Is being in 3rd place for MS the same as failing?

Read an article and wondered about MS.

Being in 3rd (or 4th) place is losing to those in first and second, but is being 3rd the same as failing? I think not.

Selling millions of units is not failing, as long as your net profit is in the black then it's not failing. I'm not sure if MS game division is in the black or not and really don't care, just tryna be a manticore.

When I think of failing I think of like........3DO, Wii U, Jaguar and (it hurts me to say it) Dreamcast. Those systems failed since they were never put out near as many games as they could have.

Xbox is definitely losing to PS4 and PC but i still don't think it's a failure, and with the moves they have been making with Game Pass and their adherence to a new business model I think they will be doing well in the future.

I like to think of myself as a manticore: i like my PC for my strategy games, PS4 for my exclusives and Xbone for multiplats, and will probably get a Switch when they finally release a more powerful model, (might settle for the one with longer battery life).

Can't we all just get along?

There is so much wrong with this topic...

but yes Xbox is definitely in 4th place.

As for the rest of your post...

"i like my PC for my strategy games...and Xbone for multiplats,"

And that's just one thing.

Smh, god speed buddy.

Is there any link showing the Xbox in 3rd or 4th place? No sure how it can be in 4th place when there are only three consoles and if you anyone argues because of PC then PC wins every generation. LOL.

That would depend on what MS aspirations were.

Nope. Just because you may not sell as much as your competitors doesn’t mean that you’re failing.

A Monopoly where every gamer is on a reoccurring monthly service and they are not required to invest in any AAA games, and simply leach off 3rd party support for free renewable income...duh

In other words, not too different from what they did this gen!

Hard to consider them a failure when they're profitable.

I think failure, just like what's good or bad, is all subjective. To figure out whether Xbox 1 is a failure or not you'd first have to know what their intent was. 40,000,000 units is honestly not that bad and they might be exactly where they want to be. They obviously arent't going anywhere since they're buying up studios left and right and clearly have the money to weather the storm that is this gen. I just hope they make some better games next gen that interest me because their hardware is phenomenal. I want them to be more open to Japanese games and RPG's

@boxrekt: I like to play strategy games with a M/KB while sitting upright in a computer chair at a desk.

I like to play multiplat non-strategy games in comfy chair on a big screen with a controller, and I prefer the Xbox UI to the PS4's (and 4k to non-4k).

Why are you always so toxic in every thread you appear in? How have you not been banned yet?

You are not up to date with tech then, all current gen consoles have poor HW. Next it will be better, even last gen had better tech for that time.

Phil Spencer said he wanted to sell 100 million consoles to me this is a failure to me personally as owner of the product its a fail

@boxrekt: Sure, as long as you convince yourself that Halo infinite, tomb raider, monster hunter world, metro exodus, gears 5 and fm4 aren't AAA games, then yes...Gamepass offers no AAA games.

What about my post makes it "toxic" to you?

You seem a little thin skinned, you do realize the board you're posting on right?

Maybe you should take this to the general discussion board if you're upset by light criticisms given toward your topic.

There were no exclusives worth playing this year for the PS4, so it has him on edge.

It's actually more than that, MS as a whole are out of touch with gamers and think everyone of us are just brainless sheep.

It far beyond 100 million they wanted to sell:

With the OG, $500, Spy-ware, Kinect always online, X1...

Xbox One sets sights on 400m sold, Xbox 360 aims for 100m

https://www.slashgear.com/xbox-one-sets-sights-on-400m-sold-xbox-360-aims-for-100m-24283466/

So when you guys hear MS talking about reaching 2Billion mystical gamers out there...

Remember M$'s expectations for the original $500, spy-ware, DRM always online, no shared games, Kinect Box one.

well it definitely isn't winning, but it seems pretty obvious they're pivoting to getting people to buy into their services/ecosystem across multiple platforms

Xbox brand as a whole is a massive failure and only exists today because Microsoft has so much money, they can eat billions of dollars of losses.

The original Xbox lost billions. Failure from day 1. Any normal company would have died from the money loss, but Microsoft is massive.

Xbox360 lost billions from RROD and warranties. Those 85 million xbox360’s sold was more like 30 million sold because everyone bought 2-3 Xbox360’s each. I bought 4 myself because of RROD lol

The xbone is their most successful console marketshare wise as the 40 Million is a much more legitimate number as hardware failure doesn’t seem to be an issue anymore.

However 40 million is still pathetic in today’s world and considered a failure.

3 gens in a row of failure and billions lost. They went from 25, to 30 to now 40 million legit marketshare.

