Special counsel Robert Mueller did not find Donald Trump's campaign or associates conspired with Russia

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Jacanuk

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#1  Edited By Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts

Well, no collusion and no obstruction.

Even though CNN and the Democrats have already begun the spin, it´s got be a massive blow to the Democrats and if nothing else this will ignite the Republicans even more.

Special counsel Robert Mueller did not find Donald Trump's campaign or associates conspired with Russia, Attorney General William Barr said Sunday.

Mueller also did not have sufficient evidence to prosecute obstruction of justice, Barr wrote, but he did not exonerate the President."The special counsel's investigation did not find that the Trump campaign or anyone associated with it conspired or coordinated with Russia in its efforts to influence the 2016 U.S. Presidential Election," the four-page letter sent to Congress states.Barr and Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein decided the evidence was "not sufficient" to support a prosecution of the President for obstruction of justice.Read: Justice Department summary of Mueller report"While this report does not conclude that the President committed a crime, it also does not exonerate him," Barr quotes Mueller as saying.Democrats have demanded that Barr make Mueller's full report public and provide the special counsel's underlying evidence to Congress. They are threatening to subpoena and take the Trump administration to court if they're not satisfied with what the Justice Department provides."We will try to negotiate. We will try everything else first. But if we have to, yes, we will certainly issue subpoenas to get that information," House Judiciary Chairman Jerry Nadler said on CNN's "State of the Union" Sunday.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/24/politics/mueller-report-release/index.html

https://www.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/dojletter0324.pdf <----- The whole letter

Interesting though that Democrats seem to have turned over the fundamental justice rule of law in our land , and made it "guilty no matter"

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Master_Live

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#2 Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts
  • No collusion: says Mueller.
  • No obstruction: says Barr and Rosenstein.
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PraetorianMan

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#3 PraetorianMan
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Yeah the no collusion charge became obvious since Friday once it became clear that Trump Jr wasn’t getting indicted. The no obstruction part is far more questionable; mueller was not willing to indict OR exonerate Trump; this is mostly coming from. Barr’s personal opinion that trump shouldn’t be charged.

Trump himself pretty well explained how firing Comey was either obstruction or a straight up abuse of power. I’d rather read the whole report on that specific issue

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N64DD

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#4 N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

Here comes the spin!

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ZmanBarzel

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#5 ZmanBarzel
Member since 2014 • 3138 Posts

“‘While this report does not conclude that the President committed a crime, it also does not exonerate him,’ Barr quotes Mueller as saying.”

And the fun continues...

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Master_Live

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#6 Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

Too bad I got work to do, would love to watch cable news endlessly, specially MSNBC.

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Jacanuk

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#7 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@zmanbarzel said:

“‘While this report does not conclude that the President committed a crime, it also does not exonerate him,’ Barr quotes Mueller as saying.”

And the fun continues...

The fun indeed begins, because in America you are innoncent until proven guilty, so if Mueller found there was not enough evidence , it does not mean Trump is guilty but bad luck, it means that Trump is innoncent.

But the spin is fun to watch, thank god this happened on a Sunday and not tomorrow and I had to work lol.

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Master_Live

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#8  Edited By Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

How soon do Democrats, liberals, "The Left" turn on Mueller?

Joy Reid already did.

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Jacanuk

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#9 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@Master_Live said:

How soon do Democrats, liberals, "The Left" turn on Mueller?

They already have, can´t remember what show but CNN already showed clips from some pundit who called it a cover-up and Mueller is paid off by Trump.

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Solaryellow

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#10  Edited By Solaryellow
Member since 2013 • 7034 Posts

The passages from the AG letter I found most interesting in regards to obstruction:

"In making this determination, we noted that the Special Counsel recognized that "the evidence does not establish that the President was involved in an underlying crime related to Russian election interference," and that, while not determinative, the absence of such evidence bears upon the President's intent with respect to obstruction. Generally speaking, to obtain and sustain an obstruction conviction, the government would need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that a person, acting with corrupt intent, engaged in obstructive conduct with a sufficient nexus to a pending or contemplated proceeding. In cataloguing the President's actions, many of which took place in public view, the report identifies no actions that, in our judgment, constitute obstructive conduct, had a nexus to a pending or contemplated proceeding, and were done with corrupt intent, each of which, under the Department's principles of federal prosecution guiding charging decisions, would need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt to establish an obstruction-of­-justice offense."

Just like they (lefties) bet the farm on Klinton winning the presidency and losing, they did the same with Muller.

