Borderlands 2 gets $30 DLC pass

 @DarkSaber2k  @TrueGB  @rann89 that's all "four" DLCs..even better.

 @Hurvl true, there is always someone worse off. i guess i'm lucky, considering i'm single, can usually afford to buy several games a year and have the time to play them.

 @isshiah Lol, companies thinking "because we can", that's the answer to many things that irritate and anger gamers.

I'd be happy if the maximum price for a game was 60 dollars. 60 dollars is 20 % off the usual price, but even if games are more expensive in Sweden, there are other countries that are even worse. People rarely think about that.

 @Hurvl in australia, where the price for new games is usually around 90 - 100 bucks. there are legitimate reasons for the higher price, as well as companies saying "because we can!".i have the $120 special edition of assassins creed III on preorder, but that price is rare. paying that much is something i do for only a select few games.

 @BlessTheMusic  @zyxe  @Jebril I agree.  Support those worth supporting, I find 2k games to be worth the investment unlike some other juggernauts *cough* EA *cough*

 @DarthLod Obviously you haven't read my comment so your reply includes things that don't even pertain to even what I'm talking about -_-.  I also never said I'm baring you from your personal freedom, in fact I said the contrary. Also I am not buying the DLC pass either because I have no idea what I'm getting.

You make a statement about cancelling a pre-order based on a DLC season pass announcement, to which that DLC pass itself has no effect on your pre-order.

You knew very well that DLC would come out for Borderlands 2, as it did with Borderlands 1.

(I'm repeating myself here cause you obviously didn't bother to read and are spitting out things that don't pertain to my actual conversation)

1) If you don't buy DLC for BL2 your pre-order is not affected at all by this announcement.

2) If you plan on buying ALL DLC then it's better for you.

3) If you plan on buying SOME DLC then it is either better or doesn't affect you AT ALL.

MY POINT ---> You are not cancelling your pre-order because of the DLC pass announcement or even the fact that you hate the DLC model to begin with. You just want everything for cheaper. If you said so from the very beginning that is a geniune statement. You are being disingenuous by stating this DLC pass annoucement has anything to do with a cancelled pre-order.

My argument here is YOUR REASONING not what you are doing. You can do whatever the F*$@ you want.

 @nezza08  @colt_a  @pound-u  @DarthLod If you are trying to tell me that I called someone an "idiot" then of course as you stated yoruself you didn't even read my comments so you would assume such things. I never even mentioned the word, because I do not think that the word "idiot" accurately represents my point. I was clear in my original comment that I thought he was either cheap or just not thinking. And I meant exactly that. Don't put words into my mouth.

 @pound-u  @saucex4  @colt_a  @DarthLod How is it not hypocrisy if you buy DLC yet you are against it. If you are truly against DLC then don't even buy it at all when it even comes out in a GOTY Edition. 

I have problems with DLC yes, but I never said I was against the idea as I clearly stated in my comments.

So I pose this question to you then. How does a DLC pass change the position of someone who already pre-ordered the game FULL KNOWING that DLC will come out in the future?

 @saucex4  @colt_a  @pound-u  @DarthLod It was put in speech marks for a reason :) But okay okay you win dude nice comeback daymn... 

 @saucex4  @colt_a  @pound-u  @DarthLod

 You only "see" hypocrisy because all you do is make assumptions. I actually practice what I preach. I didn't even bother to pre-order this game. And I largly ignore games these days whenever I hear the mention of DLC. I also don't support games at $60 anymore because I don;t feel I'm getting my money's worth anymore. By buying the game of the year edition, I am also buying one product instead of multiple. I will also wait until that version also drops in price. Even then, I rarely bother with them, unless it is for a game I really want.

 @nezza08  @colt_a  @pound-u  @DarthLod if you recognize yourself as an idiot (your admission) then I have no comment for you :p

 @saucex4  @colt_a  @pound-u  @DarthLod Shit me its fantastic how paragraphs of text can make someone seem so knowledgeable and clever. I got bored please keep churning them out! Have you got an essay on "idiots" like me too?! :D 

 @colt_a  @pound-u  @DarthLod I want to reiterate here that the DLC model is not inherently a bad practice in theory.

In theory the DLC model is a way to EXTEND the life of a particular game with additional content. This model has been misused however, in today's gaming marketplace by doing Day 1 DLC, and charging exuberant amounts of money for customizations that could have been included in the original game as unlocks. Where cosmetic DLC fits well into is the F2P model (assuming a fair F2P model of course), where you don't pay for the base game, and pay for the extra cosmetics only.

