Cinematic walking isnt useless and can serve multiple good purposes. They can help with pacing, atmosphere, or provide valuable ways to tell a good story. But moderation is key. The arkham games have some fine examples of it. They help setup many instances, provide context, and good atmosphere. The developer should limit it to situations where a cutscene isnt as effective. Making them skippable is a plus, but brevity is more important imo.
Cinematic walking isnt useless and can serve multiple good purposes. They can help with pacing, atmosphere, or provide valuable ways to tell a good story. But moderation is key. The arkham games have some fine examples of it. They help setup many instances, provide context, and good atmosphere. The developer should limit it to situations where a cutscene isnt as effective. Making them skippable is a plus, but brevity is more important imo.
Plenty of games have had excellent pacing, atmosphere, and have told their stories without relying on cinematic walking.
The difference is moments where game developers used to treat their audience with some respect and put it in the players hands have been changed to lets force this shit on the player.
I've no trouble when used in moderation and for short periods. I have more of an issue with enforced tutorials and help boxes constantly popping up than I do forced walking. Truth is, you cannot build up atmosphere or tension as effectively if you let the player rush headlong in at a pace of their choosing, swinging their dicks six ways from Sunday. I don't really agree with it in aiding exposition, but as far as revealing new environments and (as mentioned) slowing the action to build tension of events to come, meh....it serves its purpose.
@jg4xchamp: Uh ok? I didnt say that games without cinematic walking couldnt be good.
Point being that they don't really actually help with any of those elements, because they provide zero benefit over just trusting the player to naturally pay attention, or pacing your game with more genuine quite moments ala Half Life 2 and Resident Evil 4.
I hate forced cinematic walking. Imagine if Mario stopped in the middle of each level to force you to walk cinematically. Like, what the ****, man.
Wait... Don't you like Uncharted 2? If that's the case sholdn't you love cinematic walking and pointlessly drawn out gameplay sections that essentially have no gameplay. That game had a ton of it. There were at least 3 whole chapters that contained nothing but that.
In any case, I really hate this kind of thing. It's absolutely worse than cutscenes, because those can generally be skipped. These are pointless segments they force you to do.
Cinematic walking (Naughty Dog games), ridiculously long cut scenes (MGS4), and games with too many QTEs need to go away.
Uncharted games and TLoU need to go away, MGS4 should have never existed, and Hack and slash game in the GOD of War category are all a mistake, and Heavy Rain and Tell Tales games like game should be eliminated?
@jg4xchamp: wait, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't what Half Life 2 does pretty much the same thing as cinematic walking? I'm not THAT familiar with the game, but I've seen a lot of it played. Aren't there parts where the characters talk to you and all you can do is walk around in a limited space until they allow you to move on? Is that really any different at all?
Cinematic walking (Naughty Dog games), ridiculously long cut scenes (MGS4), and games with too many QTEs need to go away.
Uncharted games and TLoU need to go away, MGS4 should have never existed, and Hack and slash game in the GOD of War category are all a mistake, and Heavy Rain and Tell Tales games like game should be eliminated?
WOW...
I enjoyed UC2 and TLOU but I sure as hell hope that UC4 doesn't have crap like cinematic walking. I loved MGS3 and hated 4 so yeah 4 sucked. However I am hoping MGS5 is a lot better.
I never cared for Heavy Rain and the Tell Tales games.
@jg4xchamp: wait, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't what Half Life 2 does pretty much the same thing as cinematic walking? I'm not THAT familiar with the game, but I've seen a lot of it played. Aren't there parts where the characters talk to you and all you can do is walk around in a limited space until they allow you to move on? Is that really any different at all?
That is one of my favourite parts of the game. It's like a hilarious meta-narrative. You have all this serious end-of-the-world talking going on, and here is a MIT graduate jumping around on tables, throwing junk around the room.
@jg4xchamp: wait, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't what Half Life 2 does pretty much the same thing as cinematic walking? I'm not THAT familiar with the game, but I've seen a lot of it played. Aren't there parts where the characters talk to you and all you can do is walk around in a limited space until they allow you to move on? Is that really any different at all?
