The Blu-Ray propaganda really needs to stop

I saw this article about Capcom's announcements today, and the part about Lost Planet for PS3 was just disgusting. It states that the PS3 version's inclusion of the 360 version's DLC and the PC version's extra characters was "made possible by Blu Ray." Let's see how true this statement is:

1. Map Pack #3 for Lost Planet for the 360 was apparently 232MB. I don't know the exact numbers (seeing as I don't hae a 360 or Lost Planet), but I can reasonably predict that all 3 map packs together take up somewhere between 600MB and 1GB of space.

2. The PC version has an 8GB install according to Newegg.com.

So, even if the game took up as much space on the 360 as it did on the PC install (which usually isn't the case), the game could still fit on a normal DVD-9. Thus Blu-Ray did not in fact make this PS3 port possible, or really do much of any use.

Look, here's the thing. After seeing some movies on Blu-Ray, I'm totally sold as far as its usefulness in movies goes. It just looks ridiculously good. I just wish that Sony would stop trying to pretend that it's useful for games by spreading misinformation, and focus more on the movie-playing aspect of the PS3. Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

I saw this article about Capcom's announcements today, and the part about Lost Planet for PS3 was just disgusting. It states that the PS3 version's inclusion of the 360 version's DLC and the PC version's extra characters was "made possible by Blu Ray." Let's see how true this statement is:

1. Map Pack #3 for Lost Planet for the 360 was apparently 232MB. I don't know the exact numbers (seeing as I don't hae a 360 or Lost Planet), but I can reasonably predict that all 3 map packs together take up somewhere between 600MB and 1GB of space.

2. The PC version has an 8GB install according to Newegg.com.

So, even if the game took up as much space on the 360 as it did on the PC install (which usually isn't the case), the game could still fit on a normal DVD-9. Thus Blu-Ray did not in fact make this PS3 port possible, or really do much of any use.

Look, here's the thing. After seeing some movies on Blu-Ray, I'm totally sold as far as its usefulness in movies goes. It just looks ridiculously good. I just wish that Sony would stop trying to pretend that it's useful for games by spreading misinformation, and focus more on the movie-playing aspect of the PS3. Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

Funkyhamster

Well Capcom isn't owned by Sony, and if they said Blu-Ray helped than I don't see what the problem is..

And Lost Planet is coming to PS3?

Well Capcom isn't owned by Sony, and if they said Blu-Ray helped than I don't see what the problem is..

Koalakommander

It's still marketing in a sense, claiming that the PS3 version is superior to the other versions. Which is true; it does have the extra content of the 360 and PC versions combined... it's just that Blu-Ray doesn't have anything to do with it.

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"]

Well Capcom isn't owned by Sony, and if they said Blu-Ray helped than I don't see what the problem is..

Funkyhamster

It's still marketing in a sense, claiming that the PS3 version is superior to the other versions. Which is true; it does have the extra content of the 360 and PC versions combined... it's just that Blu-Ray doesn't have anything to do with it.

You can fit more stuff when you have more space. It's common sense.

yeah damm propaganda.... its not like BR can more then DVD making it possable to hold lost planet + all the extra add ons

Capcom are just being payed by sony.. they MUST be

end of sarcastic Xbot rant

yeah damm propaganda.... its not like BR can more then DVD making it possable to hold lost planet + all the extra add ons

Capcom are just being payed by sony.. they MUST be

end of sarcastic Xbot rant

niall077

I just proved pretty definitively that a DVD-9 could hold the extra content...

This is bascially the issue guys:

Huge games (not necessarily long) have a lot of content. These games can fit onto DVD-9s with enough compressing done to them. However, devs are finding it difficult to compress their games so much, and blu-ray makes the whole situation much less stressful.

We are coming to the point where it is very difficult to fit games on DVDs. Having multiple discs is not an issue to your typical gamers, but it is embarassing (to MS) when you have games with a 4 discs during the "next" generation of gaming. That's why it is so crucial.

