Australia PM burns Trump, lmao.

Funny.

You surely must mean Welcome to the greatest country on earth America , where democracy works and the alt-left movement got a huge wakeup call.

It's Trump who has divided America more than ever before. Trump also bowed to the Saudi king, yet the hypocrite was mocking Obama for doing the same thing, as previous American presidents had done to get that Saudi oil for America's petrodollars. And Obama took presidency at a time when America was going through recession, and successfully pulled America out of recession, which is an accomplishment worth respecting.

So far, Trump has done nothing worth respecting.

@Jacanuk: Opinions vary

I've never seen the country more divided than it is right now. Obama may have had a hand in creating the catalyst, but Trump's extremism and divisive rhetoric have ignited these differences into an inferno that is tearing the country apart on partisan lines, of which he's doing nothing to address. Instead he's drawing lines and taking a combative attitude. It's "us" vs. "them". Who's worse in character.....the one who creates the conditions for a raging forest fire, or the one that strikes the match and fans the flames?

As for bowing to other countries.....what is it with conservatives and small-dick syndrome? For some reason they seem to believe that respect is always to be had through fear and intimidation. Perhaps Obama bowed not in a gesture of submission , but one borne of respect done under the confidence of American superiority? When push comes to shove, I think we all know that America can hold its own; we don't need to rely nor dissect insignificant menial gestures or simple courtesies to demonstrate our significance.

Chirst, it's like being back in grade school. Someone who's confident in themselves doesn't need to show that they are. They know that they are.

Ya neither have i, the polarizing in America today is crazy compared to before Obama. But with that said what caused the polarizing began with Obama and i don't know what happened to the democrats, but they seem to have gone insane with the rush over Obama´s popularity among certain groups in society particular the Hollywood elite. And it continued with Hillary and it took to full flames now under Trump.

And to be fair most of the us vs them is coming from the alt-left and Hollywood, they can´t come to terms with Hilliary not winning and instead of stepping up and acknowledge that Trump won, they keep this fantasy that somehow if they act like kids, they can make the Trump term go by as if he never took office.

And as to the foreign relations and Obama, well you may call it a dick contest, but appearance has a lot to say in that. You think Putin would have tried the shit he does before Obama? of course not, particular not when he knew that the american president was not afraid to push that button. Obama on the other hand not only seemed like a apologist , he also tried to bluff a few times and got called on it. And that hurt America´s image a lot.

So you call it being back in grade school as much as you want, but America has decided to be the world's police, so when the police suddenly seems more like a kitten then a lion, the despots around the world take notice and act on it.

Polarization started with the Trump Campaign and has only gotten worse.

You keep telling yourself that.

Facts are different and maybe one day you and your alt-left side will wake up and smell the coffee.

All Trump did was take advantage of 8 years of polarizing behaviour from the alt-left Obama and the democrats.

Alt-left is a really funny term when you look at America as part of the world. Left here is center in most other places. Keep on cheering for your team like this is a sports game though.

Also, the fact that Obama is not even "alt-left". The "alt-left" usually refers to socialists like Bernie Sanders or Jeremy Corbyn. Obama is center-left in US politics, or centrist in international politics.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/12/01/meet-the-alt-left-the-gops-response-to-its-alt-right-problem/

If you use the term alt-left, be embarrassed. It was mostly spread by Sean Hannity. Lmao....yeah.

Obama is further left than what the democrats was before, but sure let´s use far-left instead .

Again, no. The "far-left" usually refers to socialists like Bernie Sanders or Jeremy Corbyn. Obama is center-left by US standards, or centrist by international standards.

Obama is by no means center-left. I have no idea where you would even get that idea from.

And can you make up your mind? are they alt-left or far left? Not to mention that Sanders is a socialist bordering on being a communist.

While Jacanuk is correct that Obama was further left than Democrats before him, you are also correct that he is centre-left. The Democrats before Obama were a centrist party that sometimes dabbled in the centre-right under Bill Clinton.

Alt-left isn't a thing except on far right blogs. Obama is only far left if you listen to said blogs. Mind pointing to anything Obama did that was far-left as far as policy? Because even the ACA was a republican idea to begin with.

There is absolutely nothing "far left" about Obama. You clearly have no idea what "far left" even means.

"Alt left" is just another alternative label for "far left". Sanders being a "socialist bordering on being a communist" is what it means to be "far left".

Then we have two very different definitions.

And you can call Obama pink for all that matters, facts are there that Obama moved the democrats a lot further to the left then before Why do you think the democrats are so out of tune with the rest of the country. It´s not because Obama was a moderate.

Make no mistake, this Australian PM Malcolm Turnbull will not be in power after the next election, what he says is irrelevant...

