Which game doesn't get enough credit this generation, iyo? *56k, back off!*

  • 144 results
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3

This topic is locked from further discussion.

Avatar image for BioShockOwnz
BioShockOwnz

52901

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 4

User Lists: 0

#1 BioShockOwnz
Member since 2006 • 52901 Posts

There are a good many, but lets just cut it down to one. What's that one title that you really enjoyed, but thought it was overlooked, underrated, sold poorly, etc?

For me, it's Rise of the Argonauts. It's not as polished as it could've been. It had some framerate issues. But man, I love this game. Then again, I love Action/RPG's.

Image 1

Image 1

Image 1

Image 1

It just felt so epic. It reminded me a lot of Jade Empire, but obviously with a different story and set of characters. The story was great. The characters were interesting and had good voice acting. The combat was simplistic, yet fun. And the world was beautiful and a joy to walk/run around. It wasn't without its problems, but it's a game well worth checking out for those into Action/RPG's, but there is a lot, and I mean a lot, of talking, so be aware of that.

So what's your choice?

Avatar image for All_that_is_Man
All_that_is_Man

2044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#2 All_that_is_Man
Member since 2008 • 2044 Posts
Monster Hunter Freedom!
Avatar image for ShaneBeck
ShaneBeck

10511

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 15

User Lists: 0

#3 ShaneBeck
Member since 2005 • 10511 Posts
I gotta say Team Fortress 2. Most fun I've had since the SNES era.
Avatar image for Shafftehr
Shafftehr

2889

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#4 Shafftehr
Member since 2008 • 2889 Posts
Viva Pinata, first or the second. Both are exceptional games.

Avatar image for jakarai
jakarai

4289

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#5 jakarai
Member since 2008 • 4289 Posts
I would have to say Heavenly Sword. Great game from beginning to end.
Avatar image for mitu123
mitu123

155290

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 32

User Lists: 0

#6 mitu123
Member since 2006 • 155290 Posts
All Rare games this gen, they aren't as good as they were with Nintendo, but they aren't that bad either. And 2 Saints Row games.
Avatar image for Gh0st_Of_0nyx
Gh0st_Of_0nyx

8992

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#7 Gh0st_Of_0nyx
Member since 2007 • 8992 Posts
Metroid prime 3 - One of the best looking games Ive played this generation and horribly underrated.
Avatar image for NocturnalNoctis
NocturnalNoctis

300

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#8 NocturnalNoctis
Member since 2009 • 300 Posts
Folklore
Avatar image for millerlight89
millerlight89

18658

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#9 millerlight89
Member since 2007 • 18658 Posts
Penumbra overture, and black plague.
Avatar image for BioShockOwnz
BioShockOwnz

52901

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 4

User Lists: 0

#10 BioShockOwnz
Member since 2006 • 52901 Posts

All Rare games this gen, they aren't as good as they were with Nintendo, but they aren't that bad either. And 2 Saints Row games.mitu123

I hated Saints Row 1. It just felt like a bad GTA clone with good shooting mechanics. But then I picked up Saints Row 2. Man, that game is fun as all heck! I love how they decided to take it so far beyond crazy. It's almost too crazy. :P Anyways, it has sooo many issues, but I forget about 'em all once I start playing, because it's just a good time.

Avatar image for jg4xchamp
jg4xchamp

64040

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 14

User Lists: 0

#11 jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 64040 Posts
Viva Pinata
Avatar image for PBSnipes
PBSnipes

14621

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#12 PBSnipes
Member since 2007 • 14621 Posts

Mass Effect- People have been losing their collective **** over the "great" writing in GTA4 and MGS4 yet Mass Effect has some of, if not the best writing in gaming history.

Company of Heroes- Does to Starcraft what Starcraft did to C&C.

PGR 4- Sublime blend of arcade and simulation (in terms of driving dynamics) racing, not to mention the ridiculous (in a good way) bike stunts.

Avatar image for SynisterGamer
SynisterGamer

806

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#13 SynisterGamer
Member since 2008 • 806 Posts

Viva Pinata.

Banjo: Nuts and Bolts

and Lost Odyssey.

