Trump vs... sports athletes

Yes, you have very little data to support the idea that police officers behave like they are in generic action movies. No where near the amount to justify a claim that there is some sort of crisis. In the real world police have a far better safety record then doctors. If that safety record justifies wild, hyperbolic ranting then pretty much everything does. Could you imagine having a conversation about healthcare with someone who rants about doctors the way you rant about the police?

Crazy thing is such people would have, at the minimum, two hundred times the bodies backing up their claims that doctors are the real 'villains', and they are still crazy

As for vaccination comment, here is a Link.

Other possible, but much rarer, side effects – reported in fewer than 1 in 10,000 babies – include:

• fits or seizures

1 in10,000 is about on par with police shootings, and that is just one vaccine.

This one sends around 1 child in 1,000 into convulsions. MMR has the same odds of giving kids seizures. If you look at millions upon millions of examples of pretty much anything, you will find a lot of statistically rare tragedy. That is just how life works. People who use rare tragedies to start panics are not helping anyone.

If you're going to cling to this hyperbolic statement as some kind of finishing line for everything ive said on this topic, then we are not going to be able to discuss this or address any problems we face, at this point i feel you really don't care, you don't seem to remember when police behaved differently, you dont seem to remember we once held them accountable and you don't seem to give a shit whether these things weve moved away from change for the better or not.

You can like this or not but we have tons of data, peer review which includes fbi reports and justice department reports, that demonstrate massive issues with our police forces. Everything from them being poorly trained and being trained to point their gun at people instead of desolating situations to them intentionally targeting minorities and lower class citizens. The problem is there are so many aspects of policing that has gone wrong in a nation that is supposed to be very.... critical of police instead of authorization.

Also anti-vaxxers cling to the idea that vaccinations causes autism. NOT that its some magical medicine with zero short term side effects for a small percentage of the world.

So I just listened to this podcast by 1A on the subject of kneeling during the national anthem. It was really well done, and I don't agree with everything said, but Joshua Johnson is a really smart guy it seems and asks many questions to the people on his show that people discussing this topic are interested in.

Just thought I would share.

Weird how going lower then 1 in 1000 is unrealistic when talking about medicine, but 1 in >10,000 is a crisis when talking about law enforcement.

As for the rest: If you would like to discuss a non-hyperbolic position please feel free to offer one. Until you leave claims there is a crisis behind however, that can't really happen.

So Trump is now a republican who disagrees with himself.

Seriously get a grip ma'am

I didnt say its unrealistic.

I said its a minor side effect, not long term. And the thing anti-vaxxers want to believe is long term autism (which is an idea that has been disproved time and time again. NOT short term side effects of medicine). Police issues, are also long term.

Keep up. If you cannot accurately read and then represent what i say, you should slow down your reading and then make sure you accurately represent it.

But you know what? Lets say i did say that its unrealistic, so what? You're talking about medicine, something with side effects that we devote billions of dollars into solving every single year. We are already addressing those concerns, its why we have the modern medicine we do and not medicine from 1950. These are unintended side effects that we are currently attempting to change, can we say that same thing about policing? No matter how much you want to minimize this issue with your numbers, can we say this same thing? This would be a very different conversation if we saw an attempt to fix these problems.

historically hes a democrat who disagree's with himself.

Once again you did not understand what I wrote. Seriously this is getting ridiculous.

Again with the twisting , don´t you ever get tired of it?

It´s at least getting old

I didn't twist anything you did. Either you are a troll or you don't understand what you read. At this point I'm not sure which but every comment you've made today has been misreading posts.

Again nice try but i know you are just a troll. Once you get caught you twist and turn your arguments until people just quit and then you can feel like you won.

Classic Troll behaviour and even when a actual police officer showed you evidence of an argument disproving yours, you twisted it to make it sound like you a laymen had the correct facts, like with the national anthem, it´s not like a hidden fact why it´s played. I mean anyone watching monday night football have seen troops stand and salute, carry the flag out and i know you try to watch the grown up CNN , where a army ranger schooled the anchors in the reason behind , even tho even they knew it was for the troops but had the reason wrong.. Same Army ranger who had a talk with Colin after his first protests and helped him understand why and helped find a middleground. IE the kneeling.

Yes, of course we can. A person seeking treatment at a hospital is more likely to suffer preventable harm at the hands of medical professionals then a criminal is to be harmed by law enforcement. You don't get that kind of record without heavily prioritizing the safety of those who are under arrest. It takes commitment, training, dedication, restraint, and a willingness to evolve to maintain that safety record. It isn't a fluke.

Is it perfect? Of course not. It is just far safer then modern medicine. If something is at least two hundred times safer then going to the hospital, I don't see justification for claiming their is a crisis, and you have not provided one.

