So xbox one X is just a little more powerful playstation 4 with no games?

Wait weren't you the one posting quotes out of context and then trying to claim they meant something different

Is this your way of admitting that it was all your fault?

The facts, AMD Rysen event was mostly about the ZEN CPU and AMD thrown in Project Scorpio into the mix. I only reported what happened during AMD's ZEN presentation and information was properly credited to AMD i.e. I didn't state it's "from my inside source" argument.

The actual reality that preserves AMD's claims would be Ryzen's low latency improvements for Jaguar as per MS's statement, hence enabling X1X to have PC's EPIC settings draw distance with 60 fps target while PS4 Pro version is less than half of it (30 fps target and less than PC EPIC draw distance settings) which is beyond the normal 9.5 percent clock speed increase from 2.1 Ghz to 2.3 Ghz. X1X's Jaguar is not a stock Jaguar with 2.3 Ghz overclock.

Based from AMD/MS claims, X1X has subset IP selections from Ryzen and Vega IP block palettes i.e. X1X doesn't have full Ryzen or Vega IP but has enough sub-element IP block selections for MS's intended goals.

Both Sony and MS was presented with Vega IP block palettes and of them has selected different sub-element IP blocks.

Don't worry ron, we forgive you for lying....probably

Again, I didn't lie i.e. Juub1990 misrepresent my POV on this matter by failing to read page 5, hence Juub1990 has lied via omission.

Ryzen marketing label itself is not important, but the results and other measures against CPU workload magnitude for R9-390X magnitude GPU. In the end of the day, it's faster than my old PC box with R9-390X.

The core argument, Is it faster than stock quad core Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz with R9-390X PC setup?

The doubters with X1X doesn't even own R9-390X and RX-480 OC to make a proper counter argument.

The context was complete and we all understood the same thing. Next time focus on forming coherent sentences and a logical set of ideas rather than posting charts. Maybe we won't understand you "out of context" you damage controlling liar.

No i haven't flag you dude so maybe other posters.

NO the xbox one is POLARIS with some Vega Features supposedly that MS never named,is not me mature than the PS4 Pro is polaris period...lol

What are the Vega features it has name them? Because MS didn't and what it name was a command processor modification that the xbox already have.

Fact is you were WRONG so sadly for you,you simple can't just space the ownage by spinning reality you were WRONG and you deserve to be ridicule for it..hahahahaa

No its yours for jumping the gun in your eternal quest to defend the xbox brand..lol

Just like you keep jumping it and claiming that a 6TF Polaris beat a 1070GTX..lol

don't get the comparisons to off the shelf PC parts when this was praised by DF for being customized?

The X's arrival will be great for all console gamers. Don't tell me Sony will not reverse engineer the hell out of it, if they have not already. This Gen already started 2 years behind the majority of what PC gamers were using then. It's going to take some major engineering, elbow grease, customization, and innovation from both of them to keep it even close. 360 and PS 3 were pretty advanced for their time of launch compared to this gen's launch. They cannot just put consoles out with off the shelf components at a price point without really doing some serious engineering.

Hahahahahahaa... I love how he does backtracks as if any one would believe him for a second,he did try to pass Ryzen as the CPU,and he claim that scorpio would not have a Jaguar CPU based on a vague quote he did from Phil Spencer which i no place said that but like always Ron interpret it as he liked..lol

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/xbox-one-scorpio-may-be-using-amds-vegaryzen-cpu-33375759/

In case there is any doubt that he try to pass Ryzen as the CPU and that he simple misinterpret Phil and other people arguments to form his own opinion of what he though was going on..lol

@ronvalencia said:

@GameboyTroy said:

Here's something interesting.

http://wccftech.com/xbox-scorpio-amd-ryzen-vega/

http://cdn.wccftech.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/scorpio_amd_ces_2017.jpg

LOL... AMD leaked Scorpio's IP blocks... AMD marketing can't help themselves from leaking Microsoft's product.

