Is FALLOUT 4 best Bethesda game yet?

@indzman said:

@Maroxad said:

@indzman said:

Yes, it is me again, the man who actually has taste and standards. I like my games to be at least competent in one area or 2. Divinity Original Sin was, this wasn't.

Unmodded, Bethesda games are like a massive swimming pool of sewer water. Sure, you can pride yourself in its size, but that just means more sewage for you to swim through.

Not saying you got poor taste, you probably've played more rpg than me. BUT you nitpick on negetives too much on most games. Say if i'm wrong on this :P

In this case, he isn't wrong, Fallout 4 is a terrible game by just about any standard. It's poor by just about every metric except for when it comes to extensibility.

@charizard1605 said:

@indzman said:

@Maroxad said:

@indzman said:

Yes, it is me again, the man who actually has taste and standards. I like my games to be at least competent in one area or 2. Divinity Original Sin was, this wasn't.

Unmodded, Bethesda games are like a massive swimming pool of sewer water. Sure, you can pride yourself in its size, but that just means more sewage for you to swim through.

Not saying you got poor taste, you probably've played more rpg than me. BUT you nitpick on negetives too much on most games. Say if i'm wrong on this :P

In this case, he isn't wrong, Fallout 4 is a terrible game by just about any standard. It's poor by just about every metric except for when it comes to extensibility.

Really Dunno how you guys find FO 4 Terrible, its much improved upon Fallout 3 , New Vegas in every way. More action oriented and fun. Hell i'm enjoying it more over Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim lol.

Heh

Let's see:

• It is graphically extremely poor
• The writing is terrible
• The dialog system is poor, overly restrictive, redundant, and removes any semblance of true role playing
• The voice acting is lifeless, with no expression or inflection to convey the true tone of what is being said
• The leveling system is terrible, with no true flexibility offered in builds, and multiple skills and leveling paths that are redundant and pointless
• Quests are almost always 'go to Point A, follow trail to Point B, clear waves of enemies, come back to collect reward
• The companion system is half heartedly implemented- I spent fifty hours helping people and gained very little favor with Valentine, but then stole one little bolt by mistake and suddenly I'm a villain?

By literally no standard is Fallout 4 even a good game. It is at its very best very mediocre, and at its worst an outright bad game (which it is more often than not). And by no standard is it better than Morrowind, Skyrim, or even Oblivion (can't seak for the other Fallout games, because I haven't played those).

Sorry, but Fallout 4 is a terrible game. The fact that it came right after Witcher 3, which is a transcendental open world RPG experience, makes it seem even worse by comparison. Bethesda are five, ten years behind the curve now, and it shows.

I would call it the least schizophrenic game they have made in a long time, They tend to straddle that akward line of RPG/FPS/Stealth with systems that actively work against each other.

FO4 is way more shooter then RPG, For better or worse. it has WAY better action mechanics, but the RPG aspects are pretty damn horrible,

Ironically I thinkt FO4 has the best main story of a bethesda game, but the poorest execution.

If you had asked if it was the best Fallout game, I would have laughed, but you asked if it was the best Bethesda game, and Ironically I might agree. There are things done better in FO 3, and the world felt more like a wasteland, and less like a really colourful mad max is world (not a knock against it, fallout was in part inspired by mad max). But FO4 has sorted a lot of the basic mechanics, so as a game it is likely the better of them.

I am quite sad to see the departure of the majority of RPG mechanics and watering down of the rest, but this is better then Fo3 that did not really know what it wanted to be.

They really need to get Obsidian to do a New Vegas 2

That is still my favorite Fallout game out of all the Bethesda published ones.

Am I wrong though? THat is the important bit.

Charizard did a fairly decent job explaining just why this game is so flawed. Though I would like to emphasise the character system a bit. The FO4 perk system was terribly thought out. Because it completely replaced skills, and because of the nature of how they handled level ups... picking perks became a means to increase your damage, instead of picking genuinely fun perks that actually change how you play. You didnt pick perks which felt like actual perks, you picked damage boosters, because you would need those in order to keep up with the level scaling (which IS there). Compare this to New Vegas where you would pick perks based on your playstyle, to possibly give new options. There was no huge emphasis on maxing damage and survivability. Also, another problem came in the form of the level requierements on perks... these may have been a good idea in theory. But because of how the whole system was handled... it seriously limited specializaiton... soon enough, I found myself picking perks that had absolutely NOTHING to do with my character concept, but I merely picked them because I was locked out of the things that actually belonged on my character, because I didnt have enough experience.

Just think of it... it came out just right after Witcher 3, a game which supposedly (havent played) schooled FO4 quite badly in its design, making it look archaic by comparison.

And even there, it fared pretty poorly. And that was where the killing blow for Fallout 4 was for me. The toolkit was absolutely horrible and modders were not very pleased with how little moddability FO4 had.

I am playing a early access game called Rimworld right now and here are just some of the many mods I play with...

• Combat Realism: Completely overhauls the combat, and adds plenty of meat to the mechanics. Weight, bulk, suppression, ammo, ammo types and makes the combat significantly more lethal, a character who gets bursted on by an assault rifle... or worse, machinegun or even worse, minigun, is as good as dead.
• Improved Crafting: Completely remakes the tech tree.
• Seed Please: Adds seeds to the game, these seeds will be modifiable.
• New AI
• New Events
• Enough weapon mods to not only double the ammount of weapons... quite possibly they quintupled the ammount.
• Illegal substances
• New Factions
• New Skills and Activities
• Overhauled UI
• Overhauled Start
• New Tools

Sadly, Fallout 4's modding scene has been utterly dismal. With most mods being gimmicky with a few actual gameplay changers few and far inbetween. And even those gameplay changers are tiny compared to the Combat Realism mod I mentioned.

