"I’m not a big fan of Xbox One and a half. If we’re going to move forward, I want to move forward in big numbers," Spencer said. "I don’t know anything about any of the rumors that are out there, but I can understand other teams’ motivations to do that. For us, our box is doing well. It performs, it’s reliable, the servers are doing well. If we’re going to go forward with anything, like I said, I want it to be a really substantial change for people – an upgrade."
Now, this could just be a red herring, but I've been extremely suspicious about the lack of rumors compared to PS4k and even NX. If the idea hadn't been hinted at by Microsoft, we might not have even suspected that it's in the works. It would be interesting though, as not competing with PS4k would actually be an effective strategy for tackling it; how many devs are going to want to put the extra work in to make a game look a lot different on a single console? If MS isn't planning a new iteration, PS4k might get nothing more than resolution bumps and higher frame rates, as well as better VR support.
I think he's probably just being secretive, but we'll see how this plays out. Either way, I think it's a safe bet that it won't launch before PS4k, and both will launch after NX.
I don't know why everyone just assumed they where doing this?
PS4.5 came from legit sources, people just seemed to assume that X1 would follow suite. Honestly, they probably will release an X1E at some point, but it'll just be a slimmer version of the X1.
Microsoft have already shown their answer to having the lesser of the two systems, which is to offer their games on PC. This way console gamers have their option, but with inferior versions, and for those who want the games looking and running better, they have PC. Offering a third option, doesn't really benefit them in any real way.
This guy talks so much shit, really. On one hand he says they will upgrade mid gen then says he doesn't want to do Xbox One 1.5 so are they doing Xbox Two mid gen then? The man's a f***ing idiot.
Just as I suspected. Phil did throw bullshit around with his last statement because he got wind of Sonys plans (not really hard to get those infos, lol) and did not want to look like a fool and being behind the times at E3 so he said that Xbox would get an upgrade. Now that he saw a relativ negativ response online and he startet his famous flip flopping.
"I’m not a big fan of Xbox One and a half. If we’re going to move forward, I want to move forward in big numbers," Spencer said. "I don’t know anything about any of the rumors that are out there, but I can understand other teams’ motivations to do that. For us, our box is doing well. It performs, it’s reliable, the servers are doing well. If we’re going to go forward with anything, like I said, I want it to be a really substantial change for people – an upgrade."
Now, this could just be a red herring, but I've been extremely suspicious about the lack of rumors compared to PS4k and even NX. If the idea hadn't been hinted at by Microsoft, we might not have even suspected that it's in the works. It would be interesting though, as not competing with PS4k would actually be an effective strategy for tackling it; how many devs are going to want to put the extra work in to make a game look a lot different on a single console? If MS isn't planning a new iteration, PS4k might get nothing more than resolution bumps and higher frame rates, as well as better VR support.
I think he's probably just being secretive, but we'll see how this plays out. Either way, I think it's a safe bet that it won't launch before PS4k, and both will launch after NX.
What I take from this is that he isn't saying we won't be seeing a new console sooner than expected, just that he wants the next box to be more than an incremental upgrade. I'm gonna guess it might be a 2017 launch then, but if PS4K comes out this year then it's going to be a rough year for Microsoft's Xbox division.
We are getting midgen console refreshes from both Sony and Microsoft, so get use to it guys. There is no way Microsoft is just gonna sit around and let Sony release a new PS4K without having something in the works to combat it. They will want to compete on a level playing field.
"I’m not a big fan of Xbox One and a half. If we’re going to move forward, I want to move forward in big numbers," Spencer said. "I don’t know anything about any of the rumors that are out there, but I can understand other teams’ motivations to do that. For us, our box is doing well. It performs, it’s reliable, the servers are doing well. If we’re going to go forward with anything, like I said, I want it to be a really substantial change for people – an upgrade."
Now, this could just be a red herring, but I've been extremely suspicious about the lack of rumors compared to PS4k and even NX. If the idea hadn't been hinted at by Microsoft, we might not have even suspected that it's in the works. It would be interesting though, as not competing with PS4k would actually be an effective strategy for tackling it; how many devs are going to want to put the extra work in to make a game look a lot different on a single console? If MS isn't planning a new iteration, PS4k might get nothing more than resolution bumps and higher frame rates, as well as better VR support.
I think he's probably just being secretive, but we'll see how this plays out. Either way, I think it's a safe bet that it won't launch before PS4k, and both will launch after NX.
What I take from this is that he isn't saying we won't be seeing a new console sooner than expected, just that he wants the next box to be more than an incremental upgrade. I'm gonna guess it might be a 2017 launch then, but if PS4K comes out this year then it's going to be a rough year for Microsoft's Xbox division.
