Ubisoft has surpassed Rockstar as king of open world games

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#1 Edited by Celtic_34 (1220 posts) -

AC IV is probably the best game of last gen and this gen and i don't think because it's a launch title that's going to change soon. Until Watchdogs comes out. The reason I say this is because their games seem to capture the best balance between open world, graphics, story and things to do that's actually enjoyable to play.

GTA has really taken a step back and isn't as appealing. Red Dead Redemption was very good. LA Noire had a good story but it's gameplay was a step back.

Square has sleeping dogs and murdered soul suspect coming out but i don't even think that's open world and these games really aren't on the same level.

Infamous second son is coming. Batman but these are superhero games and still don't think they have the same appeal.

Then there is bethesda. The witcher and games like that that are more rpg's. Skyrim and games like fallout are really great but I don't think they have the same fun factor or blend of action and combat and fun that ubisoft are coming up with.

At least in my book. AC IV and Watchdogs are the two games i'm looking forward to and playing most this gen so far.

#2 Edited by Lulu_Lulu (9923 posts) -

This is much Better than People arguing over systems. Nice Work Celtic

#3 Posted by TheEroica (13240 posts) -

I've been thinking about this a lot myself after playing AC4 and GTA5 back to back... I think the real solution to the question comes down to personal preference. Rockstar knows how to go big on missions and style... the world feels like an organic, living and breathing place that is easy to lose yourself in...

Ubisoft's open world's, when they do their best work, (AC2, AC brotherhood, Far Cry3 and AC4) have UNMATCHED pacing and they literally flood the world with things to do everywhere....

They both do what they do well... I personally lose myself in the AC open world moreso than GTA.

#4 Posted by Sushiglutton (5205 posts) -

I dunno. I just replayed AC4 and I do think it's a very good open world game. I like the combiniation of bombastic ship combat and sandboxy stealth gameplay. Many of the missions are fairly open to how you approach them. I have some problems like how some the gameplay is kind of lackluster and overall the game is just way too easy. Overall though I feel like AC4 is a much more fun and unique game than GTAV, which is just kind tedious. I don't think GTA can match the best elements of AC4's world (naval combat, plantations, naval forts). The only thing you can do is to drive various vehicles and try to break into a military facility. I also don't think that the core gameplay of GTA is that great either.

So yeah overall AC4 is def a better game than GTA 5 imo.

My biggest issues with Ubisoft's OW design are:

  • Lack of challenge
  • Lots of really generic/junky content (all the pointless collectibles and the mini-missions attached to them).
  • Core mechanics that aren't really there yet.
#5 Posted by Zaibach (13430 posts) -

you are correct TC,

currently playing Far cry3 and I dont feel like I am wasting my time like I am in gta games

AC2 still stands as one of the best games of last gen

#6 Edited by Lulu_Lulu (9923 posts) -

@ TheEroica

Rockstar's Pursuit of making things more believable and dynamic in their openworld ecosystem is noble, but its not fun at all. Same thing with Oblivion and its NPC schedules.

Its a geat technical achievment, especially when you witness things, like an Accident in GTA and the cops chasing after the suspect or EMTs coming to the rescue with out your involvement, or Creatures fighting amongst themselves in TES, but its hardly what I call fun. Only immersion whores love ecosystems.

#7 Edited by Sushiglutton (5205 posts) -

@ TheEroica

Rockstar's Pursuit of making things more believable and dynamic in their openworld ecosystem is noble, but its not fun at all. Same thing with Oblivion and its NPC schedules.

Its a geat technical achievment, especially when you witness things, like an Accident in GTA and the cops chasing after the suspect or EMTs coming to the rescue with out your involvement, or Creatures fighting amongst themselves in TES, but its hardly what I call fun. Only immersion whores love ecosystems.

Yeah it feels like GTA5 is a lot more impressive in terms of what you can see/observe than in terms of what you can actĂșally do.

#8 Edited by jun_aka_pekto (15887 posts) -

I have to agree. Far Cry 3's Reset Outpost mode have taken almost all my spare time. After finishing Crysis 3 (PC), I didn't feel the urge to play anything else except Far Cry 3 and FSX. Interesting to note both are open world although in different genres. I haven't bought any new PC game* since Crysis 3 and my PS3 has been gathering dust. Far Cry 3 is just that addictive to me.

