20,000 Palestinian homes await demolition in E. Jerusalem

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SquatsAreAwesom

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#1 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts

We must end support of a regime that is actively commiting genocide against a people.

Supporting Palestinians is not anti-Semetic as we are consistently convinced to believe. Palestinians ironically are semites.

For those of you who believe this is just the oppression of Muslims, note that a very large percentage of Palestinians are in fact Christian. A fact that is often hidden from publication.

http://www.icahd.org/?page_id=5374
What is happening in East Jerusalem? Since 1967, around 2,000 homes have been demolished in East Jerusalem. According to official statistics, from 2000 – 2008 the Israeli authorities demolished more than 670 East Jerusalem homes. The number of outstanding demolition orders is estimated at up to 20,000.

Punitive demolitions were employed to punish the family of persons suspected of participation in terrorist attacks. This practice was largely abandoned in 2005 for its lack of deterrent effect, although infrequent demolitions under the policy do continue. (2002-2005: 620 houses demolished under this scheme throughout the Occupied Palestinian Territories. 2009: 2 punitive home demolitions, both in East Jerusalem)

ICAHD estimates that 24,145 houses have been demolished in the West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza since 1967.

4,247 houses, according to the United Nations, were demolished during Operation Cast Lead in Gaza.










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GazaAli

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#2 GazaAli
Member since 2007 • 25216 Posts
You can debate whether Israelis or Palestinians are more on the right side, but what is happening in Eastern Jerusalem is absolutely terrible and genocide-like.
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l4dak47

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#3 l4dak47
Member since 2009 • 6838 Posts
It's a mess over there. But it's war. Israel is probably U.S. best ally in the Middle East, which isn't saying much, but it's politics.
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GazaAli

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#4 GazaAli
Member since 2007 • 25216 Posts
It's a mess over there. But it's war. Israel is probably U.S. best ally in the Middle East, which isn't saying much, but it's politics. l4dak47
This has absolutely nothing to do with this fact. I understand that Israel is a big US ally, but that does not mean Israel can do such things either. I understand that the US has to defend and support its ally, by giving them money and weapons for example and covering their asses when things like the Flotilla happens, but stuff like E-Jerusalem is absolutely fanatical and uncalled for.
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Stevo_the_gamer

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#5 Stevo_the_gamer  Moderator
Member since 2004 • 49576 Posts
Is it just me, or do those soldiers in that pic look photoshopped?
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redbaron3

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#6 redbaron3
Member since 2004 • 984 Posts
Genocide is the systematic killing of a racial or cultural group, IMO This is not genocide or anything close... is it wrong? Yes defiantly and I lose respect for Israel almost daily, but Genocide it is not.
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l4dak47

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#7 l4dak47
Member since 2009 • 6838 Posts
[QUOTE="l4dak47"]It's a mess over there. But it's war. Israel is probably U.S. best ally in the Middle East, which isn't saying much, but it's politics. GazaAli
This has absolutely nothing to do with this fact. I understand that Israel is a big US ally, but that does not mean Israel can do such things either. I understand that the US has to defend and support its ally, by giving them money and weapons for example and covering their asses when things like the Flotilla happens, but stuff like E-Jerusalem is absolutely fanatical and uncalled for.

I didn't say they're right, but both sides are committing crimes of war aganist each other. It makes better sense for the U.S to just stay with their ally since no-one is right.
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gameguy6700

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#8 gameguy6700
Member since 2004 • 12197 Posts
It's a mess over there. But it's war. Israel is probably U.S. best ally in the Middle East, which isn't saying much, but it's politics. l4dak47
It's not war. It's a genocide campaign. Israel wants ALL of the land that used to be Palestine. Understandably the Palestinians aren't thrilled about that, especially when Israel is hellbent on treating them like second class citizens if not trying to completely wipe out their culture. Israel also isn't a good ally. They turn around and sell a lot of the weapons we give them for free to countries like China. And if it weren't for us being allied with Israel we would ironically be on pretty good terms with the rest of the region (save for Iran who would still hate us for our attempted coup of their government).
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UCF_Knight

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#9 UCF_Knight
Member since 2010 • 6863 Posts
Is it just me, or do those soldiers in that pic look photoshopped?Stevo_the_gamer
It's not just you. Those are almost definitely fake.
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Stevo_the_gamer

