Maduro opponent Juan Guaidó claims Venezuela presidency. West recognizes him

CARACAS, Venezuela - Venezuela's crisis quickly escalated Wednesday as an opposition leader backed by the Trump administration declared himself interim president in a direct challenge to embattled socialist Nicolas Maduro, who retaliated by breaking off relations with the United States, his biggest trade partner.

For the past two weeks, ever since Maduro took the oath for a second six-year term in the face of widespread international condemnation, the newly invigorated opposition had been preparing for nationwide demonstrations Wednesday coinciding with the anniversary marking the end of Venezuela's last military dictatorship in 1958.

While Maduro has shown no signs of leaving, his main rival, National Assembly President Juan Guaido, upped the ante by declaring himself interim president before masses of anti-government demonstrators - the only way, he said, to rescue Venezuela from "dictatorship." Outside the capital, seven demonstrators were killed amid disturbances during protests that rocked several cities.

In a seemingly coordinated action, the U.S. led a chorus of Western hemisphere nations, including Canada, Brazil, Argentina and Colombia, that immediately recognized Guaido, with President Donald Trump calling on Maduro to resign and promising to use the "full weight" of the U.S. economic and diplomatic power to push for the restoration of Venezuela's democracy.

"The people of Venezuela have courageously spoken out against Maduro and his regime and demanded freedom and the rule of law," Trump said in a statement.

The stunning move, which to some harkened back to dark episodes of heavy-handed U.S. interventions in Latin America during the Cold War, drew a strong rebuke from Maduro. He responded by swiftly cutting off diplomatic relations with the United States, the biggest importer of the OPEC nation's oil, giving American diplomats 72 hours to leave the country.

https://www.local10.com/espanol/noticias/venezuela/unrest-roils-venezuela-amid-new-push-to-topple-maduro

I wonder how this is going to end. Unfortunately, I doubt the violence is going to go away anytime soon with crowed sizes like this

How likely is it for this to get nasty and bloody?

Russia, Turkey and China have recently come out saying they strongly oppose regime change, and have thrown their support behind Maduro.

probably likely, pretty sure Venezuela was already having protests including protestors throwing shit-filled containers at police

Civil war, which will be a proxy war for the divided nations. Oh god, here we go. I feel so bad for the Venezualians they are the ones that will have to pay.

Wow, that is a lot. Probaly a million people in that picture.

While I don't deny that Maduro NEEDS to be removed, can Donald "America First" Trump actually focus on the mess HE LEFT before going into another?

Just more bloodbath for the US to take control of their resources.

Conservative estimates put that particular protest at 200,000.

One million is a lot. Here is a time lapse of the latest March for Life that is estimated between 350,000 - 500,000

In recent times whenever we back someone, things gets worse. Well its not like Venezuela can get any worse than now but hmmm....

@vl4d_l3nin: looks like a river of humans. The river just keeps going.

He only NEEDS to be removed if the people elect someone else. They haven't.

This is definitley a coup attempt and it seems Maduro was prepared for it. Guaido is going to be choosing cabinet members from the fleas, rats, and spiders in his prison cell.

That's bs. Look if a president is caught doing something illegal or deemed vastly incompetent for the job he should be removed. This is a general statement so don't get your panties in a bunch even though it looks as if it fits. There is no way we should leave the job as untouchable if there is grave issues at hand. Ever. And there actually is a means to remove presidents so it's not something that wasn't thought as to possibly be necessary.

Wow. You would do well in a dictatorship where they are untouchable.

So who removes them, the people or a corrupt undemocratic opposition that cannot follow the Constitution?

You think Maduro is a dictator and undemocratic, try the opposition. Boycotting elections (even ones they could have won), ignoring the Supreme Court, engaging in violent protests, trying to damage the economy to get the president out, burning people alive, and launching coup attempts. You name it.

@nintendoboy16: they guy was voted in.

@LJS9502_basic: 1. He jas not really done anything illegal.