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ZmanBarzel

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#11 ZmanBarzel
Member since 2014 • 3138 Posts

@Jacanuk said:
@zmanbarzel said:

“‘While this report does not conclude that the President committed a crime, it also does not exonerate him,’ Barr quotes Mueller as saying.”

And the fun continues...

The fun indeed begins, because in America you are innoncent until proven guilty, so if Mueller found there was not enough evidence , it does not mean Trump is guilty but bad luck, it means that Trump is innoncent.

But the spin is fun to watch, thank god this happened on a Sunday and not tomorrow and I had to work lol.

No, it's only in the criminal justice system that you are innocent until proven guilty. The world outside of the courts doesn't work like that.

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Master_Live

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#12  Edited By Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

People that should testify before Congress regarding the content of this Report:

  • Mueller
  • Barr
  • Rosenstein
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Jacanuk

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#13 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@zmanbarzel said:
@Jacanuk said:
@zmanbarzel said:

“‘While this report does not conclude that the President committed a crime, it also does not exonerate him,’ Barr quotes Mueller as saying.”

And the fun continues...

The fun indeed begins, because in America you are innoncent until proven guilty, so if Mueller found there was not enough evidence , it does not mean Trump is guilty but bad luck, it means that Trump is innoncent.

But the spin is fun to watch, thank god this happened on a Sunday and not tomorrow and I had to work lol.

No, it's only in the criminal justice system that you are innocent until proven guilty. The world outside of the courts doesn't work like that.

You are right public opinion is the public's to do with what they want. But any serious media should not come out and pretty much turn the key component in any justice system upside down and when the report is not to their liking cry out wolf wolf wolf.

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Solaryellow

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#14 Solaryellow
Member since 2013 • 7034 Posts

According to Carl Bernstein and many others of a certain persuasion, Trump was GUILTY of crimes far worse than ole Tricky Dick.

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Master_Live

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#15  Edited By Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

I bet this becomes the most replied to and retweeted Tweet of all time.

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Planeforger

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#16  Edited By Planeforger
Member since 2004 • 19571 Posts

Trump is calling it total exoneration, but it's a little more complicated than that.

Mueller found no collusion, but arguments for and against obstructionism. Barr decided against an obstructionism charge, since he wouldn't be able to prove it beyond doubt.

So Trump is clear of the Russian collusion bit, but I can see the obstruction bit hanging around for a while. Especially if the report becomes public.

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Jacanuk

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#17 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@Solaryellow said:

According to Carl Bernstein and many others of a certain persuasion, Trump was GUILTY of crimes far worse than ole Tricky Dick.

And yet one of the most respected and always named as a bulldog and someone who would find anything, could not find anything.

Well, highly respected and seen as one of the most thorough special counsels until now, now he is a bad counsel who couldn´t find the barn door if he stood in front of it according to Bernstein and Democrats.

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N64DD

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#18 N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

I’m loving this.

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deactivated-5de67c4d9cb12

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#19  Edited By deactivated-5de67c4d9cb12
Member since 2019 • 392 Posts

Is the bar now so low that Trump not being a Russian agent is total vindication of him? lol

Still the worst president in living memory. A pathological liar and narcissist. And grossly incompetent and unfit for his job.

And in 50 years him and all conservatives will be notorious for their wilful negligence regarding climate change.

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deactivated-5e9044657a310

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#20  Edited By deactivated-5e9044657a310
Member since 2005 • 8136 Posts

Total witch Hunt!!

Weird how Republican are circle jerking each other with the word exoneration on a report that specifically says does not exonerate.

I'm loving the spin!!!

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N64DD

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#21 N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

@Nuck81: no need for a meltdown man

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N64DD

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#22 N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

@volsung: meltdowns begin

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FireEmblem_Man

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#23 FireEmblem_Man
Member since 2004 • 20248 Posts
@Jacanuk said:
@Master_Live said:

How soon do Democrats, liberals, "The Left" turn on Mueller?

They already have, can´t remember what show but CNN already showed clips from some pundit who called it a cover-up and Mueller is paid off by Trump.

They already want to Subpoena Mueller and Bill Maher is on full damage control saying he doesn't need a report to tell him that Trump is Guilty because he has a TV

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deactivated-5de67c4d9cb12

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#24 deactivated-5de67c4d9cb12
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@n64dd said:

@volsung: meltdowns begin

No I'm actually relieved. It means the US isn't as far gone as it might have been.

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N64DD

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#25 N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

@volsung: Trump 2020!

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#26  Edited By Xabiss
Member since 2012 • 4749 Posts
@volsung said:
@n64dd said:

@volsung: meltdowns begin

No I'm actually relieved. It means the US isn't as far gone as it might have been.

