Question about PS3 @ 720p output

I've heard that at 720p, the PS3 is actually making 630p and then upscaling it (known as sub-HD). Is this true?

I've heard that at 720p, the PS3 is actually making 630p and then upscaling it (known as sub-HD). Is this true?

mr-krinkles

No the PS3 does display true 720p. It depends on the game, what you heard will be related to the game. But the PS3 can process true 1080p sources.

Post the link where you heard this rumour and we can clear it up right now!

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again. 

it's because of the hardware limitations and poor ram in the PS3. they have to put the resolution down so the game doesn't stutter. 

PS3 is the only console that can do native 1080p.EVOLV3

lmao, no - no it's not.

the 360 is also capable of it - i can't believe you actually said that, or that people still think that. you should spend some time on neogaf or avsforum boards where they pixel count - the PS3 has far more titles upscaled than the 360 :D :D

[QUOTE="EVOLV3"]PS3 is the only console that can do native 1080p.3picuri3

lmao, no - no it's not.

the 360 is also capable of it - i can't believe you actually said that, or that people still think that. you should spend some time on neogaf or avsforum boards where they pixel count - the PS3 has far more titles upscaled than the 360 :D :D

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

[QUOTE="EVOLV3"]PS3 is the only console that can do native 1080p.EVOLV3

lmao, no - no it's not.

the 360 is also capable of it - i can't believe you actually said that, or that people still think that. you should spend some time on neogaf or avsforum boards where they pixel count - the PS3 has far more titles upscaled than the 360 :D :D

you are poorly misinformed - but at least you replied to float this to the top so people can see you tried to claim the 360 can't do native 1080p and the PS3 was the only one that can, heh :). list your 26 games - and i'll prove you wrong again if you want another slice o' the old humble pie  :P

if you have so many games at native 1080p then why did MGS4 have to render at HALF that resolution and upscale, and why do the vast majority of ports to the PS3 have lower resolution than the 360 counterparts? why did COD4 have to be upscaled, again, at nearly half of 1080p. is it because the PS3 is such a beast in cranking out pure native 1080p?

i thought so :) 

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again.

it's because of the hardware limitations and poor ram in the PS3. they have to put the resolution down so the game doesn't stutter.

3picuri3

Hardware limitations of the PS3? WTF!!! The PS3 can handle 1080p easily, the limiting factor is the software devs. When the PS3 becomes second nature to devs, there will be no limitations.

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again. 

3picuri3

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again.

it's because of the hardware limitations and poor ram in the PS3. they have to put the resolution down so the game doesn't stutter.

chessboxer1

Hardware limitations of the PS3? WTF!!! The PS3 can handle 1080p easily, the limiting factor is the software devs. When the PS3 becomes second nature to devs, there will be no limitations.

might want to spend some time in a hardware forum, or read comments from 1st party Sony developers, or many other developers. the limitations of the PS3 have been outlined for years and people are still trying to cope with them today. this is why MGS4 renders at half of 1080p and upscales, this is why PS3 games so frequently have issues like pop-up, lack of anti-aliasing, etc.

sorry mate, it's fact. if Sony had put more RAM in the PS3 it would have been a BEAST. but they didn't. so developers have to wrestle with a system that has a critical bottleneck with a great deal of potential power.

spend some time on neogaf forums, or avsforums, somewhere other than here. if you get all your hardware info in SW you'll be poorly misinformed. 

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again. 

Teufelhuhn

I think you mean that the vast majority of PS3 games don't upscale.  Same goes for the 360.  Only a small minority are upscaled from sub-720p resolutions.

vast majority is likely an exaggeration, but it seems every game that comes out these days is upscaling for both systems. do you keep up on the neogaf pixel counting threads? because it's been a while since i've seen a blockbuster title that doesn't upscale :) 

PS3 has no scaler chip so by nature it has to do native resolutions.Timstuff

ugh. try again. you have been misinformed. 

i guess MGS4 uses magic to upscale from sub-hd then eh? :roll: 

I read it in some thread on a Gamespot board a while ago, but have also heard somewhere on the internets that GTA4 and COD4 both run at 630p on the PS3 while full 720p on 360. I can't give you a link mate.mr-krinkles

[QUOTE="Teufelhuhn"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again. 

