What are your views on protectionism?
pro·tec·tion·ism
n.The advocacy, system, or theory of protecting domestic producers by impeding or limiting, as by tariffs or quotas, the importation of foreign goods and services.This topic is locked from further discussion.
Some protectionist practices are good.What are your views on protectionism?
pro·tec·tion·ism
n.The advocacy, system, or theory of protecting domestic producers by impeding or limiting, as by tariffs or quotas, the importation of foreign goods and services. nomsayin
[QUOTE="dave123321"]How can it ever hurtnomsayinConsumers get inferior products. Can't they just demand better
[QUOTE="nomsayin"][QUOTE="dave123321"]How can it ever hurtdave123321Consumers get inferior products. Can't they just demand better Only at the expense of reducing the quality/quantity of another good.
Not a fan of America's current state of simply being a consumer nation. FightingfanWe're not simply a consumer nation. Other countries invest in the US to produce their goods. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_received_FDI
[QUOTE="GazaAli"]You need a good balance of justified and beneficial protectionism and globalization to have a healthy, competitive, vibrant and open market.deelimanWhen is protectionism justified? You're just giving your own industries an unfair edge. It can be beneficial to your own economy, market or labour force for that matter. You have to look out for your own people sometimes there is nothing wrong with that. But it certainly need to be controlled and have safeguards to keep it in check.
We're not simply a consumer nation. Other countries invest in the US to produce their goods. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_received_FDI That doesn't say much other than that the NYSE being large.[QUOTE="Fightingfan"]Not a fan of America's current state of simply being a consumer nation. EagleEyedOne
[QUOTE="EagleEyedOne"]We're not simply a consumer nation. Other countries invest in the US to produce their goods. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_received_FDI That doesn't say much other than that the NYSE being large. Stocks and bonds are in a different account called portfolio investment. FDI is the actual building of factories or businesses in another country.[QUOTE="Fightingfan"]Not a fan of America's current state of simply being a consumer nation. Fightingfan
[QUOTE="deeliman"][QUOTE="GazaAli"]You need a good balance of justified and beneficial protectionism and globalization to have a healthy, competitive, vibrant and open market.GazaAliWhen is protectionism justified? You're just giving your own industries an unfair edge. It can be beneficial to your own economy, market or labour force for that matter. You have to look out for your own people sometimes there is nothing wrong with that. But it certainly need to be controlled and have safeguards to keep it in check. And then nations you're trading with will also protect their industries, hurting your economy. And if the major economies of the world (EU,US,China) do that than 3th world nations will get even poorer than they already are, as they cannot compete (this is already happening in the agricultural industry).
[QUOTE="deeliman"][QUOTE="GazaAli"]You need a good balance of justified and beneficial protectionism and globalization to have a healthy, competitive, vibrant and open market.GazaAliWhen is protectionism justified? You're just giving your own industries an unfair edge. It can be beneficial to your own economy, market or labour force for that matter. You have to look out for your own people sometimes there is nothing wrong with that. But it certainly need to be controlled and have safeguards to keep it in check. It is not good for your own economy. It's bad for the market because there are less options to choose from and bad for the labor force because laborers are forced to work in industries in which they are less productive. It discourages competition and ultimately wages are less than they would be if there were more businesses competing for those workers.
It also depreciates your currency since no other countries are able to use it productively. All other goods in the world become more expensive.
It's completely economically unjustifiable and will usually result in inferior living standards over the long term for most of the population.
Someone explain the broken window fallacy for me. In Texas termsdave123321Someone slashed your Chevy Silverado tires? Great! Now you can spend money to repair them instead of using that money to invest in the stock market or building something new!
Someone explain the broken window fallacy for me. In Texas termsdave123321Imagine that you are a gunshop owner (Texas terms :P), and you have kid. Your kid takes one of your guns and shoots at a window in your store, breaking it in the process. One of the bystanders offers to pay you for that broken window, because he felt bad for you. So you pay someone to fix your windows, and all is well. Now, if you try to argue from here on that breaking windows is a good thing, because it brings money in circulation ( the money you got that you payed someone with to repair your windows), that is a fallacy, because that money might have otherwise be used by that bystander to buy new shoes, or whatever. I don't really see what this has to do with protectionism though.
[QUOTE="dave123321"]Someone explain the broken window fallacy for me. In Texas termsdeelimanImagine that you are a gunshop owner (Texas terms :P), and you have kid. Your kid takes one of your guns and shoots at a window in your store, breaking it in the process. One of the bystanders offers to pay you for that broken window, because he felt bad for you. So you pay someone to fix your windows, and all is well. Now, if you try to argue from here on that breaking windows is a good thing, because it brings money in circulation ( the money you got that you payed someone with to repair your windows), that is a fallacy, because that money might have otherwise be used by that bystander to buy new shoes, or whatever. I don't really see what this has to do with protectionism though. It has absolutely nothing to do with protectionism.
[QUOTE="EagleEyedOne"][QUOTE="famicommander"]Anyone who advocates protectionism doesn't understand the broken window fallacy. Read "Economics in One Lesson" by Henry Hazlitt.famicommanderThe broken window fallacy has nothing to do with protectionist policy. It has everything to do with it. It has to do with what is seen and what is unseen. With protectionist policy people see that it stimulates domestic industry, as the broken window stimulates the window salesman. What is unseen is the damage done to the person whose window was broken, as he now must spend money that would otherwise be directed at some other productive use on the window. In the same way, people who are forced to pay higher prices for domestic products instead of cheaper foreign ones are harmed. The money they would have spent on some other productive use is redirected by protectionism to its less urgent use. Protectionism is one of the most simple and clear cut examples of the broken window fallacy. Except nothing is being destroyed. Resources are being redirected as a result of policies forcing consumers to spend on the same produced in their own country as opposed to cheaper goods produced in another country. There is no destruction only a re-allocation of money.
[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="EagleEyedOne"] The only way you would be able to import cheap goods is if your currency is worth more than the country in question. That would imply your economy is strong enough to support high interest rates. This is never the case with closed economies.EagleEyedOneNot entirely. Labor is a big cost of production and a country that doesn't pay much for labor will be able to under cut domestic production. It still depends on how cheap your currency is.
You're identifying a result, LJ is identifying a cause. It's not at its root about money, since if countries were otherwise identical then purchasing power parity would indeed hold.
It still depends on how cheap your currency is.[QUOTE="EagleEyedOne"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] Not entirely. Labor is a big cost of production and a country that doesn't pay much for labor will be able to under cut domestic production.chessmaster1989
You're identifying a result, LJ is identifying a cause. It's not at its root about money, since if countries were otherwise identical then purchasing power parity would indeed hold.
The market is not strong efficient.[QUOTE="chessmaster1989"][QUOTE="EagleEyedOne"] It still depends on how cheap your currency is.EagleEyedOne
You're identifying a result, LJ is identifying a cause. It's not at its root about money, since if countries were otherwise identical then purchasing power parity would indeed hold.
The market is not strong efficient. You're right it isn't, although there are many human causes of that. Nonetheless LJ is somewhat more correct on this than you are.[QUOTE="EagleEyedOne"][QUOTE="chessmaster1989"]The market is not strong efficient. You're right it isn't, although there are many human causes of that. Nonetheless LJ is somewhat more correct on this than you are. Perhaps. I need his responses to be clarified further as I am a bit inebriated.You're identifying a result, LJ is identifying a cause. It's not at its root about money, since if countries were otherwise identical then purchasing power parity would indeed hold.
chessmaster1989
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