lock please

I thought that what is written below was said by her but after watching it completely I realized that wasn't the case. This thread has no point.

9:30 Tara, men who gamed back in the days were laughed at and bullied at school for playing games. These guys where also rejected buy women hence the stereotype that gamers are virgins. Male gamers were not taken seriously and are still not taken seriously in mainstream media. Men are also judged by their looks too, maybe for women it's more demoralizing but also understand that women are capable of using their sexuality to get ahead in life and this is not something men can do. A man cannot just drop his pants and get favors, he has to work his butt off for everything he gets.

Zoe Quinn was needed for that panel.

Yep, gamers are a shit audience to have, especially to women. Tara Long is cool, not enough for me to care about Rev3, but cool.

...yeah this will go well

The hell happened to her.....

Also for those of you who find a woman who embraces your love of gaming, embrace that shit now.

where was carolyn...the gamming god.

I have one of those, played Donkey Kong:TF all weekend with her. I have slapped a ring on that finger.

Ayyy, my man.

anyone care to summarize for me? I was expecting Tara Strong, and someone I don't recognize came out and I'm now confused.

I'm not very far into it but it's about what you may expect. Women talking about different treatment within the games industry, the effect it had on them, how to find sucess through the stereotypes, etc. One thing that has stood out to me so far is how one of the women on the panel mentioned that often when interviewing developers she would get asked if she "really played games?"

This is perfectly normal, so where does Zoe Quinn come in?

I'm actually watching the panel right now, it's pretty good.

Word, but I do actively seek anything she does. The rest of her co-workers? meh

These chicks get it.

Death threats, harassemnt is unacceptable no matter the circumstances.

Also, Zoe Quinn's personal life should have never been brought to the spot light and the ex-bf who revealed it is a jealous douche.

I think it's reasonable to be upset at what he claims is betrayal and emotional abuse.

Meh.

The stereotypes are perpetuated on all sides; it's not just about guys harassing women.

If I had a dollar for every girl wearing a push-up bra on twitch, youtube, etc. I'd be rich. These girls are also helping to fuel this behavior that guys have towards girl gamers. It doesn't help the image of girls in the industry when legitimate gamers are outnumbered 100-1 by attention whores who have realized how much money can be made by having a pretty face/showing cleavage, and playing games.

Personally, I just take the road of looking down on all fellow gamers; girl or no. I am equally above everyone else.

Agreed.

My wife doesn't embrace my love of gaming but she doesn't get in the way either and is very supportive of my hobby, she buys me games and consoles for birthdays and christmas and unlike the other women i have had relationships with she doesn't complain about the time i spend gaming or the money i spend on games as long as we can afford it, she lets me do my own thing which is awesome.

Agreed, Raychul moore sprongs to mind, she is Fit but i cannot take her seriously when she Calls herself a hardcore gamer because she spends most of her time doing half naked photo shoots in various cosplay costumes.

Good eye Candy, Zero credibility when it comes to Reviewing games.

Personally i have alot of female friends who are gamers especially my cousin Debbie, she loves WRPG's the same as me.

I see women as equally as good as men when it comes to gaming theres just less of them is all.

Another Example would be Ubisofts own Frag dolls, all looks and no substance that team.

I find it amusing when discourse everywhere is about dropping the stereotypes and trying to see how varied all demographics are. But no... so many insist to sticking to the generalization propaganda, and in gaming the prevalent one still seems to be that all gamers are like the few very vocal hateful ones online. Yet most gamers don't even take their time to even discuss games online... or even read daily "gaming news".

@jg4xchamp: She has like one co-worker that's not an intern left

Wow, if she said that, respect.

Remember when I first started watching Rev3Games cause I missed Xplay, I hated everyone who wasn't Adam (including her) cause they just seemed like hipster douches.

Then Adam turned into the biggest hipster SJW douche on the team before quitting it (and he's still talking shit on twitter) and she's the only one on that channel left who I'd consider to be a real gamer.

get chick not wot ok

Hey look! A reasonable perspective from female gamers who aren'tfeminists!

Well yes, groups of people are always associated with their stereotype, a type of person who was/is more vocal than the others. Kind of like how people think feminists are tumblrtard pieces of shit, even though that's only the "feminazis" who actively seek inequality and not legitimate equality.