Yeah but you have full control of the player, it's not elegant about it (because you're still stuck listening to these fuckers), but you aren't pulled from the immersion of the game. The actual feel of the game is the same as if it would be in combat, there is just dudes talking.
Now compare that to all of a sudden I can't sprint because reasons, and being forced to walk at a snail's pace. Which one of those do you think breaks the illusion of the game more, hint it's not Half Life 2.
@jg4xchamp: Im not saying they can always be beneficial. But they can do awesome things like this
Loading Video...
Its all about how and why its being used.
Great segment, but I would argue the part where the player is forced to play the game at a speed slower than usual wasn't necessary. At that point they could have just made a long ass hallway (which the scarecrow stuff gives them just enough), and him dropping at that point would come after a reasonable thing.
I get the argument that "well they didn't want the player ruining their scene", but I'm a bigger fan of games that are willing to trust their player to meet the game halfway on things and pay attention, which for a game like asylum it is pretty easy to pay attention. It earns those scarecrow moments, plus in general majority of cinematic walking segments are not that shit, they are either poorly thought out wank like Nathan Drake in a desert or used for a lame info dump.
Though if you wanted to double down on a segment like that: The Sorrow in Snake Eater. I like that part.
@jg4xchamp: It has to be earned. I pretty much already said that multiple times, but imo a segment like that cannot be done any other way. The first time I did it, it caught me completely off guard. Allowing the player full control in moments like that could shatter and ruin its meaning.
I never said the majority of them are good, but it can be a useful tool when done right and for the right reasons.
@jg4xchamp: wait, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't what Half Life 2 does pretty much the same thing as cinematic walking? I'm not THAT familiar with the game, but I've seen a lot of it played. Aren't there parts where the characters talk to you and all you can do is walk around in a limited space until they allow you to move on? Is that really any different at all?
Yeah but you have full control of the player, it's not elegant about it (because you're still stuck listening to these fuckers), but you aren't pulled from the immersion of the game. The actual feel of the game is the same as if it would be in combat, there is just dudes talking.
Now compare that to all of a sudden I can't sprint because reasons, and being forced to walk at a snail's pace. Which one of those do you think breaks the illusion of the game more, hint it's not Half Life 2.
thats not really better than forcing you to slow down. plus, there is no such thing as immersion in a half life game because you're not even playing a real character.
Yeah but you have full control of the player, it's not elegant about it (because you're still stuck listening to these fuckers), but you aren't pulled from the immersion of the game. The actual feel of the game is the same as if it would be in combat, there is just dudes talking.
Now compare that to all of a sudden I can't sprint because reasons, and being forced to walk at a snail's pace. Which one of those do you think breaks the illusion of the game more, hint it's not Half Life 2.
thats not really better than forcing you to slow down. plus, there is no such thing as immersion in a half life game because you're not even playing a real character.
Listen i have no desire to pretend Half Life 2 is good, but at the least I can respect that shit over cinematic walking. **** forced walking. Shit ruins replaying games.
Yeah but you have full control of the player, it's not elegant about it (because you're still stuck listening to these fuckers), but you aren't pulled from the immersion of the game. The actual feel of the game is the same as if it would be in combat, there is just dudes talking.
Now compare that to all of a sudden I can't sprint because reasons, and being forced to walk at a snail's pace. Which one of those do you think breaks the illusion of the game more, hint it's not Half Life 2.
thats not really better than forcing you to slow down. plus, there is no such thing as immersion in a half life game because you're not even playing a real character.
Listen i have no desire to pretend Half Life 2 is good, but at the least I can respect that shit over cinematic walking. **** forced walking. Shit ruins replaying games.
nah, just take control away. running around in circles and jumping around a room like an idiot while this jackass gives me orders i have to blindly follow isn't immersive.
Listen i have no desire to pretend Half Life 2 is good, but at the least I can respect that shit over cinematic walking. **** forced walking. Shit ruins replaying games.
nah, just take control away. running around in circles and jumping around a room like an idiot while this jackass gives me orders i have to blindly follow isn't immersive.
