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Neptunian

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#1 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts

1. HAS EVOLUTION BEEN OBSERVED?Lansdowne5
Yes. This is undeniable. We have observed Speciation (which is what most biologists call Macroevolution...and when I say most, I mean the ones who make the rather pointless distinction).
As far as we know, is it scientifically possible for animals to Evolve from one type of creature into another?Lansdowne5
Yep. We've observed it.
Evolutionists have said that whales evolved from 4-legged land animals resembling cattle. Evolutionism teaches that all animals are biologically related. Birds evolved from small dinosaurs. Amphibians such as frogs evolved from fish.

However, nothing like this has ever been observed throughout human history. Nor is there proof of it in the fossil record.Lansdowne5

Well, we have observed evolution, but the reason it hasn't been observed in human history is because it happened before humanity, and that's when it's theorized to have happened. We haven't observed that directly?! REALLY?! Yes. We know this. And there isn't proof in the fossil record, but that's why it's called "evidence", and that's why it's called the THEORY, not fact. But the fossil record is ridiculously overwhelming evidence for evolution and common ancestry.
There are variations within the dog kind and the cattle kind, but never do dogs change into cats or cattle-like animals into whales.Lansdowne5
No, they don't. If we observed that, it would probably hurt the theory of evolution more than help it. However, we have seen species arise, and we have fossil evidence from just about the whole history of the Horse's evolution. Not only species changing, but genus, too.
2. WHY DOESN'T NATURAL SELECTION PROVIDE EVOLUTION?Lansdowne5
It does. End of story.
Natural selection works to insure that species, or kinds, do not greatly deteriorate and retain disadvantageous characteristics.

Natural selection acts as a conservation process which prevents each kind from becoming filled with weak and sickly individuals passing error-filled genetic codes onto future generations.

Natural selection is not capable of creating anything. It has nothing to do with the arrival of new basic types of animals. It works to prevent types of creatures from deteriorating.Lansdowne5

And it allows the superior genes to survive. Yes, that is a correct description on Natural Selection, but why new species and mutations occur is a different story, all of which are part of our theory of evolution. It's not JUST natural selection.
3. WHY DON'T MUTATIONS HELP EVOLUTIONISTS?

Imagine throwing a random change into a computer program. Will it help or hurt? There is little doubt that throwing a random instruction into a complex computer program produces problems and weakens the system.

Mutations are accidental errors in a complex biological mechanism. Mutations are dangerous to creatures, not helpful. They almost always damage animals in one way or another.Lansdowne5

First off, computers are a HORRIBLE analogy to a living thing. Mutations arise through reproduction, and a computer cannot reproduce. It's a ridiculous analogy.

Secondly, most mutations aren't harmful or helpful. Some are harmful, some are helpful. Natural Selection generally favors the helpful mutations. Often times favorable mutations depend on their environment. We have observed helpful mutations with regard to the organism's environment. Antibiotic resistance in bacteria, sickle cell resitance to malaria, Lactose tolerance, etc.

4.

GOD CREATED "KINDS" -- Read Genesis 1:11-25. How many times is the word "kind" used in these verses?

Answer: 10Lansdowne5

Flawed argument because it relies on an unproved premise, AND a certain interpretation of the Bible, too.
5.

FOREST OF TREES. It can be said that the history of living things can best be represented by a forest of trees, rather than a single tree of Evolution. What could that mean?Lansdowne5

Well, yes you can say that...doesn't mean you're right.
Creationists represent life's ancestry with many separate family trees. Each basic "kind" of animal ("baramin" is a more accurate term) was created separately. Originally, God created each animal either from the dust of the Earth or from nothing. They had no ancestors. There are no ancestral roots on these trees.

In each original animal, God placed a unique set of complex coded information -- their genetic code. This enabled them to produce more animals like themselves. And it prevented one created-kind of animal from changing into another created-kind of animal.

Not only did God provide man with all these wonderfully different kinds of animals, he built into the system something which allowed even more delights for man to discover in the future. These genetic codes were designed to allow interesting variations to develop within each "kind." From one original "kind" of butterfly, many variations have developed through the years. Each variety is a different branch on the tree of that "kind." In the same way, through one original type of dog, hundreds of variations have developed -- from poodles to dobermans.

In designing this potential for variation, God provided us with a never ending source of delight. He never meant for us to be bored with creation! Now mankind has not just one type of dog or cat or cattle, but hundreds of variations to enjoy. What a wonderful Creator we have! Lansdowne5

Well, that's nice, but unfortunately there is no reason to believe DNA and genetic codes have "limits" to their evolution. After all, Macroevolution is really just (given time) microevolution + microevolution + microevolution + microevolution, etc.
6.

ORIGINAL KINDS -- What do you think were some of the original created "kinds" of animals? Also, name some kinds that no longer seem to exist today (due to extinction) or have been greatly reduced in variety.

Examples of original kinds: Bears, cats, dogs, cattle, elephants, horses, serpents, frogs, etc.

Original kinds that seem to have become extinct: Dinosaurs, great flying reptiles, etc.

Kinds that once had greater variety: The elephant. Mammoths and mastodons are varieties of elephants that have become extinct. Etc. Lansdowne5

I don't see any argument here...
7.

VARIETIES WITHIN THE HUMAN RACE -- How did different races and skin colors develop from one original family (Adam's family)?