Who's Tara Long? lol

Who, I say, who the **** is she?

Tara Long works at Rev Games, you know, where Adam Sessler used to work?

I agree that that's happening, but I must point that it's doesn't translate well what's really going on.

I'll start by respectufully, and humbly saying that it seems you're thinking narrowly by coming from stereotypes as both a starting and ending points there. Groups are not uniform, homogenous (I see you implied you acknowledge this). Your starting point though is coming itself from a generalization on how groups interact.

When talking about terms that represent wide groups of people, "gamers" being a great example because it's based just on a hobby, not on race, gender, nationality, etc., and feminism, they can't be resumed so simply. The stereotype says nothing about them, only perpetuates prejudice. Those that base themselves on stereotypes wants to sell that vision to others. You are basing your premise on how groups view and interact with each other on a false premise when regarding to the issue at hand, as if the way they interact (or should interact) is defined by their stereotypes. Sounds, actually, like justification of how one side (feminist) is almost entirely focusing on the stereotype of the other, not willing to hear what the other members of it have to say, while the other one is not, though there are some vocal radical ones that are. There is a discrepancy, one side actually trying to discuss things, and the other one on the defensive, blocking the discussion, mostly with insults and reverse hate-speech, using radicals of the other side and stereotype as a diversion.

People should pay more attention to what this old time feminist intellectual is saying about this issue.

If one side is only concerned at attacking a stereotype, that side is not interested in solving problems. Discussing things in an aggressive tone perpetuates conflict. From what I've been seeing, the new wave of feminism is more living off of said issues and perpetrating reverse hate-speech by focusing on a war on radicals than sitting down together with others to actually focus on the ones trying to make the productive discussion. They want to sit and discuss this among themselves. It's making people believe and reproduce said speech, like Blabadon above, by saying that we gamers are a shit audience. It's indeed perpetuating it. We have to notice when the discourse that comes from the minority begins to mold the view that the majority has on it by exposure, which could be named as "hijacking" the movement. Even gamers are starting to believe that they are defined by their own radical minority. When that's not true at all. Only last gen hundreds of millions of consoles (consoles alone) were sold, their gaming libraries not defined by some oversexed and overviolent games, there being plenty of platformers, RPGs, adventurers, simulators, racing games, etc., that are just the opposite or neutral to these issues. That's a result of a shaming campaign. The discussion has to be retaken by people that actually wants to discuss them... not shame the other side and inflate hate, making even themselves hate each other. That panel in the OP was a great beginning.

While some others are basically selling themselves and/or their objectives on the stereotypes they help to stablish:

Let me remember that what the guy on the left said is statistically not true.

Basically, we have one side with radicals bashing feminists, but in that side there's also a large group of people trying to discuss another issue altogether, but they are being silenced by censorship and shaming, as if they were all like those radicals within their own "movement", making people afraid of being associated with the term itself (gamer). That side is trying to not let the vocal minority take control. The other side, though, is just now bringing more balanced voices to the occasion, trying to discuss the issue together, rather than unilaterally. Of course, all I'm saying is being based on what I've been reading the last weeks on the developments on recent issues and debates on this. One more time, I'm happy that this panel was made the way it was, and that the people invited had more balanced opinions on the issue.

I think your time frame is wrong since I didint hear her say any of those things.

@SambaLele said:

@parkurtommo said:

@SambaLele said:

@Blabadon said:

Yep, gamers are a shit audience to have, especially to women. Tara Long is cool, not enough for me to care about Rev3, but cool.

I find it amusing when discourse everywhere is about dropping the stereotypes and trying to see how varied all demographics are. But no... so many insist to sticking to the generalization propaganda, and in gaming the prevalent one still seems to be that all gamers are like the few very vocal hateful ones online. Yet most gamers don't even take their time to even discuss games online... or even read daily "gaming news".

Well yes, groups of people are always associated with their stereotype, a type of person who was/is more vocal than the others. Kind of like how people think feminists are tumblrtard pieces of shit, even though that's only the "feminazis" who actively seek inequality and not legitimate equality.

I agree that that's happening, but I must point that it's doesn't translate well what's really going on.

I'll start by respectufully, and humbly saying that it seems you're thinking narrowly by coming from stereotypes as both a starting and ending points there. Groups are not uniform, homogenous (I see you implied you acknowledge this). Your starting point though is coming itself from a generalization on how groups interact.