The big thing about Blu-Ray is that it plays movies in HD

We've read to many dev complaints to dismiss Blu-Ray as "useless.".

Look, here's the thing. After seeing some movies on Blu-Ray, I'm totally sold as far as its usefulness in movies goes. It just looks ridiculously good. I just wish that Sony would stop trying to pretend that it's useful for games by spreading misinformation, and focus more on the movie-playing aspect of the PS3. Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

Funkyhamster

you really think it isn't useful for games?

MGS4, FFXIII, GT5, R&C, Resistance, KZ2,Stranglehold(PS3 version, yes alot of extras)...all those games couldn't be done the same there being developed now without Blu-ray. Isn't that appearant to you, or are all the devs just lying( some are 3rd party).Adrian_Cloud

Okay, here's the thing. For MGS4, I know that Kojima decided to use completely uncompressed sound - which could theoretically make a small difference in audio if you're an playing the game on a really nice speaker system, but really won't have much of an effect thanks to the efficient encoding algorithms for "HD sound" these days - and which takes up ridiculous amounts of space. For example, if you rip a CD using raw WAV encoding, it takes up 900MB of space - but you can easily reduce it to 40MB or less with WMA, AAC, or MP3...

As for Stranglehold, that's because it also has Hard Boiled in HD on the disc... of course it's going to take up as much space as a Blu-Ray movie... :P

[QUOTE="niall077"]

yeah damm propaganda.... its not like BR can more then DVD making it possable to hold lost planet + all the extra add ons

Capcom are just being payed by sony.. they MUST be

end of sarcastic Xbot rant

Funkyhamster

I just proved pretty definitively that a DVD-9 could hold the extra content...

[QUOTE="niall077"]

yeah damm propaganda.... its not like BR can more then DVD making it possable to hold lost planet + all the extra add ons

Capcom are just being payed by sony.. they MUST be

end of sarcastic Xbot rant

Funkyhamster

I just proved pretty definitively that a DVD-9 could hold the extra content...

Actually, you if anything disproved it. DVD-9 doesn't hold 9gigs (8.5GB), and in fact X360 doesn't even hold the max capacity of DVD9 (last official word was it was closer to 7GB, the rest is used on copy protection and such). So, if lost planet's install is at 8GB that means it alone is near maxing the disc out, minus any downloads. If the downloads are 1GB then yep it is actually exceeding the DVD9 size limit.

[QUOTE="Adrian_Cloud"]MGS4, FFXIII, GT5, R&C, Resistance, KZ2,Stranglehold(PS3 version, yes alot of extras)...all those games couldn't be done the same there being developed now without Blu-ray. Isn't that appearant to you, or are all the devs just lying( some are 3rd party).Funkyhamster

Okay, here's the thing. For MGS4, I know that Kojima decided to use completely uncompressed sound - which could theoretically make a small difference in audio if you're an playing the game on a really nice speaker system, but really won't have much of an effect thanks to the efficient encoding algorithms for "HD sound" these days - and which takes up ridiculous amounts of space. For example, if you rip a CD using raw WAV encoding, it takes up 900MB of space - but you can easily reduce it to 40MB or less with WMA, AAC, or MP3...

As for Stranglehold, that's because it also has Hard Boiled in HD on the disc... of course it's going to take up as much space as a Blu-Ray movie... :P

For every dev praising Blu-Ray for the extra space, there is a dev complaining about the lack of space on DVD-9.

I understand what you are trying to say, Blu-Ray probably isn't as huge as everyone makes it out to be. But it certainly is a luxury that were lucky to have.

[QUOTE="Funkyhamster"]

Look, here's the thing. After seeing some movies on Blu-Ray, I'm totally sold as far as its usefulness in movies goes. It just looks ridiculously good. I just wish that Sony would stop trying to pretend that it's useful for games by spreading misinformation, and focus more on the movie-playing aspect of the PS3. Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

SambaLele

you really think it isn't useful for games?