2.that up to the government of that country to do....not a government in another country to do.

What? My comment was about allowing presidents not worthy to serve have carte blanche to continue. I'm not talking about any specific country.

@texasgoldrush: thank you. People have no idea how messed up the political issues are in south america. It's not black and white.

I think it's pretty basic knowledge how messed up the issues are there. It's never been a secret.

@LJS9502_basic: my point stands.

It's up to the government and their people to out the president nota fringe minority who keep losing elections.

The majority there actually want him as president.

You need to learn that sourh American politics are not as black and white as you think.

A lot deals with groups fighting to not become a puppet state of another country. Which the us has been trying to do from the late 1800's.

Well I don't know your exact process for removal. There should be one in case the people are wrong. Also are you sure your elections are the clear choice and not a sham?

@LJS9502_basic: actually you just know the basic issues you here on the news. Talk to the people who live or lived there. Learn south american history. Understand there is a bigger pile of b's going on here. Because this is an ossue of classisum and racism vs a people's state here.

Yeah you can find out reality from research dude. You don't always need to live there. And I'm not sure what point you're making? Obviously you have a problem right now. And it probably won't be solved without bloodshed. Unfortunately.

@LJS9502_basic: I can agree this unfortunately will not end without a war.

@dreman999: Stay safe...........

@LJS9502_basic: the president and his party are not in control of the count. That and he has yet to physically take out the opposite party yet...like an actual dictator would do.

Actual dictators don't allow opposing parties in there governments.

If they can make verbal opposition to the leader and live then it's clearly not a dictatorship or a tyranny.

I don't understand the conservative fascination with Venezuela.

It's interesting how socialist countries that have vast amounts of resources always completely screw it up.

When Chavez first came into power, it was leftists who were obsessed with the country, and they genuinely believed he would do great things for it.

Corruption?

Any "system" will fail if corruption is what rules.

This is the reason democracies fail. Obviously Maduro is incompetent but he inherited a socialist government from his predecessor and just continued the status quo. A free market economy would work far better, one with much less government interference.

Sooo it appears socialism still doesn't work.

I guess we just need to be reminded every once in a while.

Scandinavian model... Or does that go by social democracy?

@horgen: It depends on how you want to define it. You can take the wishy-washy Bernie Sanders definition of socialism and basically apply it to any government that gives you free stuff. I personally like the correct definition, that government dictates how resources produced are allocated.

Some Scandinavian countries have a more free, less regulated economy than the US. I'd have a real hard time calling those countries socialist.

Then perhaps not use socialism in Venezuela and neighboring countries as a reason for why it won't work in US when US has no interest in socialism by that definition.

Look to Scandinavia for an example on how it can be done while still giving the possibility of becoming rich.

So, is anybody actually going to do something or just keep throwing boogers around.

Let's be honest here. No one on the left ever gave a damn about Venezuela. You know that. I know that. Everyone knows that. Its a third world dump. No one ever cared about Venezuela until conservatives realized they could scream socialism is a failure to their base, pointing to it as an example. It's always the destitute third world countries, too. Never will we see conservatives heralding Norway or Sweden as a socialist hell-hole. The argument completely falls apart when you leave the third world.

@tjandmia:

Noam Chomsky claimed Chavez made a better world, while shaking the mans hand.

Sean Penn met with him, with Danny Glover. They went on talk shows praising the man.

Oliver Stone made a stupid movie celebrating him.

Micheal Moore said he was "on a quest to eliminate poverty" in one of his stupid movies.

LOTS of people were talking about what great things Chavez was doing for his country

It really shows you clearly weren't paying attention prior to 2015, when everything went to shit in that country, and his grand vision was exposed for the fraud that it has always been.

Why don't you explain socialism's failure. Instead of pointing to white capitalist countries as an example of socialism, explain how one of the most oil rich countries in the world has 90% of its citizens living in extreme poverty.

"Destitute" my ass.