If you're saying take control away with a cutscene, I'm actually okay with that.
if you're saying take control away and force me to walk and listen to this shit anyway, so on top of me still having to listen to this shit story I have to suffer a poor feeling game for a minute or 2...then no, **** off.
Listen i have no desire to pretend Half Life 2 is good, but at the least I can respect that shit over cinematic walking. **** forced walking. Shit ruins replaying games.
nah, just take control away. running around in circles and jumping around a room like an idiot while this jackass gives me orders i have to blindly follow isn't immersive.
If you're saying take control away with a cutscene, I'm actually okay with that.
if you're saying take control away and force me to walk and listen to this shit anyway, so on top of me still having to listen to this shit story I have to suffer a poor feeling game for a minute or 2...then no, **** off.
nah, just make him walk automatically if you're not gonna do a cut scene. let me take a break if you're gonna give me this long info dump.
If you're saying take control away with a cutscene, I'm actually okay with that.
if you're saying take control away and force me to walk and listen to this shit anyway, so on top of me still having to listen to this shit story I have to suffer a poor feeling game for a minute or 2...then no, **** off.
nah, just make him walk automatically if you're not gonna do a cut scene. let me take a break if you're gonna give me this long info dump.
I'm also not against walking segments where I don't have to participate, suddenly not the worst thing ever.
Cinematic walking (Naughty Dog games), ridiculously long cut scenes (MGS4), and games with too many QTEs need to go away.
Uncharted games and TLoU need to go away, MGS4 should have never existed, and Hack and slash game in the GOD of War category are all a mistake, and Heavy Rain and Tell Tales games like game should be eliminated?
WOW...
I enjoyed UC2 and TLOU but I sure as hell hope that UC4 doesn't have crap like cinematic walking. I loved MGS3 and hated 4 so yeah 4 sucked. However I am hoping MGS5 is a lot better.
I never cared for Heavy Rain and the Tell Tales games.
Cinematic walking (Naughty Dog games), ridiculously long cut scenes (MGS4), and games with too many QTEs need to go away.
Uncharted games and TLoU need to go away, MGS4 should have never existed, and Hack and slash game in the GOD of War category are all a mistake, and Heavy Rain and Tell Tales games like game should be eliminated?
WOW...
I enjoyed UC2 and TLOU but I sure as hell hope that UC4 doesn't have crap like cinematic walking. I loved MGS3 and hated 4 so yeah 4 sucked. However I am hoping MGS5 is a lot better.
I never cared for Heavy Rain and the Tell Tales games.
Hence why I said too many QTEs.
Then again GOW3 sucked.
UC3 suckedtoo.
Let me repeat myself:
MGS4 sucked.
GOW3 sucked.
Uncharted 3 sucked.
And yes I have zero interest in Heavy Rain, Beyond Two Souls and Tell tales games. In the same way that I am not interested in racing sims like GT and Forza.
Cinematic walking (Naughty Dog games), ridiculously long cut scenes (MGS4), and games with too many QTEs need to go away.
Uncharted games and TLoU need to go away, MGS4 should have never existed, and Hack and slash game in the GOD of War category are all a mistake, and Heavy Rain and Tell Tales games like game should be eliminated?
WOW...
I enjoyed UC2 and TLOU but I sure as hell hope that UC4 doesn't have crap like cinematic walking. I loved MGS3 and hated 4 so yeah 4 sucked. However I am hoping MGS5 is a lot better.
I never cared for Heavy Rain and the Tell Tales games.
Hence why I said too many QTEs.
Then again GOW3 sucked.
UC3 suckedtoo.
Let me repeat myself:
MGS4 sucked.
GOW3 sucked.
Uncharted 3 sucked.
And yes I have zero interest in Heavy Rain, Beyond Two Souls and Tell tales games. In the same way that I am not interested in racing sims like GT and Forza.
I'll give you Beyond cuz that shit is a turd, and I'll give you racing sims cuz those games are a snore fest.
Cinematic walking (Naughty Dog games), ridiculously long cut scenes (MGS4), and games with too many QTEs need to go away.
