Bioware vs. Bethesda: Battle of the western rpg Giants

These two developers have have astounded me and many more developers for over a decade of awesome rpgs. Bethesda released it's first game, The Elder Scrolls: Arena in 1994. And Bioware released its first game, Shattered Steel in 1996. I would have included lionhead studios and blizzard in the comparison, but they make more than just rpgs. They tend to have a long history of strategy along with rpgs. Bethesda and Blizzard are the only ones that I know of that basically only do western rpgs.

Bethesda

+ They can create an awesome game atmosphere where the game comes to life

+ They make awesome sequels

+ They always incorporate great graphics

- They don't make many games outside TES series (with Fallout 3 as an exception, which I'm totally getting)

- Their stories lack Bioware's depth

Bioware Pros

+ They are amazing storytellers with awesome plots, twists and turns

+ Great characters and NPCs.

+ Great polish on their titles

- They tend to be weaker from a technical standpoint

- They lack the exploration and interaction that made Bethesda great

I admit this is probably as hard a decision as trying to choose between halo 3 and COD4. We 360 owners know how hard that is. But I would have to side with Bioware on this one. Who really can deliver such a thrilling rpg full of emotion and depth. I had the most awesome rpg experience with KOTOR.

:Spoiler:
When you find out you were the dark lord Revan the entire time I was like OMG.Or in Jade empire when your master betrays you. They always have subtle hints to the main plot which always makes sense in the end.

:Spoiler end:

Maybe when Fallout 3 comes out my opinion will change but for now Bioware narrowly is still my favorite rpg maker. Not to say bethesda isn't awesome or anything. I would be sad if either of them stopped making games for the 360 and PC. So by all means tell me your opinion of the two.

When you say BioWare tend to be weaker from a technical standpoint, I know you're talking about Mass Effect exclusively. NO OTHER BioWare game I've played (and I've played them all!) has had bad technical problems.

Anyway, BioWare would have to be my favourite so far. I've seen large amounts of Morrowind being played but never played it for more than an hour. Oblivion would be the first of their games that I've owned and played/completed. But I've been a big time fan of BioWare for years. And from what I've seen, their stories are so much more immersive and compelling. While Bethesda would be more about leveling and exploration.

I'm not saying it's bad, but it was just too easy at times (with the fast travel, compass telling you where to go, and such).SlashDementia3

you know you can always NOT fast travel and there IS a difficulty slider.

And from what I've seen, their stories are so much more immersive and compelling. While Bethesda would be more about leveling and exploration.

Quintinius

i can agree with you in a since on that note if we compare the two. but i'll go with Bethesda on this one TES Morrowindand some what Oblivion are my favs. and im def. going to pick up fallout3. but i cant forget ME, jade empire or KotOR "ive wanted a game like ME for so long" (tho i dont think ME its better than Oblivion let alone Morrowind)

First of all, great thread topic, you hit it spot on with your pros and cons of each company. Second of all, are you allowed to ask a question like this? Thats like asking a parent who their favorite kid is. With that said, its a tough call. Both companies know how to make a quality game. They don't turn out good games, they turn out great games. At the end of the day, however, I feel Bioware's compelling storylines beat out Bethesda's epic, open ended Elder Scrolls series. The Knights of the Old Republic is my favorite game of all time so its only fair that I pick Bioware.

KOTOR made me love Bioware to death. I choose Bioware because i prefer sci-fi games. Kotor=Epic+Star wars which made it a double win.craigalan23

hum and i thought i loved sci-fi i guess i just learned something about myself :P (i chose bethesda)

Great thread topic mankeyador. You pretty much sum up the pros and cons in your post.

I think I would have to lean toward Bioware in this poll. I love the plots and characters in their games like Jade Empire, Mass Effect, and KOTOR. Wrex, Canderous, and HK-47 are some of the coolest RPG characters to have been introduced to gamers. Bioware gets a very slight edge over Bethesda. However, I couldn't go wrong picking a winner between these two companies. Both of these companies produce epic games. It's a win/win with this poll.

