that long ago is custom,it has less CPU over head already than the PC version,the problems with this is that people are comparing it to PC,consoles since the go have streamer line API the xbox one already has them,hell DX on xbox one has 2 of the features advertise for DX12 already and was been use,only 2 more are missing and those will not do magic.

I also find funny his comment about the xbox one using all 8 cores for DX12,we all know 2 of those cores are reserve for OS and can't be touch,i also don't believe that on DX only 1 core does all the jobs multicore had been support by DX for years and on PC many games use multiple core CPU hell games even demand it..

Software improves that apply to all hardware,CPU over head will not double GPU performance let alone catapult the xbox one hardware 4 generations ahead like AMD claim DX 12 will do with GPU,which in any case will also apply to the PS4 which is the same family of GCN,anything the xbox one can do by API the PS4 can do it as well,so if Performance on the xbox one is double by API alone,the PS4 one can be double by API as well..

This ^^ is what you don't want to see because you some how believe that MS will improve hardware by 100% but some how sony can't because well Yoshida hasn't say it or any one from sony, also because it serve your bias argument best.

DX11 didn't support Partially Resident Textures on 2011 when the GCN line came out,only OpneGL did,it took years MS to implement it,does that mean PRT are better on DX now.? No it doesn't it just support it,the same with DX12 the only problem is that DX on xbox one already have some of those features and still is been out done by PS4 hardware,so you see the ones remaining will not double the xbox one performance,sure there will be an improvement but double..i don't think so..

@tormentos

2-Bunch or crap.

3-There was benchmarks for GCN on PC all over the net relative to the power of the xbox one.

Lol We make API's at work all the time. In fact I'm working on one now! We only expose the bear minimum to outside Dev's. They have no idea whats happening and thats par for the course in API development (for obvious reasons).

Do the benchmarks fully take advantage of the system? Meaning are they real world performance in the way that the system is designed to be used? If so then you're right.

You should post on the blog and debate MisterC. I would almost pay to see that. In fact I don't think anyone has challenged his Math. I find that they're open to dissenting opinions but you had better bring your calculator.

What they claim debunk for it self..lol

The xbox one is 16 ROP,there is no way in hall 16 ROP work like 64 ROP,you know why they invent that crappy sh** right.?

Because when to claim the xbox one has more power,specially 3.9TF like yesterday link 16 ROP serve you for sh**,you will hit a bottle neck by those ROP,GPU equivalent to that kind of power have more minimum 32ROP.

So since the xbox one doesn't have 32 ROP well they invent that the 16 on xbox one can work like 64.lol

But hey how can the xbox one bandwidth that is from 140 to 150GB/s stand by MS it self move 3.9TF.?

The 7950 has 2.8TF and has 240GB/s bandwidth,the 7970 stock has not the ghz edition has 3.7 TF and 264Gb/s...

You just have to look at this numbers and all is clear very fast,the xbox one with ESRAM doesn't have the bandwidth to pass that kind of power,nor the ROP,not only that heat generation would melt the xbox one,is drawing 125 watts 6 less than the PS4 while having no internal PSU that generates more heat and still it runs hotter than the PS4 while gaming.

The problem here is not me been so smart is people like you been to stupid not understand that you are been taken by a troll..lol

Yeah i am sure you do,..lol

Is that you stormyjoe.?

API for consoles are streamline since the go,things always improve,from there to what you,misterx and C and MS is claiming is another 2 cents the xbox one is a weak 7790 downclock you can either accept it or live on denial,it was confirm by MS it self..lol

@rocky_denace: someone call the Waaambulance!

Post the list of games that are not performing better on xbox one ask those so call developers to post the games they are making that are better on xbox one because of DX12.

Oh wait how odd.? Nvidia,AMD,Intel all are hardware makers all which support windows and DX,but wait they don't make fu**ing games either..

And what developers say the ones who makes the games..

Here's an article... no idea why people go on record for stuff like this. http://www.neowin.net/news/directx-12-a-game-changer-for-xbox-one…

Activision...lol

So when will DX12 games will first land.? I hope you still here to behave your self and stop asking mods to close thread,i want you to keep this account alive until then..lol

I can post a list of games superior on PS4 NOW,you yeah live on that promise that DX12 will change everything when it does come here with a list of games which are superior on xbox one..

I never said "double". And NO, just because one company can improve their APIs does not mean a rival can necessarily match the improvements. It doesn't work that way.

Again, you continuously put words in my mouth and then try to discredit those words. I know you can read, perhaps do so when seeing my posts.