Avatar image for mitu123
mitu123

155290

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 32

User Lists: 0

#14 mitu123
Member since 2006 • 155290 Posts

[QUOTE="mitu123"]All Rare games this gen, they aren't as good as they were with Nintendo, but they aren't that bad either. And 2 Saints Row games.BioShockOwnz

I hated Saints Row 1. It just felt like a bad GTA clone with good shooting mechanics. But then I picked up Saints Row 2. Man, that game is fun as all heck! I love how they decided to take it so far beyond crazy. It's almost too crazy. :P Anyways, it has sooo many issues, but I forget about 'em all once I start playing, because it's just a good time.

Yeah, I'm enjoying SR2 more than SR so far, and SR2 did have some technical problems, but it was fun. Also, what do you think about PDZ, Kameo, 2 Viva Pinatas and BK: Nuts N Bolts?
Avatar image for millerlight89
millerlight89

18658

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#15 millerlight89
Member since 2007 • 18658 Posts

Mass Effect- People have been losing their collective **** over the "great" writing in GTA4 and MGS4 yet Mass Effect has some of, if not the best writing in gaming history.

Company of Heroes- Does to Starcraft what Starcraft did to C&C.

PGR 4- Sublime blend of arcade and simulation (in terms of driving dynamics) racing, not to mention the ridiculous (in a good way) bike stunts.

PBSnipes
Could not agree with you more with what you have stated.
Avatar image for BioShockOwnz
BioShockOwnz

52901

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 4

User Lists: 0

#16 BioShockOwnz
Member since 2006 • 52901 Posts

Yeah, I'm enjoying SR2 more than SR so far, and SR2 did have some technical problems, but it was fun. Also, what do you think about PDZ, Kameo, 2 Viva Pinatas and BK: Nuts N Bolts?mitu123

PDZ is okay, but ultimately behind the times in the story, dialogue, and gameplay department. The single player really wasn't that good. I did really enjoy the multiplayer, though.

Kameo is awesome. Other than Condemned and Amped 3, Kameo was my favorite game at the Xbox 360's launch. And it's still a beauty to look at and fun to play.

Viva Pinata is enjoyable, but a bit too slow for me. Don't get me wrong, I love strategy games, but I kept getting pulled away from it with other games. I really have to get into Trouble In Paradise. I hear it's great, and it's sitting on the shelf waiting to be played.

Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts & Bolts is one of my favorites of '08. I do still want an old school Banjo platformer, but I really enjoyed Nuts & Bolts. The humor and look of Banjo is still there, but just with a different focus on gameplay, and I found it enjoyable. Some missions were really a pain in the butt, though.

Avatar image for FrozenLiquid
FrozenLiquid

13555

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 22

User Lists: 0

#17 FrozenLiquid
Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts
I would have to say Heavenly Sword. Great game from beginning to end. jakarai
I agree with this. I mean, I dunno what the cows are doing twiddling their thumbs and logging onto home, because Heavenly Sword is a very solid action title.
Avatar image for mitu123
mitu123

155290

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 32

User Lists: 0

#18 mitu123
Member since 2006 • 155290 Posts

[QUOTE="mitu123"]Yeah, I'm enjoying SR2 more than SR so far, and SR2 did have some technical problems, but it was fun. Also, what do you think about PDZ, Kameo, 2 Viva Pinatas and BK: Nuts N Bolts?BioShockOwnz

PDZ is okay, but ultimately behind the times in the story, dialogue, and gameplay department. The single player really wasn't that good. I did really enjoy the multiplayer, though.

Kameo is awesome. Other than Condemned and Amped 3, Kameo was my favorite game at the Xbox 360's launch. And it's still a beauty to look at and fun to play.

Viva Pinata is enjoyable, but a bit too slow for me. Don't get me wrong, I love strategy games, but I kept getting pulled away from it with other games. I really have to get into Trouble In Paradise. I hear it's great, and it's sitting on the shelf waiting to be played.

Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts & Bolts is one of my favorites of '08. I do still want an old school Banjo platformer, but I really enjoyed Nuts & Bolts. The humor and look of Banjo is still there, but just with a different focus on gameplay, and I found it enjoyable. Some missions were really a pain in the butt, though.

Glad your enjoying them, and I agree with you for the most part. I still don't get the hate on Rare though. I might try Rise of the Argonauts later on, looks good.
Avatar image for BioShockOwnz
BioShockOwnz

52901

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 4

User Lists: 0

#19 BioShockOwnz
Member since 2006 • 52901 Posts

Yeah, Rare gets far too much hate. They're pretty consistent in putting out quality games.

