Will God Let Good People Into Heaven? (Poll)

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]You are not responding to the point...

Lansdowne5

The point that user made was quite valid and unless it is answered with something a tad more objective that Bible verses, then it remains unanswered and a gap in your evangelic campaign.

A serial murderer/rapist turned born again Christian is better in Gods eyes than than a famously good person who chose the "wrong" religion.

If you are a Christian you believe all none believers will roast in hell, being ripped apart by demons over and over again regardless of their moral character if they don't accept Christ.

AnnoyedDragon

Though the wording might justify what you said, still the same philosophy has been displayed by the Evangelists and thus it is a valid point to make.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Nice copy/paste but that speaks to the FAITHFUL. It does NOT address those who have not the gift of faith. Glad to clear that up for you.:)

Lansdowne5

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

[QUOTE="Mind_Mover"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]That's the theory. The exception is those who turn others away from God.

LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

A serial murderer/rapist turned born again Christian is better in Gods eyes than than a famously good person who chose the "wrong" religion.

If you are a Christian you believe all none believers will roast in hell, being ripped apart by demons over and over again regardless of their moral character if they don't accept Christ.

Teenaged

Though the wording might justify what you said, still the same philosophy has been displayed by the Evangelists and thus it is a valid point to make.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"] Wait.....what? The entire New Testament pretty much yells, "SALVATION IS NOT BY WORKS!" Do you believe people can be saved another way, other than by salvation through Christ?Lansdowne5

Edit: Man is till judged on his actions.

John 3:16 --"God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."

Acts 10:43 -- "To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins."

Romans 5:2 -- "Through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God."

Ephesians 2:8 -- "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God."

Romans 3:22 -- "Even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference."

Acts 16:31 -- "They said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved"

John 3:36 -- "He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

Galatians 2:16 -- "Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified."

It's perfectly clear from these verses alone that those who reject Jesus will not get to Heaven. They will be judged, and they will be judged guilty.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Nice copy/paste but that speaks to the FAITHFUL. It does NOT address those who have not the gift of faith. Glad to clear that up for you.:)

Lansdowne5

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

[QUOTE="Mind_Mover"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Then they are not held responsible for not knowing about Him...

LJS9502_basic

God's Word says this.

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Bring me these hypothetical righteous persons, without sin.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Mind_Mover"]@Landsdowne, do you share the same belief as LJ?

Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Nice copy/paste but that speaks to the FAITHFUL. It does NOT address those who have not the gift of faith. Glad to clear that up for you.:)

LJS9502_basic

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

A serial murderer/rapist turned born again Christian is better in Gods eyes than than a famously good person who chose the "wrong" religion.

If you are a Christian you believe all none believers will roast in hell, being ripped apart by demons over and over again regardless of their moral character if they don't accept Christ.

LJS9502_basic

Though the wording might justify what you said, still the same philosophy has been displayed by the Evangelists and thus it is a valid point to make.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Nice copy/paste but that speaks to the FAITHFUL. It does NOT address those who have not the gift of faith. Glad to clear that up for you.:)

Lansdowne5

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Nice copy/paste but that speaks to the FAITHFUL. It does NOT address those who have not the gift of faith. Glad to clear that up for you.:)

warbmxjohn

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

God's Word tells us.

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

If someone seeks God, He be faithful in revealing Himself and His plan of salvation to them.

I fail to see why an all powerful being would want to create this maze of dogma and ludicrous ways of getting into "heaven". Why would he care about us believing in him? Why would he crave all this attention? It's so obviously a human construct. I'm certainly not rejecting the idea of a God, but this humanization of him is completely ridiculous, in my opinion. Salvation through Jesus? Come on guys...jointed

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Nice copy/paste but that speaks to the FAITHFUL. It does NOT address those who have not the gift of faith. Glad to clear that up for you.:)

Lansdowne5

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

that would be gods fault.

Yes I know. I know that you must object the idea that God is truly what Lans is aying, but the case here is that this user is trying to show the errors in the evangelic view, not that God indeed shares those views.

Teenaged

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

God's Word says this.

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: And? People are not perfect. They make mistakes but if you take that literally then why would He bother to send His son....after all no one is righteous.
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. Out of context. Don't know what point you think you are making.
Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Same as above.

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Bring me these hypothetical righteous persons, without sin.

LJS9502_basic

No! Look what you've done! You've mingled your words with his post! Now you'll never get a response!

Everyone who rejects maybe, but some do not ever hear the word of the gospel, or ever hear about salvation through Christ. That is what is being discussed, how can a person who never heard of the Christian God be condemned? That is not justice.warbmxjohn

Justice is punishment to suit the crime, what about hell is equivalent on any level? It's infinite punishment for finite crimes, it is not even a punishment when you think about it; as punishments are designed to be learned from. There is no learning from hell, no coming back from it and learning not to do it again, just unending suffering.

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Let's use a contemporary comparison. With great power comes great responsibility. Now with faith that means that MORE is expected of those with faith than those without. I have seen you state in this forums that faith is a gift. Which it is. That means that without that gift you find it perfectly acceptable to condemn good people. Sorry but I don't believe God thinks as that. You know he is merciful and just...right?

LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="warbmxjohn"][QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

blackregiment

God's Word tells us.

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

If someone seeks God, He be faithful in revealing Himself and His plan of salvation to them.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]

What, you expect me to type those out myself? :?