God created humans with inherent possibilities for great variation. The various traits were probably largely intensified after the Flood and the tower of Babel when family groups became separated by language barriers. As people moved away from Babel, groups became further isolated by distance, mountain ranges, and oceans. This separation of the human race into isolated groups forced procreation from among limited gene pools.

Since children acquire the physical characteristics of their parents, long-term inbreeding within these groups caused the characteristics to become more and more emphasized in following generations. These features included nose shape, eye shape and color, hair type, lip shape, skin pigmentation, body size, and skull shape.

Lansdowne5

That's nice, but unfortunatley Evolution has a ton of evidence to support the theory, and this post relies on a premise with no evidence (the literal existence of Adam and Eve).

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#2 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts
Johhny depp would be good but there is already one with the riddler Jim Carrey plays him its the best batman film out.Philx3
True, but people once though Jack Nicholson did the best Joker.
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#3 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts
Because Downey Jr. wasn't playing a black man. He was playing an Australian who goes through a skin pigment surgery to become black in order to play the role in a movie.
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#4 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts
[QUOTE="Neptunian"]

Didn't I JUST explain this?

I have to go to work now, so I'm not saying I'll reply back if you reply and tell me how I'm wrong, but it might take me a while.

Funky_Llama

No, you asserted it.

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]

Just because we don't understand something doesn't mean it's supernatural.

LJS9502_basic

Dude...while it may be enjoyable to you to debate in these threads....no compelling arguments have been made in OT.

The arguments I was referring to aren't from OT.

No, I didn't.
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#5 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts
[QUOTE="Neptunian"][QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="Neptunian"][QUOTE="Lolster12345"]

[QUOTE="DrSponge"]There's nothing that can prove God doesn't exist.
I'm an atheist, by the way.
Funky_Llama

Im an athiest as well and there is nothing to prove he does exist either

Well, I think in order to disprove God, one has to explain all the currently unexplainable with unquestionable certainty, which means someone has to be all-knowing. When someone can actually do this, they might be considered a god, but that's more semantics. I think if God were directly observed, as in one day he actually came to earth and everyone saw him with their own eyes, and he performed acts only a god could do, that would prove his existence (unless someone wants to get in a philosophical discussion and say absolute truth does not exist).

:roll: So one would have to be omniscient to disprove God's existence, but that wouldn't be nessecary to prove it?

Well...yes.

Why? :|

Didn't I JUST explain this?

I have to go to work now, so I'm not saying I won't reply back if you reply and tell me how I'm wrong, but it might take me a while.

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#6 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts

The Story.

What do you think? I'll be honest, I was upset reading this story, because there is some pretty convincing evidence.

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#7 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts
[QUOTE="Neptunian"][QUOTE="Lolster12345"]

[QUOTE="DrSponge"]There's nothing that can prove God doesn't exist.
I'm an atheist, by the way.
Funky_Llama

Im an athiest as well and there is nothing to prove he does exist either

Well, I think in order to disprove God, one has to explain all the currently unexplainable with unquestionable certainty, which means someone has to be all-knowing. When someone can actually do this, they might be considered a god, but that's more semantics. I think if God were directly observed, as in one day he actually came to earth and everyone saw him with their own eyes, and he performed acts only a god could do, that would prove his existence (unless someone wants to get in a philosophical discussion and say absolute truth does not exist).

:roll: So one would have to be omniscient to disprove God's existence, but that wouldn't be nessecary to prove it?

Well...yes.
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#8 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts
[QUOTE="Neptunian"]

I hate when people think they can actually disprove God on a gaming forum. Something nobody has solved in millions of years solved in the OT.

Funky_Llama

That's debatable... I think there are some pretty compelling argumens against the existence of the Judeo-Abrahamic God.

Well, generally all the arguments I've ever seen just attempt to make God improbable, but it's never been disproved by deductive logic in an uncertain manner that He doesn't exist.
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#9 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts

[QUOTE="DrSponge"]There's nothing that can prove God doesn't exist.
I'm an atheist, by the way.
Lolster12345

Im an athiest as well and there is nothing to prove he does exist either

Well, I think in order to disprove God, one has to explain all the currently unexplainable with unquestionable certainty, which means someone has to be all-knowing. When someone can actually do this, they might be considered a god, but that's more semantics. I think if God were directly observed, as in one day he actually came to earth and everyone saw him with their own eyes, and he performed acts only a god could do, that would prove his existence (unless someone wants to get in a philosophical discussion and say absolute truth does not exist).
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#10 Neptunian
Member since 2008 • 207 Posts

Im not trying to flame peoples religions and such, but I have some pretty valid points that question whether god is real or not.

-Why do people say "god" answers their prayers when It could of been sheer luck? And compared with statistics, the argument is further questionable. The bible said god answers prayers, but peoples "prayers" are mostly if not all unanswered.

-Why do people look up to the bible so much when It could of been written by anyone(It just doesn't logically make sense).

-If everything is made up of matter, then how Is It possible for god to be created or to be in existence, If there was nothing from the start? And If god just magically appeared, then how could he of created the world? Its scientifically impossible.

I think science can prove that god is not real.

Vilot_Hero

1. Because that's what they believe. If you're going to use statistical analysis, you can't really come to a deductive conclusion. You can come to an inductive one, maybe, but that doesn't really prove anything.

2. Perhaps because of the teachings in it.

3. If all of your assumptions are true, that doesn't really make it impossible.

I hate when people think they can actually disprove God on a gaming forum. Something nobody has solved in millions of years solved in the OT.