None of my arguments have changed at all. It's a shame you are not able to correctly read posts. Or you do and you are a troll Jan.

Actually I asked for examples of why cops needed military grade gear and he gave me past examples when they didn't have any. Seems I was right. It isn't needed. Also I don't believe peace officers....which cops are should be militarized against the citizenry no matter what a cop thinks. I don't have high opinions of many of those that choose that profession. Some do join to serve but many join for power.

Not sure what you're whining about troops for here. Many vets and current soldiers are okay with people exercising their Constitutional rights...those who aren't don't understand what they are doing in the service then and I'm supposed to care about their opinions? Also.........their opinions are NOT facts.

The problem here is we do our best to prevent these medical mishaps. No matter how bad you want to make the situation sound, we put billions into preventing these things, pass legislation and generally try to move forward to find solutions. You don't seem to understand the fundamental difference of efforts taken, but even worse you seem to not really understand why its a dumb idea to compare policing to medicine. IMO if you were an honest person you'd be ashamed to make this comparison.

You would have... i mean... some what of a decent argument if we didnt see any of this.

No i have not done this, the FBI, justice department and academia have. As for sources, honestly i dont take you seriously enough to waste my time providing them. Even LJS, who i disagree with often, knows that if i take you seriously ill at least provide the information and sources.

Which congratulations i might add, you're in Jacanuk and DD territory here.

Just an FYI your analogy about police being comparable to medicine is faulty on it's face.

Are you for real? and nice attempt with the misspelling of my name.

You got examples, he gave you concrete examples of where the military equipment had come in use, What did you expect , new examples from the future, talk about delusional. So again no you were not right, equipment gained before Obama put a hold on the program, was not handed back neither was it required to. Meaning that they had the option during the time when the program was not active.

So he proved why the program is good and why it even sometimes benefits the suspects , the man in the car could have been shot and killed instead, but they chose to use other methods , methods they had curtsey of the military. Also as was said Military equipment is sometimes just the same equipment the cops already have, except for the fact that they have to meet a much higher standard.

And again you turn into a child when proven wrong, just admit you were wrong and get over it. The army ranger did not state a opinion, he stated facts IE the "He schooled the anchors"

Uh no. No he didn't. He gave examples of events. Not equipment.

We spend hundreds of billions investing in extremely safe law enforcement as well, and I am not trying to make any situation sound bad. My entire point is that things are not as bad as people say, remember? Hospitals are extremely safe by the standards of sane people who avoid using tragedy to distort perception. Lots of room for improvement but still safe. It just so happens that getting arrested is hundreds of times safer.

That isn't a crisis, it is a triumph. No matter how bad you want to make the situation sound.

He gave you examples of events where they used the gained equipment like you asked, It's easy enough to go back and check.

Giving them tasers and military equipment does absolutely nothing to address any of the issues that need addressing. Stop doing everything you can to avoid the actual topic, or to make direct and honest comparisons.

BTW, your little comment about making policing safer, really kind of highlights part of the problem right? That its safer than say... being a garbage man, and yet we see double the amount of shootings, police dressed in military pointing guns at everyone (which any military person will tell you this is a big no no), police presence, etc. Yah, its super safe to be a street pig right now but the whole idea behind doing that is its supposed to help them do their job, which is protecting citizens and ensuring their rights are not violated. Sadly we've gotten to the point where police are the one's violating these rights. For instance, NY had over 34,000 people arrested in one year for "resisting arrest" and that was the only charge.... im willing to bet you don't grasp why thats a bad thing and why it violates someones rights. But think about it as a solo charge, for two seconds, just take two seconds out of your life and use a handful of those brain cells.

If you had the slightest understanding of our legal system you'd understand how and why its a "crisis".... not focus on hyperbolic terms and btw, great job completely avoiding the part where i mentioned that it was not me declaring these things, rather every system you rely on for your daily life.

You are right, being arrested might be safer then being a garbage man. Don't see why that highlights something worth so much outrage, or why you need to use hyperbolic terms like crisis to describe something that is and will continue to be one of the safest things around. If you want things to improve along a path you envision you will have to convince people who disagree that you have a point. You haven't even really made an effort to make a valid argument. You just point to rare events and insult anyone who doesn't salute your toxic rants.

I also do not care that Cops have tasers and such. How is this inappropriate? America is an armed society. There was about 25 million guns sold in America last year. Why should we disarm the people who enforce gun laws? How is arming law enforcement organizations that operate in armed societies a symptom of crisis? Without answers to questions like these, all you have is a rant.

*edit* Oh I forgot the whole: "I never said it was a crisis" part. For that one, I point you back to your own words.

