Why I finally feel feminism is necessary

@MBirdy88: Well said.

I lost at #4

Agreed. Of course, it's not that way now, and at this rate it's only going to get more bloated with more bullshit.

@vl4d_l3nin: # 4 was the dead giveaway.

@Barbariser: What's your point? STEM majors are where the high paying jobs are and yet women choose other majors. You can't complain about getting "paid less" than men when only a very small fraction of women choose majors that are in high demand. The women talent pool for these jobs is a lot smaller because of this. It's like comparing a large nation's World Cup team to a smaller nations and not understanding why the smaller nation can't compete. The talent pool isn't as large. If more women chose high demand majors than this effect would be diminished.

Use your brain instead of letting emotions control you.

1. Isn't about the job, it's about the person applying for it. Obama won because he was saying the right things at the right time.

2. That's just how we are as a species. Feminists need to be realistic. Different guys like different things. If you don't want to dress sexy, or in what we consider a traditionally feminine manner, deal with men/women who like you how you are. It also works both ways, since many men or treated as objects. Just be confident about yourself. Insecure women bring this on themselves. "I need to look like this...or dress like that..". No, just be you, and f*ck anybody who's against that.

3. Kinda sucks, but in some cases, most men can literally do more than most women. Very rarely is it the other way around. If the woman is more skilled/qualified, that's a different story. When I worked retail, people would usually come to me in the department I worked in, if it was just myself and my female coworker. They would wait sometimes, even when she was available and I wasn't. If I sold a TV, I would get the TV from the warehouse. If she sold a TV, I would get the TV. If a delivery needed to be made, I made the delivery. At the same time, I've worked with some strong women who don't want men to do anything for them. It's really up to the woman. Men will treat you the way you want to be treated, but you have to earn it. That last statement wasn't even directed specifically at women. Men have been dealing with men that way forever.

4. I'm not even sure what 4 means. If you live somewhere where you can be owned as "unrestricted property", GET OUT! And many men gladly pay for that treatment(being owned/dominated).

5. Works both ways...

How can feminism fix the reality of the disposable male?

And how can feminism fix women like this...

No Karen Straughan is a very warm and loving person and mother. She's also very intelligent and well informed. It's odd if she "seems like a horrible person" based on that one video. Did you watch/listen?

@truechartreuse said:

1. Hillary Clinton is probably about to change that.

4. Where can I buy a female slave?

5. Guy gets girl pregnant, guy is forced to either care for the child or pay child support if she decides to keep it.

LOL...I had a feeling.

Thank you for writing a lot of twaddle that doesn't actually counter anything that feminists say. The fact that some of the pay gap can be explained by differences in tertiary education levels doesn't actually disprove workplace sexism, because most statistics show that women earn significantly less than men even when they graduate with the same degree or work the same job. That pay gap also exists in your beloved STEM fields.

That's not even getting into the fact that the one of the reasons for the male dominance of STEM fields is the cultural tendency to segregate different degrees into "masculine" and "feminine" fields, and it just so conveniently turns out that the "masculine" jobs happen to be high-paying, prestigious and powerful positions whereas female jobs are far less lucrative and more supportive in nature.

And men have a considerably lower life expectancy than women and represent the bulk of deaths on the workplace statistics (like, a 9 out of 10 ratio).

So unless you can explain that disparity with faulty typewriters that explode on contact with male individuals or women magically surviving being crushed by falling objects in a construction or mining site, the "economical" part of your assertion assumes all job spots are equally distributed between men and women, which is a flaw brighter than a solar flare and you should feel really f*cking bad for even thinking of making a claim like that.

"the cultural tendency to segregate different degrees into "masculine" and "feminine" fields"

Cultural tendency that women themselves follow since there is NOTHING that prevents them from going against that "tendency". Way to go with another halfwit assertion...

As for statistics, links or it didn't happen

You win sir. All those points are BS, btw Hilary Clinton may win in 2016.

@Barbariser:

My entire post was essentially about the talent pool being smaller for women who ARE STEM majors. Did you even read it?

Where I went to school, the engineering program had only a couple of females in it (my buddy was an engineering major). I was in the finance program and that was also 90% male. (This school has 40,000+ students). So, if only a handful of women are in those programs, that means the talent pool of women candidates is much smaller, which ultimately results in a smaller aggregate average wage for women in these fields. I already explained this, so I'm not going to delve deeper into it. Bottom line, there's going to be much better talent within the pool of men than the pool of women due to just sheer numbers. Like I said, if more women went into high paying fields this effect would be diminished.

I wasn't aware women were forced into any majors. They're free to choose whatever they want.

Oh, and there's plenty of statistics out there that say when you adjust for certain common sense things, the pay gap is essentially non-existent.

...and people ask why the Gamespot community has a reputation for being anti-feminist.

Anti-stupid, not anti-feminist.

1. True. Maybe more women should actually try to become president

2. Bullshit. Everybody views people/the opposite sex differently. Many women only car about the physical attractiveness of men

3. Not true in the vast majority of cases, and if it is in some cases, we have laws that combat this. The reason why women overall make less than men is because they tend to take more sick/personal days than men, and often take large chucks of time off and delay their careers for child rearing.