We are getting midgen console refreshes from both Sony and Microsoft, so get use to it guys. There is no way Microsoft is just gonna sit around and let Sony release a new PS4K without having something in the works to combat it. They will want to compete on a level playing field.
I do expect this to be the future, but as I said before, the funny thing about it is that it hurts Sony more if there's not something to compete with it since very few devs are going to put in the extra work unless it's easy to just port over some Ultra PC settings. Also, there's no way either of them will launch in 2016. I'd be absolutely shocked (on top of questioning Sony's sanity). NX likely will, but that's also extremely unlikely to compete with with those two. I mean, the only reason Nintendo would have even considered it is if they new these refreshes were going to happen.
I think he's right, if you're not going to do a substantial upgrade... Why bother ?
Yeah, I don't think he wants to do a minor upgrade. He wanted it to be substantial and able to handle all those Win10 PC games in 1440 resolution with not much effort, I'm sure. I hope they give us more info at the E3.
Strange, because if I recall Spencer had mentioned "upgradeable hardware" in the future for consoles, not necessarily a console upgrade. Maybe I'm wrong but I took that to mean one box, that we could possibly upgrade with components. Not an entirely new console.
Yep. That's pretty much what polygon and the bitbag was seeing as well. Seems like the people here might've filled in the blanks and spun what the man said. He clarified as a future where not waiting as long for console upgrades is what he referred to but never said ms was doing it now.
They might not be a fan, but if the PS4K sells, they will do something.
It took them a year+ to respond to the PS3 slim with a 360 slim. So while a "slim" XB1 is likely inevitable (if not already in advanced protototyping), they might not have really considered upgrading components. If the PS4K sells, and causes an even bigger performance gap in games, then they cant just sit on their hands IMO.
That makes no sense. The bone will get ridiculed if its running games at 720p/30fps and the same game is being played in 1080p/60fps on the ps4k. If the jump on the PS4k is minor then sure, its useless but if it isn't... the Bone is truly boned. The whole Xbox division is bone.
Probably looked at the stock of Bones in China and Japan and places in Europe and did the sums on how many would have to go into landfill if they announced anything and thought against it.
As far as i remember it's 7th Windows which use the same new concept of Windows which started with win 95 or something like that.
No, it wasn't related to that at all. Vista was NT 6.0 (95 was NOT NT), but 7 was 6.1. It was the sixth or 8th version of Windows NT, and the 6th consumer version of Windows with a desktop, unless you count both 2000 and ME as consumer versions. Microsoft just can't count.
Hmmm, interesting. Does this basically mean that this "PS4.5" isn't going to be as much of an upgrade as we think then? Because I can't imagine that MS would allow Sony to increase the console power gap even more.
Hmmm, interesting. Does this basically mean that this "PS4.5" isn't going to be as much of an upgrade as we think then? Because I can't imagine that MS would allow Sony to increase the console power gap even more.
I don't think people are waiting for another console, a power increase would be nice but not a cost. A ps4 that can handle 4k, can also handle games that can't run on the normal ps4, which means it would get exclusives.
A lot of people have been buying ps4's but let's be honest, there aren't a lot of games on it, just like on the x1 and wii u. A ps4k would be for a select crowd, so it wouldn't very successfull.
@commander: How in the hell with a straight face can you (and others) say the ps4 has no games, is this some sort of online joke at this point?!? It's got a huge library of games with more exclusives coming out this year, its to the point already that I can't keep up with all the games I'd love to play.
@commander: How in the hell with a straight face can you (and others) say the ps4 has no games, is this some sort of online joke at this point?!? It's got a huge library of games with more exclusives coming out this year, its to the point already that I can't keep up with all the games I'd love to play.
Microsoft would be wise to just wait until PS4.5 comes out and then release a true successor to the Xbox One about a year later. If they include high-end components that crush PS4.5, they could recoup the money lost on hardware by raising XBL's subscription fee or have an online only policy where XBL Gold is required for the console to function. Console gamers want the best looking versions of Madden and COD, so I could see Microsoft touting the Next Box as the "true next gen console" or some shit, citing its advantages over NX/PS4K.
He's jelly...hence the term "one and a half" to try and make sony look bad.
Jelly of?
that the PS4 not only has better hardware to begin with but is further increasing them specs.....MS are clearly in a shitty position. They are INDEED some what jealous.
HE'S A BLOODY HYPOCRITE. MADE GAMERS PURCHASE XBOX ONE ON PROMISES OF EXCLUSIVES, NOW TURNED LOYALTY TOWARDS PC GAMERS AND WINDOWS 10 BRINGING MOST OF THE EXCLUSIVES FOR MORE SALES.