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#10 Stevo_the_gamer  Moderator
Member since 2004 • 49576 Posts
It's a genocide campaign.gameguy6700
Wut. :?
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gameguy6700

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#11 gameguy6700
Member since 2004 • 12197 Posts
Genocide is the systematic killing of a racial or cultural group, IMO This is not genocide or anything close... is it wrong? Yes defiantly and I lose respect for Israel almost daily, but Genocide it is not.redbaron3
Genocide can also be the systematic destruction of culture, which is what Israel is doing. It doesn't necessarily have to involve mass killings. As Raphael Lemkin (the guy who coined the term) wrote: "Generally speaking, genocide does not necessarily mean the immediate destruction of a nation, except when accomplished by mass killings of all members of a nation. It is intended rather to signify a coordinated plan of different actions aiming at the destruction of essential foundations of the life of national groups, with the aim of annihilating the groups themselves. The objectives of such a plan would be the disintegration of the political and social institutions, of culture, language, national feelings, religion, and the economic existence of national groups, and the destruction of the personal security, liberty, health, dignity, and even the lives of the individuals belonging to such groups."
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l4dak47

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#12 l4dak47
Member since 2009 • 6838 Posts
[QUOTE="l4dak47"]It's a mess over there. But it's war. Israel is probably U.S. best ally in the Middle East, which isn't saying much, but it's politics. gameguy6700
It's not war. It's a genocide campaign. Israel wants ALL of the land that used to be Palestine. Understandably the Palestinians aren't thrilled about that, especially when Israel is hellbent on treating them like second class citizens if not trying to completely wipe out their culture. Israel also isn't a good ally. They turn around and sell a lot of the weapons we give them for free to countries like China. And if it weren't for us being allied with Israel we would ironically be on pretty good terms with the rest of the region (save for Iran who would still hate us for our attempted coup of their government).

First off, it's not a genocide. If you consider that genocide, then the Palestinians are just bad if not worse. Yes, I know the history of Israel and the Middle East. I also know that if it wasn't our alliance with Israel, we would probably be on relatively good terms with everybody else. However, it didn't work out that way and everybody except Israel hates the U.S., so therefore we have to stick with Israel.
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gameguy6700

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#13 gameguy6700
Member since 2004 • 12197 Posts
[QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="l4dak47"]It's a mess over there. But it's war. Israel is probably U.S. best ally in the Middle East, which isn't saying much, but it's politics. l4dak47
It's not war. It's a genocide campaign. Israel wants ALL of the land that used to be Palestine. Understandably the Palestinians aren't thrilled about that, especially when Israel is hellbent on treating them like second class citizens if not trying to completely wipe out their culture. Israel also isn't a good ally. They turn around and sell a lot of the weapons we give them for free to countries like China. And if it weren't for us being allied with Israel we would ironically be on pretty good terms with the rest of the region (save for Iran who would still hate us for our attempted coup of their government).

First off, it's not a genocide. If you consider that genocide, then the Palestinians are just bad if not worse. Yes, I know the history of Israel and the Middle East. I also know that if it wasn't our alliance with Israel, we would probably be on relatively good terms with everybody else. However, it didn't work out that way and everybody except Israel hates the U.S., so therefore we have to stick with Israel.

If you read my post above your's you'll see that it is, in fact, genocide. Mass killings aren't a prerequisite for genocide. As long as it's a campaign to wipe out a culture, ethnic group, or nationality it's genocide. And the difference between "wipe out" and "kill" is an important one since there are other ways besides killing to wipe out a culture, and Israel pretty much uses all of them. Economic suppression, religious suppression, denial of medical resources, denial of education, denial of movement, and denial of property (Israel is well known for evicting and demolishing Palestinian neighborhoods for no reason other than "some Israelis want to move in"). They also conduct terror campaigns much like Russia does in Chechnya. We don't need to stick with Israel either. If we were to drop their asses tomorrow you can bet that we would suddenly find ourselves on much more friendly terms with many countries within a couple days.
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dercoo

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#14 dercoo
Member since 2006 • 12555 Posts

Definition.

Genocideis the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group.

This does not sound like genocide...

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SquatsAreAwesom

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#15 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts

Definition.

Genocideis the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group.

This does not sound like genocide...

dercoo
Actually that sounds exactly like it. What part of this definition is not in line with what Israel has been doing? You're not going to tell me this is one big accident, are you?
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dercoo

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#16 dercoo
Member since 2006 • 12555 Posts

[QUOTE="dercoo"]

Definition.

