Well, all I've got is that I live in the south and no one seems paranoid at all. Seems equally valid.jim_shortsFlip a coin then? I'll let you flip. I call heads.
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Well, all I've got is that I live in the south and no one seems paranoid at all. Seems equally valid.jim_shortsFlip a coin then? I'll let you flip. I call heads.
Maybe some pride? It's certainly irrational either way.Since I don't want to make a new thread for this question but why do gun owners defend their property if it actually was a home invasion? By property I mean stuff like TV, video game systems, jewelery, etc. Stuff that you (should) have insurance on and are easily replaced. Is it worth risking you and your loved one's lives in danger?
Aljosa23
Why does this always happen with old people in the south? Are they that parinoid?
Wasdie
I blame the media.. We have these ignorant people watching all these terrible stories, because violence sells, making them believe that this sh!t happens every where constantly..
Maybe he didn't notice the guy was leaving, or maybe his finger slipped and he fired by accident?[QUOTE="Moriarity_"]I can understand the warning shot but if the guy was backing out of the driveway why shoot again?whipassmt
... You can't even justify a warning shot, how the fvck are we suppose to trust this guy with some one knocking on his door? Or a few people selling a product or other such thing?.. You can't.. This guy should never have had a weapon to begin with if this is his very FIRST response with a car pulling into the drive way.
Maybe he didn't notice the guy was leaving, or maybe his finger slipped and he fired by accident?[QUOTE="whipassmt"]
[QUOTE="Moriarity_"]I can understand the warning shot but if the guy was backing out of the driveway why shoot again?sSubZerOo
... You can't even justify a warning shot, how the fvck are we suppose to trust this guy with some one knocking on his door? Or a few people selling a product or other such thing?.. You can't.. This guy should never have had a weapon to begin with if this is his very FIRST response with a car pulling into the drive way.
First response of people leaving his drive way according to the story. Also he claims that they tried to run him down which is why he shot. The police say the scene does not point to that being possible.[QUOTE="rastotm"]Implying emotions always lead people to rational actions. He claimed to feel fear because he assumed a conflict. The normal response to fear tends to be flee whenever it's possible, if not then fight. In the discussed situation, the man went back to his home, by which he avoided the conflict. After which he picked his gun and engaged the people in the car. This re-engaging is not a rational response to fear, it is a act of aggression in order to protect his valueables.Going back to get a gun in order to kill the people on your property seems a odd response to fear.
Ace6301
"the 69-year-old Vietnam vet"
this doesn't surprise me at all.
"the police report indicates that the vehicle was leaving Sailors property when Diaz was shot. Lilburn police said they found his red Mitsubishi at the end of the driveway."
A warning shot should of been enough, why did he keep shooting after the car was leaving?
Implying emotions always lead people to rational actions. He claimed to feel fear because he assumed a conflict. The normal response to fear tends to be flee whenever it's possible, if not then fight. In the discussed situation, the man went back to his home, by which he avoided the conflict. After which he picked his gun and engaged the people in the car. This re-engaging is not a rational response to fear, it is a act of aggression in order to protect his valueables. If he assumed a conflict was imminent then arming himself would be rational. You have a greater chance with a weapon than without one obviously. However his motive for shooting them as they were leaving is suspect. It could have been he really did (incorrectly) feel his life was in danger. He could be senile. He could be an extreme racist and saw the color of the persons skin. We don't know. Shooting someone while they attempt to leave you alone is irrational though (unless you can be sure they're going to be back to try and harm you), regardless of motive[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="rastotm"]
Going back to get a gun in order to kill the people on your property seems a odd response to fear.
rastotm
A warning shot is way too much not "enough" when you shoot into the air the bullet does not just disappear. Thinking that shooting wildly into the air because there is a car stopped in your driveway is insane."the 69-year-old Vietnam vet"
this doesn't surprise me at all.
"the police report indicates that the vehicle was leaving Sailors property when Diaz was shot. Lilburn police said they found his red Mitsubishi at the end of the driveway."
A warning shot should of been enough, why did he keep shooting after the car was leaving?
SirWander
A warning shot is way too much not "enough" when you shoot into the air the bullet does not just disappear. Thinking that shooting wildly into the air because there is a car stopped in your driveway is insane. Killing a 22 year old as he tries to leave after you've fired a warning shot is also insane. He's consistent at least.[QUOTE="SirWander"]
"the 69-year-old Vietnam vet"
this doesn't surprise me at all.
"the police report indicates that the vehicle was leaving Sailors property when Diaz was shot. Lilburn police said they found his red Mitsubishi at the end of the driveway."
A warning shot should of been enough, why did he keep shooting after the car was leaving?
Person0
A warning shot is way too much not "enough" when you shoot into the air the bullet does not just disappear. Thinking that shooting wildly into the air because there is a car stopped in your driveway is insane.Person0
Yeah, no sh!t Sherlock; but why does that make him (Sailors) think that seeing a car parked in his driveway was cause enough for him to shoot in the air? But it's relative, he could have not shot the driver, and shooting in the air could still be construed as a ludicrous act. But shooting directly at a car that is leaving when a warning shot should of sufficed, I don't understand how he thought that was a good idea (IE stand up as a justifiable excuse in the court of law).
