@Maroxad: Very interesting. I can't imagine them trying to teach what I just read in your post in grade school 😂. It's a cool topic though. I have no doubt some people really do have this condition. I can't put myself in their shoes about how they feel. But if I felt like a woman trapped in a man's body, I think I'd be ok with that. I'd probably be gay at that point, if I really did feel like a woman though. My hope for children that have this illness(?) is they get help at a young age. Not making them feel bad about themselves but also helping them realize something isn't right. As for adults, they can do whatever. But they need to realize some of us aren't going to accept that as normal and in reality, are probably going to get weird looks, etc.
@Maroxad: Very interesting. I can't imagine them trying to teach what I just read in your post in grade school 😂. It's a cool topic though. I have no doubt some people really do have this condition. I can't put myself in their shoes about how they feel. But if I felt like a woman trapped in a man's body, I think I'd be ok with that. I'd probably be gay at that point, if I really did feel like a woman though. My hope for children that have this illness(?) is they get help at a young age. Not making them feel bad about themselves but also helping them realize something isn't right. As for adults, they can do whatever. But they need to realize some of us aren't going to accept that as normal and in reality, are probably going to get weird looks, etc.
I agree with you on this. I am cis myself, but it is hard to imagine what it would be like to be trans. And I hope everyone gets the best available treatment, no matter what it is.
And yeah, this is not gonna be taught in grade school. Everything I said is pretty much at uni level :) The genetics I mentioned for instance, was taught to one of my raiding buddies in Med School. So yeah, it is pretty advanced stuff.
@LJS9502_basic: The drag shows don't bother me as long as there's an age limit. Not sure if you've seen any, but it's definitely an 18+ event. Just like strip clubs don't bother me. Adults can adult. This whole drag queen story hour thing is beyond weird though.
No contradictions at all. And your christianity argument does not hold up. Evangelicalism are a movement within Christianity. Drag however, can and has existed outside the LGBT community. In fact, it predates the formalization of the LGBT community by centuries. Let me help you understand with this venn diagram,
I literally quoted you. And it is not just me pointing out your dismal reading comprehension skills, virtually everyone in both on PG and System Wars are doing it.
Democrats are mostly focusing on infrastructure. The worst example of identity politics among prominent left wing politicians was Hillary Clinton, and as we both know, she lost.
The keyword there is female. I already cited medical papers showing that the 'female' in there is determined primarily by gender identity. No contradictions at all. As for the changing language. From your own source:
In other words, languages evolve and the linguists who work on this adapted their definition to adjust to how language is being used. Do you ever get tired of owning yourself?
There is no evidence of there being conflicts of interests here. If there were likely conflicts of interests we wouldn't be finding overwhelming evidence across multiple disciplines coming to the same conclusion. As usual you provide conspiracy theories when virtually all evidence contradicts you. Intellecutally honest people base their positions on available evidence. Liars and cowards such as yourself however, start with the conclusions and try to desperately find evidence to support them. And when they don't make up excuses as to why.
PS: this thread has not reflected well on you at all. You have demonstrated once again to work on mental gymnastics. And the only person arguing with me here is you. Meanwhile, at least 3 people here have been arguing with you.
It would be nice if you posted a chart that was actually relevant. I said evangelicals and conservatives. Not evangelicals and Christians. Remember that reading comprehension thing? Talking about drag communities from the past is irrelevant. We're talking about right now. Christians didn't always lean republican either. Communties change and now and there us far more overlap then then your chart suggests.
No it's not. It's three far left posters who can't define basic terms and one person in system roles who never actually bothers to make a point. Again you just botched what I saud and I'm calling you out on it. Own up to it and move in.
No they're not. They focus on unreliable green energy, culture war bullshit and DEI programs.
How did I own myself 🤣. They literally caved and changed the defenition last year. That's exactly what I said they did.
No evidence? Or you familiar with the twerm " research bias"?
@LJS9502_basic: The drag shows don't bother me as long as there's an age limit. Not sure if you've seen any, but it's definitely an 18+ event. Just like strip clubs don't bother me. Adults can adult. This whole drag queen story hour thing is beyond weird though.
Nope. Never saw one. But if we're saying parents should have the right to raise their child, and enough Governors are doing so then the Government should stick to that. Can't have it both ways is all I'm saying.
The Drag stuff Silent is linking is something I *do* criticize by proxy. Fashion shows and hte likes should have their participants be 18+. This includes Drag Shows.
Drag Queen Story hour is fine as long as they keep it age appropriate. Here is a picture of Bugs Bunny from the 50's. Heralded as one of the best animated episodes of all time.
@Maroxad: To be fair gender and sex used to be used interchangeably. Which is where the arguments tend to be based on I think.
Depends. But you aren't wrong.
In the west, since the medieval era, we have primarily used them interchangeably. However, if we look outside the west, whether it is India, Palestine, Americas, Hawaii among others. More genders than 2 have been recognized.
@silentchief said:
Your entire argument is based off contradictions and you are making an absolute fool out if yourself. I'll say this one last time. The Drag community is a part of the LGBTQ community. It's no different then saying an attack on evangelicals is an attack on conservatives eventhough not all evangelicals are conservative. Your ability to link the basics here is abysmal.
No that's not at all what I said. This is that reading comprehension issue you have that you like to project onto others. Giving birth is in fact a characteristic of a women. A Trans women could " NEVER do that. That doesn't mean a women who is infertile is trans.
