I hate the fact that the new GOW shares more with dark souls than Bayonetta/Neir

I'm in between. I don't like the gameplay of the souls game but I don't like bayonetta or nier either. To me god of war was better than those three series by far. Still my favorite one is dragon's dogma, I can't remember an action game being as fun as that game.

@PSP107: Because literally nothing about it says garbage. It might not appeal to him, but the quality is undeniable.

He couldn't say it would flop, because that would have been an even worse comment based on the reception the game had received so far.

I get why the fans are salty, but I always felt the gameplay in GoW sucked when compared to similar games. I'm glad they're trying something new. It might end up sucking as well, but at least they're not spinning their wheels with that stagnant unsatisfying play from the previous titles.

This is a franchise built on spectacle and production values anyways and it doesn't look like you'll be losing that. It seems like they're embracing the things they're good at while losing the pretense of having a good combat system.

And of course this demo was more focussed on showing us some excellent presentation above all else. You can bet your ass the gameplay won't be that rudimentary from beginning to end. It'll probably just meet the older games halfway, and hopefully be better off for it.

@StrongBlackVine:

1st of all, are you two even fans of the series?

Criticism mentioned about the original GoW trilogy.

1. Kratos is a heartless pychopath

2. The story lacks soul

3. The fixed camera angles.

SSM fixes these things and people still bitch.

@AM-Gamer:

1. We knew that from the 1st game.

2. So does every video game story.

3. No comment yet.

"SSM fixes these things and people still bitch."

Why are you bitching by people's bitching?

I enjoyed 1-3, didn't play any of the others tho. Kratos being old, fat, and a parent looks lame. Straying so far away from the original formula will be a big gamble for the series.

Maybe put the crystal balls away for a bit, eh?

But the Souls games are good.

It would only mean an improvement for the GoW games.

OP is a strictly flash over substance kind of guy, you should hear his opinions on fighting games lol.

@Bigboi500: "Kratos being old, fat, and a parent looks lame. Straying so far away from the original formula will be a big gamble for the series."

And I agree so I don't get why people ripping others who are not impressed with what been presented so far.

@PSP107: Somewhat. I have played all the games including the portable ones except GOWIII and I plan to get the remastered version of that. Not a huge fan, but they are entertaining enough. This new direction is much more my style of game though.

@PSP107:

1. Yet people still complained

2. That's absolutely not true

3. Well there trying something new

I'm not bitching , this is system Wars.

Why are you bitching ?

Whether they stuck with the old formula or not would not have made a lick of difference to me I enjoyed the GOW games. The people who demanded change should not be complaining as they have changed and if you don't like it well don't demand change if you don't like the results. "Damned if you do, damned if you don't'

At least the OP isn't calling it a TLOU knock-off like some folks were. Because apparently anything with... woods? a child in it? is a TLOU knock-off now

Admit it. Its TLOU with vikings.

On topic I can see why they changed direction. On a gameplay scale, it was trumped by Nier and Bayonetta. It would look like a half hearted attempt at what Platinum does best. But by taking it in this direction, they can expand on things that GoW doesn't do which is character development. At the very least, they can say they did something new.

I will say this though. If combos are gone then its going to be a bad game for me. The best parts of action games is figuring out how the system works and then learning the best way to take advantage of the system for the situation you find yourself in. If it doesn't have any of that then it'll be a pass for a lot of action fans.

In terms of production value? Sure

In terms of anything that has to do with game mechanics or its story? None of that is devoid of criticism. The argument of "we've barely seen any of it" works both ways, because the praise would be unjustified as well. And no metascore would change the part where God of War's story from God of War 2 and 3 has been fucking stupid, even the devs acknowledged how one dimensional of a character they had in Kratos. Mechanically? Anyone worth their salt in this genre has routinely called out or criticized that God of War's combat mechanics are shallow, the easiest systems the genre has to offer, and pure game feel wise are feathery in comparison to a lot of God of War's contemporaries.

It's commercial status has as much to do with its status as the Call of Duty the genre, much less some undeniable quality. But those are things you find out when you actually play video games, and aren't ignorant of them.

Yep. New mythology should have brought new protagonist. Its just stupid imo. Son of Zeus in Scandinavia with the Norse now.

Combat shown smelled. It was roll in chop troll, roll back to avoid aoe attack, roll in and repeat with a plain Jane axe. I did that in Fable to Trolls a decade ago

Now we have TLOU type relationship thrust in. Going to milk this deep, emotional third person stuff for a while I see. I was rooting for the troll to eat the kid.