You are challenging me on something - software optimization - that you know absolutely nothing about, whereas I have been doing so for... a decade?

Oh really.? Is that why OpenGL and DX basically share the same functions,hell Opengl get them first and MS implement later on most of the time,like PRT API always improve,and they will support anything the other does,basically those are a set of instructions so yeah.

This is why i consider you a joke in any case i would have more faith in sony's ones they have make hardware almost impossible to code shine like no else has faster.

It took 1 year for Gears of war to land on xbox 360 which was the very first true impressive game on 360,it took the PS3 that time 1 year to deliver Uncharted 1 which was the first impressive game on PS3,even that the PS3 was way harder to code for than the 360.

Sony is great pushing hardware so if there is an once of performance in the PS4 left i give Sony a better chance to find it than MS.

No matter how much you want to pretend that changing .net for a new version is the same things as making a damn game is not really the same thing or close and i already beat you at this game your prediction were off by a truck load mine where not..

lol

DX12=effeciency gains, not teh Hidden Powah has been UNLOCKED!!!!!! it will make a difference but the idea that you will instantly get parity is just silly, compromising on game design will net more returns

I just like to play games

OpenGL and Direct X are not the same tech. That's like saying "Well, iOS and Android are the same thing".

Again, you prove you have no fricken idea what the heck you are talking about.

AS far as your .Net comment... they ARE THE SAME THING. Jesus, the dev kit you can get from MS to make your own games is a modified version of .Net. You are so clueless, it's comical.

"beat me"? PLEASE! I debunk your comments daily. You have one thing on me - one prediction that I made 6 months ago. So, your ratio of "wins to losses" is a bout 1:700. Congrats on the 1.

@tormentos:

Yeah i am sure you do,..lol

Is that you stormyjoe.?

API for consoles are streamline since the go,things always improve,from there to what you,misterx and C and MS is claiming is another 2 cents the xbox one is a weak 7790 downclock you can either accept it or live on denial,it was confirm by MS it self..lol

- I've been I development for 10 years. API dev for 3.

- I don't know who Stormyjoe is. I think he has replied already. I guess you two know each other.

- MS will tell you only what you need to know. It's a competitive disadvantage to do a deep dive on the changes that they've done. I get it because we do the same thing. The gamer in me hates it because I like tech analysis.

Yeah sure you have...

Yeah i sue not him...;lol

Oh please dude stop i have been playing videos games since the damn late 70's i am not 17 year old,MS will not hold any advantage over the PS4,anything that make the xbox one look better than the PS4 will be tell show and enlarge by 10 times..

Please dude the only missing API here is DX12,Mantle is here,LibGNM as well and since 2012,but on PS3 there was one similar as well,and even on the PS2,sony's to the metal tools are legendary MS is basically a rookie on to the metal API,their API always have been about making things easier for developers.

Wrapping things up, for the time being while Southern Islands will bring hardware support for PRT software support will remain limited. As D3D is not normally extensible it’s really only possible to easily access the feature from other APIs (e.g. OpenGL), which when it comes to games is going to greatly limit the adoption of the technology. AMD of course is working on the issue, but there are few ways around D3D’s tight restrictions on non-standard features.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5261/amd-radeon-hd-7970-review/6

I guess this mean DX will never support PRT since D3D didn't support PRT yet OpenGl did..

Yeah API evolve and even if MS find a difference way to do something on the xbox one hardware,it is the same hardware the PS4 has,so anything that work on the xbox one GPU or CPU will work on the PS4 GPU and CPU period there is no way around this.

The only way MS could have an advantage is if the GPU inside the xbox or CPU are different hardware which isn't the case here.

So yeah for anything MS can which by the way they are freaking late and behind the curve sony can have an answer.

Now unlike you who want to pretend that only MS hardware will double and sony one can't some how,i believe that anything one console done by API the other can do it,now this is on a software limitation size,both platforms are on equal footing even that sony is ahead tool wise,but the hardware difference still there.

If the PS4 can count to 10 and the xbox one was able to count to 7,and now the xbox one hardware is able to count to 14,then the PS4 hardware will be able to count to 20 because there is a hardware difference that can't be erase with software.

buffoon working with .net in something completely irrelevant to games is not the same dude stop inventing sh**,and yest i have own your ass so many times here is not even funny 700 to 1,lol that is as bad as your predictions for the xbox one vs the PS4 no wonder...