Uncharted games and TLoU need to go away, MGS4 should have never existed, and Hack and slash game in the GOD of War category are all a mistake, and Heavy Rain and Tell Tales games like game should be eliminated?
WOW...
I enjoyed UC2 and TLOU but I sure as hell hope that UC4 doesn't have crap like cinematic walking. I loved MGS3 and hated 4 so yeah 4 sucked. However I am hoping MGS5 is a lot better.
I never cared for Heavy Rain and the Tell Tales games.
Hence why I said too many QTEs.
Then again GOW3 sucked.
UC3 suckedtoo.
Let me repeat myself:
MGS4 sucked.
GOW3 sucked.
Uncharted 3 sucked.
And yes I have zero interest in Heavy Rain, Beyond Two Souls and Tell tales games. In the same way that I am not interested in racing sims like GT and Forza.
I'll give you Beyond cuz that shit is a turd, and I'll give you racing sims cuz those games are a snore fest.
But...
seriously man?
what in the ****?
A. I believe they sucked, especially compared to their predecessors. MGS3 was awesome, UC2 was awesome, and GOW2 was good.
B. Stating the obvious but it's called an opinion.
And yes I have zero interest in Heavy Rain, Beyond Two Souls and Tell tales games. In the same way that I am not interested in racing sims like GT and Forza.
I'll give you Beyond cuz that shit is a turd, and I'll give you racing sims cuz those games are a snore fest.
But...
seriously man?
what in the ****?
A. I believe they sucked, especially compared to their predecessors. MGS3 was awesome, UC2 was awesome, and GOW2 was good.
B. Stating the obvious but it's called an opinion.
Oh I know its your opinion, but man does your opinion... suck
A. I believe they sucked, especially compared to their predecessors. MGS3 was awesome, UC2 was awesome, and GOW2 was good.
B. Stating the obvious but it's called an opinion.
Oh I know its your opinion, but man does your opinion... suck
Uhh no, that's a pretty solid opinion. MGS4 and UC3 are bad games.
Bad games? Definitely not.
Disappointing? That's a guarantee.
Disappointing is all relative to the individual. After years of hearing MGS4 "has no gameplay" I was surprised at how great the game actually was. Some of the best open-ended 3rd person gameplay out there.
It's a piss design choice by developers that basically don't have a clue on how to create atmosphere in a video game. I don't care if it works in some games for some people, intentionally impeding control wile in-game is never a good design choice.
Listen i have no desire to pretend Half Life 2 is good, but at the least I can respect that shit over cinematic walking. **** forced walking. Shit ruins replaying games.
Listen i have no desire to pretend Half Life 2 is good, but at the least I can respect that shit over cinematic walking. **** forced walking. Shit ruins replaying games.
You didn't like Ravenholm?
Ravenholm is a terrific level, so is shit like Nova Prospect and that stretch where you and the rebels fight striders in city 17. I however, do not like large stretches of that game. I will respect the variety, the actual story telling in the game, the gravity gun, the tech that powers the game, but the actual game? No, it's poorly paced for large stretches making you go through mindless slogs of gameplay like the sewer segment or having you control that lame boat, the core mechanics are painfully average even back in 2004 which is why the variety gets compromised because all of it is tied to shooting that isn't fun or inherently satisfying. Max Payne and FEAR can be as repetitive all they want in comparison to Half Life 2, they make the core action satisfying. Half Life 2 doesn't. I also do not respect the 5 or 6 times Half Life 2 has a seesaw puzzle.
A: it's simplistic and dull and isn't enjoyable to anyone that is over the age of 5.
B: It's the equivalent of Ocarina of Time's "go into first person and find this switch on this soulless crevice on the wall", because it was Nintendo going LOOK OUR GAME IS IN 3D. IN Valve's case LOOK WE MADE A PHYSICS ENGINE
Only for those assholes to keep doing it in Episode 1 and 2, because like it was important to the Half Life 2 formula bro.
