When will gamers transcend graphics?

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nameless12345

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#1 nameless12345
Member since 2010 • 15125 Posts

"The best games were the best not because of graphics but because they were the most fun to play."

The above statement is mine but I think you might get an idea what I'm trying to say here.

I don't care for "amazing quality HD texture mods" or "photo-realistic graphics", I care for good, original and fun games.

I have outgrown tech-demos and want more than that.

Tech-demos are good to showcase hardware but they aren't guarantee for a good game.

The industry and gamers are too centered around graphics, imo.

There are other aspects to games I care a lot more about than visual side of things.

Simply put, the best games were not the best because of graphics but for a lot different things.

So of course I dislike that every game is judged on it's graphics rather than other qualities (which are much more important).

If a game has bad graphics, it's gonna be ignored by most people, even if it has brilliant gameplay, replay value, originality, difficulty curve, ect.

Almost as if graphics and visual presentation were the determining factor for a good game.

Discuss.

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free_milk

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#2 free_milk
Member since 2011 • 3903 Posts

If your going to make terrible threads like me

then atleast

stop

writing them

like this

ok

because its

so dam annoying to read

write in a proper civilised way

stop

writing

like

thise

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bobbetybob

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#3 bobbetybob
Member since 2005 • 19370 Posts
When we all plug games directly into our brains. Like it or not graphics are an important part of a game, they're not needed to make a game good, but they can make a good game even better.
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BPoole96

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#4 BPoole96
Member since 2008 • 22818 Posts

I will never read one of your threads until you learn how to formulate a paragraph

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DarkLink77

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#5 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

Most of us have already.

Graphics don't make a great game. But graphical mods can give you a reason to go back to a game that is fun, but hasn't aged well in that department.

I recently modded DOOM 3 with the Sikkmod, and it makes the game a lot more atmospheric and increases the tension, which makes the game better. But most games don't really benefit from that sort of thing.

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MonsieurX

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#6 MonsieurX
Member since 2008 • 39858 Posts
Never
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Rocker6

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#7 Rocker6
Member since 2009 • 13358 Posts

For almost everyone, graphics are a very important factor while forming the initial impressions of a game. And yes, I do value visual qualities a lot in my games, I want my games to look good and eye-pleasing. If the game looks visually unappealing and dull, that's a large issue right there, since my immersion will quickly drop...

Lastly, don't mistake me for being a technical graphics whore. When I say visuals, I mean the overall visual style, made by both technical and artistic sides. For example, I consider Trine 2 one of the best looking games this gen thanks to its beautiful artstyle, while on the other hand, I consider BF3 very dull and bland, despite the advanced engine...

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jun_aka_pekto

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#8 jun_aka_pekto
Member since 2010 • 25255 Posts

When? Not for a while in my case. I like my games looking good too.

If you don't like graphics then stick with the older consoles. Or, if you're on the PC, turn the graphics settings down.

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Big_Pecks

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#9 Big_Pecks
Member since 2010 • 5973 Posts

Graphics are superficial. Gamers care too much about them but they don't dictate what makes a game good compared to other things.

So, like, never. Ever.

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deactivated-59b71619573a1

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#10 deactivated-59b71619573a1
Member since 2007 • 38222 Posts

Some gamers have, some gamers will but gamers as a whole will never

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PannicAtack

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#11 PannicAtack
Member since 2006 • 21040 Posts
Not every sentence is its own paragraph. You use a paragraph when you are moving to a new idea in your overall topic.
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Liquid_

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#12 Liquid_
Member since 2003 • 3832 Posts

.