Depends on what culture war you're talking about. Republicans need to fight woke culture as the left has gone full on insane. I do not think it is wise to take on abortion as it's been a point of contention for 50 years. They should come up with a common sense middle ground and move on. But don't confuse abortion with all of the other batshit insanity the left pushes.
No they aren't and you contradicted yourself again. " An adult human female". See how sex is intrinsically linked with gender?
I'm not spreading conspiracy theories, this is a verifiable fact. I know I can't change your mind but what I've done is even better. I got most of this forum to see you are exactly what i said you were.
You don't even no how studies are funded which makes this more embarrassing. You actually think this is based off sound science and all I have to do to make you sound dumber is let you keep talking. Studies are funded by interest groups who pay people to find what they want to. Gender reassignment surgery is a 1.9 billion dollar industry and growing. You are such a sheep and honestly I would feel bad for you but the problem is people like you are actually dangerous.
No contradictions at all. And your christianity argument does not hold up. Evangelicalism are a movement within Christianity. Drag however, can and has existed outside the LGBT community. In fact, it predates the formalization of the LGBT community by centuries. Let me help you understand with this venn diagram,
I literally quoted you. And it is not just me pointing out your dismal reading comprehension skills, virtually everyone in both on PG and System Wars are doing it.
Democrats are mostly focusing on infrastructure. The worst example of identity politics among prominent left wing politicians was Hillary Clinton, and as we both know, she lost.
The keyword there is female. I already cited medical papers showing that the 'female' in there is determined primarily by gender identity. No contradictions at all. As for the changing language. From your own source:
The Cambridge Dictionary recently updated its entries for “man” and “woman” to include transgender people – the latest dictionary to broaden its lexicon to reflect evolving language around gender.
...
“(Our editors) carefully studied usage patterns of the word woman and concluded that this definition is one that learners of English should be aware of to support their understanding of how the language is used,” a Cambridge Dictionary spokesperson said in a statement to CNN. “The first definition at the entry for woman remains unchanged and continues to be ‘an adult female human being’.”
In other words, languages evolve and the linguists who work on this adapted their definition to adjust to how language is being used. Do you ever get tired of owning yourself?
There is no evidence of there being conflicts of interests here. If there were likely conflicts of interests we wouldn't be finding overwhelming evidence across multiple disciplines coming to the same conclusion. As usual you provide conspiracy theories when virtually all evidence contradicts you. Intellecutally honest people base their positions on available evidence. Liars and cowards such as yourself however, start with the conclusions and try to desperately find evidence to support them. And when they don't make up excuses as to why.
PS: I have not been exposed in this thread at all. I am the one citing data and medical papers. You are the one jumping mental hoops to justify your false conclusions.
It would be nice if you posted a chart that was actually relevant. I said evangelicals and conservatives. Not evangelicals and Christians. Remember that reading comprehension thing? Talking about drag communities from the past is irrelevant. We're talking about right now. Christians didn't always lean republican either. Communties change and now and there is far more overlap then your chart suggests.
No it's not. It's three far left posters who can't define basic terms and one person in system wars who never actually bothers to make a point. Again you just botched what I said and I'm calling you out on it. Own up to it and move in. If you didn't keep doing it I'd stop calling you out on it.
No they're not. They focus on unreliable green energy, culture war bullshit and DEI programs.
How did I own myself 🤣. They literally caved and changed the defenition last year. That's exactly what I said they did.
No evidence? Surely you know about Research bias. So wouldn't you want to know who funds the studies you give so much credibility to? Let me help you.
Every single one of those organizations are overtly progressive. It's like having a tobacco company fund a study on cigarettes.
Lol you have been exposed. Your response to another poster who was calling out your batshit insanity was to use zoology to justify your response. You compared humans to reptiles and seahorses. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds? The fact you can't use other mammals is telling and shows how dumb your logic actually is. You have multiple people in this thread arguing against you. Of the three Im arguing with which it includes you ( one wants to talk about the economy because he's to embarrassed to defend your position). The other is trying to downplay what's happening.
It would be nice if you posted a chart that was actually relevant. I said evangelicals and conservatives. Not evangelicals and Christians. Remember that reading comprehension thing? Talking about drag communities from the past is irrelevant. We're talking about right now. Christians didn't always lean republican either. Communties change and now and there us far more overlap then then your chart suggests.
No it's not. It's three far left posters who can't define basic terms and one person in system roles who never actually bothers to make a point. Again you just botched what I saud and I'm calling you out on it. Own up to it and move in.
No they're not. They focus on unreliable green energy, culture war bullshit and DEI programs.
How did I own myself 🤣. They literally caved and changed the defenition last year. That's exactly what I said they did.
No evidence? Or you familiar with the twerm " research bias"?
That is a diagram, not a chart. And the venn diagram to the left is entirely relevant. Because as has REPATEDLY been stated. You can be a part of the LGBT community without being drag, you can be drag withouyt being a part of the LGBT community. One does not necessarily mean the other. LGBT contains sexualities and gender identity groups, drag is neither. How is this so hard for you to comprehend?
Classic, rationalization when everyone turns against you. Less excuses, more owning up might help you. You can be respected while still being right wing. Because, although we disagreed, they were intellectually honest. So we could have productive conversations with them. You on the other hand, not so much.