It is directed at everyone. And even if it wasn't, it talks of everyone. So....have you ever read this book called Revelation......? It makes pretty clear that everyone who rejects God will be thrown into the lake of burning sulfer along with the False Prophet, the Beast and the Devil.

Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="jointed"]I fail to see why an all powerful being would want to create this maze of dogma and ludicrous ways of getting into "heaven". Why would he care about us believing in him? Why would he crave all this attention? It's so obviously a human construct. I'm certainly not rejecting the idea of a God, but this humanization of him is completely ridiculous, in my opinion. Salvation through Jesus? Come on guys...tktomo01

I am not talking about rejection, if a person has no knowledge of christ then why should that be his fault? shouldn't it be gods duty to pre program the human mind with christ as being the saviour, then each one can choose to reject him or not? really, a person who has no knowledge of christ doesn't even have the chance to accept or deny him :?

that would be gods fault.

Mind_Mover

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

God's Word says this.

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: And? People are not perfect. They make mistakes but if you take that literally then why would He bother to send His son....after all no one is righteous.
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. Out of context. Don't know what point you think you are making.
Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Same as above.

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Bring me these hypothetical righteous persons, without sin.

RadBooley

No! Look what you've done! You've mingled your words with his post! Now you'll never get a response!

The thief on the cross confessed his sins.....which is why Jesus forgave him and he was saved. Again....have you read this book called Revelation.....?Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Let's use a contemporary comparison. With great power comes great responsibility. Now with faith that means that MORE is expected of those with faith than those without. I have seen you state in this forums that faith is a gift. Which it is. That means that without that gift you find it perfectly acceptable to condemn good people. Sorry but I don't believe God thinks as that. You know he is merciful and just...right?

LJS9502_basic

...and why was one their saved and the other one not? Because on rejected Christ and the other came to faith.

Luk 23:39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
Luk 23:40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
Luk 23:41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
Luk 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.

No offense, but your post seems to contain an awful lot of fear, both imparted and expressed. The Bible makes it very clear that fear and love are incompatible (1 John 4:18 ) and, since God loves the world (John 3:16) and wants us to love both him and each other (1 John 4:7-12, Matthew 7:12), it necessarily follows that we are not to be afraid - something even explicitly stated in Psalm 23:4.

I think too many people pay too much attention to the whole issue of one's eternal destiny and not nearly enough attention to the ultimate reason for why Jesus instructed us to do what he did. God doesn't need anything more; thus, it makes sense that it's ultimately for us. One ought not to follow Jesus' words out of fear of hell or simply because God said so, but rather because they recognize the immense value and benefit in doing so both to oneself and to everyone with whom one comes into contact. I think there is a reason why the people who find themselves in Jesus' favor in Matthew 25:31-46 are surprised at this fact: they lived a life not out of concern for their own eternal destinies, but out of love and compassion for everyone on Earth.

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]No he does not....

LJS9502_basic

[Or even worse... he'll get reported for it! :o

Teenaged

[QUOTE="warbmxjohn"]Everyone who rejects maybe, but some do not ever hear the word of the gospel, or ever hear about salvation through Christ. That is what is being discussed, how can a person who never heard of the Christian God be condemned? That is not justice.AnnoyedDragon

Justice is punishment to suit the crime, what about hell is equivalent on any level? It's infinite punishment for finite crimes, it is not even a punishment when you think about it; as punishments are designed to be learned from. There is no learning from hell, no coming back from it and learning not to do it again, just unending suffering.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"] Indeed. I try my best to be non-conformed to the world.Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"][QUOTE="Lansdowne5"] He would be unjust to allow those into Heaven who had not been washed clean in the blood of Jesus, just as a judge would be unjust to allow someone who had clearly broken the law to go free without punishment.Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="Mind_Mover"]

I am not talking about rejection, if a person has no knowledge of christ then why should that be his fault? shouldn't it be gods duty to pre program the human mind with christ as being the saviour, then each one can choose to reject him or not? really, a person who has no knowledge of christ doesn't even have the chance to accept or deny him :?

that would be gods fault.

LJS9502_basic

blackregiment

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

[QUOTE="warbmxjohn"]Everyone who rejects maybe, but some do not ever hear the word of the gospel, or ever hear about salvation through Christ. That is what is being discussed, how can a person who never heard of the Christian God be condemned? That is not justice.warbmxjohn

God's Word tells us.

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

If someone seeks God, He be faithful in revealing Himself and His plan of salvation to them.

God answered that...

Rom 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath showed it unto them.
Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"] Indeed. I try my best to be non-conformed to the world.Lansdowne5

I am not taking his words as fact or anything, rather, i find it sad that that this person is preaching this kind of nonsense in the first place.

Mind_Mover

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"] Indeed. I try my best to be non-conformed to the world.Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"][QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"] I don't see how an eternal punishment for finite crimes is just. Funky_Llama

He must be a hit at parties.

Why hasn't this thread been locked, anyway? I don't see how it's any better than the last one, which was locked.Funky_Llama

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"][QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"] I don't see how an eternal punishment for finite crimes is just. Funky_Llama

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]I'm not conformed to the world. But I don't use the Bible to say I'm superior either.;)

DrSponge

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

LJS9502_basic

Do you believe that all of Scripure is God's breathed and is the Word of God? Do you conider the Words of Luke uninspired and therfore of less importance?

2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: