Saudis arrest 41 for "plotting to celebrate Christmas"

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whipassmt

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#1 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

From Speronews:

"Saudi religious police stormed a house in the Saudi Arabian province ofal-Jouf, detaining more than 41 guests for plotting to celebrate Christmas, a statement from the police branch released Wednesday night said.

The raid is the latest in a string of religious crackdowns against residents perceived to threaten the countrys strict religious code.Only in Saudi Arabia could the phrase plotting to celebrate Christmas appear in official statement. Religious freedom does not exist in the kingdom. There are literally millions of Christians living there, and according to the government they are permitted to practice their religion in private though not one single church is permitted. But as this news story shows, in fact the religious police do not permit such dangerous practices as a Christmas party."Nice guys those Saudis are, hopefully those guests were only detained temporarily. Hopefully they release those guys soon.
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ghoklebutter

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#2 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts

LOL I just love that title.

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wis3boi

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#3 wis3boi
Member since 2005 • 32507 Posts

"plotting" :lol:

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LJS9502_basic

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#4 LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 178844 Posts
Sad that people act as such.....
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THE_DRUGGIE

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#5 THE_DRUGGIE
Member since 2006 • 25107 Posts

It's pretty hot over there and the Christmas trees might have caught on fire.

Good job on fire prevention from the Saudi police.

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PernicioEnigma

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#6 PernicioEnigma
Member since 2010 • 6662 Posts
This could be a Monty Python skit. Too bad it's real life...
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Shottayouth13-

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#7 Shottayouth13-
Member since 2009 • 7018 Posts
At least they're still alive.Progress.
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Laihendi

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#8 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts
This is what happens when a government exists to control people rather than protect their rights.
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Capitan_Kid

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#9 Capitan_Kid
Member since 2009 • 6700 Posts
SA has a Scrooge Patrol. That's saddening. Also why're they celebrating Christmas two weeks late?
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rilpas

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#10 rilpas
Member since 2012 • 8161 Posts
SA has a Scrooge Patrol. That's saddening. Also why're they celebrating Christmas two weeks late?Capitan_Kid
likely they celebrate christmas on the three kings' day, which personally, I always thought it made more sense
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jim_shorts

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#11 jim_shorts
Member since 2006 • 7320 Posts

It would be so awful if they were caught celebrating someone who was actually mentioned in the Quran.

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Pirate700

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#12 Pirate700
Member since 2008 • 46465 Posts

"Plotting to celebrate Christmas"... :lol:

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gamerguru100

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#13 gamerguru100
Member since 2009 • 12718 Posts
At least they're still alive.Progress. Shottayouth13-
lol
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MrPraline

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#14 MrPraline
Member since 2008 • 21351 Posts
HAHAHAHA That's what you get when you live in a year that consists of 3 digits. What a f*cking joke smfh.
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whipassmt

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#15 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

According to a study by OpenDoors, Saudi Arabia is one of the three "toughest countries to be a Christian" (Afghanistan and North Korea are the other two) which I guess means that Saudi Arabia is one of the top three countries were Christians are persecuted.

Edit: North Korea is in first place as regards persecution of Christians (in North Korea it is illegal to be a Christian and some 70,000 people are estimated to have been sent to labor camps for their faith) while Saudi Arabia is in second place (Saudi Arabia bans public practice of any faith other than Islam). So if my reading of the article linked to above in this post is correct, in North Korea it is illegal to be Christian, in Saudi Arabia it is legally okay to be a Christian in your own home but if you practice your faith in public that is illegal.

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DataUsageLimit

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#16 DataUsageLimit
Member since 2013 • 114 Posts
HOW DARE we Saudi Muslims allow 41 people to celebrate our other prophets holiday! ARREST THEM! Wait.... What? How does that make sense.....
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TheFallenDemon

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#17 TheFallenDemon
Member since 2010 • 13933 Posts

This could be a Monty Python skit. Too bad it's real life...PernicioEnigma

No one expects the Saudi inquisition.

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MrPraline

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#18 MrPraline
Member since 2008 • 21351 Posts

[QUOTE="PernicioEnigma"]This could be a Monty Python skit. Too bad it's real life...TheFallenDemon


No one expects the Saudi inquisition.

lol
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Fightingfan

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#19 Fightingfan
Member since 2010 • 38011 Posts

It's pretty hot over there and the Christmas trees might have caught on fire.

Good job on fire prevention from the Saudi police.

THE_DRUGGIE
As well as being ecofriendly; Saudi Arabia did the right thing.
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DataUsageLimit

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#20 DataUsageLimit
Member since 2013 • 114 Posts
[QUOTE="Capitan_Kid"]SA has a Scrooge Patrol. That's saddening. Also why're they celebrating Christmas two weeks late?rilpas
likely they celebrate christmas on the three kings' day, which personally, I always thought it made more sense

Explain.
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DataUsageLimit

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#21 DataUsageLimit
Member since 2013 • 114 Posts

According to a study by OpenDoors, Saudi Arabia is one of the three "toughest countries to be a Christian" (Afghanistan and North Korea are the other two) which I guess means that Saudi Arabia is one of the top three countries were Christians are persecuted.

Edit: North Korea is in first place as regards persecution of Christians (in North Korea it is illegal to be a Christian and some 70,000 people are estimated to have been sent to labor camps for their faith) while Saudi Arabia is in second place (Saudi Arabia bans public practice of any faith other than Islam). So if my reading of the article linked to above in this post is correct, in North Korea it is illegal to be Christian, in Saudi Arabia it is legally okay to be a Christian in your own home but if you practice your faith in public that is illegal.

whipassmt
Wait, so what are north koreans then?
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whipassmt

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#22 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

[QUOTE="whipassmt"]

According to a study by OpenDoors, Saudi Arabia is one of the three "toughest countries to be a Christian" (Afghanistan and North Korea are the other two) which I guess means that Saudi Arabia is one of the top three countries were Christians are persecuted.

Edit: North Korea is in first place as regards persecution of Christians (in North Korea it is illegal to be a Christian and some 70,000 people are estimated to have been sent to labor camps for their faith) while Saudi Arabia is in second place (Saudi Arabia bans public practice of any faith other than Islam). So if my reading of the article linked to above in this post is correct, in North Korea it is illegal to be Christian, in Saudi Arabia it is legally okay to be a Christian in your own home but if you practice your faith in public that is illegal.

DataUsageLimit

Wait, so what are north koreans then?

I'm not sure what you mean.

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rilpas

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#23 rilpas
Member since 2012 • 8161 Posts

[QUOTE="rilpas"][QUOTE="Capitan_Kid"]SA has a Scrooge Patrol. That's saddening. Also why're they celebrating Christmas two weeks late?DataUsageLimit
likely they celebrate christmas on the three kings' day, which personally, I always thought it made more sense

Explain.

from what I understand three king's day is the day when the Magi finally reached Jesus (yeah, they weren't there on the 25th) and that's when they finally gave him their offerings.

In spain for example, they don't trade gifts until the King's day and personally, if you're going to trade gifts, I think it makes more sense to do it on the day of the Magi

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nocoolnamejim

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#24 nocoolnamejim
Member since 2003 • 15136 Posts
God damned Saudi Grinches! Saudi Fury, if you don't mind...
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whipassmt

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#25 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

[QUOTE="DataUsageLimit"][QUOTE="rilpas"] likely they celebrate christmas on the three kings' day, which personally, I always thought it made more senserilpas

Explain.

from what I understand three king's day is the day when the Magi finally reached Jesus (yeah, they weren't there on the 25th) and that's when they finally gave him their offerings.

In spain for example, they don't trade gifts until the King's day and personally, if you're going to trade gifts, I think it makes more sense to do it on the day of the Magi

Actually I think a lot of European countries don't exchange gifts on Christmas, they do so on the Feast of the Epiphany (January 6) which I think celebrates the arrival of the Magi (I'm not sure if Three King's Day and the Solemnity of the Epiphany are on the same day or not). English people and therefore Americans exchange gifts on Christmas Day (more formally known as the Solemnity of the Nativity of Our Lord) however the English Royal family exchanges gifts on the Solemnity of the Epiphany because they are of German descent.

