So, um, Avengers flopped

I have sigs disabled.

Look, the GaaS model is flooding the market and people only have so much time to dedicate to gaming. The Division 1/2, Destiny, Anthem, Avengers, Warframe, MMO's, every BR out there, Warframe, R6 Siege, Path of Exile / Diablo.....

Basically anything that has seasons (or passes) and pushes you to play content regularly and over again.

So, if you're going to push the model where multi-player repeated content is the focus, you better be damn good or have a crazy niche. Super heroes is not a niche, it's a theme. And from what I've played and heard, Avengers is just ok. So, not surprised they didn't pull in the whales.

Yeah, I didn't play the game, but I have heard little about it.

Granted, I have not heard anything bad about it...I just have not heard anything about it.

It was more or less a Destiny clone, wasn't it? Maybe not with guns n junk, but as far as the whole approach goes, yes?

I read the same thing. I wish people would go a tiny bit further than skin deep when making the whole "woke" claim.

It does occur in entertainment, just not every time a female and/or non-white person is featured.

Saw that shit when i saw the beta. My friends got it tho.

The most offensive post in this thread.

Raiden would beat Snake in a fight.

MGS2 is a better game than MGS.

I am just highlighting certain groups/traits that will be targeted for strategic inclusion. Companies are so conscious of image and worried about not offending anyone. They go out of their way to make sure things are represented in order to earn brownie points. I don't like that. If a certain trait is included due to inspiration from the creator's life experience, that is fine. However, when there is something included just to make sure that it is being represented or to make a statement, then it is wrong.

@BassMan: The gender or ethnicity of the character, or the intent behind their inclusion, should not matter. What should matter is how well they're implemented, if the character is well-written, and how well they play when it comes to the actual gameplay.

The intent matters. However, the implementation of course is more important. At the end of the day, you have to ask why this particular character is so heavily featured in an Avengers game. People are not buying the game to play as Kamala Kahn, but The Avengers. She is not a popular character. So, why have her be so prominent? Why write the story around her as a central character? It reeks of wokeness. I smell that shit a mile away.

Why should it matter if she's not a popular character? There was a time when The Avengers themselves were unpopular characters. Back in the late '90s, a Sony executive told Marvel that "nobody gives a shit about any of the other Marvel characters" besides Spider-Man. According to your logic, Marvel should've exclusively focused on Spider-Man and not bothered with The Avengers at all.

She is actually fairly popular in the comics because for the most part, she is well written.

Anyway ... the game looked bad since they revealed the first gameplay video, i'm glad it failed hard and hopefully it will be a warning for DC if they try to go for the sweet "game as a service revenue" wet dream.

Most people don't read the comics and have never even heard of her.

You make no sense saying that. Spider Man at one point was only popular in the comics and thanks to that, he made the jump to other media. Same with this character, she is fairly popular so it makes sense she is being used on other media as well.

She has only been around since 2013. The average person these days does not read comics and has not been exposed to her. She is not part of the MCU. Her popularity is minimal.

@BassMan: Exactly, that's why it makes perfect sense for her to be portrayed in different media.

I don't care if she crosses over to different media. She is not deserving of a major role in an Avengers game and her inclusion is clearly part of the woke agenda.

So I'm still super curious:

After the excessive monetization, the pivot from SP to live service game, the weak tie-in to a forced Disney franchise.....

Who thought it would be good and why?

Exactly !!! thanks for sharing your (wrong) opinion.

Dude... her whole existence is part of the woke agenda...

https://www.vox.com/2020/1/7/21038179/ms-marvel-kamala-khan-disney-plus

Do you realize that without having an "agenda" we wouldn't have characters like Black Panther? for all the mistakes Stan Lee did (early Sue Storm portrays), he knew he had to tell stories for everyone and he did his best to push the envelope wherever he could, after all a Black Superhero was unthinkable back in the day.

Listen, I'm not going to act like Marvel is all good intentions, not back then and even less now, but Kamala Khan is cool in my eyes, she has been treated with respect by writters and has earned her popularity with audiences, she is relatable and she is likable. I haven't read many comics lately but i get why she is popular, and I rather have characters like X-23 and Kamala than for example, weird experiments like The Sentry or Penance.

Now, If we were talking about the embarrasing New Warriors reboot and we had the likes of Snowflake or Safespace in the game ... then i would be 100% agree with you.