What is also worth noting is that Obama's greatest legacy, Obamacare is really just an expansion of a right wing proposal in the 70's from the heritage foundation. And Richard Nixon.

Not to burst your bubble but...

https://www.vox.com/2016/2/3/10904988/bernie-sanders-political-revolution-poll

People want single payer, people want to raise taxes on the rich, people want free college. They also don't want a big government but big government is really vague and can mean a lot of things.

And while I am at it, Obama may be to the left of Bill and Hillary Clinton but he is to the right of JFK, FDR, LBJ, Jimmy Carter.

FYI it's the conservatives that are out of touch. Unfortunately Democrats and I'm guessing some Independents are too lazy to get their asses to the polls and we have the clusterfuck that is the Trump Administration because of it. Sucks that people are apathetic to their government.

Tell me did Clinton or Trump win? and in a pretty big decisive electoral win.

So which side is most out of tune you think,

Electoral is not people's choice....

So americans want a political revolution run by Sanders but the president is Trump? and Sanders lost to Clinton in the democratic primaries with million of votes.

How did you come up with that? was it while sitting in your campus safespace talking about how you need people to feel you and consider you the most special little person ever and no one else in the whole wide world is more special. Like 90% of Sanders supporters.

And no Obama is not right to JFK, FDR, LBJ or Carter, he is further to the left then they are.

Trump won because of massive voter apathy on the left and a skewed system. Doesnt mean Trump's agenda is more popular. Look at that disapproval rating Trump has... 64%.

Comparatively Bernie Sanders is one of the most popular politicians in the country.

Did you not read the leaked documents? You know, the thing that caused massive controversy in the around the time the DNC had their little show.

If you actually bothered to check the link. You would know... but since you clearly didn't I will just do this,

Funny you mention safe spaces though. Trumpkins are the king of that... while also simultaneously lashing out on others for safe spaces.

Lol at your asseriton at the bottom. I guess it says everything that needs to be said.

And yet Sanders could not even beat Clinton. So i think you need to limit the popularity to college kids.

And yes Trump won because the democrats did not see the apathy after 8 years of a Obama who did not make life any better for a big portion of the working classes. Which is my point.

Democrats missed the train and still does not see the light most of the country is sending them, which is why they lost the presidency and now 4 straight special elections. And most likely will lose more in 2018.

Once again... if you read the emails you would have known the democrats worked to suppress bernie voters. Nor does it change the fact that he is according to poll after poll.

Democrat's biggest problem is that they are too centrist right now, and lack any real core vision. They have an identity crisis, and didnt really offer a vision for america. The left wingers cant be arsed to vote for someone who wont represent them, and the right wingers would rather vote Republican rather than Republican-lite.

Democrats may have worked against Sanders but he still didn't have the people's backing , he only got 43%

Which is the main issue. people may have a like or a favorable opinion about him, which is fine if they need a friend or in a new dinner guest, but they clearly don´t want him running the country. Since like with Obama, the super delegates would have jumped ship in a heartbeat, if they saw Clinton was on a losing streak , which never happened.

what part of voter suppression dont you understand?

Not to mention, we were talking about the popularity of agendas. Not about electability of individuals, which concerns itself with much more than just their agendas.

What definition of "far left" are you even looking at? There is no definition of "far left" that includes Obama, at all. Your claim of Obama being "far left" is nothing more than a far-right fantasy, where everything to the left of them is "far left".

IIRC, you said you used to live in the UK. From a UK perspective, Obama could barely even be considered left-wing, since he's barely to the left of David Cameron, the former right-wing UK prime minster. The NHS is way more "left" than Obamacare, yet the NHS is supported by the right-wing Conservatives, not to mention Cameron pushed for gay marriage. The UK's right-wing Conservatives must be a "left-wing" party by your standards.

What? No, not even close. This is the most ridiculous post in the thread.

JFK has had the greatest marketing campaign of all-time to trick people into thinking he's left-wing. The guy was as centrist as it came and governed from the centre-right. The others except FDR were barely considered left-wing in their own time, let alone post-2008. LBJ and Carter were southern Democrats that even in their own time were moderates compared to New England, California, and New York Democrats.

JFK was the most right wing of the bunch I listed. But still to the left of Obama, the deporter/droner in chief.

Barely being left wing is still better than being a centrist. Obama was center-left at most.

Edit: Here is some results on research done by the political scientists Keith Poole and Howard Rosenthal.

There is no reality where a president from the 1960's is more to the left than a centre-left Democrat in 2016. I am not disagreeing with the assertion that Obama is a centrist or "center-left at most" but that is still a lot more left-wing than someone from the 1960's.

If you took Obama into a time machine to the 1960's and he's advocating same-sex marriage, normalizing ties with Cuba, softer drug penalties, and equal pay for women he would be considered a communist nut job and put on a watch list by the FBI.

