What's the best RPG from a western dev?

I'm talking the entirety of video game history. What is the very best RPG that came from a western developer, in your opinion?

Baldur's Gate 2, I think.

Mass Effect from BioWare.

I really enjoyed Pillars of Eternity ... i want to say Mass Effect 2, but i think it hardly qualifies as an RPG.

Disco Elysium. It does what it sets out to do, and does so fantastically.

Combatwise, I would argue Jagged Alliance 2, then Temple of Elemental Evil. Divinity: Original Sin has good ideas, but is held back by stat bloat.

Planescape Torment from black isle, Baldurs gate 2 from bioware and Ultima 7 from origin! Oh yeah and Might and magic world of xeen (4+5 combined)

I was gonna say the same about ME1. Great games, but somehow they seem to stretch the definition of RPG.

Donno. Fav modern one is UnderRail.

It does stealth really well.

I'm mixed on this because mechanically, yeah, they are not really heavy on things like building a characters, dice rolls, etc. and things like that. You get some skill choices, sure, but not a whole lot else.

But at the same time, the core essence of an RPG is role-playing. Taking on the personality of another character, assuming a role, and acting as you would in whatever universe that character dwells.

I think in the latter, Mass Effect (and other action-RPG's) are very much role-playing games.

maybe Morrowind?

i'm probably biased since its the first RPG I played. but damn it blew my tits off as a kid.

Edit: Mass Effect is also a strong choice, that first game was so damn good despite the combat being the weakest of the trilogy. just had such great world building and start to the story of the trilogy.

As an overall package, Baldur’s Gate 2 Shadows of Amn. Planescape may have had better writing, and Icewind Dale 1/2 better combat flow, but BG2 sans expansion was a massive, packed game full of actual quests (ie not fetch) and a sense of wonder and adventure. I still remember first emerging from the starter dungeon into Waukeen's Promenade and experiencing the same sense of being lost that the player character is. And on my 6th playthrough, STILL finding new quests and secrets.

I enjoyed Throne of Baal for its mechanical additions and story closure, but that expansion marked the beginning of BioWare’s love of fake choices and the “must go to all 4 hubs in any order” formula they’ve used ever since.

Ah, shit, I love Secret of Evermore. Never see anyone mention it. The story and atmosphere were awesome. More of an action RPG, but yeah. Great game.

Nothing has yet topped the Witcher 3.

Fallout or Mass Effect.

Yeah definitely, in that case i have to go with Mass Effect 2.

Deus Ex.

Probably best game ever made.

I would say Oblivion. I love Skyrim and Fable 2, but I prefer Oblivion.

Witcher 3 for me, and it's my favorite open world.

Unpopular opinion, but...

Fable

I remember this game getting quite a bit of hate, because Peter Molyneux failed to keep his promises (as usual) and it deviates somewhat from a typical WRPG formula. But it's a great game in its own right. As someone who didn't care much for WRPGs, this game sucked me into its world like no other. It felt almost like Zelda meets GTA, but better than GTA (though not as good as Zelda).

Been meaning to play Xeen for years.

@Maroxad: "stat bloat"?

Yeah, kinda scratched my head on that one too. I love the emphasis on stats in D:OS.

Deus Ex

Stats in Original Sin 2 scaling too much for my liking. I am a bigger fan of systems like Jagged Alliance where stat ranges are aroung 60-100

I have to go with Secret of Evermore as well.

But I’m sure there was a few great ones during the super nes and genesis days

@neogeo2k2: The Secret of Evermore love in here is great. Some of my fondest gaming memories come from that game.

My top three would probably include Disco Elysium, Planescape Torment, and...Fallout 2? Vampire Bloodlines? There's a ton of competition for that third slot.

My top three would be:

1. Fable

2. World of Warcraft

3. A Blurred Line

I'm gonna go with Fable, Jade Empire, KOTOR 1 & 2.

Did you know someone on here once said the OG Xbox was bad, I know what a silly take hey lol.

