Poll: Majority of Republicans Want Kavanaugh Confirmed Even if Guilty

And? So I do not like the far-left nature of California. But come on we both now that you were not saying that, you were trying to accuse me of something, you are to chicken to just come out and say directly, so you coward behind hints.

The population of states is clearly no irrelevant, neither in what you advocate for "popular vote" which by the way every state has, so are you ok with state rights being cancelled out and all goes to the Federal government to decide. BEcause if not then you are clearly not for a popular vote system.

Also, California does not count less than a person in North Dakota or Ohio, they have a census unbiased method of determining the size of the population, which by a mathematical system determines how many votes they get. A fair and unbiased system that while the EC is not perfect, makes it far more suited for a union like America

And contradicted anything as to California.

Well, clearly they did not. and a president is 1 person not multiple.

Republicans have a majority in both chambers, so anything else you would like to showcase your complete lack of knowledge about?

Prove with citation the polls I linked are inaccurate. I need to see that their methodology/sampling/weighting is wrong.

What you are doing is giving ideas on why they might be wrong (posed in the form of a rhetorical question even you can't answer). But no numerical facts on why they actually are wrong. I do not care for arm-chair theory on mathematical issues. You can't possibly prove those (D) or (R) seats were gained or lost due to those specific issues I brought up and by how much % each, and if other issues were or were not more important to the voter. You would need to link a study that shows issue Y alone made candidates X lose or win Nationally and all compared against each other, or seriously stop bringing up Jacanuk-theories.

Now you're disputing math again.........WTF.

He disputed math the second he said all major pollsters were wrong on national polling for these issues even though they are historically accurate (He ended up mixing up EC Predictions with national polling).

What he's suggesting is simply extremely improbable and he is offering zero citation to show these polls are inaccurate.

Stop deflecting and answer the question.

How come the election results do not reflect the polls you claim prove that liberal ideas are more popular...... It´s not that hard.

Or are you refusing to answer because you know you dug yourself into a hole you can´t get up from.

Is this real life? Are you not looking at your Notifications. Are you this low IQ? I JUST answered this, again, by quoting my own post from yesterday. You keep skipping over these posts.

Here goes AGAIN.

How come the election results do not reflect the polls you claim prove that liberal ideas are more popular...... It´s not that hard.

1. Not all liberal ideas are the most popular ones. I never said all. Just the ones I linked. They are objectively more popular until counter-citation is provided. You have not given such data, so there is no reason for me or anyone else to believe these polls are all wrong.

2. Not all voters are single issue.

3. Democrat voter turn out is less.

4. But election results did reflect this for the last national opinion measure, even with lower (D) turn out.

5. Prove your theory with peer reviewedstudies. It's armchair until then,

What you are doing is giving ideas on why they might be wrong (posed in the form of a rhetorical question even you can't answer). But no numerical facts on why they actually are wrong. I do not care for arm-chair theory on mathematical issues. You can't possibly prove those (D) or (R) seats were gained or lost due to those specific issues I brought up and by how much % each, and if other issues were or were not more important to the voter. You would need to link a study that shows issue Y alone made candidates X lose or win Nationally and all compared against each other, or seriously stop bringing up Jacanuk-theories.

P.S. Posing a question without even being able to answer it yourself doesn't actually refute massive data sets. Climate deniers try this too. You have to actually refute the data I'm giving you with your own data sets, linked. And directly, not theory. Did you just start debating after the 2016? You're bad at this.

Or are you refusing to answer because you know you dug yourself into a hole you can´t get up from.

Yes. The guy sourcing all of his claims (several for each issue) is the one in the hole. Not the guy who can't give a shred of evidence that the methodology of these polls are false.

