What is "Hardcore" and what is "Casual"????? People here can

[QUOTE="AdmiralBison"]

Halo may not be considered casual. Is the majority of Xbox owners casual?

Halo is played by "hardcore" gamers really. It wouldn't have a dedicated following, nor MLG and other media -novels, films and spin offs to co-incide with it's story. When you think about Halo is simple and easy to get into but is hardly a "Casual" affair.

You should see the amount of hours, stats and talk people have on Halo. Nothing Casual about Halo.

Menalque2

The majority of gamers in general are casuals and the same goes for Xbox 360 owners. What more evidence of this do you need than the huge sales of Halo 3, Modern Warfare, GTAIV and Rock Band? Hell, what about the fact that Terminator Salvation outsold Bionic Commando? Xbox Live isn't some sort of self-contained bubble where only the hardest of the hardcore may enter.

Of course the majority of gamers are "Casual" but also those sales are made up of "Hardcore" as well. Thats's not the point.

W.O.W. Is that a casual game? What is the userbase on that beast? It's huge, does it mean the gamers are casual. They're extremely dedicated to it, as well as EverQuest, Sims, Starcradft.

Just because a game is bought in huge amounts is not neccessarily a casual affair or bought by "Casuals"

It's this straight line segregation between "Casual" and "Hardcore" once again that is the problem. "Casuals" and "Hardcore" are blurred and is only defined by the actual individual it seems.

How about KZ2 how many peole bought that game. 2 million. The game isn't "Hardcore" it's quite linear, fairly simple to play but not that many bought it.

How about PS3's then is it a hardocore machine? It seems more often it is seen as a 60% bluray player 40% games machine(exageration yes) but it seems to be used more casually as well as the lower game attach ratio.

so you havn' answered the question. Does this make the majority of Xbox owners casual then? The same can be said for Nintendo Wii and PS3s which include you and me.

It's been said everyone here in this forum is pretty much hardcore ???

So "Hardore" and "Casual" is not so fine cut.

. Sims. do you consider that casual but it is a very "Hardcore" affair. It's on PCs as well.

I always thought that PC players where the "Hardcore"

Hardcore means that you devote a lot of time into playing games and you enjoy them. Casual means that you just play games to pass time.

Wikipedian

a close defintion and that can fit on any number of fans from Wii fans to PC gamers.

Though the passing of time can be something else.

If I was unemloyed I'd be passing a lot of time playing games.

It's just this whole term " Hardcore: and "Casuals" and "Core" gamers that need to be gotten rid of or more accurately is should be distanced, not associated of stigmatised as good or bad.

It just alienates the market in some way. It also effects decision making, perspective and reviewing in my opinion.

Do we really need definitions...labels like this are sort of silly.AAllxxjjnn

I find it odd that some Industry pundits and some game journalists say that Nintendo should appeal more to it's core audience.

Who and what is the core audience?? If it's the fans of XBox360 and PS3 games. Then it is not its core audience.

It's the "Casual" or the ones who already purchased and play Wii games are it's core audience. They actually havn't changed. Another definition of Hardcore is somethig that is resistant to change. That's strange is Nintendo Hardcoringly casual? Because their IPS really havn't changed, they still see video games like casual toy.

No it's just they appeal to a different market of gamers and that market majority prefer Nintendo Wii and it's games. However it's made up of "Hardcore" and "Casual" gamers, but this is dynamic.

Moving to a core audience? from the industry pundits and some game journalists.

What it suggests is Nintendo to have games that appeal to the Xbox360 and PS3 crowd. Which I still think is not fully defined anyway.

People who have all three consoles. Would this make them "Hardcore" even though one of the consoles has a lot of "Casual Shovelware" make them casual or are they Hardcore becuase they have so many consoles and games.

The video game industry is always changing regardless if some fanboys like it or not, but fun is always constant no matter if it's considered

"Hardcore", "Core" or "Casual"

I think those are stupid terms anyway because gamers are dynamic.

[QUOTE="AAllxxjjnn"]Do we really need definitions...labels like this are sort of silly.enterawesome

Exactly.

That is the whole point of my post.