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deactivated-5cd08b1605da1

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#13 deactivated-5cd08b1605da1
Member since 2012 • 9317 Posts

If a game has bad graphics, it's gonna be ignored by most people, even if it has brilliant gameplay, replay value, originality, difficulty curve, ect.

nameless12345

Minecraft disagrees with you

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deactivated-5cd08b1605da1

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#14 deactivated-5cd08b1605da1
Member since 2012 • 9317 Posts

Not every sentence is its own paragraph. You use a paragraph when you are moving to a new idea in your overall topic.PannicAtack

well, it makes things easier to read so theres that

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ultimate-k

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#15 ultimate-k
Member since 2010 • 2348 Posts

This topic as piss poor presentation, improve on your presentation OP so people will read your posts.

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sandbox3d

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#16 sandbox3d
Member since 2010 • 5166 Posts

I did this in the late 80's. Graphics are the very least important part of a game imo. Especially the tech side.

Today I've played Punch Out NES, Tetris a bit of Phantasy Star IV and now I'm about to get back to some Hotline Miami.

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GhoX

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#17 GhoX
Member since 2006 • 6267 Posts
"The best games were the best not because of graphics but because they were the most fun to play."nameless12345
That's wrong. The best games should have the best of everything, including graphics. Graphics is an inseparable part of gaming. A game that plays great but has terrible graphics can only ever be in the second place. No, I didn't read the rest of your thread because it has terrible format.
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Rocker6

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#18 Rocker6
Member since 2009 • 13358 Posts

[QUOTE="nameless12345"]"The best games were the best not because of graphics but because they were the most fun to play."GhoX
That's wrong. The best games should have the best of everything, including graphics. Graphics is an inseparable part of gaming. A game that plays great but has terrible graphics can only ever be in the second place. No, I didn't read the rest of your thread because it has terrible format.

Exactly!

I really can't understand this "graphics don't matter" mentality. Sure, graphics alone won't make a great game, but solid gameplay with bland and unimpressive visuals will also result in a flawed game. Like it or not, visuals are a very important part in games.

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moistsandwich

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#19 moistsandwich
Member since 2009 • 25 Posts

We've already started....

allow me to explain, every generation prior to our current one has been devs chasing ways to make visuals more realistic, more colors, more polygons, better lighting, etc.

This generation is the first one where many games that didn't push the envelope visually, were extremely successful.

What I mean is, the games didn't need to be visually impressive or even nice looking to gain attention in our industry. ie: Rayman: Origins (visually pleasing, not pushing the envelope graphicly), Journey, FTL, Minecraft.... none of them are pushing anything on a technical level, yet are well received pieces of software.... that many enjoy.

I enjoy some good eye candy, but its certainly not required for me to enjoy myself with a game. I think most people even on SW feel the same.

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moistsandwich

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#20 moistsandwich
Member since 2009 • 25 Posts

I did this in the late 80's. Graphics are the very least important part of a game imo. Especially the tech side.

Today I've played Punch Out NES, Tetris a bit of Phantasy Star IV and now I'm about to get back to some Hotline Miami.

sandbox3d

nice... I find Punch Out to be a game thats fun no matter the year. Tetris is also timeless.... PSIV, uhhh.... good game, though not something I'd play more than once. Don't even know what Hotline Miami is... think I'll go check it out now.

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Ly_the_Fairy

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#21 Ly_the_Fairy
Member since 2011 • 8541 Posts

I hope nobody ever "transcends" graphics.

What I do hope is that gamers transcend the mindset that the only thing powerful hardware brings is a higher polygon count.

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PannicAtack

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#22 PannicAtack
Member since 2006 • 21040 Posts

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]Not every sentence is its own paragraph. You use a paragraph when you are moving to a new idea in your overall topic.Vatusus

well, it makes things easier to read so theres that

Are you joking? Spacing every single sentence into its own line is every bit as much of an eyesore as a plain old wall of text. In fact, it might be its own sub-category within "wall of text."

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PAL360

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#23 PAL360
Member since 2007 • 30574 Posts

I love to play a good looking game, but gameplay is more important, obviouly.

