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Johnny-n-Roger

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#1  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts

@tryit said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:
@tryit said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:

I never said I had a problem with the movie for being black nationalist wish fulfillment. I'm pointing to the fact that one can't be of sound reasoning to hold progressive views and view The Black Panther's wish fulfillment as anything but problematic and maintain that you're opposed to ethno-nationalism.

If it's not a progressive value to oppose ethno-nationalism as a concept then all the the rhetoric and gas lighting when calling someone or their views "white nationalist" might as well go right out the window.

two questions

1. why not? why cant they do that?

2. is the moral agenda of a movie and not allowing black people to sit at the front of the bus really the moral equivalent?

1. Why can't who do what?

2. Irrelevant deflection. Try again.

1. why cant they work on one agenda while being hypocritical about it?

2. no its actually the core. if your plan is to show how white culture is under attack becasue of all the attention paid to black 'rights' one ABSOLUTELY has to ask if forcing blacks to use a separate bathroom is the same moral equivalent as being hypocritical about the moral agenda of a movie. you will never in a million years EVER move the left an inch without address it. so thus this entire conversation is a waste of your time without addressing it

1. You can, but not with any credibility to a reasonable individual.

2. This is like if were were discussing the morality of a "social democracy" and I used Joseph Stalin to make a retarded point. The first tell that you're going to start introducing pseudo logic like false equivalencies and continuum fallacies is that you start dividing my position into numbered "points". It's laughably cartoonish.

Edit: So you edited your point to at least try to provide an honest argument. The argument is not in regards to the morality of "ethno-nationalism", it's whether or not white people and black people should be held to the same moral standard in this regard because of historical context.

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#2  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts

@tryit said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:
@tryit said:

so why are we even having this conversation?

if that is what Black Panther is claiming to do then why do you have a problem with it?

I never said I had a problem with the movie for being black nationalist wish fulfillment. I'm pointing to the fact that one can't be of sound reasoning to hold progressive views and view The Black Panther's wish fulfillment as anything but problematic and maintain that you're opposed to ethno-nationalism.

If it's not a progressive value to oppose ethno-nationalism as a concept then all the the rhetoric and gas lighting when calling someone or their views "white nationalist" might as well go right out the window.

two questions

1. why not? why cant they do that?

2. is the moral agenda of a movie and not allowing black people to sit at the front of the bus really the moral equivalent?

1. Why can't who do what?

2. Irrelevant deflection. Try again.

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#3 Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts

@tryit said:

so why are we even having this conversation?

if that is what Black Panther is claiming to do then why do you have a problem with it?

I never said I had a problem with the movie for being black nationalist wish fulfillment. I'm pointing to the fact that one can't be of sound reasoning to hold progressive views and view The Black Panther's wish fulfillment as anything but problematic and maintain that you're opposed to ethno-nationalism.

If it's not a progressive value to oppose ethno-nationalism as a concept then all the the rhetoric and gas lighting when calling someone or their views "white nationalist" might as well go right out the window.

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#4  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts

@tryit said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:
@tryit said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:

No he's just being a typical pretzel-brained liberal trying to conflate a subjective view of culture with a welfare statistic that isn't in his favor.

again..

people dont consider Led Zepplin to be black culture because their music is inspired by black music and people dont consider Welfare to be a black cluture because they know the details of the numbers. in fact the vast majority of them have zero idea, not even a top level knowedge.

that all said, what is wrong with wanting to preserve racial culture if one wants to? even though its a huge struggle to define

Sorry dude, gibberish again. The point you're trying to make is in left field and not relevant at all.

ok then moving on...

that all said, what is wrong with wanting to preserve racial culture if one wants to? even though its a huge struggle to define

What is wrong with wanting to preserve your racial and cultural identity? Nothing, inherently.

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#5  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts

@tryit said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:
@n64dd said:
@tryit said:

no actually reasonably minded people would NOT say 'well Led Zepplin is black culture because most of their inspiration comes from black music'

so no, people would not drill down to advanced math they would just say welfare is a black thing without even knowing (until I tell them) that the majority of welfare is actually white.

that is how reality works.

Is it just the total amount of people on welfare are higher being white, or is ratio wise?

No he's just being a typical pretzel-brained liberal trying to conflate a subjective view of culture with a welfare statistic that isn't in his favor.

again..

people dont consider Led Zepplin to be black culture because their music is inspired by black music and people dont consider Welfare to be a black cluture because they know the details of the numbers. in fact the vast majority of them have zero idea, not even a top level knowedge.

that all said, what is wrong with wanting to preserve racial culture if one wants to? even though its a huge struggle to define

Sorry dude, gibberish again. The point you're trying to make is in left field and not relevant at all.