*Ooops. I take that back. I did buy the Mass Effect Trilogy last year. But, it too has taken a back seat to Far Cry 3.

#9 Posted by LegatoSkyheart (24581 posts) -

Assassin's Creed IV Black Flag is the Red Dead Redemption of Pirate games.

#10 Posted by Heil68 (43238 posts) -

Far Cry 3 and AC4 were great open world games. I still think the GTA games have a more "alive" feel to them.

#11 Edited by Bigboi500 (29129 posts) -

I'd have to agree with the OP. ACIV simply has the broadest open world environment of any game to date, with more going on, and more things to do than anywhere else. As TheEroica said, Far Cry 3 and ACIV pacing is phenomenal and unmatched.

A lot of people wont admit it, but UbiSoft as a developer has outmached and outdone Rockstar as a developer. They can pump out their games faster and with more frequency than Rockstar, and make better games while doing it.

I expect Watch Dogs to be absolutely amazing.

#12 Edited by TheEroica (13240 posts) -

@ TheEroica

Rockstar's Pursuit of making things more believable and dynamic in their openworld ecosystem is noble, but its not fun at all. Same thing with Oblivion and its NPC schedules.

Its a geat technical achievment, especially when you witness things, like an Accident in GTA and the cops chasing after the suspect or EMTs coming to the rescue with out your involvement, or Creatures fighting amongst themselves in TES, but its hardly what I call fun. Only immersion whores love ecosystems.

well... see that's where I think theres some merit for discussion... The same could be said for Fallout New Vegas cutting you from content based on decisions you make... it's like, "I get it... but I don't like it." To me, games should always be games first and while that sounds rather short sighted, Ultimately, what I want at the end of the day is a flow like games like Assassins Creed or FarCry3 provide. within 60 seconds of the game booting I've already done something that pushes the carrot further and I'm off to do something else. Gta absolutely crushes the environment and the feeling of believability in the world... its a big huge finely detailed sandbox, but when it comes down to it, I'd rather have the game stuff fueling my ID. Fishing to built a new pouch or traversing a foreign island for a myan key strike a greater purpose for me as it connects to the game as a whole than it does to spend time base jumping or racing speedboats...

All that said, I'm glad I follow and play games that offer different takes on the open world... that should be celebrated when you think about it.... too many copycats now aday.

#13 Posted by joehult (361 posts) -

Red dead redemption is the best gen 7 game, followed by the gtas. Ubisoft is a borderline shovel ware company that only builds their new games on top of old games. The fact that Ass creed looked better on ps3 than it did on xbone is testimony to the 10 seconds they put into their crapware.

#14 Edited by jun_aka_pekto (15887 posts) -

Up to now, there are loot boxes in Far Cry 3's map hidden in caves that I haven't found the entrance to yet. I already love the setting and vistas. Just exploring alone is good enough for me because the islands seem alive on their own. But, when the game gives me the ability to alter the political layout of both islands, that is, parts of the islands can either be in Rakyat hands or under pirate/merc rule. That makes the game very special. I find it quite fun to wander into merc territory and have merc vehicles chase me all over the island, even into Rakyat-held areas where Rakyat reinforcements would join in and a big firefight would result. Then there's the animals who take no sides. They'll take down anyone, friend or foe. Very interesting world....Far Cry 3.

#15 Posted by padaporra (3389 posts) -

They're not even close in being close.

#16 Edited by cooolio (435 posts) -

I am pretty sure that TW3 will give cproject red that title when it is released

#17 Posted by N30F3N1X (7964 posts) -

AC IV is probably the best game of last gen

Stopped reading there

I lol'd

#18 Posted by Krelian-co (10227 posts) -

ac iv may be a great game but doesn't come close to gta games.

#19 Posted by turtlethetaffer (16609 posts) -

Rockstar's overrated as hell. Their games are ambitious, but the ambition gets in the way of the fun more often than not.

#20 Posted by Bigboi500 (29129 posts) -

You know there will always be blind R* fans who will stubbornly hold on to the past, but it's funny to see so many of them say stuff like "nu uh" with no other explanation or argument.

#21 Posted by Vatusus (4352 posts) -

lol no

#22 Posted by darkspineslayer (19475 posts) -

I don't get the GTA hard on either. Maybe GTAV wasn't the best ambassador.