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Zeviander

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#24 Zeviander
Member since 2011 • 9503 Posts
I hooked the Wii up last night and played a bunch of Donkey Kong Country Returns. Couldn't agree more. The games we remember 10 years on aren't the ones with the most photorealistic graphics.
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Zeviander

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#25 Zeviander
Member since 2011 • 9503 Posts
Are you joking? Spacing every single sentence into its own line is every bit as much of an eyesore as a plain old wall of text. In fact, it might be it's own sub-category within "wall of text."PannicAtack
It's the reason I stopped reading online news articles.
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DarkLink77

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#26 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

[QUOTE="GhoX"][QUOTE="nameless12345"]"The best games were the best not because of graphics but because they were the most fun to play."Rocker6

That's wrong. The best games should have the best of everything, including graphics. Graphics is an inseparable part of gaming. A game that plays great but has terrible graphics can only ever be in the second place. No, I didn't read the rest of your thread because it has terrible format.

Exactly!

I really can't understand this "graphics don't matter" mentality. Sure, graphics alone won't make a great game, but solid gameplay with bland and unimpressive visuals will also result in a flawed game. Like it or not, visuals are a very important part in games.

Bullsh!t. Which has been proven over and over and over again by indie developers and Nintendo.
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DarkLink77

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#27 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

I hooked the Wii up last night and played a bunch of Donkey Kong Country Returns. Couldn't agree more. The games we remember 10 years on aren't the ones with the most photorealistic graphics.Zeviander

I've been saying this for years.

Graphics aren't important. Noone goes back to games like FFVII, Chrono Trigger, Deus Ex, DOOM, Quake III, StarCraft, Super Mario Bros. 3 all these years later for the graphics. They go back because a great game is a great game, regardless of how pretty it is.

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Zeviander

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#28 Zeviander
Member since 2011 • 9503 Posts
I've been saying this for years.DarkLink77
Me too. Nobody listens.
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parkurtommo

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#29 parkurtommo
Member since 2009 • 28295 Posts

Yes, presentation is key in our society, if something looks bad, why would it NOT be bad?

And if a game is fun to play, fine, but does having good graphics take that fun away? If it does then I think you have serious issues lol.

I don't play games that aren't fun, no one does.

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sandbox3d

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#30 sandbox3d
Member since 2010 • 5166 Posts

[QUOTE="sandbox3d"]

I did this in the late 80's. Graphics are the very least important part of a game imo. Especially the tech side.

Today I've played Punch Out NES, Tetris a bit of Phantasy Star IV and now I'm about to get back to some Hotline Miami.

moistsandwich

nice... I find Punch Out to be a game thats fun no matter the year. Tetris is also timeless.... PSIV, uhhh.... good game, though not something I'd play more than once. Don't even know what Hotline Miami is... think I'll go check it out now.

Oh yeah, PSIV is nothing special today, but I havent played it since it came out and felt like giving it another go. Hotline Miami is crack! I heard about it here on SW a couple of days back and I've been hooked since.

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DarkLink77

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#31 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts
[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]I've been saying this for years.Zeviander
Me too. Nobody listens.

Right? It's ridiculous.
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SonySoldier-_-

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#32 SonySoldier-_-
Member since 2012 • 1186 Posts

yay another gameplay vs graphics thread.. *yawns* ... wake me when SW becomes entertaining again.

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vashkey

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#33 vashkey
Member since 2005 • 33781 Posts
Graphics are apart of feed back. It's a major part of the game. It's like asking when will comic book fans be satisfied with pre-school level art work.
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Ly_the_Fairy

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#34 Ly_the_Fairy
Member since 2011 • 8541 Posts

[QUOTE="Zeviander"][QUOTE="DarkLink77"]I've been saying this for years.DarkLink77
Me too. Nobody listens.

Right? It's ridiculous.

Acting pretentious is a good way to keep people from listening.

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Cranler

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#35 Cranler
Member since 2005 • 8809 Posts

If a game has bad graphics, it's gonna be ignored by most people

nameless12345

Cod looks like a turd on console.