The actual plot? Is hilariously bullshit across the board. It's a poor scifi action romp with a hint of 1984 thrown in to trick gamers into thinking its something special. The characters completely dick ride Gordon Freeman for the sole purpose that Valve made a game that sucks the player off left, right, and center. There is no logical reason the mother fucker who is basically responsible for aliens taking over the world is as loved as Gordon Freeman is, but he is in Half Life 2. Alyx Vance who should be one of the best female characters in gaming, is terrible based solely on the premise that is nauseating about how much she wants Gordon's dick. Like every bit of her design isn't to make her a genuine character, because she isn't. She's like the rest of the cast in Half Life, they exist solely to pander to the player and make them feel special.
So yeah Half Life 2 the all time terrific action game it's made out to be? I disagree, certainly not in an era that saw 2 Metroid Prime games, Resident Evil 4, 2 Max Payne games, Chronicles of Riddick, Farcry (shitty trigun noted), a No One Lives Forever game, the original Call of Duty, Brothers in Arms road to hill 30and where Valve's updated mod has better shooting mechanics: Counterstrike Source.
I think cinematic walking is a blast for the first playthrough; after that most of games are pretty much dead for me and that makes them not worthy of full price in my opinion...
I'm with you on this one. When I first played The walking dead, I was like "Ok this is a nice change from other games". I really liked it but when The wolf among us came out, I was like "Okay??? Haven't I done this before?". Then it got boring and gave up on telltales games. All of them are interactive movies. Should've limited that to just TWD series. Never liked GOW and Uncharted 3 is poorly done expansion of UC2.
@jg4xchamp: It has to be earned. I pretty much already said that multiple times, but imo a segment like that cannot be done any other way. The first time I did it, it caught me completely off guard. Allowing the player full control in moments like that could shatter and ruin its meaning.
I never said the majority of them are good, but it can be a useful tool when done right and for the right reasons.
Only Sith deal in absolutes, champ.
The sith lords had it right all along, the bad guys win in episode 6, you were fucking fooled.
Listen i have no desire to pretend Half Life 2 is good, but at the least I can respect that shit over cinematic walking. **** forced walking. Shit ruins replaying games.
You didn't like Ravenholm?
Ravenholm is a terrific level, so is shit like Nova Prospect and that stretch where you and the rebels fight striders in city 17. I however, do not like large stretches of that game. I will respect the variety, the actual story telling in the game, the gravity gun, the tech that powers the game, but the actual game? No, it's poorly paced for large stretches making you go through mindless slogs of gameplay like the sewer segment or having you control that lame boat, the core mechanics are painfully average even back in 2004 which is why the variety gets compromised because all of it is tied to shooting that isn't fun or inherently satisfying. Max Payne and FEAR can be as repetitive all they want in comparison to Half Life 2, they make the core action satisfying. Half Life 2 doesn't. I also do not respect the 5 or 6 times Half Life 2 has a seesaw puzzle.
A: it's simplistic and dull and isn't enjoyable to anyone that is over the age of 5.
B: It's the equivalent of Ocarina of Time's "go into first person and find this switch on this soulless crevice on the wall", because it was Nintendo going LOOK OUR GAME IS IN 3D. IN Valve's case LOOK WE MADE A PHYSICS ENGINE
Only for those assholes to keep doing it in Episode 1 and 2, because like it was important to the Half Life 2 formula bro.
The actual plot? Is hilariously bullshit across the board. It's a poor scifi action romp with a hint of 1984 thrown in to trick gamers into thinking its something special. The characters completely dick ride Gordon Freeman for the sole purpose that Valve made a game that sucks the player off left, right, and center. There is no logical reason the mother fucker who is basically responsible for aliens taking over the world is as loved as Gordon Freeman is, but he is in Half Life 2. Alyx Vance who should be one of the best female characters in gaming, is terrible based solely on the premise that is nauseating about how much she wants Gordon's dick. Like every bit of her design isn't to make her a genuine character, because she isn't. She's like the rest of the cast in Half Life, they exist solely to pander to the player and make them feel special.
So yeah Half Life 2 the all time terrific action game it's made out to be? I disagree, certainly not in an era that saw 2 Metroid Prime games, Resident Evil 4, 2 Max Payne games, Chronicles of Riddick, Farcry (shitty trigun noted), a No One Lives Forever game, the original Call of Duty, Brothers in Arms road to hill 30and where Valve's updated mod has better shooting mechanics: Counterstrike Source.