You said it had to do with letting the "inmates running the asylum" (I don't think you know what that phrase means). Linguists are doing as they always have. They observe how words are used and update definitions to match this usage. Just because the updated definition doesnt suit your biases, doesnt mean it is invalid. You are arguing with the dictionary and it is absolutely hilarious.
You would need to prove there is a bias in teh first place. The ammount of money involved in gender affirming care is trivial compared to tobacco, meat and fossil fuels. Yet, we see overwhelming research criticizing tobacco, overconsumption of meat and climate change+pollution.
Edit: Regarding the nonsense you added afterwards. The only person here calling me out is you. Nice try though. And a general rule in sciences is that the simplest system is the best, we call this Occam's razor. And doesnt need to be backed by conspiracy theories and mental gymnastics to justify itself. Just base it on contemporary evidence.
@Maroxad: That diagram has no validity behind it and again you completely botched your argument. Same way people link Christians and conservatives. It simply underestimates the overlap. That's my issue and something you seem to be struggling with. The overlap is far greater then you realize.
It's literally the same posters it always is. Not a single poster has turned against me. You don't even know what that term means. To turn against you they would have had to share your viewpoint at some point. The ones arguing with me never did.
I can't think of any right wing posters that you have showed any respect to" not that there's many left on this forum". Other than the one mod that leans right and that's about it. Every other right leaning poster you treat the same although I notice most won't even engage with you any longer and I can't blame them.
It isn't used that way among everyone. If you honestly think there was no pressure from organizations to change it I don't know what to tell you.
I proved there was bias in my edit that you called " nonsense ". I linked the organizations who fund the studies and did research on the organizations. Something any intellectually honestly person should do. Tobacco at one time was deemed safe and even healthy by Physicians. It wasn't until nearly 30 years later( the 90's) when independent research linked the health issues with smoking. This is a similar issue with trans research. Gender reaffirming care and hormone therapy has exploded the past few years and we do not have research to back up it's safety. This is something that we won't know the outcome of for years and the current generation of children will be the test rats.
Yes, a poster did in fact call you out and the posters arguing against me are to embarrassed to defend your position. Next time when you use zoology to compare humans maybe at least try to stick to mammals. You won't do that though because it will destroy your argument.
@Maroxad: That diagram has no validity behind it and again you completely botched your argument. Same way people link Christians and conservatives. It simply underestimates the overlap. That's my issue and something you seem to be struggling with. The overlap is far greater then you realize.
Not everyone is turning against me. It's literally the same posters it always is. Not a single poster has turned against me. You don't even know what that term means. To turn against you they would have had to share your viewpoint at some point. The ones arguing with me never did.
I can't think of any right wing posters that you have showed any respect to" not that there's many left on this forum". Other than the one mod that leans right and that's about it.
It isn't used that way among everyone. If you honestly think there was no pressure from organizations to change it I don't know what to tell you.
I proved there was bias in my edit that you called " nonsense ". I linked the organizations who fund the studies and did research on the organizations. Something any intellectually honestly person should do. Tobacco at one time was deemed safe and even healthy by Physicians. It wasn't until nearly 30 years later( the 90's) when independent research linked the health issues with smoking. This is a similar issue with trans research. Gender reaffirming care and hormone therapy has exploded the past few years and we do not have research to back up it's safety. This is something that we won't know the outcome of for years and the current generation of children will be the test rats.
Yes, a poster did in fact call you out and the posters arguing against me are to embarrassed to defend your position.
It does. It basically explains the error in your reasoning. Had the diagram been like the one to the right, then you would have had a point. However, the fact that there are people who fall outside the LGBT criteria while also being drag queens, shows that Drag is not LGBT. No matter how much you insist otherwise. At most you can argue that Drag is a part of LGBT culture. But so are Sylveons and Blåhajs.
YOu are constantly being called out both here and on System Wars. Don't try to lie. As for respected right wingers, there have been plenty who were respectred, including bmanva who were respected when they posted here.
As usual you provide nothing but unsubstantiated conspiracy theories. I have been citing a myriad papers itt, and you still have nothing more to offer than conspiracy theories. Doi you realize just how badly you have botched your own position? You are arguing against facts with nothing more than feelings.
Get a better argument. Or adjust your positions, if you are still responding with unsubstantiated conspiracy theories, I see no reason to continue this conversation.
@Maroxad: That diagram has no validity behind it and again you completely botched your argument. Same way people link Christians and conservatives. It simply underestimates the overlap. That's my issue and something you seem to be struggling with. The overlap is far greater then you realize.
Not everyone is turning against me. It's literally the same posters it always is. Not a single poster has turned against me. You don't even know what that term means. To turn against you they would have had to share your viewpoint at some point. The ones arguing with me never did.
I can't think of any right wing posters that you have showed any respect to" not that there's many left on this forum". Other than the one mod that leans right and that's about it.
It isn't used that way among everyone. If you honestly think there was no pressure from organizations to change it I don't know what to tell you.
I proved there was bias in my edit that you called " nonsense ". I linked the organizations who fund the studies and did research on the organizations. Something any intellectually honestly person should do. Tobacco at one time was deemed safe and even healthy by Physicians. It wasn't until nearly 30 years later( the 90's) when independent research linked the health issues with smoking. This is a similar issue with trans research. Gender reaffirming care and hormone therapy has exploded the past few years and we do not have research to back up it's safety. This is something that we won't know the outcome of for years and the current generation of children will be the test rats.