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DarkLink77

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#36 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="Zeviander"] Me too. Nobody listens.Ly_the_Fairy

Right? It's ridiculous.

Acting pretentious is a good way to keep people from listening.

:lol: Has nothing to do with pretentiousness on this one.

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AznbkdX

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#37 AznbkdX
Member since 2012 • 4284 Posts

[QUOTE="Zeviander"]I hooked the Wii up last night and played a bunch of Donkey Kong Country Returns. Couldn't agree more. The games we remember 10 years on aren't the ones with the most photorealistic graphics.DarkLink77

I've been saying this for years.

Graphics aren't important. Noone goes back to games like FFVII, Chrono Trigger, Deus Ex, DOOM, Quake III, StarCraft, Super Mario Bros. 3 all these years later for the graphics. They go back because a great game is a great game, regardless of how pretty it is.

I've also been thinking this for years, but at the same time graphics also tend to bring unfortunate side effects in games as well that keeps many games from being great later on and are unfortunately usually only good based off of nostalgia.

The problem is that graphics from the past also usually equate to bad mechanics. Deus Ex nowadays is pretty hard to play at times since it not only looks ugly, but is clunky as well. Same for even Oot and such.

For present games however, graphics dont mean crap. So many ppl playing LOL and Minecraft indicates this. Later on though you will have the same issue as you did now for past games.

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Zeviander

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#38 Zeviander
Member since 2011 • 9503 Posts
Acting pretentious is a good way to keep people from listening.Ly_the_Fairy
You need a dictionary. Expressing an opinion, possibly one most don't agree with, isn't necessarily empty posturing or acting self-important. We both have some really good reasons to think the way we do.
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sandbox3d

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#39 sandbox3d
Member since 2010 • 5166 Posts

[QUOTE="Ly_the_Fairy"]Acting pretentious is a good way to keep people from listening.Zeviander
You need a dictionary. Expressing an opinion, possibly one most don't agree with, isn't necessarily empty posturing or acting self-important. We both have some really good reasons to think the way we do.

I bet if everyone here were to list all their favorite games of all time, very few of them would be considered graphical powerhouses. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Nothing pretentious about knowing that graphics do not make the game.

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DarkLink77

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#40 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

[QUOTE="Zeviander"]I hooked the Wii up last night and played a bunch of Donkey Kong Country Returns. Couldn't agree more. The games we remember 10 years on aren't the ones with the most photorealistic graphics.AznbkdX

I've been saying this for years.

Graphics aren't important. Noone goes back to games like FFVII, Chrono Trigger, Deus Ex, DOOM, Quake III, StarCraft, Super Mario Bros. 3 all these years later for the graphics. They go back because a great game is a great game, regardless of how pretty it is.

I've also been thinking this for years, but at the same time graphics also tend to bring unfortunate side effects in games as well that keeps many games from being great later on and are unfortunately usually only good based off of nostalgia.

The problem is that graphics from the past also usually equate to bad mechanics. Deus Ex nowadays is pretty hard to play at times since it not only looks ugly, but is clunky as well. Same for even Oot and such.

For present games however, graphics dont mean crap. So many ppl playing LOL and Minecraft indicates this. Later on though you will have the same issue as you did now for past games.

Deus Ex's graphics have nothing to do with the game being clunky. It's just the way the game was made. Also :lol: at OoT being clunky or hard to play. It holds up incredibly well. Graphical ugliness only makes the other issues with the game seem more exaggerated than they already are, which I agree with.
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Ly_the_Fairy

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#41 Ly_the_Fairy
Member since 2011 • 8541 Posts

[QUOTE="Ly_the_Fairy"]Acting pretentious is a good way to keep people from listening.Zeviander
You need a dictionary. Expressing an opinion, possibly one most don't agree with, isn't necessarily empty posturing or acting self-important. We both have some really good reasons to think the way we do.