So much truth to this statement. I am a very in the middle and I did not vote for Trump, but it is hilarious watching all of the liberals go bat shit crazy on Twitter. ROFLMAO!

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#27 Solaryellow
Member since 2013 • 7034 Posts

@Nuck81 said:

Total witch Hunt!!

Weird how Republican are circle jerking each other with the word exoneration on a report that specifically says does not exonerate.

I'm loving the spin!!!

Out of curiosity, have you read the AG's letter?

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Jacanuk

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#28 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@FireEmblem_Man said:
@Jacanuk said:
@Master_Live said:

How soon do Democrats, liberals, "The Left" turn on Mueller?

They already have, can´t remember what show but CNN already showed clips from some pundit who called it a cover-up and Mueller is paid off by Trump.

They already want to Subpoena Mueller and Bill Maher is on full damage control saying he doesn't need a report to tell him that Trump is Guilty because he has a TV

It´s amazing how quickly heroes becomes villains and reverse,

Mueller was this democratic love puppy and now they want to subpoena him and ask him to stand at attention like he is a kid who just tipped over grandma.

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deactivated-5de67c4d9cb12

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#29 deactivated-5de67c4d9cb12
Member since 2019 • 392 Posts
@Jacanuk said:
@FireEmblem_Man said:
@Jacanuk said:
@Master_Live said:

How soon do Democrats, liberals, "The Left" turn on Mueller?

They already have, can´t remember what show but CNN already showed clips from some pundit who called it a cover-up and Mueller is paid off by Trump.

They already want to Subpoena Mueller and Bill Maher is on full damage control saying he doesn't need a report to tell him that Trump is Guilty because he has a TV

It´s amazing how quickly heroes becomes villains and reverse,

Mueller was this democratic love puppy and now they want to subpoena him and ask him to stand at attention like he is a kid who just tipped over grandma.

Don't play the high ground here please. Mueller was smeared as a deep state plant by the right ever since the investigation began.

If Mueller had actually found something conclusive, the chances of you guys accepting it are probably nil.

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N64DD

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#30  Edited By N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

@volsung: theres that meltdown again.

It’s over, let it go.

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#31 deactivated-5e9044657a310
Member since 2005 • 8136 Posts

@Solaryellow: the letter sent to Congress is all over the internet.

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#32 deactivated-5de67c4d9cb12
Member since 2019 • 392 Posts
@n64dd said:

@volsung: theres that meltdown again.

It’s over, let it go.

Why would I be upset the US president hasn't turned out out to be a Russian toy? It's good news for everyone.

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Jacanuk

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#34  Edited By Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@Nuck81 said:

@Solaryellow: the letter sent to Congress is all over the internet.

No really?

Maybe look what was linked to in the first post.

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#35  Edited By Solaryellow
Member since 2013 • 7034 Posts

@Nuck81 said:

@Solaryellow: the letter sent to Congress is all over the internet.

I asked if you actually read it.

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texasgoldrush

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#36 texasgoldrush
Member since 2003 • 14899 Posts

REMINDER: Trump is under multiple investigations for criminal activities he is MORE LIKELY to have committed than Russian collusion.

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Jacanuk

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#37 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@texasgoldrush said:

REMINDER: Trump is under multiple investigations for criminal activities he is MORE LIKELY to have committed than Russian collusion.

Which has nothing to do with him becoming president, and all pretty much have a statute of limitations attached

So no need for a reminder since no one in the world cares what happens to Trump after he is gone as president.

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N64DD

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#38 N64DD
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@texasgoldrush: LOL!

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texasgoldrush

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#39 texasgoldrush
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@Jacanuk said:
@texasgoldrush said:

REMINDER: Trump is under multiple investigations for criminal activities he is MORE LIKELY to have committed than Russian collusion.

Which has nothing to do with him becoming president, and all pretty much have a statute of limitations attached

So no need for a reminder since no one in the world cares what happens to Trump after he is gone as president.

Which still can get him impeached or damage him in 2020.

Campaign violations outside of Russia collusion are being investigated as well.

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N64DD

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#40 N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

@texasgoldrush: maybe he ripped a tag off a mattress, hillary 2020?

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#42 tjandmia
Member since 2017 • 3728 Posts

A blow to Democrats??? It was a republican started and led investigation.

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Jacanuk

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#44 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@texasgoldrush said:
@Jacanuk said:
@texasgoldrush said:

REMINDER: Trump is under multiple investigations for criminal activities he is MORE LIKELY to have committed than Russian collusion.