He's jelly...hence the term "one and a half" to try and make sony look bad.
Jelly of?
that the PS4 not only has better hardware to begin with but is further increasing them specs.....MS are clearly in a shitty position. They are INDEED some what jealous.
Why would they be jealous, they can release their own upgrade which could match the PS4.5 whenever they like or they could wait a bit, it's up to them.
new 3DS, PS4K, Xb1.5 are horrible hardware philosophy. This is not how you run a console generation
+1
In the end it might hurt them this philosophy of upgradable consoles every 3 years. Why? Because many people , I included , will think twice before they buy a console and not a PC .
"I’m not a big fan of Xbox One and a half. If we’re going to move forward, I want to move forward in big numbers," Spencer said. "I don’t know anything about any of the rumors that are out there, but I can understand other teams’ motivations to do that. For us, our box is doing well. It performs, it’s reliable, the servers are doing well. If we’re going to go forward with anything, like I said, I want it to be a really substantial change for people – an upgrade."
Now, this could just be a red herring, but I've been extremely suspicious about the lack of rumors compared to PS4k and even NX. If the idea hadn't been hinted at by Microsoft, we might not have even suspected that it's in the works. It would be interesting though, as not competing with PS4k would actually be an effective strategy for tackling it; how many devs are going to want to put the extra work in to make a game look a lot different on a single console? If MS isn't planning a new iteration, PS4k might get nothing more than resolution bumps and higher frame rates, as well as better VR support.
I think he's probably just being secretive, but we'll see how this plays out. Either way, I think it's a safe bet that it won't launch before PS4k, and both will launch after NX.
Options
1. Move to 14 nm FinFET Polaris 11 which is smaller than XBO's GPU. XBO's GPU is about 160 mm^2 which is about same size as 7790.
Polaris 10 = 232 mm^2 with at least 36 CU at 800Mhz. http://techfrag.com/2016/03/25/amd-polaris-10-gpu-specs-leaked/ For comparison, 7870/R9-270X's chip size is 212 mm^2.
Based on AMD's Hitman 2016 with max details 1440p/60 fps results, Polaris 10 matches R9-390X (44 CU) or Fury Pro (56 CU) or Fury Nano (64 CU) level result. This Polaris 10 version is packaged within Fury Nano size card. http://www.dsogaming.com/news/amd-polaris-showcased-running-hitman-at-1440p-60fps-total-war-warhammer-will-support-dx12/
Based from AMD's picture
Polaris 11 estimated chip size is 108 mm^2 with 18 CU count. 40 watts version has at least R9-270X/GTX 950 level performance.
For comparison, 7770/R7-250X (10 CU) chip size is 123 mm^2.
From https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNA6fll2DDQ
Polaris 11 at 40 watts delivered Star Wars Battlefront with 1920x1080p/ 60 fps which is 2X over XBO's 1280x720p/~60 result.
Scaled Polaris 11 to 100 watts would be near 2X GTX 950/R9-270X i.e. it would meet PC's minimum VR spec i.e. R9-290.
2. MS pays for current XBO's APU die shrink into 16 nm or 14 nm process tech themselves and keep the current preforamce levels i.e. R7-260 with 853Mhz down clock.
3. Stay in 28 nm process tech.
Moving to lowest Polaris 11 at 40 watts is slightly more than 2X over XBO.
For PS4K, Sony can actually select Polaris 11, scale it to 100 watts and still reach PC's minimum VR spec i.e. R9-290.
Keep in mind, Polaris 11 is the candidate GPU for PC's next AMD APU for replacing AMD's current FX-8800p APU (8 CU). Current AMD FX-8800p's IGP chip size is around 100 mm^2.
If MS didn't keep pace, Xbox One will be rendered irrelevant by fleet PCs with AMD "FX-9800p" APUs.
Haha I don't even know what's going on anymore. Too confusing. Is MS gonna let Sony release an upgraded console uncontested, or does he mean that MS:s version will be much more powerful?
"I’m not a big fan of Xbox One and a half. If we’re going to move forward, I want to move forward in big numbers," Spencer said. "I don’t know anything about any of the rumors that are out there, but I can understand other teams’ motivations to do that. For us, our box is doing well. It performs, it’s reliable, the servers are doing well. If we’re going to go forward with anything, like I said, I want it to be a really substantial change for people – an upgrade."
Now, this could just be a red herring, but I've been extremely suspicious about the lack of rumors compared to PS4k and even NX. If the idea hadn't been hinted at by Microsoft, we might not have even suspected that it's in the works. It would be interesting though, as not competing with PS4k would actually be an effective strategy for tackling it; how many devs are going to want to put the extra work in to make a game look a lot different on a single console? If MS isn't planning a new iteration, PS4k might get nothing more than resolution bumps and higher frame rates, as well as better VR support.
