Would More Lapel Cameras Bring Greater Accountibility for Police Misconduct?

Yes, they've done some studies where they've tried this in california, and wrongful arrests dropped by like 40% Violence against police dropped by 60%, and trust of police went up.

Sounds good to me, let's get er done.

I rather see more bystanders with cellphones.

You have the link?

Me too.

I think it would.

No, not even close.

Based on that, it seems like a good plan.

They don't?

The US will be the next Russia...everybody needs cameras because some fool is bound to come out of nowhere and ram into you =P

I think he's referring to the study done by the police foundation; http://www.policefoundation.org/content/body-worn-camera

Well, that's one study and I don't know them well enough to discount them completely, though I'd prefer a more neutral source.

I don't see the original study but here it is second hand

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2908751/New-study-reveals-use-body-cameras-halves-rate-police-force-causes-complaints-against-officers-drop-90-percent.html

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/04/california-police-body-cameras-cuts-violence-complaints-rialto

It's not an either/or situation. You can implement both.

It may be a good plan in terms of more cautious and mindful policing, but what about the question of accountability - bad stuff that's actually caught on tape?

@thebest31406, I wonder what you suggest, instead.

Well, I'm not against lapel cameras but it shouldn't end with lapel cameras. The Supreme Court still give cops the authority to use deadly force "if the officer reasonably believed at that moment that he or others were in imminent danger, and it doesn’t matter whether any danger actually existed." Change that law and then we're in business

@BranKetra: Agreed. These should be mandatory to prevent police from abusing their power.

Change it to what?

No, not all of it, not even close.

It certainly wouldn't bring less accountability so I say do it.

That does seem to protect police officers and endanger the civilian population too much considering the results of its application.

The mandatory requirement of said lapel cameras might also prevent actual violent criminals from not getting seen as they are in fact rather than how speculation can support a side without evidence. They ought to help everyone.

Should I have said "members of the public" instead, because that's what I meant.

I guess change it to where danger is actually present; an actual threat rather than a mere belief of an imminent threat? Maybe change the "reasonableness" standard so that such a standard isn't reserved exclusively for the officer? Maybe?

Christ. I spelled accountability wrong and I can't even change it. How embarrassing......

Sure

/end thread

Some other considerations with regard to the cameras.

Police Body-Mounted Cameras: With Right Policies in Place, a Win For All

https://www.aclu.org/police-body-mounted-cameras-right-policies-place-win-all?redirect=technology-and-liberty/police-body-mounted-cameras-right-policies-place-win-all

Police officers are public officials, they act on behalf of the public so for them to be recorded or all their interactions with the public recorded at all times is not unreasonable.

For as many camera's that go up at intersections to catch speeders and red light runners, there can be more camera's with police. The amount that can be gained not only in recording events as they happen instead of relying on potentially false accounts, but also in recording situations that could be used as teaching tools for new officers in the academy is too good to not utilize.

Body cams (the same thing as lapel cams, they're just mounted differently) are a win for everybody involved. Not only will it back up my story if I ever need to explain my actions, but it will increase trust in law enforcement.

So long as people continue to not care that I sometimes bullshit with my fellow cops when I'm on patrol, or that I grab a Monster every once and awhile, or that I deign to not give a citation when a verbal warning would suffice, we'll be okay. But if our shifts are put under a microscope for trivial offenses (me giving a verbal warning instead of a citation is technically against department SOP) then you're going to wish the system was never put in place.

A system I'm comfortable with would be my body cam footage only being accessed if my actions were called into question. For instance, after I've had to discharge my firearm, or to look at how I dealt with someone during a stop.

I don't want to see verbal warnings go away. There are some trivial things that don't need to be enforced when you know they likely won't happen again.

I'm sure that the union that represents officers will make sure disciplinary action for not following procedures to the letter on petty things will be very loosely enforced if the body cameras become standard.

There is such a thing as having shitty supervisors.

If we're going to implement such a system, there also needs to be a system in place to protect the guys like me who do our job knowing that we have a profound responsibility to upkeep. If there's a chance that I could get a bad report and lose my job (and my pension) because of a vindictive SO, I'm out. I can make better money going full-time with my landscaping/snow removal business. Then you guys get to pay for another dude to be trained who may or may not have such a good record as me.

I'm more than willing to wear a body cam if it will put people at ease. But if my life gets made miserable in the process, why should I care? And that's the mentality of almost every cop in this country.

That's kind of the thing: Not all - or even most - incidents are captured on tape. By all means, people should continue to be vigilant with public cameras, but lapel cameras should help as well.

If implemented properly, such a system should be a help to honest officers also. I'm sure we can all acknowledge that officers get a fair amount of unsubstantiated claims leveled their way as well.

I think you're right when you say that the cop cams should be used along with smart phones to better keep an eye on things. Still, the announcement from Obama and the SC mayor for more cams were made in response to the grievances many members of the public have expressed over the deadly force used by cops. The mayor's announcement in particular was made in reaction to protests over a man being murdered by a cop - which is still up in the air as to whether or not he'll be convicted. It just seems as if we're experiencing more of the same shtick used by state officials; alleviate mass discontent by proposing a strategy that doesn't necessarily address the people's grievances.

Rather have batman protecting me but meh, this will have to do!

They more or less have to do something at this point. Less so to clean up the force (which is itself important), but more so to retain some level of confidence in the force. We're approaching a crisis of confidence in the area, and that can't be allowed to happen.

I think the call for body cams is entirely reasonable in this case, and poses the possibility of addressing both issues over time. We've certainly seen worse proposals in the past, at any rate.

Maybe, I dunno, I'd like to think so. I've little reason to believe having video of police brutality and misconduct would lead to any justice for victims, however I do think the presence of the camera does something else, and that's keep both cops and civilians in check. I've heard studies done of their use show the cops wearing them don't agitate and escalate in interactions with civilians and even civilians themselves that might agitate and escalate don't do so as well, and that this has resulted in less arrests and less complaints against police. Hey, that's a good thing. In cases where cops behave appropriately and but a narrative is out there condemning the officers actions, that officer will have a record to back up their story with. I think the use of body cameras is good for both police and civilians in the end.

Yes, and it can help build public trust by showing police officers doing their jobs correctly. There's a lot of media focusing on what they do wrong and it is building a negative perception of law enforcement. I recommend listening/reading this piece from PRI.