Plan to split California into 6 states advances

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#1 Posted by whipassmt (14981 posts) -

an initiative to split California into 6 states has garnered more than 807,000 signatures, and is now going to be on the ballot for November 2016. I don't think it will pass (people generally don't like radical change), but if it does there may be six new states (Congress would probably have to approve that though).

According to Forbes Columnist Travis Brown " the initiative would achieve the triumvirate goal of proportionately distributing California’s debts based on population, ending all tax collections and spending by the existing State of California, and creating new, more representative governments with the ability to enact public policies that make the most sense for the new state." Brown says that the new states would be smaller "and thus more efficient and closer to their constituents". He also believes that California is a "failed state".

I guess if this did go through it could benefit other states, by taking all of the political power California has and breaking it up into six smaller states.

#2 Posted by jasean79 (2458 posts) -

He also believes that California is a "failed state".

Can't disagree there. As 1 or 6 states, I wouldn't choose to live any of them.

#3 Edited by chessmaster1989 (30075 posts) -

Yeah I don't really see this passing

#4 Edited by Aljosa23 (26427 posts) -

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

#5 Posted by chessmaster1989 (30075 posts) -

lol also I like how TC cited an opinion article

#6 Posted by outworld222 (2543 posts) -

Divide and distort at its best. I fail to see what this would accomplish.

#7 Posted by LJS9502_basic (153510 posts) -

@chessmaster1989 said:

Yeah I don't really see this passing

Nope.

#8 Edited by dave123321 (34484 posts) -

Cali's a hellhole

#9 Edited by lamprey263 (26461 posts) -

Texas will go blue before anything like this happens.

#10 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

If this passes (which I'm not getting my hopes up), hopefully the new state lines place me in a conservative state. Again, I'm not getting my hopes up.

#11 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -
@lamprey263 said:

Texas will go blue before anything like this happens.

This would suck so much...

#12 Edited by Toxic-Seahorse (4414 posts) -

Doesn't matter what California votes for, this would never get through Congress. It seems like nothing ever does.

#13 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

@Toxic-Seahorse said:

Doesn't matter what California votes for, this would never get through Congress. It seems like nothing ever does.

There's a slight chance it might if the republicans control both houses. We won't though. :(

#14 Edited by GazaAli (24250 posts) -

@Aljosa23 said:

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

Yea they'd do anything to make their way to the presidency again and regain relevancy. Pathetic bunch.

#15 Posted by lamprey263 (26461 posts) -

@The-Apostle said:
@lamprey263 said:

Texas will go blue before anything like this happens.

This would suck so much...

speak for yourself

#16 Edited by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

@lamprey263 said:

@The-Apostle said:
@lamprey263 said:

Texas will go blue before anything like this happens.

This would suck so much...

speak for yourself

I'm speaking for the country. A one-party, democrat nation (which is what we'd get if Texas goes blue) would be catastrophic.

#17 Edited by JimB (430 posts) -

@Aljosa23: California is another failed Democratic liberal state. The libs just don't get it. Their policies don't work.

#18 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

@JimB said:

@Aljosa23: California is another failed Democratic liberal state. The libs just don't get it. Their policies don't work.

#19 Posted by airshocker (31411 posts) -

I would support that kind of action in New York. Only we should just cut NYC off and let them fend for themselves. I'm tired of having to pay for a city I don't even live in.

#20 Posted by airshocker (31411 posts) -
@Aljosa23 said:

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

If the lines more accurately represent each state, why not?

#21 Posted by lamprey263 (26461 posts) -

@The-Apostle said:

@lamprey263 said:

@The-Apostle said:
@lamprey263 said:

Texas will go blue before anything like this happens.

This would suck so much...

speak for yourself

I'm speaking for the country. A one-party, democrat nation (which is what we'd get if Texas goes blue) would be catastrophic.

well, if it was to become one party it'd be so because the opposing party is fucking batshit crazy

maybe they should focus on some sensible policy other than just being the antithesis of their opposition

#22 Posted by dave123321 (34484 posts) -

@airshocker: no just no

#23 Posted by airshocker (31411 posts) -

@dave123321 said:

@airshocker: no just no

Why not? It more accurately represents what the population thinks. Upstate New York is vastly different in opinion than NYC, yet we get drowned out because there are 10 million people in NYC. Long Island feels the same way.

#24 Posted by Nuck81 (6048 posts) -

Republicans mad that a Democratic Governor and Legislature turned Cali's budget deficit into a surplus, and their economy is growing 30% faster than the rest of the nation

#25 Posted by Masculus (2878 posts) -

The way U.S. is, they'll probably use it to segregate the poorer areas from the ones booming with the new economy.