Nice post, i agree that Half Life 2 is underwhelming, but for other reasons. I found the gunplay in particular to be poor because of a combination between piss AI that run at you to get downed with no strategy involved and the 'bullet-sponge' design that make weapons feel like pea shooters.
I sincerely tell you, the gunplay is a massive downgrade from the original Half Life. That game had fantastic AI and great gunplay. Especially the Opposing Force expansion, that shit scared me at how well designed the AI is wen i first tried it out in 2012. It's better than almost any FPS i have ever played. I actually can't think of one better at the moment.
Ravenholm is a terrific level, so is shit like Nova Prospect and that stretch where you and the rebels fight striders in city 17. I however, do not like large stretches of that game. I will respect the variety, the actual story telling in the game, the gravity gun, the tech that powers the game, but the actual game? No, it's poorly paced for large stretches making you go through mindless slogs of gameplay like the sewer segment or having you control that lame boat, the core mechanics are painfully average even back in 2004 which is why the variety gets compromised because all of it is tied to shooting that isn't fun or inherently satisfying. Max Payne and FEAR can be as repetitive all they want in comparison to Half Life 2, they make the core action satisfying. Half Life 2 doesn't. I also do not respect the 5 or 6 times Half Life 2 has a seesaw puzzle.
A: it's simplistic and dull and isn't enjoyable to anyone that is over the age of 5.
B: It's the equivalent of Ocarina of Time's "go into first person and find this switch on this soulless crevice on the wall", because it was Nintendo going LOOK OUR GAME IS IN 3D. IN Valve's case LOOK WE MADE A PHYSICS ENGINE
Only for those assholes to keep doing it in Episode 1 and 2, because like it was important to the Half Life 2 formula bro.
The actual plot? Is hilariously bullshit across the board. It's a poor scifi action romp with a hint of 1984 thrown in to trick gamers into thinking its something special. The characters completely dick ride Gordon Freeman for the sole purpose that Valve made a game that sucks the player off left, right, and center. There is no logical reason the mother fucker who is basically responsible for aliens taking over the world is as loved as Gordon Freeman is, but he is in Half Life 2. Alyx Vance who should be one of the best female characters in gaming, is terrible based solely on the premise that is nauseating about how much she wants Gordon's dick. Like every bit of her design isn't to make her a genuine character, because she isn't. She's like the rest of the cast in Half Life, they exist solely to pander to the player and make them feel special.
So yeah Half Life 2 the all time terrific action game it's made out to be? I disagree, certainly not in an era that saw 2 Metroid Prime games, Resident Evil 4, 2 Max Payne games, Chronicles of Riddick, Farcry (shitty trigun noted), a No One Lives Forever game, the original Call of Duty, Brothers in Arms road to hill 30and where Valve's updated mod has better shooting mechanics: Counterstrike Source.
Nice post, i agree that Half Life 2 is underwhelming, but for other reasons. I found the gunplay in particular to be poor because of a combination between piss AI that run at you to get downed with no strategy involved and the 'bullet-sponge' design that make weapons feel like pea shooters.
I sincerely tell you, the gunplay is a massive downgrade from the original Half Life. That game had fantastic AI and great gunplay. Especially the Opposing Force expansion, that shit scared me at how well designed the AI is wen i first tried it out in 2012. It's better than almost any FPS i have ever played. I actually can't think of one better at the moment.
Oh don't get me wrong, I think the AI is quite poor also, but I can get over that on some basic level. The rest of it? nope.
I kind of want to try out Half Life source, but everytime i think about it I just go, why retry that when I could replay Resident Evil 4? I come up with nothing.
I've never thought cinematic walking was a bad thing for certain people until forumites started complaining about it tbh. I just don't really mind as long as its not taking up a huge amount of time or its before some long ass section that you can die on reverting you back to said walking part (rare enough for me not to remember any game like that but I'm sure there is one part in a game).
I guess the last game where it did this was TLOU. It wasn't too bad though and normally these scenes are on a chill part.
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