Roe vs Wade/Abortion

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/02/politics/quinnipiac-roe-v-wade-poll/index.html

https://news.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/nbc-wsj-poll-support-roe-v-wade-hits-new-high-n893806

https://www.kff.org/health-reform/press-release/poll-two-thirds-of-americans-dont-want-the-supreme-court-to-overturn-roe-v-wade/

Gun Control

https://news.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx (Also higher w/out recent shooting spikes).

https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/379939-ap-poll-finds-highest-support-for-gun-control-in-five-years

Climate Change

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2449

https://news.gallup.com/poll/206030/global-warming-concern-three-decade-high.aspx

http://closup.umich.edu/files/ieep-nsee-10-year-federalism.pdf

Gay Rights

https://news.gallup.com/poll/1651/gay-lesbian-rights.aspx

Weed

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/385018-poll-support-for-legal-marijuana-hits-all-time-high

Unions

https://news.gallup.com/poll/241679/labor-union-approval-steady-year-high.aspx

Healthcare

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/04/12/about-half-of-americans-support-single-payer-health-care/

https://news.gallup.com/poll/4708/healthcare-system.aspx

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/403248-poll-seventy-percent-of-americans-support-medicare-for-all

Dreamers

https://nypost.com/2018/01/11/huge-majority-of-americans-want-dreamers-to-stay-in-us-poll/

https://www.npr.org/2018/02/06/583402634/npr-poll-2-in-3-support-legal-status-for-dreamers-majority-oppose-building-a-wal

So you keep deflecting, but at least you admit you are wrong and again are just BS´ing your way as a normal kid your age would do (ie a kid of around 5)

Are you just trolling me now?

Would you please just click your notifications and stop making an ass of yourself? I answered your unproven theory (no studies linked) several times now. Even recently 1 hour ago. You skip all of these posts.

Btw, Every time you make a post without linking a study confirming this theory of yours or piece of evidence to show my polls are inaccurate, you prove you are wrong.

but at least you admit you are wrong

You're telling me all major polls are wrong?

This is an amazing claim and I need data proving this now. Please cite it.

So you finally decided to answer the question partially.

1. And if we just take the ones you linked to, Close to all Republicans voted in are against DACA/Illegal immigration, They are pro-life, not pro-choice, they are for guns, not gun control.... so anything else?

2. No, not all vote on a single issue, but a lot are and that does not explain the discrepancy there is among the polls and the election results, even if you take the polls and divide it up by political affiliation.

3. And? you claim a majority of Americans, So either you are claiming that a Majority is purely democratic and they allow a small Republican minority to choose for them, so that brings up another issue, which is importance.

4. Which election result? the president or the Congres, you need to be clear here.

5. I do not need to find an opinion from other people to back up my argument, we are looking at facts here, The Democrats are a minority party, that is a fact. The Republicans hold both chambers meaning a majority of America voted them there.

Also, you are not stating facts, polls are not facts, they are merely opinions, This is something you learn in 101 Math class in Highschool.

No, I am not telling you all polls are wrong, I am telling you that there is a discrepancy between what someone says in an anonymous poll and what they do when it´s time to put their x at the polls.

You argue that Liberal ideas are the most popular, and to back that claim up you use polls. You never deal with the above discrepancy. So either people lie in polls or Liberal ideas are not really the most popular ideas in America.

It´s not brain surgery here.

You are either incompetent or a goonish liar.

#177 Zaryia (5623 posts) - 16 hours, 58 minutes ago

#200Zaryia (5622 posts) - 36 minutes, 10 seconds ago

Only ~26% of this country is Republican. Most (R) voting for those issues doesn't change overall national views on those issues. When adding (D) and (I), more Americans agree with the ideals I linked.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/15370/party-affiliation.aspx

Still, many are not single issue voters though. And for single issue voters, YOU would have show how many votes were gained or lost to those specific issues, each. It's your theory. Prove it. You aren't offering any studies on this.

For example, even most (R) support Roe. Yet they likely still won't vote (D). https://www.wsj.com/articles/record-71-of-voters-oppose-overturning-roe-v-wade-1532379600

What do you mean and. It doesn't accurately reflect the entire national opinion if a certain side has lower turn out.

The last few presidential elections. The Democrat had more votes, and that is with lower turn out. Although you can't look at this alone due to many people not being just single issue voters and (D) having lower turn out.

Yes you do need to find a peer reviewed study when making bold claims. You're posting a wild theory you churned up on your own. I'm posting facts and data that state exactly what I'm stating. You aren't giving me a study actually showing that (D) lost seats due to those specific issues alone. Or that (D) is general has less voters due to these issues. That is your theory. You think all those polls are wrong, you must prove this with data. Those polls use data.

And you are losing this debate for it.

Polls are not opinions. They look at opinions, and use statistical measures and scientific methodology. The pollsters I am using are highly accurate, and I use multiple of each for each issue.

You have not refuted any of them yet with citation.