#26 Posted by -Sun_Tzu- (17384 posts) -

@airshocker said:

I would support that kind of action in New York. Only we should just cut NYC off and let them fend for themselves. I'm tired of having to pay for a city I don't even live in.

That would make sense. It's inclusion in New York state is pretty archaic. Just make it a federal district like DC.

I probably wouldn't support redrawing any state lines though until the electoral college is abolished.

#27 Edited by pyro1245 (1083 posts) -

Hahaha. Right. California has a population of 38 million. I'd expect it would take a few more than 800k people to make this happen. I doubt it would happen even if all of California wanted it to.

#28 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

@Nuck81 said:

Republicans mad that a Democratic Governor and Legislature turned Cali's budget deficit into a surplus, and their economy is growing 30% faster than the rest of the nation

They only "fixed" the economy with a bandaid. Most of the businesses fled over it. In the short term it's great. In the long term it'll be a fucking nightmare.

#29 Edited by SolidSnake35 (58240 posts) -

Why not offer California as a gift to Mexico?

#30 Posted by airshocker (31411 posts) -

@-Sun_Tzu- said:

@airshocker said:

I would support that kind of action in New York. Only we should just cut NYC off and let them fend for themselves. I'm tired of having to pay for a city I don't even live in.

That would make sense. It's inclusion in New York state is pretty archaic. Just make it a federal district like DC.

I probably wouldn't support redrawing any state lines though until the electoral college is abolished.

That's an interesting idea. Since a lot of the world's diplomacy occurs in NY, it would make perfect sense.

#31 Posted by HBK4life9 (25 posts) -

lol wtf? why would California do this?

#32 Posted by airshocker (31411 posts) -

@hbk4life9 said:

lol wtf? why would California do this?

Because some of their population feel(much like us NYers who don't live in NYC) aren't being represented fairly.

#33 Posted by dave123321 (34484 posts) -

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm like the federal district thing

#34 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -
@airshocker said:

@hbk4life9 said:

lol wtf? why would California do this?

Because some of their population feel(much like us NYers who don't live in NYC) aren't being represented fairly.

Pretty much this. Believe it or not, there are more Republicans in California than Democrats. The problem lies in the fact that the Democrats are too condensed in major areas while the Republicans are too spread out all over the state.

#35 Posted by Aljosa23 (26427 posts) -

@The-Apostle said:
@airshocker said:

@hbk4life9 said:

lol wtf? why would California do this?

Because some of their population feel(much like us NYers who don't live in NYC) aren't being represented fairly.

Pretty much this. Believe it or not, there are more Republicans in California than Democrats. The problem lies in the fact that the Democrats are too condensed in major areas while the Republicans are too spread out all over the state.

lol

Yet Obama won California by 60% and Romney only got 37% in the last election. You are delusional.

@airshocker said:
@Aljosa23 said:

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

If the lines more accurately represent each state, why not?

"If" they do then that's fine. No reason for me to think this is anything more than GOP vote cheating as of now though.

#36 Posted by dave123321 (34484 posts) -

buy the by, apostle, do you still think Obama wasn't born on America?

#37 Posted by BranKetra (50396 posts) -
@Aljosa23 said:

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

Let's understand the situation.

The “Six Californias” Initiative, sponsored by Silicon Valley venture capitalist Tim Draper, seeks to create areas that are more governable, more productive, and more successful.

Draper, a registered independent who has built a career on smart risk-taking and startup investing, views California as a borderline “failed state” with “the worst-managed government in the country.”

#38 Edited by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

@Aljosa23 said:

@The-Apostle said:
@airshocker said:

@hbk4life9 said:

lol wtf? why would California do this?

Because some of their population feel(much like us NYers who don't live in NYC) aren't being represented fairly.

Pretty much this. Believe it or not, there are more Republicans in California than Democrats. The problem lies in the fact that the Democrats are too condensed in major areas while the Republicans are too spread out all over the state.

lol

Yet Obama won California by 60% and Romney only got 37% in the last election. You are delusional.

I was merely stating facts (I've heard, not read). They could've switched party lines, though I heard reports that the Democrats had committed voter fraud in California. I can't source it since I'm not sure where those reports came from.

EDIT: It's also entirely possible that many republicans, believing Romney didn't stand a chance, decided not to vote at all.

#39 Posted by br0kenrabbit (13656 posts) -

@The-Apostle said:

I was merely stating facts (I've heard, not read). They could've switched party lines, though I heard reports that the Democrats had committed voter fraud in California.