Even now the most compelling mod to be coming out is not a Fallout 4 mod. But a Skyrim mod called Enderal... which is essentially a new game.

As an RPG Fallout 4 is horrible. It has hardly anything to offer for someone looking for a RPG. Where it shines is when you just take it as a light shooter and you go out and explore the world they created, especially in survival mode, where it gives you a sense of a massive STALKER game but in the Fallout universe, which Bethesda also manages to screw here and there with things that make no sense with the lore. But still, it's an enjoyable game that I would still be playing if not for a few bugs that appeared on my survival run and eventually annoyed me enough to make me quit and outright uninstall the game. When Bethesda finally announces the end of support with their final patch/DLC I will happily give it a second chance some time later.

I think with Bethesda, your first is always best. Oblivion was the first one I played and it absolutely blew me away.

Now I can really only see the bad in their games. Skyrim was pretty fun with mods though.

I like it more than Fallout 3, but Skyrim is still the best Bethesda game if you ask me.

That is a sorry excuse of reasons Char, like literally probably the worst reasons why Fallout 4 sucks. I can see people hating Fallout 4 cause the lackluster faction quests it had compared to previous Bethesda games but other than that, I'm sorry but the ignorance is strong in that post

Graphics: No they are not... The graphics in Witcher 3 are some of the best for an open world game. And using mods as an argument? Stop making excuses. bethesda did a terrible job with the graphics and optimization. Some of the textures in FO4 were absolutely dreadful, and there were far less techniques used too.

Writing: Fallout: New Vegas actually had a somewhat coherrent world as far as RPGs are concerned, fleshed out and likeable characters and compelling factions. And the questions it asked, are still questions that can be found circulating in gaming communities today. It also actually treated the fallout universe well and with respect as opposed to taking a massive dump on it. Fallout 4's story was so bad, it became a topic of ridicule for months, and the way they handled the protagonist was terrible.

Dialogue: More excuses from you. The fact that other developers does it as well doesnt excuse the fact that it's implementation in FO4 was horrible... and indeed that is where I think the issue is. Fallout 4's dialogue wheel was terrible. With the answers being Yes, No (Yes), Ask a Question and a Snarky Yes. The way Witcher 3 handled dialogue was infinitely superior, with Geralt's response only changing a few words into synonyms. Whereas the godawful attempts in Bioware and FO4, had occationally the protagonist say something completely different than what was prompted. Utterly destroying immersion. And making roleplaying impossible.

Voice Acting: Once again, you are making excuses, failures of other games DO NOT and I repeat, DO NOT justify Fallout 4's failures.

Builds: First of all, you are incredibly wrong here. Builds would radically impact quests, options and what paths are available to you, even what rewards you get in Fallout. In fact, in some rare cases, a low stat in Fallout could be beneficial even. Second, lol at the TES example as builds meaning something. TES, has enabled the player to become a master fighter/thief/mage, and master every skill in the game. And Baldur's Gate... the attributes meant almost nothing in that game. And the attributes were pretty much just... 16 or 18 in CON, Max your main stat, rest goes to dex. Str so you can carry stuff. And all classes more or less did the same thing... kill stuff. Compared to Fallout where some builds are terrible at killing stuff.

Quests: I assume you didnt play Fallout 1 or 2 then... because those quests were about problem solving. Violence was sometimes a solution, but never the solution. You could clear quests without killing waves of enemies.

Companions: Obviously the point was that, the balance was out of whac. How one minor incident could completely override hours upon hours of good deeds. Is a sign of a terrible system.

What y ou have done so far is done nothing but provide excuses.

Fallout 4 is Bethesda's lowest scoring game, and lowest scoring TES game, on every critic aggregate. (Only comparing best versions [PC]).

Fallout 4 is Bethesda's lowest user average on every user aggregate, by a significant margin. There was a reason for both this and the above. Guess why. (It sucked).

It has a disproportionately low amount of mods/mod-traffic at Nexus even taking into account the late mod kit, mostly because of how bad it was. Like seriously, the mod selection is trash compared to Skyrim at this point. No one wants to mod for this junk game.

The settlement system is shit, and feels like a chore. GTFO minecraft.

Most of the quests are randomly generated (literally) Korean MMO stuff. Look at the list, it has like 1/4th the hand-made quests of NV and Skyrim.

The story sucks.

Too few weapons, most uniques are actually not uniques - unlike other Bethesda games. Fraction of NV's items. Gotta farm loot (legendary save scumming) like some lame ARPG rather than finding specially placed amazing items like other Bethesda games.

Looks like shit.

First Bethesda game to get obliterated in the same genre in the same exact year (Witcher 3) in both scores and awards, and public opinion. They usually stomp. This time they got stomped. Thanks allot Fallout 4.

I enjoyed Fallout 3 & Oblivion more...

Fallout 4 is a shit game, With terrible graphic, no story, useless quests, terrible settlement system and yeah a waste of money!

I loved Fallout 4, but The Elder Scrolls are still my favourite series.

It's fighting for the worst spot, that being said I don't think its a bad game, it's just not as good as the rest

So damn true

Dat necro thread

Same here, fallout 4 and oblivion are kinda steps back from fallout 3 and morrowind

SKYrim was fantastic though that's how they should try to match.

Even Oblivion and Fallout 3 are much better than Fallout 4. Oblivion wowed me, but over the years their bread and butter has been getting more stale.

Well it's definitely my favorite, from the settlement building to blowing off monster's heads to running around with a dog companion.

**** no. It has forgotten what an rpg actually is