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa... What is your excuse now Rondementia...hahahahaaa

Oh this is a juicy bonus from that same thread currently banned Dynamitecop claim how he and Ronvalencia have been saying for the last 6 months (now 1 year) that scorpio would feature not only vega but also Ryzen...lol

@ronvalencia said:

GameSpot: Sony recently announced the PS4 Pro. What was initial your reaction to the announcement? It's coming out a year before Xbox Scorpio; how does that affect your plans, if at all?

Spencer: It didn't affect our plan at all. About two and a half years ago we started to look at a hardware refresh that we might want to do, which in the end led to the Xbox One S and Scorpio in terms of designs. We'd looked at doing something that was higher performance this year, and I'd say the [PS4] Pro is about what we thought--with the GPU, CPU, memory that was here this year--that you could go do, and we decided that we wanted to do something different. So we looked at Scorpio and 4K and what I thought was a bigger step in terms of performance. It was something that we wanted to focus on.

In regards to CPU, GPU and memory, MSFT wanted something different from PS4 Pro.

It wouldn't be PS4 Pro's CPU solution.

Project Scorpio ‘Beefier Than Expected’, Says Halo Director

“Haha, although I probably ‘know’ [what Project Scorpio’s specs are] in that I might have seen it in a slide or something, it’s literally not something I have time to think about now and I actually couldn’t remember whatever specs I’ve been exposed to even if I was tortured. I literally couldn’t leak or answer a question that went beyond, ‘Can I do this? Does it support that? How many of these could it render?’ What I do remember is that it’s beefier than I expected.”

Change of plans...

As i say before you complete joke of a poster you should be ridicule for your backtracking and damage control you did that to pass that image as confirmation that Scorpio had Ryzen.

I can do this all day...

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/will-amd-beat-intel-with-ryzen-33381563/

@ronvalencia said:

@crashnburn281 said:

@ronvalencia: No one ever seems to know what the hell you are talking about. Just thought you should know. Cheers.

http://www.icxm.net/x/xbox-scorpio-ryzen-new-evidence.html

A source close to ICXM visited the AMD booth at CES to ask the AMD staff about the situation to which they replied, “It's there for a reason but we can't talk about it yet.”

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/amd-ryzen-will-be-available-on-march-2nd-33381973/

How many more threads you want me to quote you using that Screen as some kind of proof that Scorpio had Ryzen.?

@ronvalencia said:

@kvally:

Since PS4 Pro's 2.3X over PS4 follows the AMD's road map is true, then Vega era Scorpio would yield about 7.36 TFLOPS. If MS is aiming for Xbox 360 style sledge hammer with year 2017 parts, 8 TFLOPS version would need an overclock or substantial increase in NCU count.

Vega 10 at 12.5 TFLOPS FP32 and 64 NCU would need 1.528 Ghz clock speed.

Examples for smaller Vega 11 which directly replaces Polaris 10 XT and XT2 (second revision).

36 NCU x 1.528 Ghz = 7.014 TFLOPS FP32

36 NCU x 1.600 Ghz = 7.372 TFLOPS FP32

40 NCU x 1.528 Ghz = 7.823 TFLOPS FP32

Xbox Scorpio being associated with AMD's New Horizon i.e. mostly RYZEN.

Xbox Scorpio has a few more months for further improvements.

Vega includes double rate FP16 feature.

Scorpio's estimate 362 mm^2 APU can handle 36 CU size Polaris 10 at 232 mm^2 which leaves 130 mm^2 for 8 core CPU, NB and another 128 bit memory controller i.e. full blown 8 core RYZEN. Reduced L3 cache could yield a larger GPU in 40 NCU range.

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/rumor-xbox-scorpio-bumped-to-8-teralfops-33377655/?page=2

You have zero credibility and you should be ridicule for your lack of honesty and your derange blind arguments in favor of the xbox.

You claimed RYZEN....

Your ronvalencia quotes wasn't the entire thread context which includes page 5 when I speculated alternatives to Ryzen despite AMD's linking Scorpio with Ryzen. This is known having a discussion.