I just prefer not only having things to do in the game world, but those things meaning something to my overall progression. Ton of shit to do in GTA, none of it appeals to me. It's there for the sake of being there, nothing more.

#23 Posted by charizard1605 (55489 posts) -

I agree.

Rockstar is pretty damn overrated here, they are propped up because of their past accomplishments, but outside of Red Dead Redemption, they haven't actually released anything in the last decade that comes close to the glory of their PS2 days.

Ubisoft has moved from strength to strength. Not only are their sandboxes simply packed with things to do, they also feel more meaningful (everything you do has a bearing on the game), and they are simply more fun.

Assassin's Creed IV and GTA5 both released last year. I couldn't play GTA5 beyond the first couple of missions. I keep wanting to go back to AC4. Assassin's Creed surpassed GTA. If you had told me I would say that just a year ago, I would have laughed out. Loud.

#24 Posted by charizard1605 (55489 posts) -

You know there will always be blind R* fans who will stubbornly hold on to the past, but it's funny to see so many of them say stuff like "nu uh" with no other explanation or argument.

Yes. To wit:

@joehult said:

Red dead redemption is the best gen 7 game, followed by the gtas. Ubisoft is a borderline shovel ware company that only builds their new games on top of old games. The fact that Ass creed looked better on ps3 than it did on xbone is testimony to the 10 seconds they put into their crapware.

They're not even close in being close.

ac iv may be a great game but doesn't come close to gta games.

You'll notice the people who still maintain that the GTA games/Rockstar are better are the ones who won't bother justifying their opinions. They come in, troll, and leave, because they don't actually have any objective parameters to claim GTA is still better.

Meanwhile, people who claim AC is better are writing paragraphs to explain why they think so.

It tells you a lot.

#25 Posted by mems_1224 (46227 posts) -

lol no. AssCreed is a mediocre series and Far Cry only has one good game in the series. AssCreed 4 might have been better than GTA5 if it didnt have one of the worst open world campaign's I've ever played.

#26 Posted by Vatusus (4352 posts) -

lol no

You know there will always be blind R* fans who will stubbornly hold on to the past, but it's funny to see so many of them say stuff like "nu uh" with no other explanation or argument.

Ok, I'll support my "nu uh"

Rockstar games have better:

Character development (not saying its amazing but still way better than the riddle of chiched characters that are AC games)

more varied gameplay

better gameplay (in AC, and by the looks of WD, R1 is all you need for like 90 percent of gameplay)

better story (again, not saying they are amazing by any means but still better than the convoluted non-sensical bullsh*t AC try to tell us)

More engaging and vivid worlds (Red Dead Redemption world was immersive like none other open-world I've ever played in my life)

satirical humour (AC tries too hard at being serious and completely fails at it. Both GTA and RDR were a perfect mix of humour and drama. The houser brothers have amazing writting and R* games are exceptional at creating engaging characters).

these are my reasons. You can agree or disagree idc, but its my opinion nonetheless

#27 Posted by ShepardCommandr (2291 posts) -

Good one! I needed a good laugh today

#28 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (9923 posts) -

@ Vatusus

Uhm, All you did was call everything about AC bullsh!t.

But thats your oppinion.

Got any facts ?

#29 Posted by way2funny (4569 posts) -

I've been thinking about this a lot myself after playing AC4 and GTA5 back to back... I think the real solution to the question comes down to personal preference. Rockstar knows how to go big on missions and style... the world feels like an organic, living and breathing place that is easy to lose yourself in...

Ubisoft's open world's, when they do their best work, (AC2, AC brotherhood, Far Cry3 and AC4) have UNMATCHED pacing and they literally flood the world with things to do everywhere....

They both do what they do well... I personally lose myself in the AC open world moreso than GTA.

STALKER did what Far Cry 2 / 3 did before they did it, and better. All ubisoft open world games are identical, with the whack a mole questing. Let us just set up a ton of points on the map, and do the same thing over and over again.It just feels so gamey

#30 Posted by lostrib (33242 posts) -

I've been playing through RDR recently, and I really hope Rockstar gets more dynamic with their missions. Doing missions for different people that have opposing goals is kind of hard to believe

#31 Edited by edwardecl (1967 posts) -

Are you joking? Rockstar are still the king of open world, and now the new king of optimisation. Nobody else offers the freedom and scale of GTAV, and the graphical output is well above average for an open world game. Assassins creed is very limited on what you can and can't do, the NPCs are very scripted, sure you have the boats now and that did impress me but not enough to in comparison to GTAV.