The Xbox brand only began sucking when MS began focusing on Kinect. That is where Xbox died, and after all these years, its far from recovering.

@hardwenzen:

"That is where Xbox died, and after all these years, its far from recovering"

How does one recover if they have already died?

Gulag, or you can be bought back by your teammate. Haven't you seen Warzone, bro?

@hardwenzen: All I see is your tripping and falling all the time, could I suggest a helmet?

So what are your faves?

@fedor: The same a ghost, sure you don't want a mulligan lol.

You asked me how, i told you how. Why is so hard to understand?

@last_lap: Its the one solid opinion he has.

Ghosts is forever on the broken clock rule. Gets a good take every now and again. Just can't dig below the surface, the reasoning will be just as dumb and hypocritical as anything else he says lol.

Divinity Original Sin 2.

But I never did play Baldur's Gate 2. BG3 will be my first Baldur's Gate expereince.

@hardwenzen: 🥱

You're getting too old, bro. Falling asleep on a gaming forum is very boomer of you.

Oh my! You're moaning about the massive build flexibility in Divinity as well??? BRO. You're becoming the most casual casual on SW. I give you 12 months, and even the next 3D mario will offer too much for your liking.

Its hard when zen levels are so low.

There's a reason why everyone calls me tryhardwenzen, i never go low. Its simply not my style, bro.

@nod_calypse: you really should and while it is a bit outdated in terms of graphics etc it’s one of the few games that doesn’t suffer much from it imo. And that is coming from someone who in general can’t play old games due to outdated graphic etc. I still play Xeen every couple of years!

Stat bloat, or numbers bloat is when numbers scale like crazy. HP, damage, you name it. This has numerous negative impacts on the game itself,

1. Gear does not stay relevant for long, legendary weapons and armor are junk compared to even generic counterparts that are 2-3 levels higher.
2. Being overlevelled trivializes encounters.
3. Numbers become extremely gamey. And becomes an arms race, rather than an actually interesting part of the gameplay. All stats have to be built around the arms race and damage stats reign supreme.

There is a reason the definitive edition reduced numbers bloat, even the devs seemed to think it was too much. Consider playing games with low number scaling. You might start seeing the issue.

1- Its called vertical progression. Literally in every game that has it🤷‍♂️
2- Happens in every game. Nothing to do with stat bloat.
3- No idea what you're trying to say here.

The only bloat i've seen in both Divinity titles and RDR2 for that matter, is worthless items that fill your inventory.

1. The armors of legend are junk compared to some random piece of cloth... dropped by some random zombie on the other half of the island. That is TERRIBLE design. It also limits your options based on your progression. Items will need a level requirement to prevent players from sneaking in to the other side, cheesing a drop, then steamroll the part where they are supposed to be.

2. So you think it is good that a tactical game loses all its tactics, because you have bigger numbers? Not to mention your statement is false. In RPGs with low scaling, you even a goblin can be a threat to a high level character. If Magic gets blown up by a grenade in JA2, no ammount of arbitary levels will save his life.

3. In games with low scaling. Numbers are more normalized and thus more easily balanced. In high scaling games, incl D:OS2, damage is almost always king. Because keepign up with the arms race is king, players will usually stick to a single stat and pump that up to keep up in the arms race. Another cool instance of low scaling, is how numbers work. Fall damage can properly work without being % based. Which means, a lot of interesting things can occur from a design point. Environmental damage can factor into gameplay in much more interesting ways.

If you actually think Numbers bloat is a good thing, I would probably recommend you Disgaea. Personally, I prefer it when my tactical games, focus on the tactics, rather than the numbers. But I guess the less skilled players. Need big numbers to compensate for their low IQs.

Funny you say that, cause Mario Odyssey had way too much fluff going on. Mario 64 was tight as hell with its 120 stars to collect. Odyssey with its 800 moons just spat those things out everywhere and often gave you 3 moons at a time, for whatever reason. It kinda sucked.