Yes, a poster did in fact call you out and the posters arguing against me are to embarrassed to defend your position.
It does. It basically explains the error in your reasoning. Had the diagram been like the one to the right, then you would have had a point. However, the fact that there are people who fall outside the LGBT criteria while also being drag queens, shows that Drag is not LGBT. No matter how much you insist otherwise.
YOu are constantly being called out both here and on System Wars. Don't try to lie. As for respected right wingers, there have been plenty who were respectred, including bmanva who were respected when they posted here.
As usual you provide nothing but unsubstantiated conspiracy theories. I have been citing a myriad papers itt, and you still have nothing more to offer than conspiracy theories. Doi you realize just how badly you have botched your own position? You are arguing against facts with nothing more than feelings.
Get a better argument. Or adjust your positions, if you are still responding with unsubstantiated conspiracy theories, I see no reason to continue this conversation.
PS: No, the only person calling me out is you.
It's not my reasoning it's the reality.. The media for an example views " banning children from dragshows" as an attack on the LGBTQ community. Any attack on drag is considered an attack on the " LGBTQ " community. I didn't make this up it's just how it is. Perhaps you should be upset at media for doing as such.
They're are ultimately two things that dictate what side you're on in this forum. Political leanings and gaming platform. I am a right wing gamer with a preference for Playstation. The vast majority of the forum are left leaning PC gamers.( like you) No Playstation gamers call me out on system wars just like no right wing posters call me out in Political gamers. Regardless , you naming one right wing poster I've never seen on this forum doesn't help your argument. You do the same shit with Eoten and SargentD. The only difference is they don't engage with you anymore.
Again what are your facts? I'm not the one comparing humans to seahorses to help my ridiculous argument. You want me to cite a study thst proves you wrong? There are no independent studies on the issue. The top fund for Trans studies is Open source foundation. If you don't see a conflict of interest there then there is no reason to continue this conversation.
Nah JohnMeyer called you out. The rest of the thread won't even defend your position.
It's not my reasoning it's the reality.. The media for an example views " banning children from dragshows" as an attack on the LGBTQ community. Any attack on drag is considered an attack on the " LGBTQ " community. I didn't make this up it's just how it is. Perhaps you should be upset at media for doing as such.
They're are ultimately two things that dictate what side you're on in this forum. Political leanings and gaming platform. I am a right wing gamer with a preference for Playstation. The vast majority of the forum are left leaning PC gamers.( like you) No Playstation gamers call me out on system wars just like no right wing posters call me out in Political gamers. Regardless , you naming one right wing poster I've never seen on this forum doesn't help your argument. You do the same shit with Eoten and SargentD. The only difference is they don't engage with you anymore.
Again what are your facts? I'm not the one comparing humans to seahorses to help my ridiculous argument. You want me to cite a study thst proves you wrong? There are no independent studies on the issue. The top fund for Trans studies is Open source foundation. If you don't see a conflict of interest there then there is no reason to continue this conversation.
Nah JohnMeyer called you out. The rest of the thread won't even defend your position.
Once again, those bills, as currently worded, will do a lot more than just affect drag shows.
Looking at everything from sides again... smh. Most gamers nowadays dont side with a platform. If you pay attention you will see that a lot of gamers on the SW board, play on multiple platforms, myself included. Hell, you have seen me several times defend the Xbox. Eoten doesnt post here anymore, and I dont call out SargentD. I only correct him when he gets something wrong. In fact, SargentD literally replied to me yesterday.
I cited myriad different studies which show that gender isnt as simple as you think it is. I cited so many papers against you. And all you did was ignore them. And your sources are primarily linked to political action not scientific research. Worse yet, that George Soros link, is a big yikesy moment in regards to you. In fact, looking at any of the papers I didnt find a single one funded by that political comittee. So your argument once again... falls flat.
JoshRMeyer didnt call me out, try again. He asked me a question, I answered it, and we found common ground.
While I didn't address this in my previous post. What happened in the 50's was that there was a growing consensus among medical experts that tobacco had serious detrimental health effects. So the tobacco industry bribed whoever they could, to promote pro-tobacco propaganda. The actual consensus in academic circles was quite the opposite of being pro-tobacco. This is why the incident reached such levels of infamy. What we are seeing with research on trans folk is the opposite. It is the scientific consensus. Further research provides further positive evidence for the biological nature of gender identities. And the positions are based not on what doctors are saying, but what they are demonstrating.
Your debate tactics are the exact same used by creatiionists. rather than providing negative or positive evidence, you... try to sow doubt.
It's not my reasoning it's the reality.. The media for an example views " banning children from dragshows" as an attack on the LGBTQ community. Any attack on drag is considered an attack on the " LGBTQ " community. I didn't make this up it's just how it is. Perhaps you should be upset at media for doing as such.
They're are ultimately two things that dictate what side you're on in this forum. Political leanings and gaming platform. I am a right wing gamer with a preference for Playstation. The vast majority of the forum are left leaning PC gamers.( like you) No Playstation gamers call me out on system wars just like no right wing posters call me out in Political gamers. Regardless , you naming one right wing poster I've never seen on this forum doesn't help your argument. You do the same shit with Eoten and SargentD. The only difference is they don't engage with you anymore.