4. Uhhh, neither are men. Unless you are talking about the middle east or something, in which case feminism here has no effect on that

5. First off, who is expecting you to have children. Second, even if it is true, grow a fucking spine and say, "no, I don't want kids"

Modern day feminism doesn't actually alleviate any of the issues facing women, it just complains about them and blames men for all their problems.

Feminism *is* necessary because there are overwhelming numbers of ignorant men and women out there who constantly reinforce the sexual inequalities in society.

Still, these particular arguments for feminism are slightly weak and that's a problem for feminism. Any weak argument for feminism simply gives the ignorant people of the world an opportunity to become more self-assured that the entire concept is completely flawed. Whereas anyone who can actually think about feminism would know that there are stronger arguments out there (whether they agree with them or not), and would simply dismiss these weaker claims.

Hm...as for #4, I suspect there are huge parts of the world where this is true. Forced marriages, forced sex within marriages, and harsh restrictions on what they are allowed to wear or do under threat of physical violence is a reality for many millions of women out in the wide world - and some of that definitely trickles through to the western world as well (although mainly behind closed doors, or in tightly knit ethnkc communities, so we don't really *see* it very much. I only know a couple of women here in Australia that are facing arranged marriages to people they've never met, but it's definitely a thing).

And the causes of those can be traced down to "male biology makes us more susceptible to cancer & heart disease", "males engage in riskier behaviour", and "males are more likely to work in dangerous environments in addition to engaging in riskier behavior". I'm all for men making choosing to reduce our reckless behaviour as well as getting more women into the army, construction, .etc.

My claim of economic disadvantage implies no such condition, you're just making shit up. The distribution of jobs between blacks and whites in the 1970s was not equal either, but you'd have to be a fucking idiot or incredibly delirious to think that that disproved the existence of racial discrimination in the economy back then, or even now. And the disadvantages faced by racial minorities in the workplace are basically identical in nature, though not degree, to those faced by women.

Yes there is. It's entirely possible for a group of people to behave in a way that doesn't seem to benefit itself, because real humans operate under the influence of things like "emotions" and "peer pressure". Even if you turned women into rationalistic robots immune to societal influences, women are rewarded less than men with the exact same competence level (in STEM), even before you get into the workplace. In the workplace, women are less likely to be hired, are paid less, and have a harder time promoting due to the fact that they are allocated fewer resources for career advancement. You'd have to be fucking delusional to ignore the barriers that make STEM fields significantly harder and less beneficial for women to pursue.

Yes, you keep babbling without understanding the spoint: everything you've said is technically true, only it doesn't actually disprove the wage gap (decent links on those "adjustments" are incoming, I hope?), or the disadvantages women face in the learning hiring & promotion process, and it doesn't address the glaring issue of why women are under-represented in these areas in the first place.

Your (and N30's) lack of understanding is pretty obvious in that you think a lack of legal barriers = perfect freedom and equality. The fact that a society can decide to formally end legal discrimination does not suddenly mean that the underlying factors that created those laws suddenly disappear and turn that place into some kind of hippy egalitarian paradise devoid of its darker cultural memory and inertia.

I'll tell you what, the day I fully support feminism is when:

1. They start making women sign up for the draft

2. Women start lobbying for the most dangerous jobs that are dominated by men, like: deep-sea fishing, truck-driving, mining, line repairing/installing, construction working, roofing, logging, etc.

3. Women start getting the same amount of jail time for the same crimes done by a male.

When those things happen, I'll be behind feminism 100%.

And that's the problem now isn't it, and that's what bothers me aswell. Now you can say that there should be better written characters for women in games, that i am fine with. But then start bitching that you HAVE to put in female characters as the main protagonist is just fucking stupid. There are places where women are treated like objects, maybe do something for them before you bitch about something as silly as this

1. Inequality of outcome doesn't automatically equate to discrimination

2. Elaborate

3. You're boldly ignorant if you think the wage gap still exists

4. What?

5. Double what? Roe v Wade didn't happen?

Of course real men support feminism. Are women so scary that we need to opress them?

If you are interested in equality then the very last thing you would want to describe yourself as is a feminist. Feminism is a sexist ideology promoting female supremacy over males. Lay people who do not read feminist literature do not realize what they are supporting, they think it is just a movement promoting equality but actually it is the opposite. It is sexist, irrational, deceitful war mongering on men so why would anyone want to be associated with that?

Simple question when have you ever heard a feminist list all the privileges women are provided by our society and list all the disadvantages of males. Answer: you never have because to do so would undermine the entire mythology of oppression. Truth is men and women are different, they have differing ways of thinking and behaving and make different life style choices. If people are free to choose their life path then automatically you will see different distribution of the genders.

Ignorance supports sexism. Feminists support sexism against men. Feminists are sexist. Feminists are ignorant.

If you goal is equality and freedom of choice then you are a humanist and humanists cannot support feminism since it deliberately lies and deceives to promote a gender divide..

@Barbariser: http://www.the-spearhead.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Gender-Wage-Gap-Final-Report.pdf

Here's one that was contracted by the DOL.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303532704579483752909957472

Just a short WSJ article that uses data from the BLS.