It's definately useful; probably not necessary, but certainly useful.

Actually, you if anything disproved it. DVD-9 doesn't hold 9gigs (8.5GB), and in fact X360 doesn't even hold the max capacity of DVD9 (last official word was it was closer to 7GB, the rest is used on copy protection and such). So, if lost planet's install is at 8GB that means it alone is near maxing the disc out, minus any downloads. If the downloads are 1GB then yep it is actually exceeding the DVD9 size limit.

DerekLoffin

That's excluding the fact that PC ports have installs much larger than the original console version... I just used it because there isn't any concrete information about how much space console games take up.

There was an interview with Dan Houser (I think it was him) in a 360 mag a couple of months ago saying Rockstar were finding the lack of disc space for GTA4 a bit of a problem.

[QUOTE="DerekLoffin"]

Actually, you if anything disproved it. DVD-9 doesn't hold 9gigs (8.5GB), and in fact X360 doesn't even hold the max capacity of DVD9 (last official word was it was closer to 7GB, the rest is used on copy protection and such). So, if lost planet's install is at 8GB that means it alone is near maxing the disc out, minus any downloads. If the downloads are 1GB then yep it is actually exceeding the DVD9 size limit.

Funkyhamster

That's excluding the fact that PC ports have installs much larger than the original console version... I just used it because there isn't any concrete information about how much space console games take up.

Maybe, but again, you haven't proven your point, if anything you did the exact opposite. Your number don't work out to support your point, they work out against your point.

Cows are right, BR has definitely helped gaming.

BR helped Motorstorm have a ton of race tracks packed-in the game.

BR helped Heavenly Sword be a lengthy game.

BR helped Lair to be a true masterpiece.

There was an interview with Dan Houser (I think it was him) in a 360 mag a couple of months ago saying Rockstar were finding the lack of disc space for GTA4 a bit of a problem.

BZSIN

The problem was with the lack of a standard hard drive NOT storage space.

I saw this article about Capcom's announcements today, and the part about Lost Planet for PS3 was just disgusting. It states that the PS3 version's inclusion of the 360 version's DLC and the PC version's extra characters was "made possible by Blu Ray." Let's see how true this statement is:

1. Map Pack #3 for Lost Planet for the 360 was apparently 232MB. I don't know the exact numbers (seeing as I don't hae a 360 or Lost Planet), but I can reasonably predict that all 3 map packs together take up somewhere between 600MB and 1GB of space.

2. The PC version has an 8GB install according to Newegg.com.

So, even if the game took up as much space on the 360 as it did on the PC install (which usually isn't the case), the game could still fit on a normal DVD-9. Thus Blu-Ray did not in fact make this PS3 port possible, or really do much of any use.

Funkyhamster

You just self-owned yourself there you know. I'm not saying the article is being honest buy DVD-9 doesn't actually hold 9GB and 360's DVD9? 7.8GB.

In otherwords it could be entirely accurate that its included on disc due to Blu-Ray.

MGS4, FFXIII, GT5, R&C, Resistance, KZ2,Stranglehold(PS3 version, yes alot of extras)...all those games couldn't be done the same there being developed now without Blu-ray. Isn't that appearant to you, or are all the devs just lying( some are 3rd party).Adrian_Cloud

I just proved pretty definitively that a DVD-9 could hold the extra content...

Funkyhamster

No you proved you don't understand the difference between binary and decimal when it comes to calculating storage space and you've also proven you don't know about 360's further reduced DVD storage space.

That's excluding the fact that PC ports have installs much larger than the original console version... I just used it because there isn't any concrete information about how much space console games take up.

Funkyhamster

Then you can't "disprove" anything because you are missing relevant information that can throw your entire assumption out the window.