By omitted the rest of the thread's context, you lied.

Too bad for you, X1X's pumping EPIC setting draw distance with 60 fps target which is far superior to PS4 Pro's non-EPIC setting draw distance with 30 fps target which is above 12 percent clock speed difference between X1X and PS4 Pro.

Draw distance heavily involves the CPU.

Any discussion on ronvalencia is NOT system wars.

@tormentos said:

@ronvalencia said:

GameSpot: Sony recently announced the PS4 Pro. What was initial your reaction to the announcement? It's coming out a year before Xbox Scorpio; how does that affect your plans, if at all?

Spencer: It didn't affect our plan at all. About two and a half years ago we started to look at a hardware refresh that we might want to do, which in the end led to the Xbox One S and Scorpio in terms of designs. We'd looked at doing something that was higher performance this year, and I'd say the [PS4] Pro is about what we thought--with the GPU, CPU, memory that was here this year--that you could go do, and we decided that we wanted to do something different. So we looked at Scorpio and 4K and what I thought was a bigger step in terms of performance. It was something that we wanted to focus on.

In regards to CPU, GPU and memory, MSFT wanted something different from PS4 Pro.

It wouldn't be PS4 Pro's CPU solution.

Project Scorpio ‘Beefier Than Expected’, Says Halo Director

“Haha, although I probably ‘know’ [what Project Scorpio’s specs are] in that I might have seen it in a slide or something, it’s literally not something I have time to think about now and I actually couldn’t remember whatever specs I’ve been exposed to even if I was tortured. I literally couldn’t leak or answer a question that went beyond, ‘Can I do this? Does it support that? How many of these could it render?’ What I do remember is that it’s beefier than I expected.”

Change of plans...

As i say before you complete joke of a poster you should be ridicule for your backtracking and damage control you did that to pass that image as confirmation that Scorpio had Ryzen.

@ronvalencia said:

@crashnburn281 said:

@ronvalencia: Your right it would probably be an overclocked FinFet Puma+. Thanks for clarifying.

PS4 Pro already has overclocked 2.1 Ghz FinFet Puma+.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-head-phil-spencer-talks-scorpio-ps4-pro-4k-re/1100-6444198/

GameSpot: Sony recently announced the PS4 Pro. What was initial your reaction to the announcement? It's coming out a year before Xbox Scorpio; how does that affect your plans, if at all?

Spencer: It didn't affect our plan at all. About two and a half years ago we started to look at a hardware refresh that we might want to do, which in the end led to the Xbox One S and Scorpio in terms of designs. We'd looked at doing something that was higher performance this year, and I'd say the [PS4] Pro is about what we thought--with the GPU, CPU, memory that was here this year--that you could go do, and we decided that we wanted to do something different. So we looked at Scorpio and 4K and what I thought was a bigger step in terms of performance. It was something that we wanted to focus on.

In regards to CPU, GPU and memory, MSFT wanted something different from PS4 Pro.

http://www.icxm.net/x/xbox-scorpio-ryzen-new-evidence.html

Branching from an image of Xbox Scorpio being advertised at the official Ryzen section of the AMD booth at this year’s CES Expo. A source close to ICXM visited the AMD booth at CES to ask the AMD staff about the situation to which they replied,“It's there for a reason but we can't talk about it yet.”

I can do this all day...

@ronvalencia said:

@crashnburn281 said:

@ronvalencia: So 2.2 GHz FinFet Puma+. More might be pushing it.

The white paper has not defined specific CPU design i.e. the claim was manufactured by Digital Foundry.

I have already bashed DF's Richard Leadbetter's Scorpio GPU claims.