When talking about terms that represent wide groups of people, "gamers" being a great example because it's based just on a hobby, not on race, gender, nationality, etc., and feminism, they can't be resumed so simply. The stereotype says nothing about them, only perpetuates prejudice. Those that base themselves on stereotypes wants to sell that vision to others. You are basing your premise on how groups view and interact with each other on a false premise when regarding to the issue at hand, as if the way they interact (or should interact) is defined by their stereotypes. Sounds, actually, like justification of how one side (feminist) is almost entirely focusing on the stereotype of the other, not willing to hear what the other members of it have to say, while the other one is not, though there are some vocal radical ones that are. There is a discrepancy, one side actually trying to discuss things, and the other one on the defensive, blocking the discussion, mostly with insults and reverse hate-speech, using radicals of the other side and stereotype as a diversion.

People should pay more attention to what this old time feminist intellectual is saying about this issue.

If one side is only concerned at attacking a stereotype, that side is not interested in solving problems. Discussing things in an aggressive tone perpetuates conflict. From what I've been seeing, the new wave of feminism is more living off of said issues and perpetrating reverse hate-speech by focusing on a war on radicals than sitting down together with others to actually focus on the ones trying to make the productive discussion. They want to sit and discuss this among themselves. It's making people believe and reproduce said speech, like Blabadon above, by saying that we gamers are a shit audience. It's indeed perpetuating it. We have to notice when the discourse that comes from the minority begins to mold the view that the majority has on it by exposure, which could be named as "hijacking" the movement. Even gamers are starting to believe that they are defined by their own radical minority. When that's not true at all. Only last gen hundreds of millions of consoles (consoles alone) were sold, their gaming libraries not defined by some oversexed and overviolent games, there being plenty of platformers, RPGs, adventurers, simulators, racing games, etc., that are just the opposite or neutral to these issues. That's a result of a shaming campaign. The discussion has to be retaken by people that actually wants to discuss them... not shame the other side and inflate hate, making even themselves hate each other. That panel in the OP was a great beginning.

While some others are basically selling themselves and/or their objectives on the stereotypes they help to stablish:

Let me remember that what the guy on the left said is statistically not true.

Basically, we have one side with radicals bashing feminists, but in that side there's also a large group of people trying to discuss another issue altogether, but they are being silenced by censorship and shaming, as if they were all like those radicals within their own "movement", making people afraid of being associated with the term itself (gamer). That side is trying to not let the vocal minority take control. The other side, though, is just now bringing more balanced voices to the occasion, trying to discuss the issue together, rather than unilaterally. Of course, all I'm saying is being based on what I've been reading the last weeks on the developments on recent issues and debates on this. One more time, I'm happy that this panel was made the way it was, and that the people invited had more balanced opinions on the issue.

I agree with you completely. That's how western society is driven now. By sensationalist journalism (further amplified by the way information is passed around on the internet) that focuses on the extremes (mostly negative ones) and that becomes people's way of knowing a group, by a stereotype. It's pretty much a deception war.

And yes, people don't directly tackle the issue at hand, but rather the people who disagree with them, and then use stereotypes to criticize said people. And guess what happens when you use false stereotypes to criticize another group of (highly opinionated) people? They disregard anything you say as stupid (and it is), suddenly you become the stereotype they are fighting. It's a viscous circle.

As long as it's contained in the harmless world of the internet, it's fine. As long as there are no hate crimes and what have you.

8/10 would bang all of them

these things It's always someone else's fault, and while today's society would have you say be responsible for your own life don't blame others, there's only so much that you can do about it when someone else was there first to give out an impression and set out what the "standard" is in modern society. Yes guys that play video games are constantly seen as nerds and geeks and that for the most part is wrong. But why is it like that ? it's probably because some guys are obsessed with video games and it's culture and they're the most visible, even most of us playing video games would look at them and have an opinion about them without knowing them. Maybe they're dorks? or virgins ? or have balls to dress like that ? or they should probably try to do something productive with their lives besides playing video games? or just that it's awesome they show what they like because some of us wouldn't have the guts to do it.