Nobody is going to match Rockstar on PS3/360, they threw that in there almost at the end of the gen and I'm guessing most developers were left awestruck, it almost certainly led to the delay of Watch Dogs.

#32 Posted by cooolio (435 posts) -

@Bigboi500 said:

You know there will always be blind R* fans who will stubbornly hold on to the past, but it's funny to see so many of them say stuff like "nu uh" with no other explanation or argument.

Yes. To wit:

@joehult said:

Red dead redemption is the best gen 7 game, followed by the gtas. Ubisoft is a borderline shovel ware company that only builds their new games on top of old games. The fact that Ass creed looked better on ps3 than it did on xbone is testimony to the 10 seconds they put into their crapware.

@padaporra said:

They're not even close in being close.

@Krelian-co said:

ac iv may be a great game but doesn't come close to gta games.

You'll notice the people who still maintain that the GTA games/Rockstar are better are the ones who won't bother justifying their opinions. They come in, troll, and leave, because they don't actually have any objective parameters to claim GTA is still better.

Meanwhile, people who claim AC is better are writing paragraphs to explain why they think so.

It tells you a lot.

None of that applies to everyone. Both have flaws. GTA has worlds that feel more alive, but you do not have any interaction with the world beyond the chaos you cause. AC4's side missions do not mean anything to its world either. Its selling points is the pirate themed open world, and the missions fit it. However, open world games thrive on giving players things to do. Both franchise are popular.

#33 Posted by TwistedShade (3139 posts) -

My problem with GTA 5 compared to AC4, is in GTA 5 I feel like I'm traveling the world just to go from point A>B, AC4 actually has interesting things to do on the way to B.

Easily agree with this GTA 5's world was boring as hell to explore especially in the mountains with nothing to do, AC4 was a blast to explore and FC3 was also a ton of fun.

#34 Edited by aroxx_ab (9218 posts) -

@Sushiglutton:

Oh yeah i totally agree with "Lots of really generic/junky content (all the pointless collectibles and the mini-missions attached to them)." i im so tired of all junk stuff to collect.

I am also tired of this stuff in other games, was it Gears of wars that started this curse with dog tags last gen? now they want us to go find dog tags and notes/papers hidden through more or less all games. They have no used more than give you achievements...

But Ubisoft makes it even more pointless cuz they mark all collectibles on map so you know where to go get them...

#35 Posted by Tqricardinho (340 posts) -

Almost, but not yet.

#36 Edited by Lulu_Lulu (9923 posts) -

@ aroxx_ab

You've obviously never spent hours looking for a stupid collected in a very large map if thats what you think. I'm glad they mark it on the map, it might also be guarded so you get a littles stealth action to make it more interesting. Theres nothing more annoying than a collectable just lying like litter, and GTA has a fuckton of these uninspired collectables.

#37 Posted by murray69murray (126 posts) -
#38 Posted by Bigboi500 (29129 posts) -

@cooolio said:

@charizard1605 said:


You'll notice the people who still maintain that the GTA games/Rockstar are better are the ones who won't bother justifying their opinions. They come in, troll, and leave, because they don't actually have any objective parameters to claim GTA is still better.

Meanwhile, people who claim AC is better are writing paragraphs to explain why they think so.

It tells you a lot.

None of that applies to everyone. Both have flaws. GTA has worlds that feel more alive, but you do not have any interaction with the world beyond the chaos you cause. AC4's side missions do not mean anything to its world either. Its selling points is the pirate themed open world, and the missions fit it. However, open world games thrive on giving players things to do. Both franchise are popular.

Sacking forts rid us of the patrolling man o wars and lesser pesky ships in regional areas. It also reveals new areas of the map that were enigmatic before hand. And you can't take all of them over until you fully upgrade the Jackdaw. It requires dedication and patience to overcome the world of AC IV, nothing in GTA V requires anything but finishing main missions to conquer its open world.

#39 Posted by biggest_loser (24007 posts) -

After playing Skyrim I think Bethesda leaves them both for dead in that department.