Definitely check out RotA. Rent it and see if it's your thing. The users on Gamespot have been rating it between a 7.0-8.0, so it's good to see gamers are enjoying it. It stinks there's no marketing for it. Liquid Entertainment did a great job for being such a small developer with limited funds. I could only imagine if they had more cash and publicity.

Avatar image for strudel420
strudel420

3687

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#20 strudel420
Member since 2006 • 3687 Posts

NHL'07 doesn't get enough acknowledgement for introducing the skill stick.

Avatar image for Stevo_the_gamer
Stevo_the_gamer

49581

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 49

User Lists: 0

#21 Stevo_the_gamer  Moderator
Member since 2004 • 49581 Posts
Three way tie between World in Conflict, Medieval 2: Total War, and Company of Heroes.
Avatar image for mitu123
mitu123

155290

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 32

User Lists: 0

#22 mitu123
Member since 2006 • 155290 Posts
Thanks, the funny thing is that I tend to enjoy games that don't get attention over the overhyped ones, there are hardly any games that lived up to the hype this gen, even more so than last gen.
Avatar image for Synthetic_NinJI
Synthetic_NinJI

2809

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#23 Synthetic_NinJI
Member since 2006 • 2809 Posts
Virtua Fighter 5, not brought up enough in SW, it can destroy alot of debates actually
Avatar image for goblaa
goblaa

19304

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#24 goblaa
Member since 2006 • 19304 Posts
Boomblox
Avatar image for jharv
jharv

1774

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#25 jharv
Member since 2007 • 1774 Posts
Metroid Prime 3
Avatar image for All_that_is_Man
All_that_is_Man

2044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#26 All_that_is_Man
Member since 2008 • 2044 Posts
Ha rare....banjo and Kazooie is all I have to say >.> that games horrible
Avatar image for GreenGoblin2099
GreenGoblin2099

16988

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#27 GreenGoblin2099
Member since 2004 • 16988 Posts
Many people diss RFoM big time, saying it looks last gen and that's pretty boring and all kind of stuff, but it's still my favo game from this gen.
Avatar image for naval
naval

11108

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#28 naval
Member since 2003 • 11108 Posts

NWN 2 : Mask of Betrayer (Very minor spoilers)


The game would be my favorite rpg since Bloodlines.
- Premise : It had a original premise like instead of being the chosen one you were the cursed one and instead of saving thousands of people your destiny was to destroy thousands wherever you go and your purpose was not to fulfill you destiny to save the world but to fight
- Characters - One of the most nicely fleshed out characters with a very good backstory and were integrally tied with the main/side quests
- Dialogues - The best in a long long time
- Gameplay - It is the same old DnD which some people love other hate, but it had a spirit eater mechanic which makes the urgency of the situation very clear and allows the player to better associate with it's character.
- Locations - Lots of amazing locations from Shaodw Realms to Bones of Dying God to Witches Covenant etc

A good reivew : http://www.rpgcodex.net/content.php?id=159 (a bit of swearing is there)

Avatar image for SynisterGamer
SynisterGamer

806

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#29 SynisterGamer
Member since 2008 • 806 Posts

Many people diss RFoM big time, saying it looks last gen and that's pretty boring and all kind of stuff, but it's still my favo game from this gen.GreenGoblin2099

RFoM was an awesome game, but R2 wasn't apart from multiplayer and only multiplayer games I play are Halo and CoD4.

But not my fav game this gen, but my first game I would get apart from Uncharted and Killzone 2 when I get a PS3.

Avatar image for FragTycoon
FragTycoon

6430

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#30 FragTycoon
Member since 2008 • 6430 Posts
[QUOTE="PBSnipes"]

Mass Effect- People have been losing their collective **** over the "great" writing in GTA4 and MGS4 yet Mass Effect has some of, if not the best writing in gaming history.

Company of Heroes- Does to Starcraft what Starcraft did to C&C.

PGR 4- Sublime blend of arcade and simulation (in terms of driving dynamics) racing, not to mention the ridiculous (in a good way) bike stunts.

millerlight89

Could not agree with you more with what you have stated.