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rilpas

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#26 rilpas
Member since 2012 • 8161 Posts

[QUOTE="rilpas"]

[QUOTE="DataUsageLimit"] Explain.whipassmt

from what I understand three king's day is the day when the Magi finally reached Jesus (yeah, they weren't there on the 25th) and that's when they finally gave him their offerings.

In spain for example, they don't trade gifts until the King's day and personally, if you're going to trade gifts, I think it makes more sense to do it on the day of the Magi

Actually I think a lot of European countries don't exchange gifts on Christmas, they do so on the Feast of the Epiphany (January 6) which I think celebrates the arrival of the Magi (I'm not sure if Three King's Day and the Solemnity of the Epiphany are on the same day or not). English people and therefore Americans exchange gifts on Christmas Day (more formally known as the Solemnity of the Nativity of Our Lord) however the English Royal family exchanges gifts on the Solemnity of the Epiphany because they are of German descent.

Ah so you call it a different name, yeah we call it the Three Kings' day here.

As for what countries exhange gifts on what date is a bit of a toss up, in my country (Portugal) we exchange them on the 25th.

But like a I said, in Spain they do it on the 6th

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jeremiah06

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#27 jeremiah06
Member since 2004 • 7217 Posts

"plotting" :lol:

wis3boi

LOL I just love that title.

ghoklebutter
I know right!
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whipassmt

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#28 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

[QUOTE="whipassmt"]

[QUOTE="rilpas"]

from what I understand three king's day is the day when the Magi finally reached Jesus (yeah, they weren't there on the 25th) and that's when they finally gave him their offerings.

In spain for example, they don't trade gifts until the King's day and personally, if you're going to trade gifts, I think it makes more sense to do it on the day of the Magi

rilpas

Actually I think a lot of European countries don't exchange gifts on Christmas, they do so on the Feast of the Epiphany (January 6) which I think celebrates the arrival of the Magi (I'm not sure if Three King's Day and the Solemnity of the Epiphany are on the same day or not). English people and therefore Americans exchange gifts on Christmas Day (more formally known as the Solemnity of the Nativity of Our Lord) however the English Royal family exchanges gifts on the Solemnity of the Epiphany because they are of German descent.

Ah so you call it a different name, yeah we call it the Three Kings' day here.

As for what countries exhange gifts on what date is a bit of a toss up, in my country (Portugal) we exchange them on the 25th.

But like a I said, in Spain they do it on the 6th

Ah, I see.

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deactivated-61cc564148ef4

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#29 deactivated-61cc564148ef4
Member since 2007 • 10909 Posts

Those monsters.

Trying to spread joy in Saudi Arabia.

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worlock77

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#30 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts
Rules are rules. Those Christians should move if they don't like it, or something.
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nocoolnamejim

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#31 nocoolnamejim
Member since 2003 • 15136 Posts
Rules are rules. Those Christians should move if they don't like it, or something.worlock77
I see what you did there...
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DataUsageLimit

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#32 DataUsageLimit
Member since 2013 • 114 Posts

[QUOTE="DataUsageLimit"][QUOTE="whipassmt"]

According to a study by OpenDoors, Saudi Arabia is one of the three "toughest countries to be a Christian" (Afghanistan and North Korea are the other two) which I guess means that Saudi Arabia is one of the top three countries were Christians are persecuted.

Edit: North Korea is in first place as regards persecution of Christians (in North Korea it is illegal to be a Christian and some 70,000 people are estimated to have been sent to labor camps for their faith) while Saudi Arabia is in second place (Saudi Arabia bans public practice of any faith other than Islam). So if my reading of the article linked to above in this post is correct, in North Korea it is illegal to be Christian, in Saudi Arabia it is legally okay to be a Christian in your own home but if you practice your faith in public that is illegal.

whipassmt

Wait, so what are north koreans then?

I'm not sure what you mean.

In religious terms.
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deactivated-59d151f079814

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#33 deactivated-59d151f079814
Member since 2003 • 47239 Posts

... My god can the US government stop supporting these dbags?