I am all for changes but there are glaring dumb crap here. It sucked

So it will be a mediocre game. Loved GoW

Good call. It just was weak and to read it is still Kratos is stupid

Let's not pretend that Kratos was really anything at all by the middle of the second game. He wasn't a scumbag, or an avatar of anger, or anything. He was maybe a teenager with daddy issues.

You can have scumbags as good characters. Grand Theft Auto is the most commercial example. Kratos was not that.

@ConanTheStoner: Yo Cobro, remember we tried a God of War that wanted to make the combat not shit. We got Ascension.

I feel like I'm the only one who wasn't necessarily seeing what was wrong with God of War not going for the deepest combo system. It was easy to understand, visceral, and felt good. It was learning your shapes in kindergarten compared to a college course like high level Bayonetta play, but it did what it wanted to well.

All this to say, I'm also glad they're throwing out the old combat. Hell I don't know why they feel they needed to stick with the old Kratos. If you're gonna reboot, go all in. Probably could have built an even more compelling character without the baggage of being garbage for most of his other games.

Admittedly, I've never played Ascension. Was the combat good?

It's not the simplicity of GoW that puts me off though. I'm a dude who likes Nintendo staples like Mario and Zelda. I'm currently enjoying a replay of Shovel Knight. Doom 4 fucking rocks and it's as simple as it gets. I'd even argue that Bloodborne, as much as I love the combat in that game, is still more simple than what GoW brings the table.

My issue is with the game feel in general. On the most surface level, hacking through hordes of enemies feels like slashing at a pillow with a butter knife. But the problems go beyond immediate feedback. NG, DMC, Bayo, all of these games have a distinct rhythm to call their own. A cadence to their battle systems that flows so well, yet punishes you dearly for falling out of line. The element of risk and reward is constantly at play and everything in your tool box has a time and place in battle. Ultimately it leads to a very rewarding experience as you continually work towards mastering the games rules and subtleties. I just don't get that feeling with the GoW games. The timing and choice of my inputs doesn't feel important. It usually feels like autopilot mode. I know that 9 times out of 10 I can just mash buttons to get by and as a result it never feels satisfying. You unlock all these flashy combos but when it comes down to it you don't even need to learn half of them. It's not just about Kratos either, the enemies feed directly into these issues. They're sluggish punching bags that might tickle you for making a mistake. It's not that I want it to be a brutally difficult game. I just want a sense of rhythm that keeps you on your toes. The typical response is "well, just increase the difficulty!" and trust me, I do, but it doesn't overwrite how the core game works.

God of War feels like something that was intentionally designed for people who just want to wind down after a long days work. You can put in minimal effort and get an epic showing in return. Nothing wrong with that I suppose. But when it comes to this genre I want something more involving. Something with addictive systems to master that will bring me back for plenty of replays over the years.

I saw someone say it before, that God of War is to its genre as old school Mortal Kombat was to the fighter genre. And I think it's a great comparison. It's brutal, it's over the top, it looks amazing, and it's super easy to get into. So obviously people love it. But I'd still much rather have my Super Street Fighter 2 (NGB/Bayo/DMC,etc)

Ah, that's the word I was looking for.

@ConanTheStoner: That is a good analogy.

I suppose I just have a different take on the game feel. When you're powered up by early-mid game, it just flows pretty much regardless of what you press. Sure, not a ton of skill and more flash than substance, but it was what it was.

Ascension kind of ruined what little flow the combat had by basically locking the back end of most combos behind a combo multiplier minimum. Combine with cheap enemy design that makes it unreasonably hard to keep the combos going, it was like playing most of the game with the level 1 blades. Everything just got choppy and annoying.

I kinda agree.

The gameplay was top notch in God Of War. Even if I love (norse) mythology I really don't want this slow Dark Souls crap in a God of War game.

It was one of the most exciting PS4 titles for me before E3, now it's one of the least exciting titles.

...

That sounds like shite. I mean, it's a concept worth exploring I suppose, but you'd think they would have left it on the cutting room floor.

I'm just imagining how shitty such a design choice would be if applied to something like NGB. You go to pull off a combo that you know by heart, but oops! Your combo multiplier wasn't quite there. #rekt

Gross lol.

Anyways though, I am actually looking forward to the next GoW footage. I'm thinking with the big reveal out the way they'll likely show us the meat of the gameplay. They probably want to, considering the divisive reactions, and I have a feeling that a lot of fans concerns will be alleviated.

Only half way through number 3. Its decent but doubt i will be going back for more.

Cory has said they haven't skimped out on combat, puzzles and large enemies. I trust the guy.