Which has nothing to do with him becoming president, and all pretty much have a statute of limitations attached

So no need for a reminder since no one in the world cares what happens to Trump after he is gone as president.

Which still can get him impeached or damage him in 2020.

Campaign violations outside of Russia collusion are being investigated as well.

Nothing in his past can get him impeached, all they can do is line up the charges and get ready for when he is not the president anymore.

And Campaign Violation is a slap on the wrist, even Obama got a campaign Violation and was fined a couple of hundred thousand $

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texasgoldrush

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#45 texasgoldrush
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@Jacanuk said:
@texasgoldrush said:
@Jacanuk said:
@texasgoldrush said:

REMINDER: Trump is under multiple investigations for criminal activities he is MORE LIKELY to have committed than Russian collusion.

Which has nothing to do with him becoming president, and all pretty much have a statute of limitations attached

So no need for a reminder since no one in the world cares what happens to Trump after he is gone as president.

Which still can get him impeached or damage him in 2020.

Campaign violations outside of Russia collusion are being investigated as well.

Nothing in his past can get him impeached, all they can do is line up the charges and get ready for when he is not the president anymore.

And Campaign Violation is a slap on the wrist, even Obama got a campaign Violation and was fined a couple of hundred thousand $

WRONG

Campaign violations can send you to prison, and people have. And yes, they can impeach the president for past crimes, especially financial fraud.

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texasgoldrush

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#46 texasgoldrush
Member since 2003 • 14899 Posts

@tjandmia said:

A blow to Democrats??? It was a republican started and led investigation.

The executive branch investigates itself.....lol

Thats really what this is.

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#47  Edited By Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts
@texasgoldrush said:
@Jacanuk said:
@texasgoldrush said:
@Jacanuk said:

Which has nothing to do with him becoming president, and all pretty much have a statute of limitations attached

So no need for a reminder since no one in the world cares what happens to Trump after he is gone as president.

Which still can get him impeached or damage him in 2020.

Campaign violations outside of Russia collusion are being investigated as well.

Nothing in his past can get him impeached, all they can do is line up the charges and get ready for when he is not the president anymore.

And Campaign Violation is a slap on the wrist, even Obama got a campaign Violation and was fined a couple of hundred thousand $

WRONG

Campaign violations can send you to prison, and people have. And yes, they can impeach the president for past crimes, especially financial fraud.

Yes, the sentencing frame can be jail time, but it´s rarely dealt like that and do not believe for a second that because it´s Trump they would be harsher than normal which is a fine.

, Also there is the previous cases that are similar. which also didn´t lead to jail time.

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texasgoldrush

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#48 texasgoldrush
Member since 2003 • 14899 Posts

@Jacanuk said:
@texasgoldrush said:
@Jacanuk said:
@texasgoldrush said:
@Jacanuk said:

Which has nothing to do with him becoming president, and all pretty much have a statute of limitations attached

So no need for a reminder since no one in the world cares what happens to Trump after he is gone as president.

Which still can get him impeached or damage him in 2020.

Campaign violations outside of Russia collusion are being investigated as well.

Nothing in his past can get him impeached, all they can do is line up the charges and get ready for when he is not the president anymore.

And Campaign Violation is a slap on the wrist, even Obama got a campaign Violation and was fined a couple of hundred thousand $

WRONG

Campaign violations can send you to prison, and people have. And yes, they can impeach the president for past crimes, especially financial fraud.

Yes, the sentencing frame can be jail time, but it´s rarely dealt like that and do not believe a second that because it´s Trump they would be harsher than normal which is a fine.

, Also there is the previous cases that are similar. which also didn´t lead to jail time.

But they can and they have, especially if you led to another committing a crime. And using campaign money for personal use is a offense punishable with prison time.

And thats not the only thing being investigated as well.

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#49 Sevenizz
Member since 2010 • 6462 Posts

@FireEmblem_Man: You heard correctly. His ministers are abandoning ship left and right and we’re voting him out in the Fall.

Andrew Scheer will be our next PM and Trudeau will be a 1 term footnote of how a fake SJW is not fit for the position.

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#50 deactivated-5f4e2292197f1
Member since 2015 • 1374 Posts

Yet I listened to countless "Russian Trump" jokes for last 2 years.

It's been about Trump's pettiness and that he's a criminal who needs to be in prison, oh and the endless shaming of him and his family.

With Bush and Obama it always felt like they deserved it, but even then, they never went as far as people have with Trump and almost feel half of it wasn't justified at all with Trump.