Again what are your facts? I'm not the one comparing humans to seahorses to help my ridiculous argument. You want me to cite a study thst proves you wrong? There are no independent studies on the issue. The top fund for Trans studies is Open source foundation. If you don't see a conflict of interest there then there is no reason to continue this conversation.
Nah JohnMeyer called you out. The rest of the thread won't even defend your position.
Once again, those bills, as currently worded, will do a lot more than just affect drag shows.
Looking at everything from sides again... smh. Most gamers nowadays dont side with a platform. If you pay attention you will see that a lot of gamers on the SW board, play on multiple platforms, myself included. Hell, you have seen me several times defend the Xbox. Eoten doesnt post here anymore, and I dont call out SargentD. I only correct him when he gets something wrong. In fact, SargentD literally replied to me yesterday.
I cited myriad different studies which show that gender isnt as simple as you think it is. I cited so many papers against you. And all you did was ignore them. And your sources are primarily linked to political action not scientific research. Worse yet, that George Soros link, is a big yikesy moment in regards to you. In fact, looking at any of the papers I didnt find a single one funded by that political comittee. So your argument once again... falls flat.
JoshRMeyer didnt call me out, try again. He asked me a question, I answered it, and we came to an agreement.
While I didn't address this in my previous post. What happened in the 50's was that there was a growing consensus among medical experts that tobacco had serious detrimental health effects. So the tobacco industry bribed whoever they could, to promote pro-tobacco propaganda. The actual consensus in academic circles was quite the opposite of being pro-tobacco. This is why the incident reached such levels of infamy.
The fact of the matter is, you are still spreading conspiracy theories, and that George Soros link absolutely destroyed your own argument. What a massive Yikes. I have provided evidence to point out the biological nature of transgender identities and why we call trans women women, and you are only trying to sow doubt in the research rather than providing positive or negative evidence. This is exactly the tactic of the creationists. You are arguing just like they did.
Not allowing kids at drag shows is the primary purpose of at least one of those bills. One the left calls an attack on " the trans community ". That's their words not mine.
Yes, I own a PS5, Switch and XSX. Notice I said preference for. It doesn't mean I don't play on other platforms. It doesn't change the fact you have a massive hate boner for Playstation which coincidentally is something everyone has in common when it involves " calling me out" in system wars.
All of which fall apart under simple scrutiny. You can't say a women is an " Adult human Female " and then say "or" anyone who identifies as " female". Female is " Sex". You can't identify as a Sex. Because the two are intrinsically linked. You than compared humans to seahorses and reptiles which was a desperate attempt that didn't prove your point at all. Why not do it with Horses, wolves, lions are bears? You can't because your argument collapses.
Again read my link. The top funding of " Trans research " is from an organization run by " George Soros". How does that destroy my argument? Every single one of the top 10 is a progressive outlet. You can't say the papers you looked at don't mention his organization therefore it's invalid. It isn't a conspiracy theory. I pulled the list and his organization is the top donor. Again this is Common and what I mean by " the inmates running the asylum ". Ironically enough I didn't even know this to be true until I looked it up. I found it ironic that not a single counter study has been funded and now we know why.
This is big tobacco all over again. Even if there was a growing consensus among medical experts you didn't know it until the 90's.
Your logic is " I have countless research funded by trans activist groups" and unless you counter that with other research " that will never be funded" then your argument is invalid. Again stop denying the basics and we may get somewhere.
Not allowing kids at drag shows is the primary purpose of at least one of those bills. One the left calls an attack on " the trans community ". That's their words not mine.
Yes, I own a PS5, Switch and XSX. Notice I said preference for. It doesn't mean I don't play on other platforms. It doesn't change the fact you have a massive hate boner for Playstation which coincidentally is something everyone has in common when it involves " calling me out" in system wars.
All of which fall apart under simple scrutiny. You can't say a women is an " Adult human Female " and then say "or" anyone who identifies as " female". Female is " Sex". You can't identify as a Sex. Because the two are intrinsically linked. You than compared humans to seahorses and reptiles which was a desperate attempt that didn't prove your point at all. Why not do it with Horses, wolves, lions are bears? You can't because your argument collapses.
Again read my link. The top funding of " Trans research " is from an organization run by " George Soros". How does that destroy my argument? Every single one of the top 10 is a progressive outlet. You can't say the papers you looked at don't mention his organization therefore it's invalid. It isn't a conspiracy theory. I pulled the list and his organization is the top donor. Again this is Common and what I mean by " the inmates running the asylum ".
This is big tobacco all over again. Even if there was a growing consensus among medical experts you didn't know it until the 90's.
Your logic is " I have countless research funded by trans activist groups" and unless you counter that with other research " that will never be funded" then your argument is invalid. Again stop denying the basics and we may get so somewhere.
Either address what has been said, or don't say anything at all. Learn what sets are too while I am at it.
Preference doesnt really count either. When I say play on multiple platforms. I mean play. We sometimes get multiplats on PC, sometimes on console, based on what would work best for that individual game. Because everything is multiplat based these days. Our preferences have mostly been dilluted away. Pretty much only Nintendo and PC see non-timed exclusives these days. And as a consequence, the preferences we do see these days is mostly rooted in video game genres, rather than system.
It doesnt fall apart. It doesnt fit your narrative so you reject it. Words have multiple meanings. There is a female sex, but also a female gender. Which is why the same dictionary also explicitly said that trans women are women. Quote mining is easy, you should look for the whole truth though.
