One of Shadow of Mordor's most ambitious features scaled back for Xbox 360/PS3

Nemesis system won't have the same level of depth and variety if you're playing on older machines.

One of the most ambitious features in Monolith's upcoming Lord of the Rings prequel Middle-earth: Shadow of Mordor--the Nemesis system--will be scaled back for the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 versions of the game.

Design director Michael de Plater said Monolith went to great lengths to make it so the Xbox 360 and PS3 versions of Shadow of Mordor are on the same level as the Xbox One and PlayStation 4 iterations, but in some ways, this was just not possible.

"We're very focused on the PS4 and Xbox One," he told IGN. "We're focusing on the next-gen platforms, and then going to do whatever we can to get as much as possible on current-gen."

"To break it down, some of the stuff we're pretty confident will still be very similar on current gen: the core mechanics, like combat, stealth, ranged and movements; the basic control and gameplay, that should all be really solid," he added. "What it won't have is the same level of depth and variety and simulation within the 'Nemesis system'."

This is because the Nemesis system is "just so huge" in terms of content, calculations, and artificial intelligence, de Plater said. He said Monolith will try its best to get "as much of it in as we can," but it won't be the full vision for the Nemesis system.

The Nemesis system for Shadow of Mordor allows every enemy that players face to be a unique individual with their own personality, as well as strengths and weaknesses. These enemies will continue to do their tasks when off-screen and can even grow in rank and esteem when players meet them again. If a player chooses not to kill an enemy, the enemy will learn from the experience and grow stronger.

de Plater assured fans, however, that the Shadow of Mordor story and core gameplay will be "the same" across console generations.

According to The Witcher studio CD Projekt Red CEO Marcin Iwinski, cross-generation development will always mean that developers must compromise in one way or another. That's why CD Projekt Red is making The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt exclusive to Xbox One, PS4, and PC.

Shadow of Mordor--which is most definitely not a movie game--is coming to Xbox 360, Xbox One, PlayStation 3, PlayStation 4, and PC, but not Wii U. No release date has been announced.

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Eddie Makuch

Eddie Makuch is a news editor at GameSpot, and would like to see the Whalers return to Hartford.
Middle-earth: Shadow of Mordor

Middle-earth: Shadow of Mordor

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165 comments
BigFeef
BigFeef

If my gaming budget wasn't already strained with the upcoming October and November releases; I'd have snap this game up in a heartbeat at release. Rented it for a week on the PS4 and I had tons of fun with it. The Nemesis System was pretty cool and made the game so much better; building upon an already good story and great gameplay. I'd recommend this game to anyone and plan to pick it up myself as soon as my budget allows.

Vodoo
Vodoo

The entire game IS the Nemesis System. If you don't have that, you don't have Shadows of Mordor. Thankfully I have both the XB1 & PS4

;-)

spongeboy1985
spongeboy1985

@Vodoo The game is about killing orcs and such. I imagine that there will still be some aspects of the nemesis in that version I imagine though the game wont keep track as  much you probably can still manipulate the ranks but not the degree of the Pc Xb1 Ps4 version. Im gonna guessthe last gen version wont track branded orcs so you may be able to only temporarily brand non captain orcs and as soon as you leave the area they reset. If anything the game may only track captains which is Nemesis at its core. 

Vo1taire
Vo1taire

So Assassin's Creed Middle Earth basically...

hanlon23
hanlon23

Nope you should watch a game play there is so much more depth to It than Assassins Creed. For example is you can take over an enemy send him back and he can climb the ranks all along he is on your side because you took over his mind. Also the nemesis program if you fight a boss and lose he will remember you when you run into him again , he remembers how you fought and fighting tactics you used on him to his advantage as this is just a little example their is so much more.

spongeboy1985
spongeboy1985

@hanlon23 Ive played it and its basically that in a nutshell as far as a lot of the action stuff  and minus the Nemesis sytem which is another beast enturelybut Id say Mordor does a lot of it better. 

Metamania
Metamania

The solution is really simple then - just buy one of the two next-gen versions of the game. Sounds like a plan!

kentonmuller
kentonmuller

@Metamania Except if you don't have enough money currently. Aren't you just an arrogant a-hole!

deusvex
deusvex

If you live with your parents make them by you one, if your in college take out a student loan for "living expenses", if you have work everyday and have a lot of bills just save a little out of each check(that's what I did), and if your unemployed or homeless just head to the underpass and fly a sign with something clever on it like "Ninjas kidnapped my dog, need money for kung-fu lessons.". Anyway you look at it if you haven't upgraded yet...your not trying hard enough

deusvex
deusvex

If you live with your parents make them buy you one, if your in college take out a student loan for "living expenses", if you have work everyday and have a lot of bills just save a little out of each check(that's what I did), and if your unemployed or homeless just head to the underpass and fly a sign with something clever on it like "Ninjas kidnapped my dog, need money for kung-fu lessons.". Anyway you look at it if you haven't upgraded yet...your not trying hard enough.

Dannystaples14
Dannystaples14

So the Nemesis system will be for bosses and mini-bosses? I can't imagine a PC would have enough power to calculate each individual "minion" character in a game like this with the same individuality, let alone a PC.