The Xbox brand is growing slowly, but only in America and some parts of the UK. The rest of the world couldn’t care less about Xbox.

The next Xbox will struggle to reach 40 million next gen assuming Microsoft doesn’t just give up and shut the brand down and eat the money loss.

Honestly, it isn't. People are actually leaving the platform.

Since MS announced Play Anywhere in 2016 (Xbox was was estimated to be appox 30m). Since then MS has only managed to sell around 10 million more consoles divided by 3 years.

Ironically the only spike we see to sales from those 10 million additional consoles came from...INSTALLED users who already owned an Xbox One!

This came in the form of OG Kinect Xbox One owners swapping out that old unit and getting milked for the S or the X in 2017. No one else is buying Xbox One.

When the S released, X1 won like 3 NPDs then never topped the chart again.

Think to yourself how many xbox fanboys (who never changed sides) here scream the X NOW when in discussion? Weren't most of them were still arguing for xbox BEFORE Nov 2017? So that means virtually all of them double dipped to boost Xbox One numbers internally.

So, that small number of 30 million Xbox owners hasn't increased since 2016. The 10 million extra sells came from OG xbox one owners who upgraded to S or X.

Context. They technically finished 3rd in sales overall during the 360 generation, but they were certainly front-of-mind overall.

@boxrekt: You make an excellent point. Their fan base is probably still around 30 million like you said.

I forgot that most Xbone fanboys upgraded to an S or X which makes those first couple years of sales really pointless.

It seems the Xbox brands plateau is a 30 million fan base.

Making money is not failing. Not coming in first place is not failing. Despite what goes on in the gaming community and their lust for sales wars, making money is all that matters to these companies.

Maybe make better games next time to compete with Sony and Nintendo

@MarkoftheSivak:

Microsoft Surface sales are growing. Microsoft needs to promote Surface tablet gaming when Intel Ice-lake 11th gen tile render GPU arrives.

Microsoft's Windows (the original DirectX box) has open access when compared to GARDEN WALLED Apple iOS and Sony PS4.

Your argument is hypocritical.

The main reason for Xbox devices existence is Microsoft's disagreement against Intel's CPU bias cost structures within game console's price target. With Xbox, MS can set DRM hardware support and it's feature set.

Xbox = GPU bias cost structures.

The other Direct Xbox aka Windows 10 gaming PC dominates China and South Korea.

Xbox doesn't need to exist IF Intel IGP wasn't crap. Intel 11th gen IGP with IceLake APU would be Intel's 1st GPU to nearly rival XBO and rivals AMD RX Vega 8/10 IGP.

Being in 3rd place does not mean you are failing at all. Failing to release many exclusives does mean you are failing. So X-box failed this generation.

@Random_Matt: 200 million

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/microsofts-original-xbox-one-goal-was-to-sell-200-/1100-6444028/

I'd say that's a fail then.

If that is true, MS really did read the market wrong. I'll assume their media hub goal was seriously a dumb line of thought.

is there any actual hard data to back all that up?

I Would love to know how many have actually been sold it's all speculation. It's been a huge fail this generation without a doubt.

But Nintendo have shown you can comeback next generation.

Funny coming from a guy that just posted this:

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/anyone-in-support-of-insta-locks-for-fact-based-th-33464327/

Now he is here pulling shit out of his ass and stating them as facts.

Here is a fact. No one knows how many Xboxs have been sold. The only one that knows is Microsoft. The rest are estimates only until Microsoft releases those official numbers themselves.

I'm sure profit wise they'd rather be #1

There never is. LOL.

I don’t see them as failing, but I will always resent their attempt to take ownership away from gamers. They had a huge blow with the always online thing, and now they are being relatively successful with game pass.

Either way, I will simply continue to support GOG. They are the only ones I see now truly respecting ownership of games. They and Nintendo. Sony is in the middle and Microsoft is the worse offender.

As a stand alone product 10's of millions units sold is hard to sell as failure, however compared to the mind share and general brand association they enjoyed with the 360 it is a complete failure.

Short answer... No

Long answer... Noperzzzz. :P

Seems like you don't know the difference between a "THREAD" and a post lol.

I still stand by that thread's argument, but a few things.

My post here is an opinion I formed based on reasonable evidence I see, but you're right I can't verify it as fact. So you're free to either agree the connections I've put together or disregard them.

After all, my post was only one of the many side post comments made in the sea of general posts of the main thread.

lol but why are you linking a topic I made about "thread creation" when saying this?

Did you find a "thread" I made about my opinion here?

I mean, If I did you'd have a point!?

Disregarding the fact that you can't "lock" a post...