I disagree, (with mass effect)

I couldn't stop laughing at the similarities with both Kotor and killer robots that wipes out civilization, not familiar at all. :P

Other then that, the combat, blah, the pop-in(360), blah, the dead planets you have to drive around, blah, the reused areas, blah.

It's not a bad game at all (one of my favs this gen) but it's no where near what it should be with a little more effort.

Avatar image for Ciocio7
Ciocio7

101

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#31 Ciocio7
Member since 2009 • 101 Posts
Warhawk(Plus downloadable content), Unreal Tournament 3(Has 50 online maps/levels to download for free!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
Avatar image for LinKuei_warrior
LinKuei_warrior

2670

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 23

User Lists: 0

#32 LinKuei_warrior
Member since 2006 • 2670 Posts
Saintsrow 2 is way underrated as far as its story goes.people overlook it cos of what game reviewers label it,but it actually has great cutscenes and well placed humor in them!
Avatar image for abuabed
abuabed

6606

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#33 abuabed
Member since 2005 • 6606 Posts
Monster Hunter Freedom!All_that_is_Man
This guy has hit the spot. 100% true.
Avatar image for SolidTy
SolidTy

49991

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#34 SolidTy
Member since 2005 • 49991 Posts

Viva Pinata, first or the second. Both are exceptional games.Shafftehr

Funny thing, Viva Pinata (2), isn't a sequel at all. At most, it was the first game with a few extra's. Milkage at it's finest, but not many have played and got 1000 points for both, like me.

It didn't even let you use your data from the first game. Fun series, and according to Bill Gates, designed for the ladies (Google it, it's that whole SIMS, Animal Crossing, Harvest Moon Market).

Still, it's a good choice for this thread, sure enough. :)

Avatar image for FrozenLiquid
FrozenLiquid

13555

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 22

User Lists: 0

#35 FrozenLiquid
Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts

[QUOTE="Shafftehr"]Viva Pinata, first or the second. Both are exceptional games.SolidTy

Funny thing, Viva Pinata (2), isn't a sequel at all. At most, it was the first game with a few extra's. Milkage at it's finest, but not many have played and got 1000 points for both, like me.

It didn't even let you use your data from the first game. Fun series, and according to Bill Gates, designed for the ladies (Google it, it's that whole SIMS, Animal Crossing, Harvest Moon Market).

Still, it's a good choice for this thread, sure enough. :)

I don't game as much as I use to, but I did enjoy Viva Pinata. If I have the first, is there enough to warrant a purchase of the second game?

Avatar image for Funky_Llama
Funky_Llama

18428

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#36 Funky_Llama
Member since 2006 • 18428 Posts
I gotta say Team Fortress 2. Most fun I've had since the SNES era.ShaneBeck
Yay, someone chose my favourite game! :P
Avatar image for SolidTy
SolidTy

49991

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#37 SolidTy
Member since 2005 • 49991 Posts
[QUOTE="SolidTy"]

[QUOTE="Shafftehr"]Viva Pinata, first or the second. Both are exceptional games.FrozenLiquid

Funny thing, Viva Pinata (2), isn't a sequel at all. At most, it was the first game with a few extra's. Milkage at it's finest, but not many have played and got 1000 points for both, like me.

It didn't even let you use your data from the first game. Fun series, and according to Bill Gates, designed for the ladies (Google it, it's that whole SIMS, Animal Crossing, Harvest Moon Market).

Still, it's a good choice for this thread, sure enough. :)

I don't game as much as I use to, but I did enjoy Viva Pinata. If I have the first, is there enough to warrant a purchase of the second game?

Not for $40, no way.

Being that you are a fan, if you are willing to start over a new game of VIVA, and like the idea of some more pinata's, and a few gameplay tweaks, I would recommend it for under $20, which is what I wish I payed instead of $40. I needed it at the time, and it was still fun.

I was sore when I got home and saw how little they added, it was more of an attempt for Microsoft to get the game some more recognition (Which it deserves). A true sequel will hopefully come soon. :)

Avatar image for Nerd_Man
Nerd_Man

13819

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#38 Nerd_Man
Member since 2007 • 13819 Posts

Metroid prime 3 - One of the best looking games Ive played this generation and horribly underrated.Gh0st_Of_0nyx

I agree... I thought Metroid Prime 3 was going to be a huge release for Nintendo, but when it came out, people kinda just moved on... People always fail to mention MP3 and just go straight to SMG and SSBB. MP3 is seriously one of the best games on the Wii, and one of the best games that came out in 2007.