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#6  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts
@n64dd said:
@tryit said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:
@tryit said:

@Johnny-n-Roger

Last post of the day.

If you parse culture by race then The Welfare program is a white thing and rock and roll is a black thing.

so it doesnt work very well

Except any reasonable person would only consider welfare per capita because you don't compare statistics regarding total populations when one population is 5 times as large as the other. Once you do that you see that whites are not even close to other races by a long shot. Factor in taxes paid per capita by race and it's a complete disaster for you. Have a nice day.

no actually reasonably minded people would NOT say 'well Led Zepplin is black culture because most of their inspiration comes from black music'

so no, people would not drill down to advanced math they would just say welfare is a black thing without even knowing (until I tell them) that the majority of welfare is actually white.

that is how reality works.

Is it just the total amount of people on welfare are higher being white, or is ratio wise?

No he's just being a typical pretzel-brained liberal trying to conflate a subjective view of culture with an objective welfare statistic that isn't in his favor. His arguments are always incredibly petty and are typically continuum fallacies revolving around semantics rather than substance.

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#7  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts

@joebones5000 said:

@Johnny-n-Roger: Chicago or detroit. Why, those two aren't even in the top. ten most gun violent cities? Deep red sates like Mississippi and Kentucky have cities with those honors.

that takes 5 seconds to debunk

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/02/19/homicides-toll-big-u-s-cities-2017/302763002/

https://www.thetrace.org/2017/07/gun-homicide-rates-baltimore-st-lous-detroit/

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#8  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts
@joebones5000 said:

Lol. Leave it to some idiot conservative to deflect from the real problem - guns, by attempting to make it a racial issue. GTFO with that nonsense.

I thought your head was going to explode earlier because you couldn't respond to my question. I'm glad you recovered. When someone insists on this shitty meme where working class are the problem with guns then I respond with a shitty meme of my own.

If you think working class Americans are the "gun culture" problem, then move to Chicago or Detroit.

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#9  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
Member since 2003 • 15151 Posts

@zaryia said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:They don't take a step back and look at actual murder statistics, where these murders are occurring, what weapons are being used, and what the gun laws are in the areas that these crimes are taking place.

Review of More Than 130 Studies Provides Powerful Evidence That Gun Control Saves Lives

https://www.sciencealert.com/scientific-evidence-that-stricter-gun-control-works-saves-lives

And stop saying the left, It's most Americans.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/02/25/poll-americans-support-tougher-gun-laws-dont-expect-congress-act/371104002/

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/02/two-new-polls-show-widespread-support-stricter-gun-laws.html

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/poll-support-gun-control-hits-record-high-n849686

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/new-poll-suggests-the-nra-is-losing-support_us_5a957b9ee4b03a8f3a22e85e

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/04/25/poll-gun-owners-nra-237564

I reverted my post back to the form that you originally quoted, not because I don't stand by my previous assertion. It's not that I don't think gun laws aren't effective, I just think that folks are proposing legislative measures on the pretense that the "mass shooter" is the primary issue with guns. That's only a secondary issue. If they're proposing that background checks and an assault weapon ban is going to be an effective measure in reducing the instance of homicide in Chicago then I think they're wrong.

It's also this insistence that "gun culture" and the 2nd ammendment supporting working-class are the problem with violent crime in the US that I find particularly absurd. If that's someone's meme-worthy approach to legislate then they're obviously fundamentally retarded. Unfortunately that's what politicians are.

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#10  Edited By Johnny-n-Roger
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@zaryia said:
@Johnny-n-Roger said:
@n64dd said:
@zaryia said:

This is pure off-topic deflection.

It's not a link to some article that thinks for you so you don't know how to handle it.

It's kind of cute.

Leftists are completely ignorant to the implicit, and at times, blatant bias of the media towards the corporate progressive narrative. They just assume that the oppression narrative is true and that the biggest problem with violent behavior in America is white guys with guns. Talking points for low-IQ individuals.

I never said any of that, and I'm not a liberal. People on all political extremes do what you just said.

I was merely pointing out the fact that your reply was a purely off-topic deflection, because it objectively was.

There is nothing wrong with preferring citation over memes. N64DD is trolling me.

Yeah I figured. And yes, Islamic terrorism is the low-IQ talking point of the right used to justify legislation. It's not a tactic specific to one side. The notion that the 2nd Amendment supporting American working class redneck is ruining modern western society? Good luck providing for that. Obviously they didn't engage.