It's isn't Jaguar......but it's Puma....WTF! Architecturally there is no difference between the two. Just circuit-design different & probably different libraries since both are made on different foundries (TSMC & GloFo respectively)

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/will-amd-beat-intel-with-ryzen-33381563/

@ronvalencia said:

@crashnburn281 said:

@ronvalencia: No one ever seems to know what the hell you are talking about. Just thought you should know. Cheers.

http://www.icxm.net/x/xbox-scorpio-ryzen-new-evidence.html

A source close to ICXM visited the AMD booth at CES to ask the AMD staff about the situation to which they replied, “It's there for a reason but we can't talk about it yet.”

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/amd-ryzen-will-be-available-on-march-2nd-33381973/

How many more threads you want me to quote you using that Screen as some kind of proof that Scorpio had Ryzen.?

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/rumor-xbox-scorpio-bumped-to-8-teralfops-33377655/?page=2

You have zero credibility and you should be ridicule for your lack of honesty and your derange blind arguments in favor of the xbox.

You claimed RYZEN....

This is not system war i.e. this is poster war.

Too bad for you,

1. X1X's pumping EPIC setting draw distance with 60 fps target which is far superior to PS4 Pro's non-EPIC setting draw distance with 30 fps target which is above 12 percent clock speed difference between X1X and PS4 Pro. Draw distance heavily involves the CPU.

Regardless of missing "Ryzen" marketing label, X1X's CPU is yielding more than 12 percent clock speed increase over PS4 Pro's results.

2. X1X's is superior to my old R9-390X and another poster's RX-480 OC. Vega 11 was used as an example for AMD's superior RX-480/RX-580 replacement solution i.e. the question for can AMD to deliver superior GPU over Polaris 10/20 XT at mainstream prices?

No is system wars and is call exposing your lies..hahahahaa

1-You mean like Tomb Raider target 60FPS on PS4 + better textures and 1080p cut scenes vs 30FPS worse textures and 900p cut scenes on xbox one? Even that the PS4 has a slower CPU?

The xbox one is not Rysen and yielding 12% increase means nothing with 10% higher clock speed,which mean again that the xbox one X is bottleneck CPU wise.

2-The Xbox one X is not out so we can openly compare.

3-Nice to see you that you totally ignore what my quotes were about lemming,you were wrong and you did claim that Ryzen would be on Scorpio contrary to what you say now..

@ronvalencia said:

Scorpio's estimate 362 mm^2 APU can handle 36 CU size Polaris 10 at 232 mm^2 which leaves 130 mm^2 for 8 core CPU, NB and another 128 bit memory controller i.e. full blown 8 core RYZEN. Reduced L3 cache could yield a larger GPU in 40 NCU range.

You claimed Ryzen and you use horizon screen from AMD GDC to try to prove that Ryzen was inside scorpio...lol

So what? That's was made in speculation thread without MS's plans being visible. It was AMD that linked Ryzen with Scorpio.

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/rumor-xbox-scorpio-bumped-to-8-teralfops-33377655/?page=2

Notice the topic's title i.e. rumor.

Notice I even have 40 CU version just like the real X1X. I didn't expect a smaller box than XBO S, hence dropping higher clock speed version.

It's pretty close to what I envisage i.e.

1. Better than my old R9-390X and other poster's RX-480 OC. MS selected the better IP blocks from Vega IP pool i.e. NCU is nearly pointless without reducing the bottlenecks with graphics pipeline. It's even nicer to see upgraded PolarisPlus with 40/44 CU which is upgrade for my old R9-390X. The core argument has been reached.

2. Better than simple overclocked Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz. The important part is delivering better CPU results over 12 percent Jaguar overclock above PS4 Pro's Jaguar 2.1 Ghz, hence reducing any argument for X1X having stock a Jaguar design with unsolved high latency design problem.

Ryzen speculation was based from running Doom Vulkan on R9-290 OC with stock quad core Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz OC, but MS has offered alternative to Ryzen i.e.

a. Custom DirectX12 command processor with microcoding support. MS and EA DICE sources. Reduce CPU workload up to a half.

b. Low latency Jaguar improvements. AMD and MS sources. Half of Ryzen's data and instruction feed improvements, hence AMD can claim Scorpio being linked with Ryzen.

c. Very efficient XBO APIs over other APIs. EA DICE sources i.e. better than PC's DirectX12/Vulkan.