Sony is trying to convince everyone that Blu-ray is necessary. That's because they stand to make a sh--load of $$ if people adopt it. Sony isn't trying to revolutionize games or movies. It's trying to take your $$. The sooner people realize this truth the better. They will effectively control most media if Blu-ray wins. And "TrueHD" is also another Sonyism. Remember, Sony says that if it isn't "TrueHD and Blu-ray then it's crap!" I see through their marketing campaign like it was made of glass.fanboy999

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"]

Well Capcom isn't owned by Sony, and if they said Blu-Ray helped than I don't see what the problem is..

Funkyhamster

It's still marketing in a sense, claiming that the PS3 version is superior to the other versions. Which is true; it does have the extra content of the 360 and PC versions combined... it's just that Blu-Ray doesn't have anything to do with it.

of course it's marketing. how else would you really make a person buy a game that is a year old. They have to claim something or very few would get interested

[QUOTE="Adrian_Cloud"]MGS4, FFXIII, GT5, R&C, Resistance, KZ2,Stranglehold(PS3 version, yes alot of extras)...all those games couldn't be done the same there being developed now without Blu-ray. Isn't that appearant to you, or are all the devs just lying( some are 3rd party).jlh47

Correct.

If you take out all the extra language tracks, then most (excluding all JRPGs) PS3 games would fit on DVd9.

I saw this article about Capcom's announcements today, and the part about Lost Planet for PS3 was just disgusting. It states that the PS3 version's inclusion of the 360 version's DLC and the PC version's extra characters was "made possible by Blu Ray." Let's see how true this statement is:

1. Map Pack #3 for Lost Planet for the 360 was apparently 232MB. I don't know the exact numbers (seeing as I don't hae a 360 or Lost Planet), but I can reasonably predict that all 3 map packs together take up somewhere between 600MB and 1GB of space.

2. The PC version has an 8GB install according to Newegg.com.

So, even if the game took up as much space on the 360 as it did on the PC install (which usually isn't the case), the game could still fit on a normal DVD-9. Thus Blu-Ray did not in fact make this PS3 port possible, or really do much of any use.

Look, here's the thing. After seeing some movies on Blu-Ray, I'm totally sold as far as its usefulness in movies goes. It just looks ridiculously good. I just wish that Sony would stop trying to pretend that it's useful for games by spreading misinformation, and focus more on the movie-playing aspect of the PS3. Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

Funkyhamster

xbox360 didnt have enough storage on the disk that's reason they have maps to download lol, on ps3 they had enough so included dlc from 360.

xbox360 didnt have enough storage on the disk that's reason they have maps to download lol, on ps3 they had enough so included dlc from 360.

ut3nophysics

So, what you're saying is that Motorstorm's whopping8 tracks took up all 25Gigs on the BR disc and that's why Sony had to release the other tracks via DLC?

:shock:

Cows are right, BR has definitely helped gaming.

BR helped Motorstorm have a ton of race tracks packed-in the game.

BR helped Heavenly Sword be a lengthy game.

BR helped Lair to be a true masterpiece.

LosDaddie

BR will help Ratchet and Clank on the 30th (the demo was more than a gig)

BR will help Uncharted in a month

BR will help Stranglehold by adding the value of a full movie

I don't see DVD helping Blue Dragon compress to 8.5 gigs

I pity that you limit yourself to only AAA games....Guitar Hero 2 didn't get AAA but it was a heck of fun

[QUOTE="ut3nophysics"]

xbox360 didnt have enough storage on the disk that's reason they have maps to download lol, on ps3 they had enough so included dlc from 360.

LosDaddie

So, what you're saying is that Motorstorm's whopping8 tracks took up all 25Gigs on the BR disc and that's why Sony had to release the other tracks via DLC?

:shock:

I don't see Blue Dragon being under 8.5 gigs

BR will help Ratchet and Clank on the 30th (the demo was more than a gig)

BR will help Uncharted in a month

BR will help Stranglehold by adding the value of a full movieaaron6581230

So bascially, more WaitStation3? :lol:

FYI: Plenty of x360 demos are more than 1G. Or did you not know that? Oh and I enjoyed R&C demo on my PS3.