You're accusing the wrong party.

#40 Edited by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -
@br0kenrabbit said:

@The-Apostle said:

I was merely stating facts (I've heard, not read). They could've switched party lines, though I heard reports that the Democrats had committed voter fraud in California.

You're accusing the wrong party.

Meh... That's the LA Times. That's like linking to NY Times or CNN. >_>

#41 Edited by br0kenrabbit (13656 posts) -

@The-Apostle said:

Meh... That's the LA Times. That's like linking to NY Times or CNN. >_>

*sigh* Typical RW deflection. Anyway, the man pleaded guilty. That there's a link to Google, so take your pick of sources.

#42 Posted by ReadingRainbow4 (16957 posts) -

This has to be one of the stupidest plans ever.

#43 Posted by Nuck81 (6048 posts) -

@The-Apostle said:

@Nuck81 said:

Republicans mad that a Democratic Governor and Legislature turned Cali's budget deficit into a surplus, and their economy is growing 30% faster than the rest of the nation

They only "fixed" the economy with a bandaid. Most of the businesses fled over it. In the short term it's great. In the long term it'll be a fucking nightmare.

Right, because the deficit, debt, and brink of Bankruptcy, that California was experiencing while under Republican control made it a paradise.

That's pretty much why Kansas is enjoying so much Economic prosperity right now............oh, wait

#44 Posted by airshocker (31411 posts) -
@Aljosa23 said:
@airshocker said:
@Aljosa23 said:

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

If the lines more accurately represent each state, why not?

"If" they do then that's fine. No reason for me to think this is anything more than GOP vote cheating as of now though.

What are you talking about? Creating different states would bring two more senators a piece. Not to mention representatives for states specifically.

That's pretty damn good odds for either party to pick up more seats.

#45 Edited by dave123321 (34484 posts) -

How much will it cost to overhaul the flag and phase it in

#46 Edited by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -
@Nuck81 said:

@The-Apostle said:

@Nuck81 said:

Republicans mad that a Democratic Governor and Legislature turned Cali's budget deficit into a surplus, and their economy is growing 30% faster than the rest of the nation

They only "fixed" the economy with a bandaid. Most of the businesses fled over it. In the short term it's great. In the long term it'll be a fucking nightmare.

Right, because the deficit, debt, and brink of Bankruptcy, that California was experiencing while under Republican control made it a paradise.

That's pretty much why Kansas is enjoying so much Economic prosperity right now............oh, wait

Like I said, it was a short term, temporary solution. The businesses left. Once California begins feeling the effects of that then things will be worse than ever.

#47 Posted by Aljosa23 (26427 posts) -

@airshocker said:
@Aljosa23 said:
@airshocker said:
@Aljosa23 said:

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

If the lines more accurately represent each state, why not?

"If" they do then that's fine. No reason for me to think this is anything more than GOP vote cheating as of now though.

What are you talking about? Creating different states would bring two more senators a piece. Not to mention representatives for states specifically.

That's pretty damn good odds for either party to pick up more seats.

I was talking more about the electoral college. The GOP knows they will never win California so the next best thing is to split the state up so they at least get something.

#48 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

@Aljosa23 said:

@airshocker said:
@Aljosa23 said:
@airshocker said:
@Aljosa23 said:

Another Republican gerrymandering scheme only now they want to re-draw state lines. Funny shit indeed.

If the lines more accurately represent each state, why not?

"If" they do then that's fine. No reason for me to think this is anything more than GOP vote cheating as of now though.

What are you talking about? Creating different states would bring two more senators a piece. Not to mention representatives for states specifically.

That's pretty damn good odds for either party to pick up more seats.

I was talking more about the electoral college. The GOP knows they will never win California so the next best thing is to split the state up so they at least get something.

I'm not seeing the problem.

#49 Posted by XaosII (16705 posts) -

@The-Apostle said:

I'm not seeing the problem.

You don't see the problem in the fact that since its becoming so difficult for a party to win that instead of changing people's hearts and minds, its better to change the system so that it's more beneficial to them?

You would be gaming the election system rather than actually following any kind of democratic process. You don't see that as problematic?

#50 Posted by The-Apostle (12193 posts) -

@XaosII said:

@The-Apostle said:

I'm not seeing the problem.

You don't see the problem in the fact that since its becoming so difficult for a party to win that instead of changing people's hearts and minds, its better to change the system so that it's more beneficial to them?

You would be gaming the election system rather than actually following any kind of democratic process. You don't see that as problematic?

Actually, I heard the guy who proposed it is an Independent.