Genocideis the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group.

This does not sound like genocide...

SquatsAreAwesom

Actually that sounds exactly like it. What part of this definition is not in line with what Israel has been doing? You're not going to tell me this is one big accident, are you?

move=destroyed:|

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l4dak47

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#17 l4dak47
Member since 2009 • 6838 Posts
[QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="l4dak47"][QUOTE="gameguy6700"] It's not war. It's a genocide campaign. Israel wants ALL of the land that used to be Palestine. Understandably the Palestinians aren't thrilled about that, especially when Israel is hellbent on treating them like second class citizens if not trying to completely wipe out their culture. Israel also isn't a good ally. They turn around and sell a lot of the weapons we give them for free to countries like China. And if it weren't for us being allied with Israel we would ironically be on pretty good terms with the rest of the region (save for Iran who would still hate us for our attempted coup of their government).

First off, it's not a genocide. If you consider that genocide, then the Palestinians are just bad if not worse. Yes, I know the history of Israel and the Middle East. I also know that if it wasn't our alliance with Israel, we would probably be on relatively good terms with everybody else. However, it didn't work out that way and everybody except Israel hates the U.S., so therefore we have to stick with Israel.

If you read my post above your's you'll see that it is, in fact, genocide. Mass killings aren't a prerequisite for genocide. As long as it's a campaign to wipe out a culture, ethnic group, or nationality it's genocide. And the difference between "wipe out" and "kill" is an important one since there are other ways besides killing to wipe out a culture, and Israel pretty much uses all of them. Economic suppression, religious suppression, denial of medical resources, denial of education, denial of movement, and denial of property (Israel is well known for evicting and demolishing Palestinian neighborhoods for no reason other than "some Israelis want to move in"). They also conduct terror campaigns much like Russia does in Chechnya. We don't need to stick with Israel either. If we were to drop their asses tomorrow you can bet that we would suddenly find ourselves on much more friendly terms with many countries within a couple days.

Okay, Palestinians are also committing war-crimes so they're both wrong. You can't just say Israel is completely wrong or that Palestine is wrong. They're both wrong. Also, even if we did drop Israel, I doubt our relations would get better with the other countries. You have to consider how Israel would act if they found out we stopped supporting them. They might do something very bad to try to guarantee their survival in the Middle East. Like it or not, the U.S is effectively keeping Israel in check.
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Gallion-Beast

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#18 Gallion-Beast
Member since 2005 • 35803 Posts
They're committing genocide....against houses! :o
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SquatsAreAwesom

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#20 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts

[QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"][QUOTE="dercoo"]

Definition.

Genocideis the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group.

This does not sound like genocide...

dercoo

Actually that sounds exactly like it. What part of this definition is not in line with what Israel has been doing? You're not going to tell me this is one big accident, are you?

move=destroyed:|

So you're suggesting that if you wipe out 20,000 Palestinian homes and push it's people into the desert, that isn't genocide?

That the combination of all the events that Israel is doing to the Palestinians, is not genocide?

Amazing.

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deactivated-6127ced9bcba0

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#21 deactivated-6127ced9bcba0
Member since 2006 • 31700 Posts

I think I'd rather just let Israel do it's thing.

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dercoo

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#22 dercoo
Member since 2006 • 12555 Posts

[QUOTE="dercoo"]

[QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"] Actually that sounds exactly like it. What part of this definition is not in line with what Israel has been doing? You're not going to tell me this is one big accident, are you?SquatsAreAwesom

move=destroyed:|

So you're suggesting that if you wipe out 20,000 Palestinian homes and push it's people into the desert, that isn't genocide?

That the combination of all the events that Israel is doing to the Palestinians, is not genocide?

Amazing.

I could very well argue that Palestine's are doing actual genocides against jews.

You know with killing civilians in terrorist attacks.

Palestine is not an innocent school girl.

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SquatsAreAwesom

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#23 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts

[QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"]

[QUOTE="dercoo"]

move=destroyed:|

dercoo

So you're suggesting that if you wipe out 20,000 Palestinian homes and push it's people into the desert, that isn't genocide?

That the combination of all the events that Israel is doing to the Palestinians, is not genocide?

Amazing.

I could very well argue that Palestine's are doing actual genocides against jews.