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worlock77

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#34 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

... My god can the US government stop supporting these dbags?

sSubZerOo
When we cease our dependancy on oil or they run out of it, whichever comes first.
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WSGRandomPerson

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#35 WSGRandomPerson
Member since 2007 • 13697 Posts
Lmao.
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SergeantGuy

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#36 SergeantGuy
Member since 2013 • 54 Posts
This could be a Monty Python skit. Too bad it's real life...PernicioEnigma
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one_plum

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#37 one_plum
Member since 2009 • 6822 Posts

In other news Saudi Arabia became the world's largest producer of coal.

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leviathan91

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#38 leviathan91
Member since 2007 • 7763 Posts

Now you see Bill O'Rielly, that's a War on Christmas.

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wis3boi

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#39 wis3boi
Member since 2005 • 32507 Posts

Now you see Bill O'Rielly, that's a War on Christmas.

leviathan91

:lol:

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EatShanna

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#40 EatShanna
Member since 2008 • 875 Posts
Religion of Grinch.
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Aero5555

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#41 Aero5555
Member since 2006 • 1333 Posts

This is strange. Wish I could get more details on this. As long as they were celebrating in their own private household then they had no right to arrest them.

Though I know that if the household has Muslims living in it along with those of other faiths, the Muslims tend to prefer not to celebrate so the rest of the group go to a diplomatic quarter or residence entirely occupied by non-Muslims. Same goes for any Asian expats working in the labor sector (Filipino, Indian... etc.). Maybe a Muslim reported the celebration and made it look as if they're celebrating in public. Them religious police are very hot-headed with these things and act without confirming. a simple rumor jumps them into action. Then they get public outlash within the country once, and if, the news that they wrongly acted is true. Incidents like these get alot of ridicule from the social media within the country. Trust me. the religious police's reputation got so bad last year that they sacked the chief and brought in a new one. It's just one of those things. I know alot of expats who celebrated Christmas last month here and were fine.

And given how it happened in Jouf, a rural area, just shows how it's more about the culture and norms of said area. Just like the 90-year-old marriage story.

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deactivated-6127ced9bcba0

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#42 deactivated-6127ced9bcba0
Member since 2006 • 31700 Posts

When we cease our dependancy on oil or they run out of it, whichever comes first.worlock77

We get most of our oil from Canada, actually.

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FMAB_GTO

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#43 FMAB_GTO
Member since 2010 • 14385 Posts
Stupid so stupid >_
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SaudiFury

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#44 SaudiFury
Member since 2007 • 8709 Posts

God damned Saudi Grinches! Saudi Fury, if you don't mind...  nocoolnamejim

From what i understand, non-Muslims are allowed to pray within their homes (this is not always respected as is this case right now), but not allowed for public displays. this prohibition is extended to also other Muslims, Shia, Sufi, or other.

and this job seems like something the religious polices is responsible for. and this has happened before, this is not a new case. happened a lot after the Gulf War years when we had lots of American and British expatriates living there, even in the American compounds (which i don't know when the rule was changed are now completely hands off from the religious police).

One thing that's definently not on the menu is prosletyzing to Muslims to change religions. that will not go over well. at. all. especially with the religious authority in charge.

----------------------------------------

I know Fize doesn't like me blaming the religion, or hating on the PVPV (the religious police, also called the haya for short). I don't like this institution at all. The same nonesense occurs in places like Malaysia where 65% of the population is Muslim the rest is everyone else (Christian, Buddhist, nons, etc).

-----------------------------------------

I would also like to add a tangent, I didn't fully read the article, but assuming that these are Saudi - Arab's born and raised that are now Christian, it's almost a stereotype as to why they are that. Most of them will be young women, some guys. and it seems mostly routed in a need for a more lax religion. Putting aside all the negatives you can poke at Christianity, and then the Islamic based criticisms like shirk (placing something or someone alongside the same status of God). Christianity can be often seen as very simple to accept, that being the famous line "accept Jesus as your lord and savior and your sins will be forgiven and you may enter heaven" as well as a strong emphasis on forgivness and peace.