While at the same time girls like to flaunt that they have a good body. They like to wear tight clothing to show off that they're sexy and that it's normal and sexy to go out and kiss another girl. Other girls would immediately look at them as whores but they in turn look at them as b*tches whining about what's not their business. And the sexy girls set a standard as-well that all men want to look at are boobs and become sexist. This is entirely wrong, yes we get horny that doesn't mean it's what guys in general care about. Being a guy growing up with guys i can confirm that "sexist macho shit" it's just a cover up to not look like a homo guys do fall in love with girls some are just a-holes in general it hasn't nothing to do with being sexist or not and a lot are actually the ignored good guys that get shoved down the corner and forgotten until they can be proven useful. In high school for example though if you didn't say you wanted to see boobs you was either a homo or a christian. ( yea as odd as that might seem like i used to be a heavy christian so in an odd way i set out that religious standard ) of-course that didn't stop people from trying to harass me about my believes because of all the atheist that there were.

all in all while this is an interesting topic let's be honest, the girls flaunting have the right idea. We should all just mind our business and stop stereo types. Is the only thing i see wrong, it's not guys fault or women's it's people getting together shoving down ideas on everyone's minds about each other. I personally even as a gamer since i was 5 don't feel part of that conversation at all, even though they're talking about us it's pretty much feels like they're going the wrong way doing the same thing they're complaining about.

10/10 Day 1.

"Gamers" nowadays are budebros playing cod and halo, games nowadays are "interactive experiances" movies. take no skill or any form of dedication and effort or thinking.

Basicly "Gamers" are dead as some article said. Now its just males and females playing games. So ditch the stereotypes already. People who post here and other sites were seeing as nerds...now every dudebro posts and games are designed to appeal to the same crowd as hollywood movies.

I did see pic somewhere comparing a male twitch streamer compared to a female one. The male had the game in focus with a small webcam shot of him in the bottom left while the female one had the game in a small screen with her and her cleavage taking up most of the screen.

Thanks for the discussion. I agree with all that. The internet, especially social medias, are actually silencing debates and radicalizing people. I strong advise reading the linked article, it's a good read. Employing fallacies in order to "win" is more important than actually debating it seems. Yet, the internet is not a living thing with opinion and habits of it's own... it's not the internet that does that. It's us. We can have the discussions and the internet is a great place for that. It's down to us to achieve that. It's all down to propagating a culture of mutual understanding instead of this culture of conflict we have today. The first thing to do is to not silence yourself because you're afraid of the backlash from either side of the discussion, and be civilized, try to understand other people's points... set the example.

Of course, always knowing that, like you said, hate crimes and what have you should not be tolerated, and be a police matter, investigated and punished if needed, but not taken as an actual part of the discussions themselves, or representative of either side of it, because they aren't. If anything those are diversions.

I don't understand exactly what is your position. Is that you find gamers to be "dudebros" or that stereotypes should be ditched already? You do or you do not accept the stereotypes after all?

I am truly convinced that so called "Third Wave" feminists are nowhere near the same as actual feminists. Equality and representation is a good thing. Hell, there are a lot of women who make great games out there. Having new ideas and creative talent is only good news for me as a gamer. All in all, we win if girls are more active and taking interest in gaming as a hobby.

What doesn't make sense is a bunch of people sitting around with little to no merit in the industry trying to tell people how things should run. In the grand scheme of things, a lot of the people trying to judge gamer culture themselves have added exactly jack and shit to gaming let alone the dialogue surrounding it. As someone who's been a gamer since the 80's, I've seen us come a long way with how society treats and receives us. If I have to be blunt, hearing a bunch of chickens cluck about how they want an "easy recognition" button makes me wonder how serious some of these people actually want to be taken.

I'm glad to hear that some girls in gaming are not throwing out actual sense in the name of some jihad against gamers and the industry. Good on them and I hope they drown out the radical third-wavers who will only ever want people to tune out the good with the bad.

TotalBiscuit pointed out that much of the scandal has more to do with Zoe Quinn's response rather than what she has done. On Reddit, I pointed out through an alternative account that the issue here isn't that Zoe Quinn is sleeping around that's the problem, it's the fact that she muffled a critical review on YouTube through copyright claims.

Zoe Quinn isn't the first person to sleep around, nor will she be the last. She is the Cersei Lannister of the industry, and I hope she meets the same fate as Cersei (getting fat and shamed).

Lock Request granted.