Do you realize just how bad George Soros link make you look? And I don't know why citing a political advocacy group is the gotcha you are desperately trying to find. The research they have done is sociological not rooted in the hard sciences. Furthermore, if you actually read academic papers. You would realize that reputable journals let you check funding sources if applicable. None of the ones I have read have cited any political action groups.
The tobacco industry knew, which is why they bribed any doctors they could. Also, what we are seeing with research on trans folk is the opposite. It is the scientific consensus. Further research provides further positive evidence for the biological nature of gender identities. And the positions are based not on what doctors are saying, but what they are demonstrating. Pro-tobacco propaganda relied on appeals to authority. Meanwhile, the trans community is citing mainstream science... not the experts, the science itself.
If there was negative evidence for the success rate of transitioning, the neurological basis of gender identity. It would be published, regardless of funding. Seriously I have been asking you to provide evidence, and all you do is do the same old creationist rhetorical strategy of trying to sow doubt in the research than providing actual evidence. you are at this point no better than a flat earther or creationist.
In fact, I will say this here. Normally I might have ignored the transgender issues myself. But Transgender denial, is fuelling anti-scientific sentiments. And anti-science is a critical issue facing the west. Up there with democratic backsliding. When a society no longer has any trust in the scientific body of knowledge. Our ability to remain competitive will seriously decline. I don't side primarily with transgender issues over some culture wars crap. I do so because I will fight anti-intellectualism on any front.
It's not my reasoning it's the reality.. The media for an example views " banning children from dragshows" as an attack on the LGBTQ community. Any attack on drag is considered an attack on the " LGBTQ " community. I didn't make this up it's just how it is. Perhaps you should be upset at media for doing as such.
They're are ultimately two things that dictate what side you're on in this forum. Political leanings and gaming platform. I am a right wing gamer with a preference for Playstation. The vast majority of the forum are left leaning PC gamers.( like you) No Playstation gamers call me out on system wars just like no right wing posters call me out in Political gamers. Regardless , you naming one right wing poster I've never seen on this forum doesn't help your argument. You do the same shit with Eoten and SargentD. The only difference is they don't engage with you anymore.
Again what are your facts? I'm not the one comparing humans to seahorses to help my ridiculous argument. You want me to cite a study thst proves you wrong? There are no independent studies on the issue. The top fund for Trans studies is Open source foundation. If you don't see a conflict of interest there then there is no reason to continue this conversation.
Nah JohnMeyer called you out. The rest of the thread won't even defend your position.
Once again, those bills, as currently worded, will do a lot more than just affect drag shows.
Looking at everything from sides again... smh. Most gamers nowadays dont side with a platform. If you pay attention you will see that a lot of gamers on the SW board, play on multiple platforms, myself included. Hell, you have seen me several times defend the Xbox. Eoten doesnt post here anymore, and I dont call out SargentD. I only correct him when he gets something wrong. In fact, SargentD literally replied to me yesterday.
I cited myriad different studies which show that gender isnt as simple as you think it is. I cited so many papers against you. And all you did was ignore them. And your sources are primarily linked to political action not scientific research. Worse yet, that George Soros link, is a big yikesy moment in regards to you. In fact, looking at any of the papers I didnt find a single one funded by that political comittee. So your argument once again... falls flat.
JoshRMeyer didnt call me out, try again. He asked me a question, I answered it, and we came to an agreement.
While I didn't address this in my previous post. What happened in the 50's was that there was a growing consensus among medical experts that tobacco had serious detrimental health effects. So the tobacco industry bribed whoever they could, to promote pro-tobacco propaganda. The actual consensus in academic circles was quite the opposite of being pro-tobacco. This is why the incident reached such levels of infamy.
The fact of the matter is, you are still spreading conspiracy theories, and that George Soros link absolutely destroyed your own argument. What a massive Yikes. I have provided evidence to point out the biological nature of transgender identities and why we call trans women women, and you are only trying to sow doubt in the research rather than providing positive or negative evidence. This is exactly the tactic of the creationists. You are arguing just like they did.
Not allowing kids at drag shows is the primary purpose of at least one of those bills. One the left calls an attack on " the trans community ". That's their words not mine.
Yes, I own a PS5, Switch and XSX. Notice I said preference for. It doesn't mean I don't play on other platforms. It doesn't change the fact you have a massive hate boner for Playstation which coincidentally is something everyone has in common when it involves " calling me out" in system wars.
All of which fall apart under simple scrutiny. You can't say a women is an " Adult human Female " and then say "or" anyone who identifies as " female". Female is " Sex". You can't identify as a Sex. Because the two are intrinsically linked. You than compared humans to seahorses and reptiles which was a desperate attempt that didn't prove your point at all. Why not do it with Horses, wolves, lions are bears? You can't because your argument collapses.
Again read my link. The top funding of " Trans research " is from an organization run by " George Soros". How does that destroy my argument? Every single one of the top 10 is a progressive outlet. You can't say the papers you looked at don't mention his organization therefore it's invalid. It isn't a conspiracy theory. I pulled the list and his organization is the top donor. Again this is Common and what I mean by " the inmates running the asylum ".
This is big tobacco all over again. Even if there was a growing consensus among medical experts you didn't know it until the 90's.
Your logic is " I have countless research funded by trans activist groups" and unless you counter that with other research " that will never be funded" then your argument is invalid. Again stop denying the basics and we may get so somewhere.