You know with killing civilians in terrorist attacks.

Palestine is not an innocent school girl.













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ghoklebutter

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#24 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts
Nothing new.
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p2250

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#25 p2250
Member since 2003 • 1520 Posts

Ironically, Palestinians supported Hitler's genocide of the Jews in WWII.

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dercoo

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#26 dercoo
Member since 2006 • 12555 Posts

Its not like certain groups like to launch attacks from schools

oh wait.

Both sides have dirty blood soaked hands.

Acting like Israel is the sole demon responsible for everything makes you look like an idiot.

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testfactor888

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#27 testfactor888
Member since 2010 • 7157 Posts
Good for Israel =)
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testfactor888

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#28 testfactor888
Member since 2010 • 7157 Posts

Its not like certain groups like to launch attacks from schools

oh wait.

Both sides have dirty blood soaked hands.

Acting like Israel is the sole demon responsible for everything makes you look like an idiot.

dercoo
This I can agree with
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ghoklebutter

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#29 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts

Ironically, Palestinians supported Hitler's genocide of the Jews in WWII.

p2250
That was one Palestinian Mufti, not the majority of Palestinians. :|
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p2250

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#30 p2250
Member since 2003 • 1520 Posts
Good for Israel =)testfactor888
This
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ghoklebutter

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#31 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts
Good for Israel =)testfactor888
Demolishing 20,000 homes is okay?
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Ringx55

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#32 Ringx55
Member since 2008 • 5967 Posts
Good for Israel =)testfactor888
I agree
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SquatsAreAwesom

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#33 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts

Its not like certain groups like to launch attacks from schools

oh wait.

Both sides have dirty blood soaked hands.

Acting like Israel is the sole demon responsible for everything makes you look like an idiot.

dercoo
You mean like how the IDF blew up a UN school saying there were missles being launched from there, but the UN denied it? UMMM.... Right. Any "idiot" can look at the charts and clearly see there is a huge difference between what Israel has and continues to do.
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SaudiFury

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#34 SaudiFury
Member since 2007 • 8709 Posts

Ironically, Palestinians supported Hitler's genocide of the Jews in WWII.

p2250
Ironically.. Arabs and Palestinians didn't know S*** about world events outside their villages. and anyone who wasn't British or French was a welcome foreign ally. I forget the name of the group of men, but it was Americans who went out and did a study back then and found that Arabs supported both America and Germany quite a bit. only common denominator is that they did not have much interactions with them like they did with their occupiers France and Britain. ------------ On the topic It is a real damn shame.... to imagine people look the other way as 20,000 people get kicked out of the Holy City so taht one or the other side can claim more of an ownership of it. Thought this was the stuff nations did in the 10th century not 21st. I'm not saying that this is genocide, nor am i saying that it is all Israel's fault or all Palestine's fault. Try and put yourself in their shoes - if you dare or can imagine it - all your life you grew up in your hometown ____ and then the other religious group decided their gonna force you out.
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Ringx55

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#35 Ringx55
Member since 2008 • 5967 Posts
[QUOTE="dercoo"]

Its not like certain groups like to launch attacks from schools

oh wait.

Both sides have dirty blood soaked hands.

Acting like Israel is the sole demon responsible for everything makes you look like an idiot.

SquatsAreAwesom
You mean like how the IDF blew up a UN school saying there were missles being launched from there, but the UN denied it? UMMM.... Right. Any "idiot" can look at the charts and clearly see there is a huge difference between what Israel has and continues to do.

I see the charts and find it 100% justified.
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SquatsAreAwesom

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#36 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts
I see the charts and find it 100% justified.Ringx55
What exactly is it you find justified? The destruction of 20,000 homes?
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Ringx55

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#37 Ringx55
Member since 2008 • 5967 Posts
[QUOTE="Ringx55"]I see the charts and find it 100% justified.SquatsAreAwesom
What exactly is it you find justified? The destruction of 20,000 homes?

They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.
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calzeta930

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#38 calzeta930
Member since 2010 • 720 Posts
Is it just me, or do those soldiers in that pic look photoshopped?Stevo_the_gamer
no its not just you... :D
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#40 SaudiFury
Member since 2007 • 8709 Posts
[QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"][QUOTE="Ringx55"]I see the charts and find it 100% justified.Ringx55
What exactly is it you find justified? The destruction of 20,000 homes?