The DLC season pass, as it stands misrepresents what the product is. You do not know what you are getting, which in my mind is outrageous.  If this was just a bundle that was available all the time, and included details of what you were getting, that is a genuine representation of what I would rather call a DLC pre-order bundle.

Borderlands 2 apparently hitting the 58 hour mark is a good sign of how much content is available. For those who play only 1 character and skip tons of side-quests then probably that will be cut in half. For some the amount of content is still not reasonable, and that's a matter of personal taste and I can't say anything on that. What I can say is 58 hours for 1 character playthrough is good for a $60 title, and that DLC is in this case actually an extension of the game and not just a "milking attempt".

 @colt_a  @pound-u  @DarthLod 

1) Borderlands imo (you are of course entitled to yours) was a complete product on release. I got 200 hours from the original game, and an additional 200 from the DLCs.

2) Gearbox practices their DLC releases fairly and released over the course of almost 1 year.

3) I agree yes there are a lot of cases where corporates take advantage of the current DLC model. Part of the problem here is corporate law. Corporations in the United States are bound BY LAW to make as much money as they can for the interest of their shareholders, and are sometimes inhibited BY LAW to be socially responsible. Regardless gearbox for the most part has not stepped outside the bounds of fairness in my mind.

4) I already made points elsewhere in the comments that I do not like the "season pass" idea, and that it misrepresents what the DLC product truly is. However, I would be fine if this bundle was available ALL THE TIME, and that it describes the product exactly to the consumer.

5) My argument here is that they have already pre-ordered the game FULL KNOWING that DLC will be coming in the future @ full price of say ~$10 each, which it most likely will be. And then with this announcement it changes their original position negatively? How? 1) If they are planning on buying all DLC it will be cheaper (my position remains that I still disagree with not describing your product) 2) If they plan on buying some DLC in the future it makes no difference. 3) If they don't plan on buying DLC then again it makes no difference.

This is why I say it's disingenuous, which is my main point. If they hate the DLC model, so be it, I have no problem with that stance. But why even pre-order to begin with I say. If you are taking a hard political stance on the matter then don't buy any games with the DLC model at all. If you are truly genuine to your cause you wouldn't even wait for the GOTY, you would just ignore gearbox completely.

All I see from the comments that I replied to is hypocrisy. They are against DLC, but they still want it and will buy it later.

 @saucex4  @pound-u  @DarthLod

Yes yes, AAA game development costs a lot, you should be THANKFUL to be milked.  Just like those people selling you gas need to raise prices to feed their children.  I wish people would stop believing what every greedy corporation will tell them.  They are ALL liars.

Their points have nothing to do with the value of Borderlands.  It has everything to do with the DLC mentality every developer has taken.  Very few make a great complete game anymore.  Many developers that would have an "Oh it would be great to add this..." idea are told by their superiors "Yea, that's a good idea, we will make that an add on".  We will never again get a full complete product that is the best a developer can make.  Because they always leave something behind for DLC. 

Borderlands 1 and most of their DLC was worth it.  But you can't guarantee that Borderlands 2 will be.  And with them 'planning for DLC' you can be sure that the base game will not be as great as it could be.

Canceling a preorder is a statement against the industry and their DLC practices.  It doesn't really matter who its against...if it happens to every game that does this...they will get the message.

 @pound-u  @DarthLod *simple want more for cheaper

 @pound-u  @DarthLod You have not presented a clear arguement. Frankly you haven't presented an argument at all, which is laughable XD.

You are distorting the facts. I don't know where you buy your games from, but $90 is not the base cost of the game itself. It's $60 for a single copy, and even cheaper if you went into a 4 pack. With pre-order you even get the first DLC included with that. Personally I spent ~$40 on my copy because of the 4-pack I bought with friends and I bought it @ 10% off. 

Anyway, cynicism aside, I believe that what you are trying to say is that you are completely against the DLC business model, and honestly there are some bad ones.

Here are the facts of gaming in today's market. 1) Games are far far larger in scale and production value @ the AAA level than they ever were before, and those publishers that are fair offer a lot of content for that $50-$60 price. I can't say that for every game, but I can say that for borderlands.

2) Downloadable Content is not a purchase requirement, and the game is more than likely a complete standalone title. Gameguide makers spent 58 hours on their first playthrough, which is a decent amount of content for your money. I again go back to borderlands 1, even though it had a terrible ending, it was in fact a complete game on release.

As already mentioned several times by gamespot and gearbox they have already finished the base game, and are now working on DLC content.

You are the same as the commenter imo. You do not value the base game of Borderlands @ $60 and you simply want more for a cheaper and you using DLC as an excuse is disingenuous.