This war is over

What about both quality and quantity?

Shit, didn't get the Memo,lol

there was never a war only a massacre. I've been telling you guys this since 2013 almost in a daily basis.

245 games and only 35 of them are 80+ on metacritic

When it comes to first party exclusives SONY is falling flat on it's face at the moment, not even you can deny that, the xbone isn't doing much better but neither console has Quantity AND quality at the moment unless you count multi platform games that are on both systems.

This gen has been shit all round for exclusives so far, i may even skip this gen as far as the PS4 and xbone are concerned, especially if it's only going to be five year cycle, i will just stick with the Wii-U and my 360 till the games dry out.

I don;t get SONY, they where doing Extremely well with First party exclusives now it's all falling apart

Saying that, i am enjoying Sackboy run on my tablet at the moment.

So this makes 4 gens in a row where the worst system with the worst games sells the most.

And now you're doing the exact same shit. Still funny or is it sad, yet?

Cows don't want PC included because it will just show how much PC Gaming is pillaging the market and annihilating consoles. So they keep mooing "THAT DOESN'T COUNT"

http://hexus.net/gaming/news/pc/81292-pc-games-software-market-exceed-35bn-2018-says-oga/

So they don't even have sales and all they have is their mediocre exclusives. And Sony is currently burning through money trying to stay alive. Not helped by that utter FLOP of a 720P VR Morpheus. Seriously. 720P

Sony took first place in the worlds tallest midget competition. And burned their entire company to the ground to do it

@gabensherald: is that you jankar?did you get a gaming PC yet?

How is it over? It's the start of the second year.

@scottpsfan14: Last time I played a PS4 game I had to wait through 30 minutes of installation (GTA 5). Before that was Assassin's Creed Black Flag. Even Killzone Shadow Fall had to be installed. On my Xbox One everything has to be installed. I took me roughly 6 hours to properly install Halo Master Chief Collection. It also doesn't help that both consoles only have a pathetic 500 gbs of space for their entire OS and all of their game storage.

The architecture of a game console is completely pointless in the debate, all that matters is how they operate, the types of features that they want to support, and its general usability. Those things have been moving more toward how a PC works now for years. Game console are no longer dedicated gaming machines and can't be thought of as such. What they have become are general home PCs with a focus on entertainment. Their functionality has been expanded greatly. Furthemore PCs are becoming more "console like" in terms of usability and form factor.

The biggest thing is their closed ecosystems. When you buy an Xbox One game you can only play it on the Xbox One. If you want to play online you need to pay extra. As alternatives start hitting the market that are far more flexible, things are going to change. The idea of incompatible generations is an outdated concept. The idea that all you can do on a console at a time is play a game is an outdated concept. Even the PS4 and Xbox One have multitasking to some degree and I expect that functionality to greatly expand. Your example that PS4 games run at a low level is just not accurate. They may have low level hardware access but they sit on top of an OS which runs in the background. On the Xbox One there is also support for running apps simultaneously.

Your answer to my question was looking at the wrong things. You looked at the guts of a device, I'm looking at the usability and seeing where general computing is going. Consoles are a dying breed. They make no sense given where devices and software consumption are heading. They are an unnecessary burden for your home tech ecosystem.

Yes that right, the Exact same shit i did last gen, check my fucking posting history, i have ALWAYS been a quality over quantity kind of bloke which is why last gen i was saying the SAME thing to the lems i just said to you.

Not my fault that last gen the 360 beat the Ps3 in both Quantity AND quality with the most high scoring games out of the two.

its a hell of a package. the most powerful console, with all the 3rd party support for the same price as the competition. its not lacking any key features or anything. sonys first party output has yet to impress but for a lot of people who only want the one console its the best choice. sony has absolutely nailed it this gen.

its certainly the console i would recommend to anyone just looking for a gaming console.

however i also have no interest in buying it myself. there are no exclusives for it that i am interested in. the multiplats i get for my PC.

Well said sir

@charizard1605: Sigh... read "The Art of War". It's still way to early.

@blackace: lol, you want to apply ancient Chinese military philosophy to arguments about video games?

I was never talking about 1st party. Since I own both machines I'm well aware of how lacklustre both machines are so far looking at only 1st party, with a slight edge to Xbone imo, but that's subjective. What I also know as an owner is how many games the Xbone simply isn't getting. I see it every week in when I shop the Xbox store on Xbone vs. the PS store on PS4. I can't run from it like users here with no machines can.