3picuri3

I think you mean that the vast majority of PS3 games don't upscale.  Same goes for the 360.  Only a small minority are upscaled from sub-720p resolutions.

vast majority is likely an exaggeration, but it seems every game that comes out these days is upscaling for both systems. do you keep up on the neogaf pixel counting threads? because it's been a while since i've seen a blockbuster title that doesn't upscale :) 

[QUOTE="chessboxer1"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again.

it's because of the hardware limitations and poor ram in the PS3. they have to put the resolution down so the game doesn't stutter.

3picuri3

Hardware limitations of the PS3? WTF!!! The PS3 can handle 1080p easily, the limiting factor is the software devs. When the PS3 becomes second nature to devs, there will be no limitations.

might want to spend some time in a hardware forum, or read comments from 1st party Sony developers, or many other developers. the limitations of the PS3 have been outlined for years and people are still trying to cope with them today. this is why MGS4 renders at half of 1080p and upscales, this is why PS3 games so frequently have issues like pop-up, lack of anti-aliasing, etc.

sorry mate, it's fact. if Sony had put more RAM in the PS3 it would have been a BEAST. but they didn't. so developers have to wrestle with a system that has a critical bottleneck with a great deal of potential power.

spend some time on neogaf forums, or avsforums, somewhere other than here. if you get all your hardware info in SW you'll be poorly misinformed.

This RAM issue isn't an issue, developers have yet to grasp the true potential of the Cell processor, making a seemingly low amount of RAM irrelevent.

Talk is cheap anyhow, we'll see how limited the hardware is when devs come to gips with the PS3 hardware. It's too early to say it's a bottleneck.

PS3 has no scaler chip so by nature it has to do native resolutions.Timstuff

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

no - not as a rule. but the vast majority of PS3 games both exclusive and multiplat upscale from sub-HD resolutions. this has been proven time and time again.

it's because of the hardware limitations and poor ram in the PS3. they have to put the resolution down so the game doesn't stutter.

chessboxer1

Hardware limitations of the PS3? WTF!!! The PS3 can handle 1080p easily, the limiting factor is the software devs. When the PS3 becomes second nature to devs, there will be no limitations.

Don't Count on it. PS3 and 360 simply don't have the memory for it. Games that support it now are quite simple and support very few advanced graphical tecnhologies. 1080P is stressing on modern PC hardware that is much more powefull. PS3 and 360 dosn't stand a chance.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"][QUOTE="Teufelhuhn"]

 

I think you mean that the vast majority of PS3 games don't upscale.  Same goes for the 360.  Only a small minority are upscaled from sub-720p resolutions.Teufelhuhn

vast majority is likely an exaggeration, but it seems every game that comes out these days is upscaling for both systems. do you keep up on the neogaf pixel counting threads? because it's been a while since i've seen a blockbuster title that doesn't upscale :) 

then you should know that many many many titles upscale:

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=46241

hardly any titles use AA for the PS3 either. 

This RAM issue isn't an issue, developers have yet to grasp the true potential of the Cell processor, making a seemingly low amount of RAM irrelevent.

Talk is cheap anyhow, we'll see how limited the hardware is when devs come to gips with the PS3 hardware. It's too early to say it's a bottleneck.

chessboxer1

i work in software, you're just not understanding the larger issues here.

there is only as much potential as the hardware will allow - don't expect any miracle to happen that makes PS3 games suddenly a lot better than 360 games. the RAM issue is THE issue with the PS3. it's not too early to say it's a bottleneck, it's a fact mate. it's been outlined by hardware experts - it's being coped / dealt with on the software side of things. 

you have to understand that all components of a device like the PS3, which is essentially a PC, depend on eachother to perform to the their full potential. the memory limitations with the PS3 make it impossible to fully tap the potential of the cell processor - if you don't believe me then fire an email off to a professor or teacher that deals with computer science - or email your favorite developer :).  

then you should know that many many many titles upscale:

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=46241

hardly any titles use AA for the PS3 either. 

3picuri3

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

then you should know that many many many titles upscale:

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=46241

hardly any titles use AA for the PS3 either. 

Teufelhuhn

it is the minority, but if you actually go through the list it's the majority of AAA titles for both systems that upscale. the majority of titles that don't are shovelware or arcade / psn. and even psn has it's share or upscaled titles, as with xbl. 

[QUOTE="chessboxer1"]

This RAM issue isn't an issue, developers have yet to grasp the true potential of the Cell processor, making a seemingly low amount of RAM irrelevent.

Talk is cheap anyhow, we'll see how limited the hardware is when devs come to gips with the PS3 hardware. It's too early to say it's a bottleneck.