Points a, b and c covered the need for mobile Ryzen and +3 Ghz mobile Excavator. The core argument has been reached.

Your arguments about ronvalencia are not about system wars, but personality war.

That's was made in speculation thread without MS's plans being visible. It was AMD that linked Ryzen with Scorpio.

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/rumor-xbox-scorpio-bumped-to-8-teralfops-33377655/?page=2

Notice the topic's title i.e. rumor.

Notice I even have 40 CU version just like the real X1X. I didn't expect a smaller box than XBO S, hence dropping higher clock speed version.

It's pretty close to what I envisage i.e.

1. Better than my old R9-390X and other poster's RX-480 OC. MS selected the better IP blocks from Vega IP pool i.e. NCU is nearly pointless without reducing the bottlenecks with graphics pipeline. It's even nicer to see upgraded PolarisPlus with 40/44 CU which is upgrade for my old R9-390X. The core argument has been reached.

2. Better than simple overclocked Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz. The important part is delivering better CPU results over 12 percent Jaguar overclock above PS4 Pro's Jaguar 2.1 Ghz, hence reducing any argument for X1X having stock a Jaguar design with unsolved high latency design problem.

Ryzen speculation was based from running Doom Vulkan on R9-290 OC with stock quad core Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz OC, but MS has offered alternative to Ryzen i.e.

a. Custom DirectX12 command processor with microcoding support. MS and EA DICE sources. Reduce CPU workload up to a half.

b. Low latency Jaguar improvements. AMD and MS sources. Half of Ryzen's data and instruction feed improvements, hence AMD can claim Scorpio being linked with Ryzen.

c. Very efficient XBO APIs over other APIs. EA DICE sources i.e. better than PC's DirectX12/Vulkan.

Points a, b and c covered the need for mobile Ryzen and +3 Ghz mobile Excavator. The core argument has been reached.

Your arguments about ronvalencia are not about system wars, but personality war.

@metalslimenite said:

For instance, you claimed the X1X was going to cost $399. You were only off by $100, but someone like you who works in the industry shouldn't come up that wrong.

Wrong From https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/if-sony-announces-a-100-price-cut-at-e3-is-scorpio-33393454/?page=2

To quote myself

https://www.windowscentral.com/what-were-expecting-microsofts-xbox-e3-2017-conference

According to Windows Central, Scorpio has a $399 price target.

I cite my references.

From https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/scorpio-will-fail-if-the-price-aint-right-33389818/?page=1

To quote myself

The APU BOM cost difference is about 12 percent.

https://pcpartpicker.com/products/video-card/#sort=a8&c=370

4 GB vs 8 GB difference between RX-480 4GB vs 8GB variants is $36 at retail price hence whole sale price is less e.g. $18 extra.

Scorpio doesn't have PS4 Pro's 1 GB DDR3 cost.

Looking at $450 price range. The price could be lower later in 2017.

Scorpio could surf HDMI 2.1 4K UHDTV upgrade wave.

The above is my own speculation.

Above my post with "Looking at $450 price range", I used 500 GB 7200 RPM HDD while the real X1X has 1 TB 7200 RPM HDD and 8 GB Flash memory.

@ronvalencia: "It's pretty close to what I envisage"

BS, you're a hypocrite. There are direct quotes of you claiming it will be a Ryzen and now you're trying to spin your crap predictions. At least man up and acknowledge that you were wrong for once.

BS, you're a hypocrite. There are direct quotes of I'm claiming Excavator and now you're trying to spin your crap narrative. At least man up and acknowledge that you were wrong for once.

Too bad for you,

Better than simple overclocked Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz. The important part is delivering better CPU results over 12 percent Jaguar overclock above PS4 Pro's Jaguar 2.1 Ghz, hence reducing any argument for X1X having stock a Jaguar design with unsolved high latency design problem.