I quoted "Number of Games" and posted a link proving both quality and quantity. However, if you are looking at 80+ metacritic, PS4 wins over Xbone still.

Quality and Quantity.

As far as other arguments, like last gen being better...I agree. I've said it over and over in other threads. No reason to upgrade yet to new machines. The argument though was already isolated to current gen, so backpedaling about last gen or 1st parties is just derailing the convo and it's an entirely different point. I'm simply pointing out PS4 has more quality and quantity over the Xbone as that was the discussion, not that the PS4 or Xbone have more than the PS360.

There is a reason my last gen machines are still in my livingroom with my current gen machines.

Regarding Sony's 1st party. The answer is simple. Sony has done this every gen. They supported the older console longer than the competition with 1st party exclusives. The catch is that the next gen starts and they have less to bring to the table since they are still supporting the older machine. The Last of Us for PS3 released the same year as the PS4 release, a few months earlier in June. It's nuts to release a new IP like that for an older system when you look at how fast the 360 and Wii 1st party exclusives were dropped. Huge 1st party/2nd party studios like Sony Santa Monica, Media Molecule, Polyphony, Quantic Dream, Insomniac, and more have yet to release their PS4 titles because they were still supporting PS3 later. I remember it when the PS2 came out and Sony was rolling out 1st party PS1 games. The PS2 to PS3 (God of War 2 and Gran Turismo 4) transition. The PS3 to PS4 transition. It's a huge trend where Sony divides their resources between platforms. Sony supports their older consoles longer with 1st party exclusives, but that means their resources are divided. It takes on average 2 years to get a title out. Doing the math puts us here. Enough about 1st parties, I know this like the back of my hand. My post was never about 1st parties, it was simply about Number of Games as I underlined above.

I'd say this is more along the lines of "Remember the Alamo" than anything but we actually lost something of note when that happened.

You disappoint me delta I expected more of a convincing counter argument from you. Since when does stability and PSN go together? Lmao! Not to mention superior matchmaking and 300K servers which = less lag. How is the DS4 superior to the XBO controller when it only lasts 4 hours on a single charge, it's analogue sticks are known to wear and it doesn't even have impulse triggers? PS4 has more and better features than the XBO? OMG! WTF!?! So all of a sudden Shareplay and Remote Play >>>Snap, suspend/resume, Skype, DLNA and MP3 support???

Jeez, dude you have always made convincing counter arguments in the past but you dropped the ball here. I agree with the games argument but there was more wrong with his post than just that.

not at my best today mate, thanks for picking the ball up for me dude:)

DS4?

Anyway its only been like 1 year or a little over 1 year........

nothing was worth hyping up soo far. They all look like 5-8 range. Bloodbourne should be the first games cows should hype up as a AAA scoring game

No it hasn't Last gen the 360 controller was the standard. The Ds4 is garbage. The battery life sucks. The sticks are ass. Theres a light that never turns off. The thing sucks balls.

@inb4uall: can't even use it on a pc unless you jump through hoops. Idk how people like the ds4, it feels like a ds3 with actual triggers so it's a small step above dog shit.

Maybe you could try holding one so you see how much of an ass you look like right now.

Wait has it started yet? Then where are the games? I'd consider this the launch-phase of the generation.

I have. Multiple occasions.

Can't really fault your logic there. I also agree with the OP tbh.

I'm not a huge fan of Sony's first party so far, but they are clearly ahead of the pack when all is said and done.

Well I guess if you aren't including PC in the mix...

I hated the DS3 and DS2 and all the Duel Shock pads if i'm honest, but the DS4 is awesome. One issue is that it takes jumping through some hoops to get it working well with a PC, but luckily i've got an Xbone pad for my PC.

I was directing that more towards Mems statement than yours. Although, I don't really agree with yours as well, you're entitled to your opinion on it as at least you gave realistic examples of what you don't like. Mems post, on the other hand, was just a two year old flinging spaghetti at a wall.

Troll bait article, where are the mods?

@Scipio8 said:

You have one last E3 to drop megatons. If MS has teh moneybagz powah, it's now or never.

what article?

@Shewgenja: I have. Meh controller is meh.

"War" seems awfully generous.

Microsoft just dropped a bomb at GDC. Xbox One + Windows 10 games in one store, cross play and cross buy. You buy for Xbox One, you also buy for PC - Windows 10.

What you are talking about are simple software problems that can easily be addressed. I understand completely how software is run on the machines currently and they are much closer to PCs than you know.