Efficiency gains with a *

DX12 will rely more on GPUCompute which means that it would have been a better system if it had more GCN CUs than it does. All that supposed compute workload that is freed up or more efficient on the XBone is easily eclipsed by the fact that PS4s GPU simply has more hardware to throw at it.

So, DX12 isn't going to close the gap with the PS4 no matter what anyone says. It's not physically/scientifically/mathematically possible. What it will do is hopefully give developers a much better API to use the XBones hardware features than what they have now, which frees them up to do more things with their games and that is a good thing.

..because they have more time to work with the PS4 now.

Moon is made of blue cheese...

Microsoft does not have to give it's API's to Sony, nor does Sony have to give their APIs to Microsoft. You literally have no idea how software works. You are really making yourself look like an idiot for debating things you know nothing about.

And, for the love of God, STOP F**KING SAYING I THINK THE XB1 WILL DOUBLE IN SPEED - I HAVE NEVER SAID THAT. Clear enough? Do you need it in a larger font?

Also, you are again saying things that I have never said, and then trying to counter them. I never said Sony's APIs wouldn't also increase in performance. WTF is the matter with you???!!!!

Finally, being a .Net developer is 100% relevant. You just don't know what you are talking about enough to understand that.

I don't believe Intel, NVidia or AMD have said a single thing to the effect of DX12 making the X1 better. I'mma have to call shenanigans on that one.

Also, you act like DX12 is like the Manhattan Project in some super secret lab under the ocean. Information on it is widely available. Especially to people in MSDN. I'm going to drop the mic and walk away now.

Tormento's I'm not trying to dis-credit your argument because some of it is true as DX and OpenGL share some basic function but once you're past very basic functions and instructions, the two differ quite a bit. I've had experience with both, much more DX then OGL but I believe I've worked with them enough to know there are some pretty substantial differences.

I'm just wondering if you have any real life experience with either and if so where do you think one exceeds over the other?

For me personally DX12 will be the better platform for a little while It makes up a lot of short comings that DX11 suffered from. Saying that I fully expect OpenGL to make the same improvements (I'm sure internally it's already in the works.) For awhile we will see better PS4 exclusives, then we'll see some better X1 exclusives using the new tools and then better PS4 exclusives. It will be a race that always goes back and forth with the PS4 most likely ending up in the better position in the end.

@rocky_denace said:

@Shewgenja said:

@rocky_denace said:

You see here we go round and round the same circle rinse and repeat for the 1000's time no one on here has any real world hands on experience with DX12 yet a developer currently working with it does along with Intel AMD and Nvidia have all said DX12 is a big leap and will make the X1 have a big performance boost. But we are still going round and round with fanboys who have no knowledge at all or have no access to the API dev tools yet they are proclaiming basically that a real developer who is working with it along with MS AMD Intel and Nvidia that they are all full of shit?

Geezzz mods close this worthless thread please.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=N0trrEQzWE4

I don't believe Intel, NVidia or AMD have said a single thing to the effect of DX12 making the X1 better. I'mma have to call shenanigans on that one.

Also, you act like DX12 is like the Manhattan Project in some super secret lab under the ocean. Information on it is widely available. Especially to people in MSDN. I'm going to drop the mic and walk away now.

Even in the face of links provided with proof you still hit yourself in the face with a cream pie and stay blind to it. This thread is so full of worthless blind fanboys

^Hey look, I found one!

@lostrib said:

@rocky_denace said:

@Shewgenja said:

@rocky_denace said:

You see here we go round and round the same circle rinse and repeat for the 1000's time no one on here has any real world hands on experience with DX12 yet a developer currently working with it does along with Intel AMD and Nvidia have all said DX12 is a big leap and will make the X1 have a big performance boost. But we are still going round and round with fanboys who have no knowledge at all or have no access to the API dev tools yet they are proclaiming basically that a real developer who is working with it along with MS AMD Intel and Nvidia that they are all full of shit?

Geezzz mods close this worthless thread please.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=N0trrEQzWE4

I don't believe Intel, NVidia or AMD have said a single thing to the effect of DX12 making the X1 better. I'mma have to call shenanigans on that one.

Also, you act like DX12 is like the Manhattan Project in some super secret lab under the ocean. Information on it is widely available. Especially to people in MSDN. I'm going to drop the mic and walk away now.

Even in the face of links provided with proof you still hit yourself in the face with a cream pie and stay blind to it. This thread is so full of worthless blind fanboys

^Hey look, I found one!

hahaha ziiiiiiiiiiiiing

@lostrib: lol

I don't know who that is in your signature, but her facial expression makes me want to make naughty time with my computer monitor.

google Gina Carano. edit: actually don't she's quite hit and miss on google. The gif of her in my sig is her looking phenomenal.