But when you both express that opinion with additional responses like "nobody listens to this idea" as if everyone is some sort of uncultured gamer, and not to mention completely downplaying the importance of graphics to begin with, it does come off as pretentious.

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DarkLink77

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#42 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

[QUOTE="Zeviander"][QUOTE="Ly_the_Fairy"]Acting pretentious is a good way to keep people from listening.Ly_the_Fairy

You need a dictionary. Expressing an opinion, possibly one most don't agree with, isn't necessarily empty posturing or acting self-important. We both have some really good reasons to think the way we do.

But when you both express that opinion with additional responses like "nobody listens to this idea" as if everyone is some sort of uncultured gamer, and not to mention completely downplaying the importance of graphics to begin with, it does come off as pretentious.

Nobody said anyone else was uncultured. We just pointed out that most people disagree, which this thread is proof of. You're putting words in our mouths.
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AznbkdX

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#43 AznbkdX
Member since 2012 • 4284 Posts

[QUOTE="Zeviander"][QUOTE="Ly_the_Fairy"]Acting pretentious is a good way to keep people from listening.sandbox3d

You need a dictionary. Expressing an opinion, possibly one most don't agree with, isn't necessarily empty posturing or acting self-important. We both have some really good reasons to think the way we do.

I bet if everyone here were to list all their favorite games of all time, very few of them would be considered graphical powerhouses. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Nothing pretentious about knowing that graphics do not make the game.

Once again, they name it off of nostalgia more than anything.

There are boatloads of games today that are actually quite a bit better than your favorites from the past.

I'm only saying this because although I love Oot and even Mario 64, if you play any of the newer ones from the franchises, its night and day really.

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DarkLink77

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#44 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

[QUOTE="sandbox3d"]

[QUOTE="Zeviander"] You need a dictionary. Expressing an opinion, possibly one most don't agree with, isn't necessarily empty posturing or acting self-important. We both have some really good reasons to think the way we do.AznbkdX

I bet if everyone here were to list all their favorite games of all time, very few of them would be considered graphical powerhouses. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Nothing pretentious about knowing that graphics do not make the game.

Once again, they name it off of nostalgia more than anything.

There are boatloads of games today that are actually quite a bit better than your favorites from the past.

I'm only saying this because although I love Oot and even Mario 64, if you play any of the newer ones from the franchises, its night and day really.

This is blatantly false.

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sandbox3d

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#45 sandbox3d
Member since 2010 • 5166 Posts

[QUOTE="sandbox3d"]

[QUOTE="Zeviander"] You need a dictionary. Expressing an opinion, possibly one most don't agree with, isn't necessarily empty posturing or acting self-important. We both have some really good reasons to think the way we do.AznbkdX

I bet if everyone here were to list all their favorite games of all time, very few of them would be considered graphical powerhouses. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Nothing pretentious about knowing that graphics do not make the game.

Once again, they name it off of nostalgia more than anything.

There are boatloads of games today that are actually quite a bit better than your favorites from the past.

I'm only saying this because although I love Oot and even Mario 64, if you play any of the newer ones from the franchises, its night and day really.

A well designed game is a well designed game. I do agree, most games of today are only getting better, but some games of the past still hold up just as well. Games like Yoshis Island, or SotN for example. Every bit as good as a modern game. Even something like Ninja Gaiden Black. It may not be that old school, but its still one of the best games in its genre, if not THE best.

But even so, I'm not just talking about old games. There are plenty of new games with below average graphics that are simply amazing. None of my favorite games from this gen would be brought up in a graphics king thread, I can tell you that.

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AznbkdX

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#46 AznbkdX
Member since 2012 • 4284 Posts

[QUOTE="AznbkdX"]

[QUOTE="sandbox3d"]

I bet if everyone here were to list all their favorite games of all time, very few of them would be considered graphical powerhouses. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Nothing pretentious about knowing that graphics do not make the game.