#40 Posted by uninspiredcup (7623 posts) -

Yes my friends. Pressing counter-x to win and have dozens upon dozens of dead men pile up without any challenge truly is a showstopper. The 4 hour tutorial that takes up 1/3 of the game. The cardboard copy rehashes. The over stylized blinky-flashy not confusing UI. Desmonds riving not plagiarized story. Holding a single key to run and jump. Incredibly linear missions that have no risk/reward.


Truly, these fellows take the genre to a new level. A mystical magical one full of craftsman.


While you young fellows enjoy your casual non-game. I'll be playing Arma with the big boys.

#41 Posted by robokill (1064 posts) -

I don't know how anyone truly liked AC4, open world, more like "open world". I hate it so much, so much standing around, so much boring dialogue, so much follow this guy, listen to that conversation and then there's the present day nonsense, omg.... I don't want to even think about how terrible AC4 is.

#42 Edited by PrincessGomez92 (3358 posts) -

Haven't played any of the Ubisoft open world games, but I did enjoy Sleeping Dogs more than the Rockstar games I've played (haven't played GTA V yet). I still enjoyed them, but I found the combat in Sleeping Dogs much better, the side stuff way more compelling, and the story more enjoyable.

#43 Edited by PhazonBlazer (11498 posts) -

#44 Posted by Vatusus (4352 posts) -

@Bigboi500 said:

You know there will always be blind R* fans who will stubbornly hold on to the past, but it's funny to see so many of them say stuff like "nu uh" with no other explanation or argument.

Yes. To wit:

@joehult said:

Red dead redemption is the best gen 7 game, followed by the gtas. Ubisoft is a borderline shovel ware company that only builds their new games on top of old games. The fact that Ass creed looked better on ps3 than it did on xbone is testimony to the 10 seconds they put into their crapware.

@padaporra said:

They're not even close in being close.

@Krelian-co said:

ac iv may be a great game but doesn't come close to gta games.

You'll notice the people who still maintain that the GTA games/Rockstar are better are the ones who won't bother justifying their opinions. They come in, troll, and leave, because they don't actually have any objective parameters to claim GTA is still better.

Meanwhile, people who claim AC is better are writing paragraphs to explain why they think so.

It tells you a lot.

Bullshit. Maybe they just dont feel like explaining cause, seriously, R* games explain itselves. And I backed up mine reasons as why R* is still king in a previous post.

#45 Posted by jsmoke03 (12612 posts) -

depends on the game. you talk ac4 but it was just last year that they came out with ac3. i think rockstar has been more consistent and they push the boundaries of open world in a different way. gta always has a million more things to do than an ac game. i have far cry 3, but farcry 2 is still in my mind

#46 Edited by Vatusus (4352 posts) -
@Lulu_Lulu said:

@ Vatusus

Uhm, All you did was call everything about AC bullsh!t.

But thats your oppinion.

Got any facts ?

Why dafuq do I need facts for? Do you have any facts as why GTA V is worse than AC IV other than opinions? It'll always be subjective

But if you like facts then yes, I've a fact for you: GTA and RDR are rated higher than any AC or FC. Is that a good FACT for you?

#47 Posted by Lulu_Lulu (9923 posts) -

@ Vatusus

Skyrim and COD are also highly rated. Not exactly Reliable.

Using common sense too much for ya ? You gona rely on other peoples oppinion.

To be honest with you they both suck, mostly because people like you go "ooooooh aaaaaaah" just driving great distances to do shallow crap, and repeat. As if it would kill them to add a puzzle or two. This whole total freedom thing is not without its flaws.

#48 Posted by cooolio (435 posts) -

@Bigboi500: When I refer to an open world I mean everything from the npcs to the dirt you walk on. Its basically the same thing that they did Far Cry 3. Clear this enemy controlled error so that you can buy goods and have a safe haven.

#49 Edited by MBirdy88 (7396 posts) -

Nothing like grinding up towers finding gems.... repetitive ship combat and armies with guns queueing up to melee attack you one at a time.

....

....

GTA has much more to do as a sandbox.

#50 Edited by jun_aka_pekto (15887 posts) -

I never played any of the Assassin's Creed games. I'm very particular with the setting and so far, the setting of Far Cry 3 is the only setting I've liked in open world games.

How similar is AC4 to Far Cry 3? Can you take potshots at the locals and then have them go after you (as in Far Cry 3)? I know if I took a shot at some Rakyat and stuck around, the 2-3 quickly became 8-10 pissed off Rakyat.