[QUOTE="rastotm"]He claimed to feel fear because he assumed a conflict. The normal response to fear tends to be flee whenever it's possible, if not then fight. In the discussed situation, the man went back to his home, by which he avoided the conflict. After which he picked his gun and engaged the people in the car. This re-engaging is not a rational response to fear, it is a act of aggression in order to protect his valueables. If he assumed a conflict was imminent then arming himself would be rational. You have a greater chance with a weapon than without one obviously. However his motive for shooting them as they were leaving is suspect. It could have been he really did (incorrectly) feel his life was in danger. He could be senile. He could be an extreme racist and saw the color of the persons skin. We don't know. Shooting someone while they attempt to leave you alone is irrational though (unless you can be sure they're going to be back to try and harm you), regardless of motive He had a far greater chance by fleeing or locking himself up in the house. The fact of the matter remains that he disengaged and engaged again. This is a unlikely response to fear. It is however possible that he went back with the, reasonably acceptable, intent to scare the people away from his property. This escalated in a situation where he felt the need to shoot in order to protect his life. Which leads my to my main point, this isn't a simple case of self defense because he returned in order chase the people away which can be deemed as a irresponsible act. That being said, it seems we largely agree. I simply replied because emotions and related behaviour are interesting subjects.[QUOTE="Ace6301"] Implying emotions always lead people to rational actions.Ace6301
If he assumed a conflict was imminent then arming himself would be rational. You have a greater chance with a weapon than without one obviously. However his motive for shooting them as they were leaving is suspect. It could have been he really did (incorrectly) feel his life was in danger. He could be senile. He could be an extreme racist and saw the color of the persons skin. We don't know. Shooting someone while they attempt to leave you alone is irrational though (unless you can be sure they're going to be back to try and harm you), regardless of motive He had a far greater chance by fleeing or locking himself up in the house. The fact of the matter remains that he disengaged and engaged again. This is a unlikely response to fear. It is however possible that he went back with the, reasonably acceptable, intent to scare the people away from his property. This escalated in a situation where he felt the need to shoot in order to protect his life. Which leads my to my main point, this isn't a simple case of self defense because he returned in order chase the people away which can be deemed as a irresponsible act. That being said, it seems we largely agree. I simply replied because emotions and related behaviour are interesting subjects. He probably would have. Not everyone reacts the same to emotions though. Some people are afraid of buildings they believe are haunted and make a sport out of spending a night there because fear can be exciting. Some people will initially run away and then change their mind and come back and try to kill someone. What starts as one emotion may lead to another as one gains the upperhand. Excitement over fear and anger over fear respectively. Just because it's not the driving emotion at the time per se doesn't mean that it wasn't there to set off the chain of events. I somewhat doubt in this situation that he did the shooting out of fear for his life seeing as how it appears he's lying about the events now. Assuming they were indeed fleeing it's extremely clear cut murder.[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="rastotm"] He claimed to feel fear because he assumed a conflict. The normal response to fear tends to be flee whenever it's possible, if not then fight. In the discussed situation, the man went back to his home, by which he avoided the conflict. After which he picked his gun and engaged the people in the car. This re-engaging is not a rational response to fear, it is a act of aggression in order to protect his valueables.
rastotm
[QUOTE="Nayef_shroof"]You don't need a gun license to own a gun. To own one legally I mean.Well, if people in the states are that ardent about keeping their guns, I would suggest that politicians enforce policies that would make it much more difficult to obtain a gun license. It's just ludicrous how many incidents like this occur.
Person0
I can understand the warning shot but if the guy was backing out of the driveway why shoot again?Moriarity_
That warning shot was incredibly reckless as well. Shots fired into the air come back down and they can hit innocent people. The man really had no business owning a gun.
[QUOTE="thegerg"][QUOTE="Nayef_shroof"] ? How does it work in the United States then?Nayef_shroofIt varies by state. But generally you need a gun license to own a gun, right? In many states its go to store, pass instant background check and walk out with gun or wait like a week or 2 and go back for gun. At guns shows it pass background check, walk out with gun.
Because if not they'd just find other ways to kill, people have been doing that since the beginning of time.[QUOTE="double_decker"][QUOTE="Crazyguy105"]
Another life needlessly lost.
Why are trigger happy people allowed to use weapons again?
wis3boi
I highly doubt a man pulling into the wrong driveway would have died if this idiot didnt have a gun on him. What would he do, throw a knife through the windshield?
this.The argument against guns is getting stronger and stronger...
Well the one form you have to fill out the answer is no for every question so probably. The background check just checks for convictions afaikIs the background check easier to pass than a grade 1 math quiz?
one_plum
[QUOTE="Moriarity_"]I can understand the warning shot but if the guy was backing out of the driveway why shoot again?worlock77
That warning shot was incredibly reckless as well. Shots fired into the air come back down and they can hit innocent people. The man really had no business owning a gun.
Pretty much. He should go to jail for manslaughter at least. He had no reason to shoot that person. It was not - in the least bit - self defense.Really don't understand why he shot this guy. If events were as reported here, he should be charged with murder. You have to at least wait until someone stops, gets out of their car, and in some way threatens you with a weapon or tries to break in. Shooting the guy as he drove away? Boy.. he really showed him.
Good on the police. Castle law shouldn't be abused and they did right, so it seems, by charging this man.
Damn, itchy triger finger much. People really should be trained how to use a gun before being allowed to purchase one
American gun culture is messed up. It gives stupid people the idea that you need guns to defend yourself, which in turn creates the idea that you're constantly in danger and the only way to fight that danger is with a gun.
he was ex-military, so I don't imagine that was the issueDamn, itchy triger finger much. People really should be trained how to use a gun before being allowed to purchase one
The_Gaming_Baby
The most striking thing from this piece is that of the initial reaction. Unless you are in an incredibly rough and dangerous area, there would be no though of "quick I need to get a weapon and threaten the people outside". Madness, and again, another life lost by the use of a weapon that is meant to be used as "protection".
God bless the United States and all those clever people in it.
[QUOTE="The_Gaming_Baby"]he was ex-military, so I don't imagine that was the issueDamn, itchy triger finger much. People really should be trained how to use a gun before being allowed to purchase one
lamprey263
the military teach people how to kill, it could have assisted.
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