I know, because you googled your heart out and couldn't find any counter data to them.

This is your theory. You didn't prove it with a single digit or link so far. You would have to prove single issue voters made more D candidates lose due to the specific issues I showed. I would have to see the actual numbers and stats on this. Please post a study.

Those specific ideas are the most popular. Not every liberal issue. I didn't just argue it, I showed it is objectively the case until counter-data is provided (You won't).

You never deal with the above discrepancy. So either people lie in polls or Liberal ideas are not really the most popular ideas in America.

I've dealt with your theory multiple times. Apart from you not proving it with numbers, I told you not every single voter is single issue, (D) has lower turn out,and that (D) actually had the higher votes in the last national election making your entire theory odd. People don't lie in polls, it's just that several of them don't vote or don't let 1 issue sway their vote.

IE: Most (R) are for Roe yet wont vote (D).

It´s not brain surgery here.

I know. Which is why I accept the results of multiple coveted pollsters (after double checking their methodology and history) instead of brain storming ideas of why they might not be true without actually having a single number to cite. That would be dumb. Worse than climate-denial levels of dumb.

Statistics can say whatever you make them say.

Well, it´s not easy to follow the posts when they get edited on the fly.

Yes, 26% is republican and 27% is Democrat the rest is independent. but 238 seats out of 435 are republican and 51 out of 100 seats in the Senate is Republican. And if you look at the two independent, Democrats only have 47.

But if we look at the independent voters, it´s interesting to see that 44% seen themselves as independent which normally means they go with the ideas they feel the strongest for. Which would mean they could go for a single issue, which they don't, the independent tend to follow either of the two main sides.

@zaryia said:

What do you mean and. It doesn't accurately reflect the entire national opinion if a certain side has lower turn out.

Well, i mean that if your premise is that there is A: More democrats but because of lower turnout, the fewer Republicans are allowed to vote in their candidate. That it must mean that these Democrats do not care enough to vote, which make their opinion moot.

@zaryia said:

The last few presidential elections. The Democrat had more votes, and that is with lower turn out. Reflecting those ideas were more popular, although you can't look at this alone due to many people not being just single issue voters and (D) having lower turn out.

Sure, but as we have seen since Obama, the presidential election is a popularity contest, no one cares about the issues which especially Trump´s ability to win shows. So using the presidential election results as an argument is moot.

If you look at the local state government, Republicans have 31 States, Democrats have 14. and 4 is split. And only 6 states have a democratic controlled 3 level government, Guess which ones (California, Hawaii, Oregon, Rhode Island, Connecticut, Delaware) Hold only 15 governorships, Republicans hold 33.

@zaryia said:

Yes you do need to find a peer reviewed study when making bold claims. You're posting a wild theory you churned up on your own. I'm posting facts and data that state exactly what I'm stating. You aren't giving me a study actually showing that (D) lost seats due to those specific issues alone. Or that (D) is general has less voters due to these issues. That is your theory. You think all those polls are wrong, you must prove this with data. Those polls use data.

And you are losing this debate for it.

I am stating facts, I do not need someone else's opinion to back anything up, we are dealing with objective facts here, it´s a fact that there are a 100 senators, 51 of those are republican, 47 is democratic, it´s a fact that as stated above that by far the republicans are in control in most state governments.

So if you refute them, you are refuting empirical data. And if you claim to win a debate by refuting empirical data, you clearly never attended or watch a debate in high school, university or at any educational level. Unless of course you are not born in America and have had your basic education in another country.

@zaryia said:

Polls are not opinions. They look at opinions, and use statistical measures and scientific methodology. The pollsters I am using are highly accurate, and I use multiple of each for each issue.

You have not refuted any of them yet with citation.

Now you are moving the goal post, The polls are done by empirical methods, but the data it collects are opinions so the end result will be an opinion,

Those 2 posts came with answering your question, I didn't edit it in. You got caught.

So liar or stupid? Which was it?

Now prove that is due to those specific issues. You are offering zero data to suggest your theory is correct.

Remember not everyone is a single issue voter, I never said all issues are left leaning, D has less turn out, and that D actually won the most national votes.

Lower (D) turnout doesn't change the national opinion on a specific subject. Their opinion being moot is your opinion.

Do you have a study that shows no one cares about the issues for Presidential Election? You seem to be riffing again.

But your drawing an unconfirmed theory based off of those facts. You can't say a poll showing most Americans support Dreamers is wrong because (R) had more votes for Senators. You would need to PROVE THIS. You need to show me a peer reviewed study states for a fact that there are more Republican seats due to those issues I linked polls to. You can't just look at how many seats (R) hold and then say issue X/Y/Z has a left or right tilt for the USA. It needs to be more specific than that (like you know, a nations poll specifically asking that 1 question on the issue).

For example, most Republicans agree Roe vs Wade should stay. Yet they will still vote Republican. Your theory is flawed, and this is the reason you can't actually source or cite a study confirming it. Because it's fake. That is why you are offering no links directly showing it. You made it up.

No shit. They are national opinion polls. I didn't move any goal post, I was stating the obvious. The national opinion on those issues is leaning towards the left. It is a FACT that most Americans have a left leaning opinion on those specific topics.

I won this debate because you couldn't refute a single one of my polls with citation. You got fucking destroyed. Should I start linking more of them? I won't mind, because you can't refute them.

If you think you won this debate you are either willfully ignorant or simply just clever enough to see the truth.

You have refuted nothing, you come with opinion polls which is based on opinions that do not reflect in the government, you know the very thing that is supposed to carry out those "ideals"

You lost end of this debate.

I won this debate because you have yet to link a shred of counter citation. I linked massive data you gave a dodgy and perplexing theory with 0 studies to show it might be true.

I brought the goods, and you didn't. You lost badly.

I showed the fact that most Americans lean heavily on those major topics. You couldn't refute the polls with any valid citation, so I won. Instead you talked about how (R) being in control of more Senate seats means cannabis polls are all wrong and it actually doesn't have ~63% national support! Proof? Who needs that, I'll draw random inferences that make zero sense!

You are suggesting there is a massive conspiracy theory and these polls are all wrong. I need to see proof of this. Please offer links.

The polls I link have their sampling and methodology linked on all of those pages as well.

Feel free to prove they are all false.

Are you really saying you want me to link to well known established facts that the Republicans have control of most of the local state government in the country? Sorry, I have to ask are you even American? because unless you live under a rock, any American should be aware who is representing them at the state-government level.

Or is it more likely that you have figured out you lost and now are just trying to pull a rabbit out of your behind

Because clearly there is a massive dissonance among those polls and the government voters pick, which is not merely because Democrats are too lazy to vote. Also, I never speculated on the reason for the dissonance, I just pointed out that the facts do not back your insane claim up.

@zaryia: Did said polls ask the entire population? If not, you move to the realm of assuming, and we all know what that means. I thought polls said Hilary would win. Polls up here in Canada keep saying the conservatives have no shot at winning elections...yet, they keep winning now.

The fascist left is on it's way down.

NO. I'm asking you to link your not so well known theory that national opinion polls on a singular subjects (such as legalizing cannabis) are invalid due to (R) or (D) having more control of local state governments. This is a theory until data is shown directly linking these things and taking out lower D turn out, single issue voters, and exact voter count for each nationally.

You haven't given a shred of evidence for that.

IE: Prove that the polls are wrong and 63% of Americans do not support legalizing marijuana using your theory. Give me the data, how wrong was this number based off of (R) seats gained due to this specific Issue. Apply your THEORY (which conveniently has 0 citation/studies).

I lost? I gave dozens of links of data and then you came up with some wild theory and gave 0 studies showing it is real....

Is this reality right now? You appear to have issues in almost every single poll thread here.

There is a dissonance because (D) has less votes, not everyone is a single issue voter, and I didn't say EVERY issue was left leaning. Also the fact that the last time we had a pure national vote, (D) actually won with more votes.

You didn't speculate reasons for the dissonance because your theory didn't hold any water. You couldn't find any studies on it. You lost.

The facts do back up my "insane claims", I linked dozens of accurate pollsters.

This isn't how polling works...don't be like Jacanuk.

On average, the national polls were correct and very accurate on their measure of Hillary vs Trump. This isn't disputable.

No, what you are asking is to be spoon fed opinions, Which makes it pointless to debate anything with you, since you lack the key element of intelligence in any debate. You make a claim and then when proven wrong, you move the goal post or you simply just keep repeating the same links over and over again.

And the nonsense that Republicans control a majority of state governments is merely because Democrats do not vote, is just so stupid that it´s like asking a 4-year-old to explain gravity.

But let´s hold here, you are clearly not even close to being able to form an independent thought, I do not intend to waste time posting links that is common knowledge to anyone.

I'm asking for a scientific peer reviewed study, because what you are describing is a pure theory and in no way actually counters the clear and direct data I linked showing most Americans are left leaning on those specific topics. Not "spoon fed opinions".

I did debate with you. I showed why your uncorroborated theory was false and that you couldn't even offer any data directly proving it or any data directly disproving my polls. I asked you to apply your theory via numbers, you couldn't even do this. How much are those polls wrong by? Which votes were changed due to those specific issues?

I wasn't proven wrong. Currently all of my links are sound.

You would have to prove those links are giving false numbers. We're still stuck at step 1.

I never said that is why (R) control a majority of state government. I said that is one of the reasons as to why your uncorroborated theory holds no water.

IE: Prove that the polls are wrong and 63% of Americans do not support legalizing marijuana using your theory. Give me the data, how wrong was this number based off of (R) positions gained due to this specific Issue and votes changed. Apply your theory. Be specific, cite numbers.

(Spoilers: He won't be able to do any of the above. Because he's just riffing. Accurate pollsters make him mad and he can't refute them.)

I made a factual claim.

I backed up my factual claim with direct numerical data showing most Americans lean left on those specific issues I mentioned.

The polls caught you off-guard, and then you made up a theory. Then you tried to google studies supporting your theory, and fell short. And that puts us here, with you losing.

You have never made a factual claim, you link to polls that are based on opinions gathered by a questionable method. So link to a credible scientific source that backs up your claim and not an article from the hill or a poll from Gallup.

And also start refuting the ESTABLISHED Facts that Republicans have most of the state government control, start with linking to sources that can prove without a shadow of doubt that there are 51 Republican senators, 238 Republicans in the Congress and then you can go on to the only 6 states which have a 3 level democratic controlled government and prove that there are a lot more.

I am waiting. If you cannot link to anything else than the same polls you have done 10000000 times, then this debate is over and you lost so live with it.

I made a factual claim. I said Americans opinions are left leaning on those issues. Multiple reliable polls show this is true for those issues. There is not a shred of data showing otherwise (which is why you're not citing anything, and getting mad at the fact I did cite stuff.)

The facts on my claims are numerous, reliable, and accurate.

You lost this one man. You lose every poll thread. You go nuts in each and every one of them.

[Citation Needed]

WHAT? Gallup is a credible scientific source.

https://www.gallup.com/178685/methodology-center.aspx

https://www.gallup.com/seniorscientists/171815/senior-scientists.aspx

https://www.gallup.com/178667/gallup-world-poll-work.aspx

As are many of the pollsters I used. Extremely high accuracy ratings, and coveted. Your opinion on them is not a valid one. I can't believe this. Dude you're not looking so good right now for this "debate".

I made a factual claim. I said Americans opinions are left leaning on those issues. Multiple reliable polls show this is true for those issues.

I don't refute those facts. I never did. They just don't counter my polls. What you just wrote doesn't even mention national opinion on specific topics.

Prove that (R) controlling more means that those specific issues I linked are actually conservative leaning for national opinion, and that the polls are wrong. You're not giving any data or proof of this correlation that you and you alone are making. Hell, the data itself you just cited makes no mention of national opinion. It just says (R) have more power. It makes zero mention of national opinion on those specific topics I linked polls for. Your theory doesn't check out, there is no data supporting it,

IE: Prove that the polls are wrong and 63% of Americans do not support legalizing marijuana using your theory. Give me the data, how wrong was this number based off of (R) positions gained due to this specific Issue and votes changed. Apply your theory. Be specific, cite numbers.

Again come up with a scientific peer-reviewed source that disputes the fact that Republicans hold control in the top 3 chambers of the federal government, hold a majority of state governments and governorships. Otherwise, I am just going to ignore your BS.

And it´s funny you mention Marijuana because that disproves your point and proves my point, people in states where it is now legal voted for that, they voted for that in record numbers, so clearly that is an issue that heats up the voters. So considering that, Explain why the same engagement is not present in any of the other issues? Why do people say one thing in the polls you cite as a credible source, and another when they vote....