RE: that graph is useless because it compares them in their own times. That is not what I am concerned about.

Funny you mention same sex marriage... considering he was opposed to it for a good chunk of the time. Only flip flopping once it became convenient.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/may/11/barack-obama/president-barack-obamas-shift-gay-marriage/

Obama is to the left on these politicians on social issues. But there is a LOT more to the left right spectrum than just social issues.

It is plain to see your argument is pure nonsense if you have to look at positions Obama held over 10 years ago to try and make your point, as if that even has any relevance in 2016.

You are right that there is more to it than social issues. But, an era of fervent anti-communism and anti-socialism is definitely not more progressive than 2016 in terms of economics either.

In that case, we must only apply the same standards to the other living former presidents. In which case your same sex argument is pretty null and void, since the other living presidents are for it too.

Economically speaking, the US has moved to the right, not the left. And Obama's cheerleading for TPP was as right wing as they come.

How? None of the living presidents held same-sex marriage approval while they were in office. Obama was the first to do it in 2012.

I don't agree that TPP is right wing, and the Democrats and Bernie Sanders hoodwinked everyone regarding TPP.

The actual agreement itself promotes increased wages, environmental protections and poverty reduction in developing nations, prohibits illegal child labour, codifies the right for collective bargaining, and outlaws employment discrimination among a slew of other, traditionally left-wing ideas.

None of these positions are right wing at all. Free trade is merely one part of a larger agreement that will be beneficial for the developing world as well as the first world in the future economy. As well as, all citizens enjoy the fruits of free trade like that $5 shirt at H&M or cheap lumber used to build their homes.

Just like NAFTA, TPP is an easy scapegoat by the US government trick the people from finding out the real culprit of who is keeping wages down and not properly educating the nation for the future economy: the US government itself. It is thinly veiled strategy of socially acceptable hate and blame towards foreigners for "taking" jobs.

Doesnt matter, because Obama only really came around when approval for same sex marriage was practically the normal.

The TPP would improve worker conditions for some countries, but as far as the US costs go, the so called left leaning parts of it... don't do nearly enough,

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/01/140117-trans-pacific-partnership-free-trade-environment-obama/

Unlike other democratic politicians who actually took a stand, Obama just half measures... but the bad greatly outweighs the good. Looking further at the TPP, 90% of workers would see a pay cut for instance. Increase of fracking, minimal food safety standards, Increased corporate power, ect.

I don't think that's fair. He still deserves credit for being the first sitting President to support same-sex marriage. If you want to argue that TPP doesn't go far enough then sure go ahead, but that's different than what you said earlier. Don't make the perfect the enemy of the good.

If you want a read an actual fair and detailed economic analysis of TPP read the World Bank's analysis: https://web.archive.org/web/20160212030617/http://www.worldbank.org/content/dam/Worldbank/GEP/GEP2016a/Global-Economic-Prospects-January-2016-Implications-Trans-Pacific-Partnership-Agreement.pdf

As for Obama, I agree with that all of that to some extent, but at the same time I think you are severely overestimating past presidents compared to him. Someone like JFK and LBJ should be disqualified entirely because of the Bay of Pigs and Vietnam.

By that same logic we should give LBJ credit for being the first sitting president to fully embrace the civil rights movement. Being a key part of it.

Bay of Pigs and Vietnam are definately black marks, but if you look at the overall picture, they were more to the left than Obama was. If I were to look at singular incidents. I could look at any of the following such as the unprecedented mass deportations, the multiple interventions across multiple countries across the middle east and conclude he is right wing.

Keep in mind, that outside the US same sex marriage is a lot less partisan. Here in Sweden for instance, Same Sex Marriage got support from 6 out of 7 prominent parties, all across the political spectrum.

The most ridiculous posts in this thread are the ones claiming Obama is "far left".

I've stopped taking Jacanuk seriously a long time ago, while Maroxad is (outside of video games) a reasonably intelligent individual.

That is ridiculous but honestly not all that surprising.

The guy insulted me for stating that Justice Anthony Kennedy is more right leaning than left leaning.

Hey! That stuff regarding MGS5 was just a parody! :P

What stuff?

Somethign quite a while back. Made a series of posts on the SW lounge as a parody of some of the more insane criticism I found on the game. Basically an accumulation of every single bad argument I found on a site that must not be named.

Within my parody. I lied, but I wanted to be caught.

That was how I tried to tell people it was a poe.

Video game censorship, for one.

lol if that's the worst thing you can say about Australia, you just proved my point. Way to live in such an insulated bubble you think people give a crap about "video game censorship" when it comes to naming the best countries on earth.

Have you ever been outside of the US?

I was being facetious, but okay.

Silly Canadian.

Have you seen some of the posts in here? It's hard to tell who is serious and who is joking lol.