I pity that you limit yourself to only AAA games....Guitar Hero 2 didn't get AAA but it was a heck of fun

aaron6581230

I pity that you limit yourself to one console, while I own all 3. 8)

[QUOTE="LosDaddie"][QUOTE="ut3nophysics"]

xbox360 didnt have enough storage on the disk that's reason they have maps to download lol, on ps3 they had enough so included dlc from 360.

aaron6581230

So, what you're saying is that Motorstorm's whopping8 tracks took up all 25Gigs on the BR disc and that's why Sony had to release the other tracks via DLC?

:shock:

I don't see Blue Dragon being under 8.5 gigs

One JRPG example is all you have? :lol: And yet you couldn't even answer the question? :lol: :lol:

Yup, DVD9 held back Halo3 and GameSpot's 2006 Game of the Year....oh wait :shock:

1. Map Pack #3 for Lost Planet for the 360 was apparently 232MB. I don't know the exact numbers (seeing as I don't hae a 360 or Lost Planet), but I can reasonably predict that all 3 map packs together take up somewhere between 600MB and 1GB of space.Funkyhamster

Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

Funkyhamster

What use can normal people get out of the Cell?

[QUOTE="Funkyhamster"]

[QUOTE="Adrian_Cloud"]MGS4, FFXIII, GT5, R&C, Resistance, KZ2,Stranglehold(PS3 version, yes alot of extras)...all those games couldn't be done the same there being developed now without Blu-ray. Isn't that appearant to you, or are all the devs just lying( some are 3rd party).Koalakommander

Okay, here's the thing. For MGS4, I know that Kojima decided to use completely uncompressed sound - which could theoretically make a small difference in audio if you're an playing the game on a really nice speaker system, but really won't have much of an effect thanks to the efficient encoding algorithms for "HD sound" these days - and which takes up ridiculous amounts of space. For example, if you rip a CD using raw WAV encoding, it takes up 900MB of space - but you can easily reduce it to 40MB or less with WMA, AAC, or MP3...

As for Stranglehold, that's because it also has Hard Boiled in HD on the disc... of course it's going to take up as much space as a Blu-Ray movie... :P

For every dev praising Blu-Ray for the extra space, there is a dev complaining about the lack of space on DVD-9.

I understand what you are trying to say, Blu-Ray probably isn't as huge as everyone makes it out to be. But it certainly is aluxury that were lucky to have.

Amen Brother :wink:

Funk, one DVD9 sure, but not one 360 DVD9 as the maximum space avaliable for 360 games is just 7.5GB.

But nothing stops them from shipping in 2 discs and requiring a HDD.

If Blu-ray wasn't needed, I doubt people would actually be using it. Just raises costs for them.

To assume that all the companies who use Blu-ray as the choice format for their games were bribed or encouraged to use Blu-ray discs sounds like paranoia.

Unless there's any game developers here who can give their relfections on it, everyone else here saying Blu-ray isn't needed is just making assumptions and uninformed opinions.

What use can normal people get out of the Cell?

OXIIIIXO

Well for one its a darn good hardware multimedia decoder..

[QUOTE="Funkyhamster"]

Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

OXIIIIXO

What use can normal people get out of the Cell?

[QUOTE="Funkyhamster"]

Talking about the power of the Cell seems like a far more plausible way to market the PS3 as a "supercomputer" (even if it's still a little inaccurate) without misinforming the public.

OXIIIIXO

What use can normal people get out of the Cell?

What use can normal people get out of the Xenon?

uhh on dvd-9's microsoft can only use a little bit less than 8 gigs look it up

they use about 1.5 gigs for security

Cows are right, BR has definitely helped gaming.

BR helped Motorstorm have a ton of race tracks packed-in the game.

BR helped Heavenly Sword be a lengthy game.

BR helped Lair to be a true masterpiece.

LosDaddie