I think he's probably just being secretive, but we'll see how this plays out. Either way, I think it's a safe bet that it won't launch before PS4k, and both will launch after NX.
Options
1. Move to 14 nm FinFET Polaris 11 which is smaller than XBO's GPU. XBO's GPU is about 160 mm^2 which is about same size as 7790.
Polaris 10 = 232 mm^2 with at least 36 CU at 800Mhz. http://techfrag.com/2016/03/25/amd-polaris-10-gpu-specs-leaked/ For comparison, 7870/R9-270X's chip size is 212 mm^2.
Based on AMD's Hitman 2016 with max details 1440p/60 fps results, Polaris 10 matches R9-390X (44 CU) or Fury Pro (56 CU) or Fury Nano (64 CU) level result. This Polaris 10 version is packaged within Fury Nano size card. http://www.dsogaming.com/news/amd-polaris-showcased-running-hitman-at-1440p-60fps-total-war-warhammer-will-support-dx12/
Based from AMD's picture
Polaris 11 estimated chip size is 108 mm^2 with 18 CU count. 40 watts version has at least R9-270X/GTX 950 level performance.
For comparison, 7770/R7-250X (10 CU) chip size is 123 mm^2.
From https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNA6fll2DDQ
Polaris 11 at 40 watts delivered Star Wars Battlefront with 1920x1080p/ 60 fps which is 2X over XBO's 1280x720p/~60 result.
Scaled Polaris 11 to 100 watts would be near 2X GTX 950/R9-270X i.e. it would meet PC's minimum VR spec i.e. R9-290.
2. MS pays for current XBO's APU die shrink into 16 nm or 14 nm process tech themselves and keep the current preforamce levels i.e. R7-260 with 853Mhz down clock.
3. Stay in 28 nm process tech.
Moving to lowest Polaris 11 at 40 watts is slightly more than 2X over XBO.
For PS4K, Sony can actually select Polaris 11, scale it to 100 watts and still reach PC's minimum VR spec i.e. R9-290.
Keep in mind the Polaris 11 is the candidate GPU for PC's next AMD APU for replacing AMD FX-8800p APU (8 CU). Current AMD FX-8800p's IGP chip size is around 100 mm^2.
If MS didn't keep pace, Xbox One will be rendered irrelevant by fleet PCs with AMD "FX-9800p" APUs.
This is all under the assumption that current games would still be able to work 100% natively on Polaris without any issues. From the way that PS4k was described, I doubt that this is the case; it sounds like a die shrinks with more CUs added and not much more. Also, 2x is much smaller jump than you think it is.
Haha I don't even know what's going on anymore. Too confusing. Is MS gonna let Sony release an upgraded console uncontested, or does he mean that MS:s version will be much more powerful?
Polaris 11 at 40 watts will give you 2X over XBO.
Polaris 11 at 100 watts may give you 4X over XBO with 20 watts being wasted for leakage.
AMD is moving to 14 nm FinFET with it's own money.
Haha I don't even know what's going on anymore. Too confusing. Is MS gonna let Sony release an upgraded console uncontested, or does he mean that MS:s version will be much more powerful?
Polaris 11 at 40 watts will give you 2X over XBO.
Polaris 11 at 100 watts may give you 4X over XBO with 20 watts being wasted for leakage.
AMD is moving to 14 nm FinFET with it's own money.
Just to make sure I get this (not that savy) you are saying that Xbox could make a significant leap right now within the constraint of a typical console price?
Haha I don't even know what's going on anymore. Too confusing. Is MS gonna let Sony release an upgraded console uncontested, or does he mean that MS:s version will be much more powerful?
Polaris 11 at 40 watts will give you 2X over XBO.
Polaris 11 at 100 watts may give you 4X over XBO with 20 watts being wasted for leakage.
AMD is moving to 14 nm FinFET with it's own money.
Just to make sure I get this (not that savy) you are saying that Xbox could make a significant leap right now within the constraint of a typical console price?
That's what he's saying, but "significant" is subjective and he may be underestimating the price and overestimating the availability of these components. Basically, he thinks that this 4x increase is possible in a $400 console, but he's very likely wrong on that front. He's also assuming that the changes in in the Polaris-GCN architecture aren't significant enough to affect compatibility. We can't say that for sure at this point. He's also completely ignoring the fact that a much more powerful CPU and much faster (and possibly even a bit more) RAM would be needed. He's also assuming that a full Polaris 10 will cost $200-250. I don't see that happening at all, but let's wait.
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