10/10 would wreck.

Oh and uhh some on-topic videogame stuff .. err.. XBone sucks. It's sauce is weak. Blah blah. Thank you Based Kaz.

..Damn she's fine.

@Shewgenja: you are loosing control sir, i better not see his signature

to pull off DX12 effects you are going to need extra GPU power to render it.

right now X1 cant even render Titanfall which is DX9 based engine at 1080p and MS wants people to believe that X1 will render DX12 games at 1440p/60fps?

damn, what a slap in the face that is to all xbox fans, its an insult, but thank god for social media, this will be debunked before its even out, heck, it already feels like its been debunked.

She is cute... damn

On topic... are you saying that you've had access to DX 12?

It's probably best not to ask for the mods when you're using a word that isn't allowed on the forums

She used to be an American Gladiator.

yeah she either is/was a pro fighter too I believe. Pray for the men that ever cheat on her.

You are a buffoon and you will always be.

MS and sony don't have to give API one to another to be able to use features of one API on another..

PRT wasn't support by DX on 2011,now they are on DX 11.2 you also know them as Tile Resources..

The MS got a hold of OpenGL.? You know sh** of what your talking MS doesn't need to get OpenGL to be able to support something OpenGL support i just proved that very easy just like they don't need to get Sony APi or the other way around,and while DX11.2 is relatively new OpenGL since 2011 has support for PRT.

I have a point with links you don't.

API get new features all the time,mostly like PRT OpenGL get them first,in this case it took MS almost 3 years to bring tile resources after OpenGL did.

Dude WTF i argue with you for pages on end to get you to admit that SONY api would also improve and then after you did,you try to minimize sony's improvements based on the fact that developers haven't complain,that sony hasn't say anything or that sony API was good enough,so it would not improve like DX on xbox one..

A few months ago Tile resources was the secret weapon you lemmings were using,Tile Resources is PRT which is also supported on PS4 i argue this to hell and beyond and you people would not admit working for PS4..lol

The new secret sauce no is DX12..lol

No is not you are not making a game nor you are a damn game developers quick talking sh**.

It's double digit on AMD CPUs. The person who stated 2X for X1 is from Star Swarm Mantle benchmark stake-holders.

http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/adam/c992448b1fde675a7e39d816426b9753/kaveri11.jpg

On DX11 vs Mantle on AMD Kaveri and Star Swarm Mantle, it's 3X.

Yes dude I know.....

@tormentos said:

@StormyJoe said:

Moon is made of blue cheese...

Microsoft does not have to give it's API's to Sony, nor does Sony have to give their APIs to Microsoft. You literally have no idea how software works. You are really making yourself look like an idiot for debating things you know nothing about.

And, for the love of God, STOP F**KING SAYING I THINK THE XB1 WILL DOUBLE IN SPEED - I HAVE NEVER SAID THAT. Clear enough? Do you need it in a larger font?

Also, you are again saying things that I have never said, and then trying to counter them. I never said Sony's APIs wouldn't also increase in performance. WTF is the matter with you???!!!!

Finally, being a .Net developer is 100% relevant. You just don't know what you are talking about enough to understand that.

You are a buffoon and you will always be.

MS and sony don't have to give API one to another to be able to use features of one API on another..

PRT wasn't support by DX on 2011,now they are on DX 11.2 you also know them as Tile Resources..

The MS got a hold of OpenGL.? You know sh** of what your talking MS doesn't need to get OpenGL to be able to support something OpenGL support i just proved that very easy just like they don't need to get Sony APi or the other way around,and while DX11.2 is relatively new OpenGL since 2011 has support for PRT.

I have a point with links you don't.

API get new features all the time,mostly like PRT OpenGL get them first,in this case it took MS almost 3 years to bring tile resources after OpenGL did.

Dude WTF i argue with you for pages on end to get you to admit that SONY api would also improve and then after you did,you try to minimize sony's improvements based on the fact that developers haven't complain,that sony hasn't say anything or that sony API was good enough,so it would not improve like DX on xbox one..

A few months ago Tile resources was the secret weapon you lemmings were using,Tile Resources is PRT which is also supported on PS4 i argue this to hell and beyond and you people would not admit working for PS4..lol

The new secret sauce no is DX12..lol

No is not you are not making a game nor you are a damn game developers quick talking sh**.