Either address what has been said, or don't say anything at all. Learn what sets are too while I am at it.
Preference doesnt really count either. When I say play on multiple platforms. I mean play. We sometimes get multiplats on PC, sometimes on console, based on what would work best for that individual game. Because everything is multiplat based these days. Our preferences have mostly been dilluted away. Pretty much only Nintendo and PC see non-timed exclusives these days. And as a consequence, the preferences we do see these days is mostly rooted in video game genres, rather than system.
It doesnt fall apart. It doesnt fit your narrative so you reject it. Words have multiple meanings. There is a female sex, but also a female gender. Which is why the same dictionary also explicitly said that trans women are women. Quote mining is easy, you should look for the whole truth though.
Do you realize just how bad George Soros link make you look? And I don't know why citing a political advocacy group is the gotcha you are desperately trying to find. The research they have done is sociological not rooted in the hard sciences. Furthermore, if you actually read academic papers. You would realize that reputable journals let you check funding sources if applicable. None of the ones I have read have cited any political action groups.
The tobacco industry knew, which is why they bribed any doctors they could. Also, what we are seeing with research on trans folk is the opposite. It is the scientific consensus. Further research provides further positive evidence for the biological nature of gender identities. And the positions are based not on what doctors are saying, but what they are demonstrating. Pro-tobacco propaganda relied on appeals to authority. Meanwhile, the trans community is citing mainstream science... not the experts, the science itself.
If there was negative evidence for the success rate of transitioning, the neurological basis of gender identity. It would be published, regardless of funding. Seriously I have been asking you to provide evidence, and all you do is do the same old creationist rhetorical strategy of trying to sow doubt in the research than providing actual evidence. you are at this point no better than a flat earther or creationist.
In fact, I will say this here. Normally I might have ignored the transgender issues myself. But Transgender denial, is fuelling anti-scientific sentiments. And anti-science is a critical issue facing the west. Up there with democratic backsliding. When a society no longer has any trust in the scientific body of knowledge. Our ability to remain competitive will seriously decline. I don't side primarily with transgender issues over some culture wars crap. I do so because I will fight anti-intellectualism on any front.
I wouldn't need to if you didn't spend 6 post arguing semantics and trying to pretend the community's had nothing in common.
I'm just telling people's posting habits. Again I didn't make the rules. System Wars has groups they call Cow's, Lemmings, sheep and hermits. Almost everyone gets thrown into one group or the other. The people that call me out in SW seem to have a hate boner for Playstation. I don't find taste to be separated by genre either as someone will trash " movie ganes" then praise Hellblade". It's a cesspool over there.
Do you know how bad your reaction to it makes you look? You want to know something funny? I had no idea he was in charge of that group. I literally looked up who the top donors of trans causes were and then found it was a group he owned. He is a heavy contributer to the Tides foundation as well which ranks 4th on the list. You also somehow ignored the other link I posted. Again why are a large portion of the trans experts trans? What other field does this? Do schizophrenic's study their own disorder? You see no issue with this or you going to deny it's happening?
Then give me widespread data on the effects hormone therapy had on children as they become adult. You can't cite it because they don't have the data. They have very small samples.
You are telling me a man who thinks he is a women is a women and saying I'm the flat earther? Not only that your side supports legislation that ignores biological differences. You are the defenition of a sheep who questions nothing as long as it fits your narrative. Imagine saying the science justifies a " biological man competing with a biological women" and then citing anti intellectualism as your motivation.
Again your type is dangerous and I'm glad the right is finally working to expose people that are actually contributing to a complete collapse of society.
I wouldn't need to if you didn't spend 6 post arguing semantics and trying to pretend the community's had nothing in common.
I'm just telling people's posting habits. Again I didn't make the rules. System Wars has groups they call Cow's, Lemmings, sheep and hermits. Almost everyone gets thrown into one group or the other. The people that call me out in SW seem to have a hate boner for Playstation. I don't find taste to be separated by genre either as someone will trash " movie ganes" then praise Hellblade". It's a cesspool over there.
Do you know how bad your reaction to it makes you look? You want to know something funny? I had no idea he was in charge of that group. I literally looked up who the top donors of trans causes were and then found it was a group he owned. He is a heavy contributer to the Tides foundation as well which ranks 4th on the list. You also somehow ignored the other link I posted. Again why are a large portion of the trans experts trans? What other field does this? Do schizophrenic's study their own disorder? You see no issue with this or you going to deny it's happening?
Then give me widespread data on the effects hormone therapy had on children as they become adult. You can't cite it because they don't have the data. They have very small samples.
You are telling me a man who thinks he is a women is a women and saying I'm the flat earther? Not only that your side supports legislation that ignores biological differences. You are the defenition of a sheep who questions nothing as long as it fits your narrative. Imagine saying the science justifies a " biological man competing with a biological women" and then citing anti intellectualism as your motivation.
Again your type is dangerous and I'm glad the right is finally working to expose people that are actually contributing to a complete collapse of society.
No you are not. And you are still throwing excuses as opposed to actual evidence. And trans causes doesnt necessarily mean scientific research. I am not citing sociology, I am citing scientific journals. As for your question, I am saying that your debate tactics are identical to that of a flat earther or creationist. Instead of providing evidence, you provide excuses, conspiracy theories and attempt to attack the source, rather than the evidence itself.