Ryzen speculation was based from running Doom Vulkan on R9-290 OC with stock quad core Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz OC, but MS has offered alternative to Ryzen i.e.

a. Custom DirectX12 command processor with microcoding support. MS and EA DICE sources. Reduce CPU workload up to a half.

b. Low latency Jaguar improvements. AMD and MS sources. Half of Ryzen's data and instruction feed improvements, hence AMD can claim Scorpio being linked with Ryzen.

c. Very efficient XBO APIs over other APIs. EA DICE sources i.e. better than PC's DirectX12/Vulkan.

Points a, b and c covered the need for mobile Ryzen and +3 Ghz mobile Excavator. The core argument has been reached.

Your arguments about ronvalencia are not about system wars, but personality war.

@ronvalencia: "BS, you're a hypocrite. There are direct quotes of I'm claiming Excavator and now you're trying to spin your crap narrative. At least man up and acknowledge that you were wrong for once."

Man you're pathetic. You can't even come with sentences of your own. Stop being a joke and maybe some people will take you seriously.

Again a bunch of hogwash that you spill and can't proof that the X1X is equivalent to the GTX1070 like you moronically have claimed time and time again.

And stop referring yourself in third person, you look even more pathetic and seem that you're losing your mind even more.

Oh please stop with your damage control been a speculation thread means nothing,you claimed Ryzen would be on Scorpio and even claim that AMD leaked MS plans on another thread as well,i quote you like in 4 different threads using that Horizon screen as some kind of proof that Ryzen was in i quote you using Phil Spencer words out of context to claim that MS wanted something different to the Pro and again hint that Ryzen was in,you did even worse with Vega as you claim Sony had a rushed half assed polaris with 2 vega features and that MS gave time to AMD to finish the complete Vega IP. Hahahahahaa

Reality is.

1-Vega and Ryzen are not part of Scorpio.

2-Ryzen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jaguar inside the xbox one X.

3-The xbox one X is not $399 like you predicted using the Soc size.

4-FP16 double pumped is not on Polaris or xbox one X,is a Vega feature and no sub word crap of yours will change that as MS it self confirmed that they don't have FP16 double pumped MS >>>>>>>> YOU.

You can admit been wrong when you are ready fool.

BUllshit you claimed Ryzen and i quote you hypocrite mods should ban you,for your disrupting posting which is what it is by now that you do,you don't even have the guts to say hey i was wrong.

Everyone knows here what you try to do,you hyped Vega,FP16 and Ryzen for Scorpio in many threads and you were wrong,hell you even fell fast for the whole 8TF crap and started to speculate on how using Verga MS would achieve it..lol

And now you are running hype for a shitty modification of the command processor that has been inside the xbox since the xbox 360,worse claiming low latency crap when i already proved that MS not only admit the xbox one has such modification as well,but that low latency was the goal as well and i quote MS architects directly on DF interview.

What MS did with the XBO X CPU was already done,they simply OC to 2.3ghz which is not enough to feed a 6TF GPU,a 2.3 jaguar would never drive a 6TF GPU to its max potential as a i7 or Ryzen would,there is a reason why benchmarks are done with i7 and not Jaguars dude.

You simply have become the joke of this place,you don't even have the honesty to say i was wrong,which is ok it is ok to be wrong dude is not the end of the world.

@tormentos: He will never admit to being wrong. He will argue and argue. This is a man not interested in discussing but in arguing. Hell you are man enough to admit when you are wrong. Even I at but ron? He will argue with everyone and everything.

Hahahaha yep..

Is hilarious seeing him try to spin that he claim Ryzen would be on xbox one X as well as Vega,then trying to claim that Jaguar = Ryzen some how based on a modification that MS has been doing to the command processor since the 360 days is the icing on the cake..

Now he is damage controlling killing floor 2 been 1800p while the 1070GTX can hit 4k..lol

It would have been so much easier for him just to say i was wrong big deal..lol