The problem with your argument is that you're trying to link 2 things that have no connection to each other and clumsily trying to establish a point based on that erroneous assumption.

@boxrekt said:

@Xabiss said:

@drlostrib said:

@boxrekt said:

Honestly, it isn't. People are actually leaving the platform.

Since MS announced Play Anywhere in 2016 (Xbox was was estimated to be appox 30m). Since then MS has only managed to sell around 10 million more consoles divided by 3 years.

Ironically the only spike we see to sales from those 10 million additional consoles came from...INSTALLED users who already owned an Xbox One!

This came in the form of OG Kinect Xbox One owners swapping out that old unit and getting milked for the S or the X in 2017. No one else is buying Xbox One.

When the S released, X1 won like 3 NPDs then never topped the chart again.

Think to yourself how many xbox fanboys (who never changed sides) here scream the X NOW when in discussion? Weren't most of them were still arguing for xbox BEFORE Nov 2017? So that means virtually all of them double dipped to boost Xbox One numbers internally.

So, that small number of 30 million Xbox owners hasn't increased since 2016. The 10 million extra sells came from OG xbox one owners who upgraded to S or X.

is there any actual hard data to back all that up?

Funny coming from a guy that just posted this:

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/anyone-in-support-of-insta-locks-for-fact-based-th-33464327/

Now he is here pulling shit out of his ass and stating them as facts.

Here is a fact. No one knows how many Xboxs have been sold. The only one that knows is Microsoft. The rest are estimates only until Microsoft releases those official numbers themselves.

Seems like you don't know the difference between a "THREAD" and a post lol.

I still stand by that thread's argument, but a few things.

My post here is an opinion I formed based on reasonable evidence I see, but you're right I can't verify it as fact. So you're free to either agree the connections I've put together or disregard them.

After all, my post was only one of the many side post comments made in the sea of general posts of the main thread.

lol but why are you linking a topic I made about "thread creation" when saying this?

Did you find a "thread" I made about my opinion here?

I mean, If I did you'd have a point!?

Disregarding the fact that you can't "lock" a post...

The problem with your argument is that you're trying to link 2 things that have no connection to each other and clumsily trying to establish a point based on that erroneous assumption.

Man you are so delusional it hurts. How you wrote your post, you wrote it as fact. I am not the only one to ask you to put a source. When you post something like that you need to back it up period. Just like when someone starts a new thread they need to back it up if the post warrants it, which you bitched about. Now you are ass hurt when someone ask you to put a source to you nonsense. So cry away!

All MS have cared about this generation is services and to be fair to them it has been a saving grace after their console sales tanked. They will definitely be hurting when compared to Sony numbers but we all know ms don't do numbers anymore.

Xbox One is definitely NOT failing. Yeah, it's losing to it's competitors, but not failing. It's said to have sold over 40 million units, and still has a bunch of games available for it, and still has a large userbase. Definitely not a a failure. Failures are the likes of the ones you mentioned.

@Pedro: Maybe the 3ds puts in 4th, I dunno? At any rate I don't think its a failure, the Wii u now that's a failure.

@vfighter: Maybe. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@thehig1 said:

@ronvalencia said:

The main reason for Xbox devices existence is Microsoft's disagreement against Intel's CPU bias cost structures within game console's price target. With Xbox, MS can set DRM hardware support and it's feature set.

Xbox = GPU bias cost structures.

The other Direct Xbox aka Windows 10 gaming PC dominates China and South Korea.

Xbox doesn't need to exist IF Intel IGP wasn't crap. Intel 11th gen IGP with IceLake APU would be Intel's 1st GPU to nearly rival XBO and rivals AMD RX Vega 8/10 IGP.

Xbox game consoles are built with GPU bias design with $399 to $499 price range.

Fully assembled Intel based office PC with $399 to $499 price range doesn't have MS's Xbox GPU performance target. Assembly labor cost has to be paid.

@ronvalencia: What!?!

Did they even been 2nd before?

Don't make me copy and paste his response.

When you had to get to 40 million systems by constant fire sales, game giveaways and constantly upgrading hardware, all the while undercutting said hardware sales by going multiplat... then HELL yeah you failed.

Funny how you don't bring up the fire sales and bundles with Spiderman. LOL.

Also "constantly upgrading hardware"? LMAO.

Pedro's so desperate to defend his precious fail box that he has to bring up Sony's holiday bundles to counter. ???? Jesus fucking H Christ!

For Xbox, everyday's a holiday bundle. Remember when Microsoft expected people to pay $500 for an Xbox One X once? Yeah, those days were brief.