Sounds cool. Seems to me like it needs to be well implemented though. If not it could very easily fall into the realm of irrelevance.

orlandosgondar
orlandosgondar

@Dannystaples14 Let alone PC? PC is easily the best version of this game. The best graphics too, there is even an national ULTRA setting with additional 6 gigs of ultra textures optional install not possible or available on consoles. Thats the sort of elite pc gamer feature you get a pc for. IT does require a top of the line video card though. The video card alone has to have 6 gigs of ram. Most consumer pcs barely have that ram in the first place let alone the video card. So i understand why you aren't a believer but still. Let alone pc nothing, its the consoles that im surprised could keep up. Well they cant actually, not last gen but xbox1 and ps4 can run this game, lower graphics by a little but full experience. Im surprised =)

Yes believe it or not, nemesis system works! they remember you, grow in ranks, fight for power, when you are not gone and come back different orcs have grown in power. All in all it allows for some fascinating features. Play the game, it works, don't assume or speculate just try it out!

batsu336
batsu336

@orlandosgondar @Dannystaples14 Yawn.....PC is the best...blah blah blah.  Sure, if you don't mind pissing away $2,000 every 3 years just to keep up. The PC version is exactly the same as next gen consoles, except that you can upgrade the graphics slightly (and I do mean slightly) if you have a stupidly expensive rig that will cost 1/2 as much in 2 years, when it is considered just a so-so rig.

kalibore
kalibore

@batsu336 @orlandosgondar @Dannystaples14 

My latest rig, 32gb RAM - 4Gb Nvidia graphics etc was under £1000. 

It will still be owning games in 5 years technically, that then are running on a 'next gen console' with 8GB of RAM and the equivilent of a AMD HD 7850 card that you can buy today for £100,

If you are spending $2000 every 3 years, you need to start looking at where your shopping and what for.

benelori
benelori

I'm a bit afraid that the AI part that is doing the calculations will only affect enemy behaviour in combat...it's not such a bad thing, don't get me we wrong, but if there would be different scenes and dialogue that would come with every different scenario, then it would be something I can get excited for

eddieham13
eddieham13

@benelori  Yeah I also have some concern about replayability and longevity in regards to the the fact that the enemies have voices.


Unless the scripts we heard them say will probably just be said by another boss (and that's fine).

I mean the things that where said did seem like they could be said again and the voices of Orcs and Uruk's are kinda samey so they wouldn't need that many variations.


One can hope.

leimonides
leimonides

Interesting; something to keep in mind when the game actually gets released.

guardianofhonor
guardianofhonor

Game looks like its just trying to cash grab off the LOTR name...violating LOTR canon is unforgivable.

FLOPPAGE_50
FLOPPAGE_50

@guardianofhonor  if anything we need more LORE from middle earth, the hardcore fans will eat this up, LOTR online is already ancient now.

hadlee73
hadlee73

When they tried to run the game engine on the last gen systems, they received the error message, "Man needs more RAM!"

trackles
trackles

Well yeah, Last gen to be expected, if on Xbox one again though Ill be very pissed.

wolf503
wolf503

Well that's good & bad I guess, since it will flourish more on current gen, but then it may not be worth buying on older gen either. This at least gives me hope that they will succeed with the nemesis system. I really hope they do.

hystavito
hystavito

I was skeptical about just how deep and complex the Nemesis system would really be.  This has made me somewhat less skeptical if it truly cannot be done on older hardware.

Defender1978
Defender1978

Can't buy it on my Wii U?  PC it is then.  

RobDev
RobDev

well personally i'm glad a developer is putting processing power towards decent AI. In the resolution/fps arms race AI has not evolved as it should have.

Pewbert
Pewbert

Are people so dumb that developers need to come out and say that a game won't be as good on a newer console compared to a 7 year old console?

cboye18
cboye18

@Pewbert  Well it won't matter if the game itself sucks, does it? Game looks pretty bland to me....

wolf503
wolf503

@Pewbert No, because crossgen usually results in the current gen suffering. The differences are usually very marginal so buying a game on either old or current wouldn't matter, but in this case I'd be pretty damn annoyed if Monolith didn't mention that the older gen would be scaled back, especially on the nemesis system, which is pretty much 1 of, if not the main reason to buy the game lol

haze0986
haze0986

for all those saying stop producing for last gen.....not everybody has money to burn on new tech, sit back and listen to yourselves , how selfish are you....i still play my ps3 faithfully alongside my ps4 so i hope devs make ps3 games for a long time. kids i tell ya

haze0986
haze0986

@eddieham13 @haze0986 yea, i just hate hearing people say stop selling games for this system because"i bought a new one" its beyond childish, i bought my ps4 and a few ps3 games the same day... i know crazy right

haze0986
haze0986

@eddieham13 @haze0986 the last ps2 game was sold i think either last year or 2 years ago lol so they supported ps2 a little too long

eddieham13
eddieham13

@haze0986  Eventually they will stop but I agree not quite yet. While I do have a PS4 I don't think last gen is dead for at least 1 year yet.

It is old though. I mean we don't support ps2 anymore...

Talavaj
Talavaj

Just keep making games for the last gen dudes, it is not like we have got the next gen for a couple months now or anything.

haze0986
haze0986

@Talavaj  you are aware its it a next gen game aswell right? whats it hurting? the next gen gets the game so what are you saying

RobDev
RobDev

@Talavaj  yes, because they will stop making games for 150 MILLION consoles to make games for 8.5 million. Brilliant idea genius.

blackothh
blackothh

or just stop supporting the old systems

RobDev
RobDev

@blackothh  8.5 million vs 150 million+. Economic suicide,but sure, great idea.

RobDev
RobDev

@blackothh @RobDev  what, firstly you are saying stop supporting the old systems now the new ones are crappy (so crappy in fact they have breaking records) . Make up your mind. here is a workflow to help with future posts. 

Think->think some more->last bit of thinking->post comment.

The-Longshot
The-Longshot

looks pretty sweet to me, tho I don't have an xb1. 

jecomans
jecomans

I had been wondering how they were reconciling what they had touted as 'very next-gen features' with the fact that they were putting the game on the last-gen consoles? I'm glad that they are simplifying the game on the old hardware, not the new hardware like most other developers with their slightly prettier XBO/PS4 editions.