They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

and what if you don't want to move? It's your home for crying out loud. last time i checked i didn't see Palestinians moving in on Bera' Sheva and deciding they can just kick you out.. or are you simply a zealot who believes Israel has it's God given right to take everything between the Mediterranean and the Jordan river?
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ghoklebutter

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#41 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts
[QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"][QUOTE="Ringx55"]I see the charts and find it 100% justified.Ringx55
What exactly is it you find justified? The destruction of 20,000 homes?

They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

They're being demolished, not moved.
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Ringx55

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#42 Ringx55
Member since 2008 • 5967 Posts
[QUOTE="ghoklebutter"][QUOTE="Ringx55"][QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"] What exactly is it you find justified? The destruction of 20,000 homes?

They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

They're being demolished, not moved.

Even better, more room for Israel.
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Ringx55

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#43 Ringx55
Member since 2008 • 5967 Posts
[QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"][QUOTE="Ringx55"][QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"] What exactly is it you find justified? The destruction of 20,000 homes?

They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

You're a sick individual.

Hardly, I don't support a nation who lets terrorist freely roam and attack Israeli border.
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Ringx55

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#44 Ringx55
Member since 2008 • 5967 Posts
[QUOTE="SaudiFury"][QUOTE="Ringx55"][QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"] What exactly is it you find justified? The destruction of 20,000 homes?

They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

and what if you don't want to move? It's your home for crying out loud. last time i checked i didn't see Palestinians moving in on Bera' Sheva and deciding they can just kick you out.. or are you simply a zealot who believes Israel has it's God given right to take everything between the Mediterranean and the Jordan river?

Man, there seem to be a lot of Israli haters up in hur thread. And I think it's there right to protect their country.
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SaudiFury

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#45 SaudiFury
Member since 2007 • 8709 Posts
[QUOTE="Ringx55"][QUOTE="SaudiFury"][QUOTE="Ringx55"] They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

and what if you don't want to move? It's your home for crying out loud. last time i checked i didn't see Palestinians moving in on Bera' Sheva and deciding they can just kick you out.. or are you simply a zealot who believes Israel has it's God given right to take everything between the Mediterranean and the Jordan river?

Man, there seem to be a lot of Israli haters up in hur thread. And I think it's there right to protect their country.

I am most definitely not an Israeli hater. my definition of borders is just not 7th century....
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Ringx55

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#46 Ringx55
Member since 2008 • 5967 Posts
[QUOTE="SaudiFury"][QUOTE="Ringx55"][QUOTE="SaudiFury"] and what if you don't want to move? It's your home for crying out loud. last time i checked i didn't see Palestinians moving in on Bera' Sheva and deciding they can just kick you out.. or are you simply a zealot who believes Israel has it's God given right to take everything between the Mediterranean and the Jordan river?

Man, there seem to be a lot of Israli haters up in hur thread. And I think it's there right to protect their country.

I am most definitely not an Israeli hater. my definition of borders is just not 7th century....

Well, mine tends to be.
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SquatsAreAwesom

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#47 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts
[QUOTE="Ringx55"][QUOTE="SquatsAreAwesom"][QUOTE="Ringx55"] They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

You're a sick individual.

Hardly, I don't support a nation who lets terrorist freely roam and attack Israeli border.

You sound like a terrorist if I can be frank.
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br0kenrabbit

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#48 br0kenrabbit
Member since 2004 • 17877 Posts

The only chance that region has is as a united secular state. Two-states won't work. Unfortunately, both sides claim Divine Right so a secular or united state is out of the question.

Impasse.

Cue human suffering.

"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results."

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ghoklebutter

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#49 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts
[QUOTE="Ringx55"][QUOTE="ghoklebutter"][QUOTE="Ringx55"] They're being moved I don't see whats wrong. I find it pretty cool they have the balls to really push when it comes to shove.

They're being demolished, not moved.

Even better, more room for Israel.

Who is to decide which two nations are better? Palestinians are people, too.
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SquatsAreAwesom

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#50 SquatsAreAwesom
Member since 2009 • 1678 Posts

The only chance that region has is as a united secular state. Two-states won't work. Unfortunately, both sides claim Divine Right so a secular or united state is out of the question.

Impasse.

Cue human suffering.

"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results."

br0kenrabbit
In fact I agree, however the right wing Israeli government would not allow this to happen.