Applications on the PS4 do not run at "BIOS" level. That's not even a level to run at unless you embed all of the drivers for talking with the CPU, RAM, and all the rest of the hardware right into the game itself. Operating systems exist as a way to run software on a system through a unified set of instructions that are translated to the hardware. Drivers live on the OS level and act as the interpreter of code to instruction. Otherwise each single game would have to interface directly to the hardware and that would add a lot of overhead for the developers (writing their own graphic drivers). All of the game consoles have a level of operating system that connects software to hardware.

Why do you think your game console has to boot up first? It first needs to fire up the OS before it can start running applications. The OS is how software communicates to the hardware. Video games on modern consoles do not talk directly to hardware. APIs and drivers exist within the OS that act as the instructions that game code calls to accomplish tasks that utilize the hardware. That's why we update our consoles software from time to time and why software updates to the console can enable more features for the devs to utilize. All inputs go through the OS before going into the game. Network operations are managed by the OS. The game doesn't actually connect directly to the network card in the console. The OS manages all of that. The OS does all of the translations between the hardware and the software.

APIs can be "low level" and are still on the OS level. The difference between a graphic API on a PC and that of a console is that on the PC it's gotta translate to hundreds of different processors and GPUs. That's not the case on a console. There is also threading and memory operations that the OS does. Windows is pretty demanding compared to the OSs found on game consoles. With Windows when you ask for RAM, you may get hardware ram or you may get virtual RAM. With a console when you ask for RAM, you get RAM, the hell with the consequences if you run out. Also with thread management, the OSs for consoles are not coded to utilize all of the physical cores. Windows manages all of that and can interject itself whenever it needs. Console OS don't do that, their processes are limited to the 1 or 2 cores assigned to them and then they simply act as an interpreter to translate the code to the CPU to be run.

The OS is involved in everything. Without the OS you have no compilers to run your code, no way to talk to your hardware. The OS manages all of it. There is no running modern software to the level of a video game without an operating system and there is not a need. BIOS level doesn't exist. It's not a place that runs code.

Yup PS4 pretty much won this gen as this gen is looking like the PS2 era except this time Sony has the better hardware. No surprise since Nintendo and MS fucked up from the beginning.

All the system needs now is games I am interested in but 2015 looks like its time to invest in a PS4 (Bloodborne and Persona 5).

I like my Wii U but that system never stood a chance. Meanwhile MS first party has never interested me outside of Halo but Bungie has left.

It sucks that the PS4 has to pay to play online unlike the PS3. In fact I despise it. But PSN+ I think is better then Xbox live as a service.

@extrodinare101: Dragon Quest Heroes is single player.

I agree that Sony is currently dominant, and it'd be a very tall order for Microsoft or Nintendo to catch up at the current stage in the generation. However, I personally don't feel the need to buy any current generation consoles at this point, since none of the consoles appeal enough to me. Heck, I think the previous generation's consoles are practically winning this generation's console wars. There just isn't enough innovation on any current console to overcome the vast library of quality games on previous consoles, there aren't enough titles that are exclusive to the current generation, and I can play any current third party cross-platform titles I take interest in on PC. That's not to say that current generation's consoles aren't better, but I still have yet to feel the need to rearrange my backlog since I have no issue waiting for a further price drop.

It does feel very comfortable in your hands, but the analog sticks are terrible, I had to buy kontrol freeks to not lose my sanity, and I've taken apart my ds4's multiple times to fix the L2/R2 buttons from wobbling and squeaking. Battery life is inexcusable, it's irritating. I have ps4/one/pc/wiiu and I have to give major props to the xone controller for battery life, R2/L2 triggers, and analog sticks. Those bumpers are crap though.

yeah and those scores are extremely generous.

Not one game is really pushing the enveloppe right now. Last gen we had already bioshock, oblvion , dead space

all we get now is sony exclusives that are just like reruns in hd, multiplat remasters, rehashes

It's the gen of the remasters and rehashes, I'm glad I stopped falling for it, i'm very carefull where i spend my money on nowadays otherwise they will keep on feeding us this crap.

' I'm simply pointing out PS4 has more quality and quantity over the Xbone as that was the discussion,'

it wasn't the discussion though, i was calling the quality of SONYs first party titles into question, i never Compared the PS4 to the Xbone in that regard beyond saying the Xbone isn't doing much better, i was Being Critical of both consoles NOT comparing the two with that point.

The PS4 has lots of Quantity and no quality in my opinion, the Xbone has Neither Quantity or quality.