@madsnakehhh: I don't have an issue with diverse characters. My issue is Kamala Kahn being featured so prominently in the game to serve the agenda. She is getting a massive push. Black Panther is a more recognizable character than her and he is not even in the game. Anyway, I called out the obvious and then people started attacking me. It is silly.

The game is called Marvel'sAvengers after all. She hasn't earned her stripes or paid her dues to hang with the big boys. Had she been included in a lesser role as some side character that you meet throughout the game, I wouldn't even have brought it up.

Marvel ultimate alliance 3 is a far better game than this crap. They made a worse game than anthem and that was bad. The more gamers reject these GAAS style games the better. We already have destiny and the division and that’s 2 games too many.

Last I checked you seem to be deeply offended, so companies are definitely not going out of their way to not offend anyone. You keep saying there is agenda being pushed yet provide no evidence but keep falling back to what she looks like.

"If a certain trait is included due to inspiration from the creator's life experience, that is fine. However, when there is something included just to make sure that it is being represented or to make a statement, then it is wrong."

On one hand its OK for creators to include traits and inspiration from their life but they can't make a strong statement. Why is it that when it comes to non white main protagonist all of these rules and arbitrary criteria are needed? Folks like you NEVER request these constraints for white characters. I never seen someone that shares your perspective push the same criticism for white characters. Again, why is that?

It's also worth noting that the X-Men were inspired by the civil rights movement, with Xavier inspired by Martin Luther King and Magneto inspired by Malcolm X. The X-Men story was a metaphor for racism, with the Mutants representing minorities.

The way Ms Marvel (Kamala Khan) is introduced in the Avengers game is not unlike how Black Panther (T'Challa) was introduced in Captain America: Civil War. Up until then, most people had never heard of Black Panther before. That movie was essentially promoted as an Avengers movie, with Captain America and Iron Man getting top billing, and Black Panther barely getting much mention in promotional materials.

So it took audiences by surprise when Civil War turned out to be largely a Black Panther origin story, with Black Panther playing a central role, getting about as much screen time as Captain America and Iron Man, beating Captain America in a fight, capturing the mastermind villain, and portrayed as the most rational character in the movie. By the end of the movie, Black Panther was the stand-out star of the show. That's when he became an overnight star, and Black Panther went on to become a cultural phenomenon.

But we can actually see your sig. If you have it disable, how is it possible we can see your sig but not ours?

I know you can see mine but there is an option to disable sigs as in the visibility of all sigs in the forum.

This shit just keeps dragging on and I have wasted enough time in this thread. I've already said what I wanted to. Agree/disagree.... I don't care anymore.

I didn't know that. That's interesting as I never done it. But then again, I enjoy seeing everyone's sigs so yeah.

At least we finally got the big budget Ms. Marvel portrayal we all wanted.

Whenever I hear something described as a game as a service, I immediately avoid it like the plague. What a bad idea for an Avenger's game.

Sweet. This warms my heart.

Hopefully they gone back to Deus Ex.

This thread is funny: "The black lady doesn't fit! The big green dude is cool though." :P

I'm glad it failed. I'd love a AAA single player Avengers game. Not some online treadmill crap.

Yea, they should have told Sony to keep their money and not include Spidey in any versions. It was a better choice to focus on the other characters. Plus Spidey has their own games.

You know what.....this is entire interaction between you and @BassMan is bullshit. You shouldnt even have to say what you are saying here and the very fact that you have to says gamers still have a VERY long way to go. @BassMan and other seem pretty hell bent on their racism and possible sexism towards Kamala. You guys are just weird man.

Avengers has a TON of Flaws, but including Kamala wasnt the issue. The biggest problem with Avengers is Square's greed. The product was an unfinished beta, the main story was far too short, so many bugs and glitches and not enough endgame content or endgame variety. Thats its. They could have replaced Kamala with Miles Morales and the game would have been the exact same mess it was. Square will have to learn the hard way. @BassMan stop being a terrible person.

lol I remember this thread.

Imagine reviving an old thread and mentioning me 3 times... LOL

Looked so bad right from the start. Is this surprising?

It isn't Spider-Man PS4 game and that's the problem with Avengers, it had no single player heavy content.

Shame. I still really enjoy the game but it definitely does have problems. Hopefully they can fix it up and bring some players back. The lack of communication from the devs is concerning. Sony is looking really dumb for advertising spiderman for a game that might be absolutely dead in like a month.