That's expected since all 3 countries are essentially run by 'strong men' themselves. Dictators have to stick together now!

Yep exactly, plus it allows them to aggro the USA also. Hopefully things don't get anymore violent in Venezuela anyway.

@vl4d_l3nin: Its "Dutch Elm Disease". Venezuela's oil economy detracts from all other sectors of the economy. If oil plunges, the entire economy goes bust.

Second, Chavez was a vastly superior leader than Maduro is, and would have more political capital to adjust his policies. Next, much of the damage the economy has suffered is due to opposition actions and lately, US sanctions. And if you think socialists are failures, look at Evo Morales. he has turned Bolivia around.

But that's the specific model the Democratic Socialists are pushing. The Scandinavian Model. Not the Venezuela one.

Why would I point to a red herring?

“When I talk about democratic socialism, I’m not looking at Venezuela. I’m not looking at Cuba. I’m looking at countries like Denmark and Sweden.”

They are very specific here. Anything else is spin and fear-mongering. At most you can debate they are using incorrect semantics.

They want to use it as spin and fear-mongering in the 2020 election to say "hey look, that's what the Democrats want", even though that is objectively false.

@vl4d_l3nin:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-election-nationalizations/factbox-venezuelas-nationalizations-under-chavez-idUSBRE89701X20121008

Venezuela declared a trade war against US companies' Venezuela hardware assets nationalization (aka state sponsored stealing) e.g. return US companies owned Oil Rigs to the US.

US has it's own trade protectionist policies against Venezuela's socialist trade war.

1. Welfare shouldn't be a life style.

2. Welfare service delivery should be the smallest government overhead for maximum service efficiency.

US Democratic Socialists has big government(1) approach which is not Australian/Scandinavian style universal health care approach.

https://interactives.commonwealthfund.org/2017/july/mirror-mirror/

Welfare service delivery should be the smallest government overhead for maximum service efficiency.

Notice Scandinavian and CANZUK administrative efficiency rankings.

Australia = 1st

New Zealand = 2nd

UK = 3rd

Norway = 4th

Sweden = 5th

Canada and Germany = 6th.

Reference

1. https://www.investors.com/politics/commentary/federal-jobs-guarantee-democrats/

DSA's big government approach.

Not to mention all the SOE's in those countries operate off of the profit motive. Something the DSA wants to abolish.

It's all futile trying to get through to them, dude. Socialism is by far the most pervasive ideology ever. Religion wishes it could be the opiate that is socialism.

DSA has no experience on implementing CANZUK's safety net services.

http://theconversation.com/why-biologics-were-such-a-big-deal-in-the-trans-pacific-partnership-48595

To reduce universal health's cost, does the Dems has the courage to fix the current "data-exclusivity-medications" which dampen open competition?

Australia (with it's center right wing government) has targeted US "data-exclusivity-medications" condition as the killer to Australia's universal health care system.

Obama administration didn't like Australia's arguments in TPP. Obama Care has very high overheads with the government paying insurance companies which then pays hospitals.

In the Australian system,

1. The government directly pays the hospitals and any extra health services are paid by the insurance industry. Promote healthy foods via advertising medium.

2. Promote generics medicine competition patent system. Open competition is better. State protected monopolies (corporate socialism) via the patent system is bad.

CANZUK group has universal health care system.

France has socialist universal health care with high administrative overheads.

Complete red herring. You suck at arguing. lol None of this has anything to do with my question. Why is every single comparison the right makes on something to which it is opposed always an example of some third world dictatorship that has no equivalency in the first world? Not one first world country that progressives want to emulate has any equivalency to Venezuela. Why not cite Japan, France, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Australia, Finland, New Zealand, etc? Oh, that's right, because you can't.

What about even Israel??? Healthcare as a fundamental right! ha ha.

Why do you think anyone wants to live off welfare? If you wish to be dirt poor all your life perhaps, but most people want to achieve something.