as far as i can see, and this may upset some people, those who consider themselves 'hardcore' gamers are just annoyed when anyone can pick up a game and play.

it used to be easy to sneer at someone who couldnt play games.

'ohhhhhh, maaaaaannn. how many times do i have to tell you!!!!! it's up triangle left square L1 three times and then square triangle circle cross circle. its soooooo easy'

nowadays, your gran can play games with you. and sometimes win.

there are party games which are just pick up and play, and you cannot really sit involved in them for hours. i think this is more what people are talking about losing with some of the party style games with the wii. but that ignores many of the games mentioned, like zelda etc, and also the longevity of games like mario galax and what are sure to be equally time munching games, SSBB and MK.

[QUOTE="hellhund"][QUOTE="hards80"]

first off, i love my wii, its alot of fun, and glad to own one and have owned everything from nintendo.

that said, i dont see that it will last as long as my xbox360 or a ps3 would. with the proliference of high defintion TV's and other consoles offering HD, consumers will get so used to HD, that not having it will frustrate them. also, the graphical limitations will frustrate 3rd party developers, especially after the ps2 dies and no longer can you just port, and i think you will see a decrease in those companies releasing on the wii.

so i think we will see a wii2 before the next generation offerings from microsoft and sony.

*disclaimer- this is purely my speculative opinion and is based on nothing.

boostud

I think people are overestimating the amount of people that have HD TVs or will have them in the very near future. I can count on one finger the number of people I know with an HDTV, and he just got it. People just have other things to spend money on, especially with the economy pissy.

HDTV's are now mainstream. Go to any store and that is all they have now. I only know of a few people who DONT have HDTVs now. Hell, even my grandparents bought 3 of them to replace all their old TVs.

as wiifan says above, the wii has tapped a new market, and as such cannot be judged in the same way as the others. how many of the people new to the console world as a result of nintendo are going to sit up in two years time and say 'hmm, hang on! this game of wii bowling is not in 1080p! this is an outrage!'

they won't care. with wiiware providing access to hundreds of developers able to get their games out to a ready made casual market, the wii will be around for a long long long time.

and even if it is not, it's entry price into the market, and how it got to market will also help it stick around.

SONY parents - "what do you mean that £350 thing i just bought you that you spend all day on in your darkened room when i tell you to go out and play needs replacin!?!? why? so you can make things look nicer!!!!!'

Wii parents - "there's a new wii coming out? but we can still play tennis on it? how much? well, the last one wasn't to expensive, and we do like playing it as well, so i don't see why not,'.

the wii has changed gaming, and i don't think anyone need worry about it's longevity.

i am sure this will have been said before, but 6 pages of stuff to read???

surely it cannot be denied that ninty are looking at the casual gamer as the biggest area for expansion, and considering their sales figures compared to ms or sony, it appears they are right. but abandoning the hardcore? that is a completely different thing. expanding one way doesn't mean you will reduce in other ways.

there are clearly games that are still 'hardcore' games, be they tough puzzle games, long and involved adventure games or online enabled FPS.

depends what your idea of hardcore is, but with online play for PES, online battle mode in kart and online SSBB, it would be easy to sit down with some mates and play for hours and hours and hours. is that not hardcore? the games rely on skill, so the more you practice, the better you ill become, which again favours the 'hardcore' gamer.

so no, they haven't abandoned the hardcore, they have just embraced the casual.

i use the news channel. it is good for seeing what is actually being reported elsewhere in the world, as opposed to what you get given in your own country. the difference can be pretty interesting.