Now growing up there, i'm often told by my parents and extended family that Islam is a very easy religion to follow, but then you got very conservative religious authorities who basically bully you, simple things like Valentines Day heart, owning a cat, or playing pokemon card games are either outright banned or made more difficult to obtain (with the threat of legal reprecussions), top it off with living in an aboslute monarchy environment, plus all the strong tribal and traditioanl customs (which are NOT big on individualism), the religion ends up becoming like a prison for some people, it becomes the thing that is used to stop you from enjoying some pretty simple things in life. or i should add, enjoy simple things without having to feel like you should feel guilty.

Plus there isn't a REAL sense of like ' do this simple thing and all is forgiven' you are to be held to account on judgment day before God in Islam. only He may forgive of your sins. there is no easy get-out-of-jail card except for martyrdom (which helps explain it's appeal), but i've always distinguashed martyrs as something where they have to react, not provoke, and not over something like "omfg you draw a rude picture of mohammed!' or "your country killed a bunch of our people with a drone, now lemme bomb your school bus!". There is, a simple easy one with Christianity - at least the one that gets talked about a lot in the Western world.

In Saudi, Islam isn't simply reading, memorizing ,and understanding the Quran, and following the 5 pillars, it's also having to ascribe to ancient hadiths, and the laws that have to be formulated from ancient scripture to deal with modern things (like cell phone pictures - cells capable of taking pics were temporarily banned in Saudi, the internet, etc.). and Saudi is oft mocked even by it's closest neighbors (in the Gulf) for just how conservative they are and get.

Then there is also the aspect i've seen where Saudi's will go from Islam, to Christianity (for the same reasons i just mentioned above) to straight out Atheism, like sliding out of having to do anything with regards to religion, not so much a sincere belief change.

other then all that.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRawE3OOUrCuZbn_ThakEK

just you would be surprised the sorts of parties that i've been to (no orgies - don't get the dirty ideas), parties where all the guys and girls were doing a theme. Where going to a private water park Sunset Beach and you see Saudi girls in bakini's (and if you even LOOK religious they won't let you in, they wont take your money they don't want the trouble). People have places (more and more i'd say in the last 6 years and that's a good thing) where they can just let out some steam from all the conservative cultural, religions, police-state BS that goes on in the public sphere.

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th3warr1or

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#45 th3warr1or
Member since 2007 • 20637 Posts
Don't Muslims like Jesus? I'm confused. I thought he's a prophet in Islam.
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#46 Aero5555
Member since 2006 • 1333 Posts

I know Fize doesn't like me blaming the religion, or hating on the PVPV (the religious police, also called the haya for short). I don't like this institution at all. The same nonesense occurs in places like Malaysia where 65% of the population is Muslim the rest is everyone else (Christian, Buddhist, nons, etc).

SaudiFury

I also know your views on them as well (I've lurked long enough to know). And yeah, I'm not a big fan of the PVPV, they've done some stupid idiotic stuff, but I don't condemn them either. They've done alot of good in the country, especially with busting drug trafficking.

I'm similar to Fize, I don't like to blame everything on the conservativeness or the PVPV. Those who go through rejection and end up hating the country because of it I feel sorry for. But at the same time some were raised too liberal in a country that just doesn't fit them. Especially if the kid's a halfie (Saudi with a non-Saudi mother).

(The following paragraphs are related to Saudis. They don't represent My view or judgement of Westerners and other nationalities)

All Saudis, liberal or conservative, describe themselves as Muslims. They grew up in a conservative society. My generation were taught not to drink/date/and all that. So if I see a Saudi drink or do whatever they were taught by their religion not to do, I find it shameful and outright abnormal.

I'm not surprised you outright despise the PVPV. You date and all that, which is something I don't do, and loath getting lumped into or being labeled as someone who's close with those like-minded Saudis. I don't despise you guys. I respect you. But please don't ever drink or date infront of me. I will outright leave the premise and maybe even give you a telling. That Sunset Beach party you mentioned, for example. You will never see me in those kinda events.

On a side note, Saudis who hate on Islam are even worse than non-Saudi athiests. They piss all over your morals and have disgusting prejudices on their fellow conservative countrymen. I can't stand them.