Note that AMD's GL_AMD_sparse_texture(1) vendor specific extension was displaced by GL_ARB_sparse_texture(2).

GL_ARB_sparse_texture is part of OpenGL 4.4 and AMD doesn't support OpenGL 4.4(3) at this time and AMD's GL_AMD_sparse_texture extension is dead.

References

1. https://www.opengl.org/registry/specs/AMD/sparse_texture.txt

2. http://www.opengl.org/registry/specs/ARB/sparse_texture.txt it has NVIDIA's input.

3. http://www.khronos.org/news/press/khronos-releases-opengl-4.4-specification

Without ARB's support, it's a dead end API.

----------------

For textures that fits within the 6 GB memory, AMD PRT has more performance gain on X1 (1) than PS4(2).

1. X1's TMU fetch source starts from 68 GB/s** to 204 GB/s** ESRAM. Hotchip.org stated peak 204 GB/s** BW (Back Write). "Tiling tricks" needs to be applied for textures (via AMD PRT) and render targets.

2. PS4's TMU fetch source remains at 176 GB/s**.

**theoretical peak values.

For greater than 6 GB textures, AMD PRT can be applied on HDD or Blu-ray sources.

In terms of AMD PRT functionality, AMD Kaveri APU's single speed memory design is similar to PS4's single speed memory design and the only large difference is with memory speed e.g. Kaveri's 128bit DDR3-2xx0 Mhz vs PS4's 256bit GDDR5-5500 Mhz.

PS4's PRT function just with HDD/Blu-Ray -> GDDR5.

X1's PRT function is with HDD/Blu-Ray -> DDR3 -> ESRAM.

Kaveri's PRT function just with HDD/SSD -> DDR3.

Gaming PC with dGPU's PRT function is with HDD/SSD -> DDR3 -> GDDR5.

what a load of bollox any kid here thinking dx12 is going to make any diffrence is going to be very let down.

since when does more technical graphics use less power ha ha ha the x1 will struggle even more with dx12 belive me it will be very watered down than what youl see on pc.

this is just more damage control from ms cos the ps4 is better..

@tormentos:

updated conversation from Brad Wardell:

Brad Wardell - "One way to look at the XBox One with DirectX 11 is it has 8 cores but only 1 of them does dx work. With dx12, all 8 do."

Some guy - "Xboxone alredy does that. All those dx 12 improvements are about windows not xbox."

Brad Wardell - "I'm sorry but you're totally wrong on that front. If you disagree, better tell MS. I'm just the messenger."

Some guy - "in all materials published they talk about PC. They only mention XBOX as already hawing close to zero owerhead."

Brad Wardell - "XBO is very low on overhead. Overhead is not the problem. It is that the XBO isn't splitting DX tasks across the 8 cores."

Multi-core issue:

Some guy - "I thought the Xbox One had 6 cores available for gaming and 2 cores reserved for the OS, does DX12 change this?"

Brad Wardell - "not that I'm aware of. #cores for gaming is different than cores that interact with the GPU."

Did you watch that video demo they showed where they used 3DMark to demonstrate the workload on the cpu, where one core was main thread and pulled the biggest load then they switched to DX12 and the wordload was splitted evenly across all cores? This might be a pretty big deal, Infamous had CPU bottleneck right? It might be that also the PS4 currently dosent split the load evenly accross the cores, but what do I know. Im not a dev

MS needs to lie more.

@FastRobby: tormentos eating lemmings alive you mean

From what I have read the PS4 API is very close to Mantle. I have also read that DX12 is very close to Mantle so it seems like both the PS4 and Xbox One API are going to be based on the same core implementation. That would further suggest that any advances AMD make with Mantle between now and DX12's release will be incorporated to DX12 and likely to the PS4 API as well.

Mantle is very good at improving minimum frame rates in sections that are CPU bound, this is obvious in larger BF4 maps. Given that we see the PS4 consistently score higher minimums than Xbox One, even in cases where the PS4 is pushing more intense graphical settings (BF4 again) it would suggest that the advances AMD made with Mantle have found their way into the low level PS4 API and are on their way to the Xbox API in the form of DX12.

Given that it would seem logical to conclude that the Xbox One will close the gap somewhat with PS4, I see 900p vs 1080p with all else being equal becoming the norm as that would be a good balance for the GPU performance differences and the amount of ESRAM the Xbox One has. The current status of 900p vs 1080p + more graphics or 720p vs 1080p shows a larger discrepancy than the GPU performance differences would indicate, even when taking into account the ESRAM.