You seem to be in a mindset that you think everyone on here is comparing the Two,understandable considering the general atmosphere around here i suppose but i honestly was not making any sort of PS4 over Xbone argument, just pointing out that a console having X amount of games does not equate to it being a good console, there has to be quality as well.

I suggest you re read my posts and put them in the correct context dude:)

This isn`t a point you should be trying to make with Bloodborne coming out soon. It`s going to curbstomp every exclusive on the PS4 and Xbone, probably the first 90+ metacritic exclusive between them.

@charizard1605_ in the famous words of the Batman trilogy, "YOU WERE THE CHOSEN ONE!?!?! YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO BE THE BEST OF US!?!?!" Can't believe your jumping on the PS4 bandwangon. Not that the PS4 is bad but it is too early to make such a call. Smh I'm so disappointed in you.

PS4 games are like applications running on a Windows OS. The biggest difference is that Windows is FAR more restrictive of what an app can do and way more controlling of resources. When it comes to graphic APIs, something like OpenGL or DirectX translates the code into something that your machine can run. The thing is with those APIs they have to translate to several thousand different pieces of hardware. AMD and Nvidia do their best to provide a "best fit" kind of a driver that DirectX and OpenGL can use that fits entire series of graphic cards. As you can imagine, that's kind of inefficient. Furthemore currently OpenGL and DirectX can't have multiple hardware threads talking to a GPU, that's changing with DX12 and Vulkan.

APIs on the consoles do not have to translate the software to thousands of pieces of hardware. Their APIs basically talk right to the drivers of the graphic cards directly. These things are all optimized for the exact set of hardware and their architecture that is present in the machine. As you can imagine it's far more efficient. For graphic APIs that's the biggest difference.

For running basic software on a console you can basically tell the OS to give you direct resources. Windows doesn't work that way. When you ask Windows for RAM it gives you its own addresses to memory. Basically you have to go through Windows to access memory. It's pretty fast, but the real thing is that it's safe. When your application crashes due to an error Windows can gracefully shut it down. Windows may also not give you RAM, it may give you page file memory which is harddrive space that acts like RAM. This is extremely slow but prevents crashes as you never technically run out of RAM. On a console you're given RAM. What you with it is up to you. If you lock it up that's your fault. Before the PS4 and Xbox One this would usually crash the system, but now their OSs have gotten more robust so they can close out software much more cleanly. This is because you're running the software on the app. I've crashed GTA V more than once on my PS4 but all but one time I was able to go back to the dashboard.

As for CPU useage when using Windows you're basically dumping your processing into Windows managed threads. On a console, the OSs are as unobtrusive as possible with how they let you talk to the CPU. They do all of the translating and the scheduling of the threads, but they keep their system operations to dedicated OS threads on dedicated OS cores. This splits the cores of the CPU between game and OS. The OS can free up some of its cores to give to the game if it wants (the Xbox One just did that). With Windows that's not the case. Windows throw any thread it sees fit into the scheuler. This is why when you right-click a process in the process tab in Windows you can set an affinity and a priority. You can tell Windows which CPUs to run the program on and what priority to give that program's threads, but a program can't do that itself (at least to my knowledge). On a console you can go "Run X task now on core 1 and Y task now on core 2". Way more efficient.

Consoles are still made to run games. Everything about them is tuned to allow the games to get as much performance out of the hardware as possible. Windows is a one-size-fits-all approach that has a lot of overhead. This is why PC games take more resources to run than consoles games.

The PS4 has a BIOS, but that's not what you think it is. Though now-a-days we use something called a Unified Extensible Frimware Interface. Read up on it.

I quoted Golden Element who said this. The chain shows where I posted and when:

@SolidTy said:

What about both quality and quantity?

When I saw "number of games" post suggesting there is no quality, I corrected that. Yes, these new machines, being new, have less games than the last gen, for sure.

This notion, btw, isn't a new notion, many users have tried to insinuate the PS4 has less quality titles than the Xbone. All I was doing was keeping the thread honest.

If you meant something else and there is more context involved, the good news is I never quoted you to begin with.

Yeah, not holding my Breath, Cows said EXACTLY the same thing about the Order and look how that turned out, Also, i am making this point HERE and NOW, Before Bloodborne actually releases so until it Does, my point stands and i should be trying to make it because i am making it HERE and NOW and in the Here and Now bloodborne does not even come into the equation because it's not released.

using an unreleased game and assumptions to push your point ''This isn`t a point you should be trying to make' isn't too bright really is it?