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GrayF0X786

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#47 GrayF0X786
Member since 2012 • 4185 Posts

Don't Muslims like Jesus? I'm confused. I thought he's a prophet in Islam. th3warr1or
anyone who has more then half a brain knows that christmas is a pagan belief, and has nothing to do with christianity in the first place.

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SaudiFury

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#48 SaudiFury
Member since 2007 • 8709 Posts

Aero5555
well if you say you know my views then i'll avoid having to repeat my arguement against the PVPV existence as a legal authority enforcing institution. I do think that the job of stopping drug trafficking, sex trafficking, slave trafficking (all of these things do happen to some degree - especially in the third world) could be tasks done by other authorities.

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but anyways. yeah i do date, if and when the right girl comes along, but i don't drink, do drugs (worst i've done was tried MJ in college and it's not nearly as bad or addicting or mind altering as people make it out to be, and cigar/cigarillo's). Never been the guy who does night clubs. The worst - in terms of public affairs - is just wanting to simply be out with my date. Now in America, it's pretty easy can go just about everywhere. In Saudi i've never dared, i've always gone to Bahrain (thank you God for Bahrain for being only a 20 minute drive - on a good day) and go to the mall there to meet up and have a good day together. I'm not ignorant of the sensitivities people have, and i don't do obscene things in public either, just simply being to around the girl.

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but that's just me. I don't hate Saudi, frick-sake i chose it as my screenname years ago and still happily use it. I do tend to find myself defending it or clarifying a situation when issues come up where it's easy to do the generalized "lol saudi' joking. At the same time though i do find myself butting heads with Saudi's as well sometimes, like i have in the past with Fize. and i don't hate him, worst i could say about him is he seems a little schitzo in that regard, in one defense he will love me, and then in another seem to feel as though i've betrayed the country. But i do get where Fize is coming from, because i've met people who think like him too. But i do very much respect his opinion, even if we might disagree harshly.

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whenever i'm in Saudi i tend to make the best friends with the liberals, those where i share a common interest in (regardless of social/politics), halfies (the only group i think i could marry and be happy with - because they seem to really 'get' me as i am myself also a halfy), the foreigners (whether American/Brit or Filipino, Indian, Indonesian), or the closeted outsiders (secret gay christian, atheist mostly). I've already had one cousin come out to me being gay and that was in secret, and the only reason he did so was because he knew of my mother, my upbringing, and my social mores. and it was incredibly important for him, because my family is pretty much anti-gay across the board and would never accept it.

but that's kinda the circles i run in Saudi.

but yeah that's all..

i'm suddenly thinking of myself like Ezio Auditore in Assassin's Creed 2 :P.... making friends with all the 'low' people in the society.

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Aero5555

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#49 Aero5555
Member since 2006 • 1333 Posts

SaudiFury

FYI, alot of Saudis just like you are good friends of mine. Halfies who the worst they've done is butt-heads with other very conservative countrymen, date, and diss the PVPV any chance they get. But what they do realize is that, whenever they meet up with me, those characteristics get locked up and don't come out til after we say our farewells and call it a day. The worst kind, and the ones I generally avoid, are those who boast about it like ignorant people, piss on their own country, and proud themselves on it publically. Those Saudis I consider helpless and I don't want anything to do with them. From what I've read, you sound like the former. Which isn't a good thing overall, but atleast you come off as moral and decent. You date and stuff but you don't identify yourself by it and just keep it to yourself. I also take into account that you're a halfie.

And about Fize being schitzo, or your belief that he is. I dunno exactly what topics you disagreed on. But maybe he comes off like he's your best friend a second and an enemy the next because, like me, he loves you as a brother in Islam and wishes you the best. Yet he despises your loath of the PVPV, your insistence on dating, but at the same time prays to Allah that he will guide you to the straight path some day. I also wish you the same. Allah yehdeek ya rab.

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pie-junior

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#50 pie-junior
Member since 2007 • 2866 Posts

Aero5555

Saudi,

how do manage to stay calm and friendly in the face of this constant, moral superiority infused, judgment aimed at you