"You want to call the idea of correcting this behavior by police "fantasy" yet you fail to realize that the only other countries who deal with police as bad as Americas, are third world shitholes with dictators. You also fail to realize that you and your fellow porkers, have gotten progressively worse at your jobs over the years. Anyone actually attempting to solve crimes becomes a detective. SWAT and street cops simply want control over people.... anyone looking into these issues has seen the many peer reviews on the psychology of sliced back fats. You exhibit these same behaviors, you could give a shit about doing a better job as a cop. You don't give a shit about improving a community or police work... or solving these problems... how is it that police shootings can double in one year and you don't care at all? That you're not suggesting that maybe, just maybe, the problem is with how police forces function since we 100% cannot find any other correlating factors? Someone suggests that police learn to fire their weapons properly and go right to action movie number 182,987 that you saw and remember that scenario, and present it as something that an officer would most likely go through in their career. All to avoid any kind of solutions to these problems, where some of these problems just fucking started half a decade ago."

Pretty sure anyone sane would define that kind of mess as a "crisis" I don't know about you, but if I felt like I lived in a third world shithole I would panic a bit.

What a curious deflection, driven by ad hominem. I don't feel the need to recap on your side-stepping, omission, and then aimless rambling mantra. It appears that having a reasonable discussion with you is no longer viable due to your fervent elementary behavior. Take some time off the website to better collect your thoughts.

@Stevo_the_gamer: Man that's not cool.

Can't play nice, then don't post.

See below first example during the discussion from before, highlighted equipmentwith asterisks:

Last night, our ***HELICOPTER*** unit (and a highway patrol ***FIXED WING AIRCRAFT***), provided ***FLIR*** support for a stolen vehicle location from a pursuit which escaped into a neighborhood. A general description of the vehicle and the air units were able to detect heat on vehicles, and they're able to determine if a vehicle was traveling at a high rate of speed due to level of heat on tires. This allows law enforcement to better coordinate and be more effective in catching suspects who fled and managed to get away from view.

The new camera system (which I believe cost around 300k?), can pinpoint on addresses from miles out (CHP has the best camera out there though). The camera can remain fixed on the address or object while the helicopter goes into a hovering-circling position. So, if we locate the stolen vehicle and the suspects foot bail, the camera will easily track them. The helicopter can read a license plate from a mile away. It's incredible stuff.

Nice copycat there.

Also nice hypocrisy,

Just seems you got mad at him.

What does a helicopter have to do with anything?

Once again you missed the point.

I can't hand-hold anymore that I have already done above.

In other words you aren't going to elaborate on what point you're trying to make. Most helicopters have infrared on them to find bodies in the dark. Is there a reason the cops on the ground aren't looking at plate numbers?

Once again you prove to be a hypocrite.

KOD´s response was far far worse and if we remove the moderator badge from Steve for a min, that was certainly uncalled for.

But yet no "LJS"

Look I'm not going around in circles with you. You didn't understand my post as yours demonstrates so drop it.

Wow this backfired hard on Trump, why is he behaving like a clown anyways? This story was almost forgotten till' he brought it up, then it completely exploded again. Should a president be calling football players sons of bitches? Seems childish.

He couldn't even say that bout the KKK and Neo-Nazis rofl.

Also the far right wingnutjobs in this thread won't accept that this entire ordeal was a huge political misfire and miscalculation on Trump's part, sad.

Who, Trump and his crew?

He's very unpresidential and yeah...........calling white supremacists very fine people and football players sons of bitches shows exactly what he thinks of race. His racism does not surprise me.....what does surprise me is those who continue to support him.

Well, even Steve seemed to have missed your "sarcasm" so perhaps next time make it more clear.

No Steve commented. I have no doubt he understands posts.

Where is the ad hominem?

Being a master in this Blue, shouldn´t you know what it means?

You revealed yourself. You think money should be put before integrity, and people should compromise thir beliefs to appease YOU. I bet you never stood for the pledge when you watch football, but you damn sure are gonna act like it now.

@Mercenary848:

Haters gonna hate.........

True that. Also careful when debating stevo....as we can see with how he handled kod for being honest. I know from personal experience he will suspend you for telling too much truth.

Name-calling and insults aren't ad hominems lol.

Please educate yourself.

Yeah I noticed that.

Didn't you call him an idiot or something along those lines? Or were you the one that wrote that cops should be hung in public?

That's what he meant about telling too much truth.

Neither, but the former.......nah im not gonna risk it lol

It's alright, @perfect_blue bit the bullet for you. lol, I'm outta here.

That was hilarious, but I dont think it was me who called him an idiot. I needto look up the thread, but it was probably something about the way he acts in relation to being an officer.

Also you all are about to get me suspended again by bringing this up lol

#NoRagrets