It is to dispel silly descriptions of types of gamers and games becuase of a negative connotation such as "Casual" or "Hardcore" that is used.

you know it's blah, blah Casual play game x and blah blah Game y takes more skill becuase it's played by hardcore therefore it's better.

This also effects game reviewers too.

that's great and all but the thoery isn't exact.

If those soccer moms, grandpas and al played on a Wii they would be considered non-gamers thn. Because they are now playing games.

Shovel ware is just a term you use to show your dislike for a particular style of game, but it doesn't mean the audience is "Casual"

What if there are gamers out there who are naturally good at games, but do not spend time often playing games?

Just because some people who only buy big games like EA sports, HAlo, CoD, GTA and Wii Sports doesn't mean they are not enthusisatic. If anything they are enthusiastic because they are buying those big games. Wouldn't that make them more prude and like the "Elite" tiltes.

Those games you mentioned score very high and are generally the pinacle of their peers.

AdmiralBison

I never described the market for shovelware as "casuals", I described them as non-gamers. Maybe a little bit on the crude side, but I am talking about the market that Nintendo has tapped into. People who would never have touched videogames before.

So what if there are talented gamers out there who don't have the time to hone themselves? Is a person who never practiced piano in his life, but has perfect hands suddenly a piano virtuoso? I really fail to see where you're going with this.

I never said there was anything wrong with liking casual titles such as Halo, CoD or EA sports games. But nine times out of ten, the person buying something like Call of Duty, GTA or FIFA is somebody either new to gaming or has very little interest. They are great games and they are made for the masses.

I just find it funny how some ppl seem to spout a lot of nonsense about there being no difference. Yes we are all gamers, well no kidding? But not everyone plays games the same way, or the same kinds of games, have the same level of interest etc. These differences and terms we use for them are there, we know and use them, everybody does, game journalists and companies do as well. Now the only thing there is to argue is the connotation we give to them, either positive, negative or neutral.

I just find it funny how some ppl seem to spout a lot of nonsense about there being no difference. Yes we are all gamers, well no kidding? But not everyone plays games the same way, or the same kinds of games, have the same level of interest etc. These differences and terms we use for them are there, we know and use them, everybody does, game journalists and companies do as well. Now the only thing there is to argue is the connotation we give to them, either positive, negative or neutral.

Dystopian-X

truth is in this post.

unfortunately lines of demarkation evoke faction witch is why system wars is here.

I just find it funny how some ppl seem to spout a lot of nonsense about there being no difference. Yes we are all gamers, well no kidding? But not everyone plays games the same way, or the same kinds of games, have the same level of interest etc. These differences and terms we use for them are there, we know and use them, everybody does, game journalists and companies do as well. Now the only thing there is to argue is the connotation we give to them, either positive, negative or neutral.

Dystopian-X

Not really. The problem is that your jamming dozens of diverse gaming tendencies into 2 extreme categories that nobody can agree on the definition. For the most part "hardcore gamer" is used by people to make themselves feel elite. We really don't need to use those terms to have analytical discussions about gaming and in my eyes they dilute the substance contained in any argument.

[QUOTE="Dystopian-X"]

I just find it funny how some ppl seem to spout a lot of nonsense about there being no difference. Yes we are all gamers, well no kidding? But not everyone plays games the same way, or the same kinds of games, have the same level of interest etc. These differences and terms we use for them are there, we know and use them, everybody does, game journalists and companies do as well. Now the only thing there is to argue is the connotation we give to them, either positive, negative or neutral.

Not really. The problem is that your jamming dozens of diverse gaming tendencies into 2 extreme categories that nobody can agree on the definition. For the most part "hardcore gamer" is used by people to make themselves feel elite. We really don't need to use those terms to have analytical discussions about gaming and in my eyes they dilute the substance contained in any argument.

I'm so casual that instead of playing games I argue with you guys on SW. I think I'm the prime definition of a casual.

I'm so casual that instead of playing games I argue with you guys on SW. I think I'm the prime definition of a casual.

Silverbond

EDIT in fact its so hardcore I had to edit and put two more "X's" on the end of MAX!