Your original post pretty much sums up a lot of what I want to say about both games :) Great topic for discussion.

great topic and perfect points for each company imo.

however, KOTOR swings my vote to BioWare's side

story-wise = bioware

gameplay openeness wise = bethesda

Bioware even though the mass effect elavator rides drove me crazyquader_ac400

Bioware.

TES series is decent, I can see why so many people love it but I don't like the "Ok here you go have fun.I'll be back in.... never." feeling oblivion has. I like RPGs like KoTOR and Mass Effect that have a story you follow and you effect the story with your decisions, rather then the massive overwhelming feeling I got in oblivion. but I would never discredit the game, it's just not my cup of tea.

But no one beats Biowares story telling ability, been fiending for ME2 since I finished the first.

(Im still getting Fallout 3 though)

I'll have to go with Bioware on this one, the story telling is just great. Bethesda is awesome and has great lore to almost everything, but they went with a too player friendly game with Oblivion. I'm not saying it's bad, but it was just too easy at times (with the fast travel, compass telling you where to go, and such).SlashDementia3

I agree. And Oblivion's world might have been big but it was empty. Most of it had nothing to do and the characters were not interesting.

Mass Effect was one of Bioware's weakest games. Baldurs Gate was amazing.

"I'd take bethesda over bioware for one reason, their games always seem to have more content than bioware games. Thats not to say that i don't love bioware to death, but their games lack the content that bethesda provides."

Neverwinter Knights and Baldurs Gate 2.

Bioware easily wins this one, there really is no contest here, and Ill tell you why.

All Bethesda has (so far) is the The Elder Scrolls series, which didnt actually reach critical acclaim until Morrowind. That really showed off what they can do, however then they turned around and dropped the ball with a little game called Oblivion. Oblivion was a good unique game........................if youve never played Morrowind. To those of us who have played it, Oblivion was not refreshing, it was not unique, it was not good. What it was though, it was stale and boring. Hardly anything in Oblivion was changed from Morrowind, and most of the stuff that was changed, wasnt changed for the better. A previous person said it felt noobed up, I say it just felt watered down.

Thats what makes Bioware the better company, 1. Theyve already shown that within the RPG genre they can make different RPG's of different styles, and theyll turn out good. 2. You dont get the feeling like youve already done this before in a previous game while playing a different one. Even when playing BG2, I never got the feeling like Ive already done all of this in BG1.

So just because a company can pump out 1 or 2 (depending on who you ask) good sandbox games doesnt make them a better RPG company whose track record more than speaks for itself. Bethesda still has a lot to learn if they want to be known for something other that just Morrowind and Oblivion. Fallout 3 could go either way for them, they could be known as the company that resurrected the series, or they could be known as the company that put the final nail in the coffin.

1. Theyve already shown that within the RPG genre they can make different RPG's of different styles, and theyll turn out good. 2. You dont get the feeling like youve already done this before in a previous game while playing a different one. Even when playing BG2, I never got the feeling like Ive already done all of this in BG1.EvilAshTwin

i choose BioWare. I like that they do different things and not just same series over and over. Also they're great storytellers. Bethesda has talent too.. I loved Morrowind, but Oblivion was a dissapointment. Never had a chance to play Arena and Daggerfall so I can't say much about them. I hope that Fallout 3 will be a great game, but I feel some fear in my heart.

But I hope MS puts KOTOR on Xbox Originals, I would download it in a heartbeat.JohnnySN1P3R

I would be first one to download it. I never had the chance to play original KOTOR. I have KOTOR 2, which I love, but all people say that the first KOTOR is so much better.

I'm gonna have to disagree that bioware's games have a smaller scope. Their flagship RPG's are great, but the neverwinter nights series has an amazing mod creator and people are building amazing stories 24/7. I just stopped playing the first one and it was tons of fun.

Don't get me wrong though I love Bethesda and I'm gonna get Fallout for sure I tend to like their gameplay more.