And to be frank, I had enough of your excuses. So I am giving you an ultimatum,
I want you to do two things.
Provide Positive or Negative Evidence against the biological nature of gender identity, the positive effects of transitioning.
Provide Positive or Negative Evidence against the notion that woman and man do not exclude trans man or trans woman.
And to make sure you know I am not shifting the burder of proof, for point 2, here is positive evidence that woman includes trans woman and man includes trans man.
I am not interested in hearing any more excuses. I want actual evidence. Failure to do so and you demonstrate that your entire position has no leg to stand on.
I wouldn't need to if you didn't spend 6 post arguing semantics and trying to pretend the community's had nothing in common.
I'm just telling people's posting habits. Again I didn't make the rules. System Wars has groups they call Cow's, Lemmings, sheep and hermits. Almost everyone gets thrown into one group or the other. The people that call me out in SW seem to have a hate boner for Playstation. I don't find taste to be separated by genre either as someone will trash " movie ganes" then praise Hellblade". It's a cesspool over there.
Do you know how bad your reaction to it makes you look? You want to know something funny? I had no idea he was in charge of that group. I literally looked up who the top donors of trans causes were and then found it was a group he owned. He is a heavy contributer to the Tides foundation as well which ranks 4th on the list. You also somehow ignored the other link I posted. Again why are a large portion of the trans experts trans? What other field does this? Do schizophrenic's study their own disorder? You see no issue with this or you going to deny it's happening?
Then give me widespread data on the effects hormone therapy had on children as they become adult. You can't cite it because they don't have the data. They have very small samples.
You are telling me a man who thinks he is a women is a women and saying I'm the flat earther? Not only that your side supports legislation that ignores biological differences. You are the defenition of a sheep who questions nothing as long as it fits your narrative. Imagine saying the science justifies a " biological man competing with a biological women" and then citing anti intellectualism as your motivation.
Again your type is dangerous and I'm glad the right is finally working to expose people that are actually contributing to a complete collapse of society.
No you are not. And you are still throwing excuses as opposed to actual evidence. And trans causes doesnt necessarily mean scientific research. I am not citing sociology, I am citing scientific journals. As for your question, I am saying that your debate tactics are identical to that of a flat earther or creationist. Instead of providing evidence, you provide excuses, conspiracy theories and attempt to attack the source, rather than the evidence itself.
And to be frank, I had enough of your excuses. So I am giving you an ultimatum,
I want you to do two things.
Provide Positive or Negative Evidence against the biological nature of gender identity, the positive effects of transitioning.
Provide Positive or Negative Evidence against the notion that woman and man do not exclude trans man or trans woman.
And to make sure you know I am not shifting the burder of proof, for point 2, here is positive evidence that woman includes trans woman and man includes trans man.
I am not interested in hearing any more excuses. I want actual evidence. Failure to do so and you demonstrate that your entire position has no leg to stand on.
They specifically mention some of the studies that were funded. Again the only thing you will accept is a counter study which you know don't exist. I'm telling you why they don't exist. They will soon hopefully .Regardless none of your arguments are based in science. Your argument is based off Social constructionism.
It's why you can't use any example that makes sense because your entire argument relies on one flawed theory.
They specifically mention some of the studies that were funded. Again the only thing you will accept is a counter study which you know don't exist. I'm telling you why they don't exist. They will soon hopefully .Regardless none of your arguments are based in science. Your argument is based off Social constructionism.
It's why you can't use any example that makes sense because your entire argument relies on one flawed theory.
So you admit you are not basing your position on any evidence.
They specifically mention some of the studies that were funded. Again the only thing you will accept is a counter study which you know don't exist. I'm telling you why they don't exist. They will soon hopefully .Regardless none of your arguments are based in science. Your argument is based off Social constructionism.
It's why you can't use any example that makes sense because your entire argument relies on one flawed theory.
So you admit you are not basing your position on any evidence.
Good to know. Have a good day.
I am actually.
I respect the tangible difference that exist, while you completely ignore them.
In a nutshell its a label anyone who looks like an orc adopts so they can be special and unique because instead of looking like an ugly male orc they can be a revolting female orc. Then be special and act perpetually aggrieved and thrive in negative attention because they never got any being ugly orcs.
The demographic consists predominantly of introverted unattractive usually obese people unhappy with their life. They find the trans community is generally the same. They’re indoctrinated to believe they need to change to be happy & get all this attention from that community.
Anywhere outside of that community they’re regarded as mentally ill cross dressing orcs. They’re trained to respond with words like fascist, transphobic alt right to anyone that doesn’t accommodate their mental deficiency.
These people tend to navigate towards positions where they can further control opinion and silence objective opinions. Usually as moderators because they can’t fit in anywhere else which only shows the fragility of their mind set.
@thatforumuser: a person with a mental disorder that thinks they are in the wrong body they were born with. In their head they they think they are the opposite sex of what they were born as TC.
This is sounding like same as gay conversion therapy to me. Maybe some people believe it and want to do this but some do not believe it can happen and I do not know.
If a person feels good identifying as something else that is their right I don't much care. When this group goes in to schools to influence young children who for the most part do not understand sex or have drag shows which are an adult activity it is time to say enough is enough. I don't care how one spins it certain things can't be changed. What sex you are at birth is what you are that never changes no matter what you say or do, it is what it is. If I were to identify as a leprechaun I would still be six foot two and white.
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