[QUOTE="DaBrainz"]

[QUOTE="Dystopian-X"]

I just find it funny how some ppl seem to spout a lot of nonsense about there being no difference. Yes we are all gamers, well no kidding? But not everyone plays games the same way, or the same kinds of games, have the same level of interest etc. These differences and terms we use for them are there, we know and use them, everybody does, game journalists and companies do as well. Now the only thing there is to argue is the connotation we give to them, either positive, negative or neutral.

blue_hazy_basic

Not really. The problem is that your jamming dozens of diverse gaming tendencies into 2 extreme categories that nobody can agree on the definition. For the most part "hardcore gamer" is used by people to make themselves feel elite. We really don't need to use those terms to have analytical discussions about gaming and in my eyes they dilute the substance contained in any argument.

But then people with no skill that play WoW 40 hours a week are more hardcore than the dood that mopped the floor with me at Total War? IDK about that.

That's your definition. I don't consider time spent necessarily a trait of an acomplished gamer.

I'm not hardcore or casual. I'm just a gamer. >_>

But then people with no skill that play WoW 40 hours a week are more hardcore than the dood that mopped the floor with me at Total War? IDK about that.

That's your definition. I don't consider time spent necessarily a trait of an acomplished gamer.

DaBrainz

Usually time spent means more experience in certain game. It's likely that the dude who mopped the floor with you at Total War has a fair ammount of time in that game as well.

[QUOTE="Menalque2"]

[QUOTE="AdmiralBison"]

Halo may not be considered casual. Is the majority of Xbox owners casual?

Halo is played by "hardcore" gamers really. It wouldn't have a dedicated following, nor MLG and other media -novels, films and spin offs to co-incide with it's story. When you think about Halo is simple and easy to get into but is hardly a "Casual" affair.

You should see the amount of hours, stats and talk people have on Halo. Nothing Casual about Halo.

The majority of gamers in general are casuals and the same goes for Xbox 360 owners. What more evidence of this do you need than the huge sales of Halo 3, Modern Warfare, GTAIV and Rock Band? Hell, what about the fact that Terminator Salvation outsold Bionic Commando? Xbox Live isn't some sort of self-contained bubble where only the hardest of the hardcore may enter.

Of course the majority of gamers are "Casual" but also those sales are made up of "Hardcore" as well. Thats's not the point.

W.O.W. Is that a casual game? What is the userbase on that beast? It's huge, does it mean the gamers are casual. They're extremely dedicated to it, as well as EverQuest, Sims, Starcradft.

Just because a game is bought in huge amounts is not neccessarily a casual affair or bought by "Casuals"

It's this straight line segregation between "Casual" and "Hardcore" once again that is the problem. "Casuals" and "Hardcore" are blurred and is only defined by the actual individual it seems.

How about KZ2 how many peole bought that game. 2 million. The game isn't "Hardcore" it's quite linear, fairly simple to play but not that many bought it.

How about PS3's then is it a hardocore machine? It seems more often it is seen as a 60% bluray player 40% games machine(exageration yes) but it seems to be used more casually as well as the lower game attach ratio.

so you havn' answered the question. Does this make the majority of Xbox owners casual then? The same can be said for Nintendo Wii and PS3s which include you and me.

It's been said everyone here in this forum is pretty much hardcore ???

So "Hardore" and "Casual" is not so fine cut.

. Sims. do you consider that casual but it is a very "Hardcore" affair. It's on PCs as well.

I always thought that PC players where the "Hardcore"

[QUOTE="blue_hazy_basic"][QUOTE="DaBrainz"]

Not really. The problem is that your jamming dozens of diverse gaming tendencies into 2 extreme categories that nobody can agree on the definition. For the most part "hardcore gamer" is used by people to make themselves feel elite. We really don't need to use those terms to have analytical discussions about gaming and in my eyes they dilute the substance contained in any argument.

But then people with no skill that play WoW 40 hours a week are more hardcore than the dood that mopped the floor with me at Total War? IDK about that.

That's your definition. I don't consider time spent necessarily a trait of an acomplished gamer.