I'm gonna have to go with Bioware on this on though.

bioware is great, gotta love those star wars rpg's

bethesda is amazing as well

hope they both continue making great games for the next millenium or so :D

KOTOR = winner.

So Bioware
ethanpaige

Bioware gets my vote. It's hard to argue with Bethesda's complete openness and exploration, but there's nothing to focus it making it feel dry and lacking of purpose. Their characters and NPC's are rediculously (sometimes hilariously) unconvincing, as well.

With Bioware's stuff, I actually feel incentive to move forward, and replay. I'm also far more driven to interact with characters, rather than just pushing through those sequences as fast as I can. Without that engagement, I can't go with Bethesda. The only thing I think Bioware could learn from Bethesda is to at least show some appreciation for open-world environments, exploration, and of course, technical quality.

I do have to put a word in for Lionhead, though! Despite the slightly patronizing obviousness and excessive humor of Fable 2, they showed an impressive sense of charm and beauty in their art design that I think more RPG's should include. They seem to know what matters and what doesn't when it comes to pleasing the eye, and that on it's own can keep you coming back for more.

(edit): Wow, I just realized how old this thread is. I found it in a Google search, so I wasn't paying attention... oh well, call me a necromancer.

Look, i love Fallout 3 but with such a fascinating setting, couldn't they come up with a stronger storyline than "help your dad build the world's biggest brita filter?" Elder Scrolls have never featured very compelling stories, either. Also, while F3 was fun, first person is just not good for melee-based combat and the Elder Scrolls have proved this repeatedly.

Bioware usually tells great stories, and that's primarily why i pick up an RPG in the first place. I think they dropped the ball a bit with ME and JE but to really have this conversation, you have to go back to the days of Interplay when Bioware and Black Isle were producing the most phenomenal RPGs in the industry under the same roof. Torment (Black Isle) is still my favorite, but Baldur's Gate 2 comes very close.

BG2 shows Bioware's true potential as a game developer. BG2 was massive..so massive that you could spend so much time just doing subquests that you would literally forget what the main story was about (which happened to me). Some of them are simple dungeon raids, others would end with you owning a castle of your own, complete with staff that you would manage and quests involving said staff. I remember one where I think it was a guard was caught stealing money from me, but it turns out he did it to help pay for medicine for his family. There were so many decisions I could make here. I think I eventually chose to fire him, because I can't have guards stealing from me, but I also let him keep the money for his family. Another thing, people made a big deal about being able to get married and have a kid in Fable 2...yeah, BG2 did that almost 2 decades earlier. This is just one example of how BG2 was so far ahead of its time. It also had a lot of the things KotOR had such as dialogue trees and characters that responded to your actions. The combat system can be pretty much considered KotOR's great-grandaddy, but while KotOR is very similar in this regard, it's not nearly as deep or satisfying as BG2.

In many ways Bioware has never managed to reattain the heights it did with BG2, but seeing what they're doing with DragonAge and hearing the Bioware staff talking about getting back to their fantasy roots, I can't help but be excited. Bethesda is a pretty innovative company, but they just can't match Bioware at their best. Bioware also created Minsc and Boo...Bethesda just can't compete with that.

Bioware games tend to feel shallow and insubstantial, as though nothing is really deeper than two or three lines of dialogue. Their games also feel really sterile, and nothing has a sense of being lived in.

Bethesda is synonymous with arbitrary, and their games feel unfocused, messy, glitchy, and sorely unpolished.

Frankly neither is, in my mind, better, they just each have their positives and their negatives. I really miss Black Isle though, that was a company that knew what a rpg should be.

Also, old thread:P

i only own bioware´s MASS EFFECT

and bethedsa´s TES Oblivion

i loved both games but i have around 400 hrs gameplay on Oblivion, and around 50 on mass effect...obviusly cuz i enjoyed more Oblivion...so

i give my vote to Bethedsa

even tho i loved oblivion, Fallout 3 is just sooo likely to Oblivion, kinda lack of imagination

i keep my vote anyway