From what we know, we saw a 'Tutorial' portion of the game, designed to show the different direction the franchise is taking since everyone harped on about GoW being tired and old, Kratos full of rage 24/7 etc etc. I personally aren't fully on board with the new direction, or at least I need to see a lot more to be 100% convinced, it looks cool but I was definitely expecting a PS4 version of GoW 3 or Acn because those games on PS3 looked and played awesome, knowing full well what the PS4 is capable of.

One thing I was worried about is the grandiose depiction of scale that always baffled me in GoW:

as with this new camera angle we're not going to be getting these types of views any more.

Luckily, Barlog has stated that the troll mini boss in the E3 gameplay is a 'regular' enemy....so damn!

To me the new God Of War as more in common with Uncharted and TLOU than Dark Souls ... yes Dark Souls is slow and brutal ... but so far from what we saw is more cinematic and "emotional" which is like TLOU. I fear the combat part of the game will be clunky just like in TLOU

@misterpmedia: All your post did was make me want a "real" sequel to the gow games, almost forgot how epic they were with scale and badass enemies/bosses!

The God of War games always kinda sucked though. They have great presentations, but that alone can't cover up just how shallow the combat is, and how uncreative the experience ultimately becomes. My problems are much less to do with Kratos and more to do with the gameplay, although I find it pretty strange on how they're trying to craft a redemption tale out of an irredeemable character. Seems like a very forced decision.

@AM-Gamer:

1. Yet people still complained

2. That's absolutely not true

3. Well there trying something new

I'm not bitching , this is system Wars.

Why are you bitching ?

lol@ trying to spin it.

@StrongBlackVine:"This new direction is much more my style of game though."

Then can I argue that you shouldn't rip true fans of the series.

ITT: People who don't grasp the criticisms of Kratos

We love a genre that gave us Bayonetta and Dante, as the genres best examples of characters. We love cheese and something that isn't super serious, Kratos fucking sucks, because that story itself seriously and takes Kratos the anger ball seriously. It tries to make him empathetic, but you have to accept that this idiot was told 3 times to not be a dick wagon, and says **** it, I"m gonna be a dick wagon...and then proceeds to kill his own family. But okay lets meet half way and accept the original plol is a greek tragedy, even I would agree those staples are handled very well.

The sequels are much better games (because lolvideogamestories), but the character is like extra dumb in those stories. Kratos once against told "don't be a dick", by Athena, gets told by Zeus quit being a dick. He then proceeds to get punished for being a dick. Then climbs out of hell wondering why he got punished for being a dick. Proceeds to then wreck the planet in his infinite dickdom, and then the story says Zeus is the one that went insane, Pandora the fucking plot device and the box put hope inside of Kratos.

So you're stuck with this character who is one fucking note: I'm angry, all the time. Except you've had no real reason to see things from his point of view other than you shut your brain off, and then proceeds to slaughter the gods, only for the game not even not even go all in on his anti-hero/villain status, because he's not even that, he's never fucking presented as that. They actually try to redeem that son of a bitch with a plot line that is mind bendingly stupid.

Which that's supposed to be this franchises calling card, in this franchise with a lot of cheesy stories, God of War is the classy one with the story. Except it sucks, it's infinitely more stupid.

This isn't going to be one of those "well that not my interpretation"..no **** you, you're apologizing for bad writing. Fucking gamers.

That doesn't even get into pettier shit, like the decade of Kratos status as a fucking badass....he has a bleeding vagina for 3 games, what badass? He's a bitch.

As far the gameplay shift, God of War was never mechanically all that satisfying, but this new one looks really slow, and really sluggish. It's not that the fixed camera is gone, it's that they went with the camera similar to how The Last of Us does it. As in not on his shoulder, but more or less on his back. That might work for what is more or less a cover shooter, where you crouch walk a lot, but in a 3d beat em up? There is a reason we've been using Ocarina's camera style for ages, especially in Souls stuff, and there is a reason the camera has been things like what NG and Bayonetta have with a quick camera reset for when things get hectic.

@jg4xchamp:

Wait, are you ripping God of War's story and Kratos but praising Dante and the DMC story arc?

Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha

Devil May Cry is stupid, and it indulges you in it. It's the opposite of pretentious, it's a self aware cheesefest and I wouldn't have it any other way. Dante's actually fun in his cheese (Fill your heart with light cheese not withstanding), and it's a better game for it. Devil May Cry and its ilk are more like Commando or Robocop. God of War is fucking Transformers.

Although if we're going all in on the narrative direction stuff. Viewtiful Joe and The Wonderful 101 are the best of the bunch in that regard, also more into cheese, but that much more endearing.

@jg4xchamp: "Devil May Cry and its ilk are more like Commando or Robocop."

Now this just beyond laughable =(