DarkLink77

Once again, they name it off of nostalgia more than anything.

There are boatloads of games today that are actually quite a bit better than your favorites from the past.

I'm only saying this because although I love Oot and even Mario 64, if you play any of the newer ones from the franchises, its night and day really.

This is blatantly false.

For the most part, it really isn't.

Of course they are still fun games, and it really depends on the gamer themselves. Generally many ppl tend to see the next game as the next step. Just psychologically its easy to find inferiority in past games compared to new ones.

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organic_machine

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#47 organic_machine
Member since 2004 • 10143 Posts

I recently modded DOOM 3 with the Sikkmod, and it makes the game a lot more atmospheric and increases the tension, which makes the game better. But most games don't really benefit from that sort of thing.

DarkLink77

Uh huh. "How do I post in such a way that I can advertise my mod while still remaining relevant to the topic" much?

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AznbkdX

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#48 AznbkdX
Member since 2012 • 4284 Posts

[QUOTE="AznbkdX"]

[QUOTE="sandbox3d"]

I bet if everyone here were to list all their favorite games of all time, very few of them would be considered graphical powerhouses. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Nothing pretentious about knowing that graphics do not make the game.

sandbox3d

Once again, they name it off of nostalgia more than anything.

There are boatloads of games today that are actually quite a bit better than your favorites from the past.

I'm only saying this because although I love Oot and even Mario 64, if you play any of the newer ones from the franchises, its night and day really.

A well designed game is a well designed game. I do agree, most games of today are only getting better, but some games of the past still hold up just as well. Games like Yoshis Island, or SotN for example. Every bit as good as a modern game. Even something like Ninja Gaiden Black. It may not be that old school, but its still one of the best games in its genre, if not THE best.

But even so, I'm not just talking about old games. There are plenty of new games with below average graphics that are simply amazing. None of my favorite games from this gen would be brought up in a graphics king thread, I can tell you that.

I love me some Okami and other artstyle types of games, so I can agree with you there :).

Off of old games however... they were great for their time. Its not hard to see that the series evolve normally for the better. It might not seem that way only because you are used to the old way of doing it. For the most part, outdated mechanics are usually surpassed in future games, and by quite a bit.

Its funny because even if mechanics are surpassed much of the time, that doesn't mean that the new mechanics are any good for their place in the present time. That's probably what ppl mix up when remembering games.

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DarkLink77

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#49 DarkLink77
Member since 2004 • 32731 Posts

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

I recently modded DOOM 3 with the Sikkmod, and it makes the game a lot more atmospheric and increases the tension, which makes the game better. But most games don't really benefit from that sort of thing.

organic_machine

Uh huh. "How do I post in such a way that I can advertise my mod while still remaining relevant to the topic" much?

...

I didn't make Sikkmod, you ignorant f*ck, nor do I have anything to do with it.

It was wildly popular among the DOOM 3 community before I posted in this, but you'd know that if you didn't have you head so far up your ass trying to look smart at the expense of others.

I was just showing how improved graphics/lighting can improve a game, but no, I had to be advertising a mod for a game you can't buy on PC anymore since the release of the BFG Edition, because that's thye only reason I would bring a well-known mod that makes the game more enjoyable by making the graphics better in a thread about whether or not graphics matter in video games. :roll:

Moron.

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Zeviander

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#50 Zeviander
Member since 2011 • 9503 Posts
But when you both express that opinion with additional responses like "nobody listens to this idea" as if everyone is some sort of uncultured gamer, and not to mention completely downplaying the importance of graphics to begin with, it does come off as pretentious.Ly_the_Fairy
Uncultured? Strawman much? The vast majority of gamers these days, especially those who do not frequent message boards, are very easily impressed by pretty visuals without any substance to back it up. And we are downplaying the importance of graphics because we are trying to make a point. You still don't seem to understand the definition of "pretentious" and are throwing it around like it legitimizes your point.