Avatar image for jg4xchamp
jg4xchamp

64040

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 14

User Lists: 0

#39 jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 64040 Posts

[QUOTE="Gh0st_Of_0nyx"]Metroid prime 3 - One of the best looking games Ive played this generation and horribly underrated.Nerd_Man

I agree... I thought Metroid Prime 3 was going to be a huge release for Nintendo, but when it came out, people kinda just moved on... People always fail to mention MP3 and just go straight to SMG and SSBB. MP3 is seriously one of the best games on the Wii, and one of the best games that came out in 2007.

HELL YEAH agreed...
Avatar image for SolidTy
SolidTy

49991

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#40 SolidTy
Member since 2005 • 49991 Posts

[QUOTE="Gh0st_Of_0nyx"]Metroid prime 3 - One of the best looking games Ive played this generation and horribly underrated.Nerd_Man

I agree... I thought Metroid Prime 3 was going to be a huge release for Nintendo, but when it came out, people kinda just moved on... People always fail to mention MP3 and just go straight to SMG and SSBB. MP3 is seriously one of the best games on the Wii, and one of the best games that came out in 2007.

Funny thing about MP3, all Nintendo and Retro did was make the MP control scheme what we play today. Whether on PC, or on PS3/360/)S2, the Left moves your head, and the right moves your feet.(Wow, it only took them three games to figure out why every other game does this)

So genius of them to finally get it right. The scanning of various items really made the game so less monotonous, I'm glad they keep forcing that fun down on us.

I do own it, and I did enjoy it, but I wasn't as impressed as say a person like yourself though.

Avatar image for 50u1r34v3r
50u1r34v3r

1560

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#41 50u1r34v3r
Member since 2006 • 1560 Posts

Gotta go with The Darkness. Hardly ever gets any credit here.

(Though it was good to see some love for it in the COR:AoDA topic a couple of days ago)

Avatar image for anshul89
anshul89

5705

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#42 anshul89
Member since 2006 • 5705 Posts
King's Bounty.
Avatar image for Hellboard
Hellboard

2429

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 86

User Lists: 0

#43 Hellboard
Member since 2008 • 2429 Posts
far cry 2, it suppose to be the the greatest fps this year, but people hate it, despite that assasin creed had the same repetition issue and worse.
Avatar image for tOtalPWNaAe
tOtalPWNaAe

3375

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#44 tOtalPWNaAe
Member since 2008 • 3375 Posts
R&C:FTOD VC DS
Avatar image for lusitanogamer
lusitanogamer

9338

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#45 lusitanogamer
Member since 2006 • 9338 Posts

This is a great game that doesn't get enough credit.

Avatar image for Gaming_Guru_Guy
Gaming_Guru_Guy

485

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#46 Gaming_Guru_Guy
Member since 2008 • 485 Posts

For me without question it is this game.

This should be played by all racing fans it is so goooood!

Avatar image for Floppy_Jim
Floppy_Jim

25931

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#47 Floppy_Jim
Member since 2007 • 25931 Posts
There's a lot- Crackdown, Motorstorm PR, Lost Odyssey, The Darkness, Ratchet and Clank TOD, etc.
Avatar image for st1ka
st1ka

8179

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#48 st1ka
Member since 2008 • 8179 Posts

Neverwinter nights 2 mask of the betrayer

Kameo

Viva Pinata

Lost Odyssey

and to a certain point:

King's bounty: The legend

castlevania: Dracula X chronicles

Avatar image for marklarmer
marklarmer

3883

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#49 marklarmer
Member since 2004 • 3883 Posts
as much as i would like to say games like Saints Row 2, FarCry 2 and Forza 2, it has to be Geow 2 for me. Only 2 years dev time (something reviewers seem to want to kill off), ignored by reviewers graphically and yet about to get insulted in basically every KZ2 review.
Avatar image for RoOodriGowW
RoOodriGowW

3309

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#50 RoOodriGowW
Member since 2008 • 3309 Posts
Gotta agree with the guy who said Folklore.