3picuri3

i work in software, you're just not understanding the larger issues here.

there is only as much potential as the hardware will allow - don't expect any miracle to happen that makes PS3 games suddenly a lot better than 360 games. the RAM issue is THE issue with the PS3. it's not too early to say it's a bottleneck, it's a fact mate. it's been outlined by hardware experts - it's being coped / dealt with on the software side of things.

you have to understand that all components of a device like the PS3, which is essentially a PC, depend on eachother to perform to the their full potential. the memory limitations with the PS3 make it impossible to fully tap the potential of the cell processor - if you don't believe me then fire an email off to a professor or teacher that deals with computer science - or email your favorite developer :).

The architecture of the cell processor is unlike any PC processor out there; so to say it's essentially like a PC is unfounded.

You work in software, so you should know that you can do amazing things with software on limiting hardware. The PS3 is still untapped potential. This RAM issue isn't an issue.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"][QUOTE="chessboxer1"]

This RAM issue isn't an issue, developers have yet to grasp the true potential of the Cell processor, making a seemingly low amount of RAM irrelevent.

Talk is cheap anyhow, we'll see how limited the hardware is when devs come to gips with the PS3 hardware. It's too early to say it's a bottleneck.

chessboxer1

i work in software, you're just not understanding the larger issues here.

there is only as much potential as the hardware will allow - don't expect any miracle to happen that makes PS3 games suddenly a lot better than 360 games. the RAM issue is THE issue with the PS3. it's not too early to say it's a bottleneck, it's a fact mate. it's been outlined by hardware experts - it's being coped / dealt with on the software side of things.

you have to understand that all components of a device like the PS3, which is essentially a PC, depend on eachother to perform to the their full potential. the memory limitations with the PS3 make it impossible to fully tap the potential of the cell processor - if you don't believe me then fire an email off to a professor or teacher that deals with computer science - or email your favorite developer :).

The architecture of the cell processor is unlike any PC processor out there; so to say it's essentially like a PC is unfounded.

You work in software, so you should know that you can do amazing things with software on limiting hardware. The PS3 is still untapped potential. This RAM issue isn't an issue.

i'm not going to continue this, feel free to read up on this stuff though and maybe next time if you're not so dismissive we'll continue the discussion :) there is no untapped power, that is a myth. if you don't realize that now you'll surely realize when this gen is over.

the cell, outside the PS3, is immensely powerful and amazing things can be done with it. most of these applications don't relate to gaming though.

and FYI there are PCs with Cell processors. It was designed for use with PCs (which just means personal computer) so again - you're misinformed. take care. 

and feel free to email developers, or just google about the PS3 ram bottleneck. it's the number one issue currently adversely affecting PS3 development. this is a fact. 

Lets say it true, how long are you going to wait for the PS3 to do amazing things???

Would you buy a car if they told you "it will go fast! but not now, you just have to wait for it.....but for now you have to pay us 100,000$"

here is your cell killer: http://www.guru3d.com/article/intel-core-i7-920-and-965-review/5

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

[QUOTE="EVOLV3"]PS3 is the only console that can do native 1080p.EVOLV3

lmao, no - no it's not.

the 360 is also capable of it - i can't believe you actually said that, or that people still think that. you should spend some time on neogaf or avsforum boards where they pixel count - the PS3 has far more titles upscaled than the 360 :D :D

I'm guessing someone didn't do his research. If you actually went to the beyond3d forum you'd know the actual number of native 1080p games is much more than 3 on the 360. 

And 3picur3 is right on another count. There are a number of games that are upscaled to 720p on the PS3 that run in native 720p on the 360. So yeah, you'll both be enjoying plenty of upscaled games as well. :D

[QUOTE="chessboxer1"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]

i work in software, you're just not understanding the larger issues here.

there is only as much potential as the hardware will allow - don't expect any miracle to happen that makes PS3 games suddenly a lot better than 360 games. the RAM issue is THE issue with the PS3. it's not too early to say it's a bottleneck, it's a fact mate. it's been outlined by hardware experts - it's being coped / dealt with on the software side of things.

you have to understand that all components of a device like the PS3, which is essentially a PC, depend on eachother to perform to the their full potential. the memory limitations with the PS3 make it impossible to fully tap the potential of the cell processor - if you don't believe me then fire an email off to a professor or teacher that deals with computer science - or email your favorite developer :).

3picuri3

The architecture of the cell processor is unlike any PC processor out there; so to say it's essentially like a PC is unfounded.

You work in software, so you should know that you can do amazing things with software on limiting hardware. The PS3 is still untapped potential. This RAM issue isn't an issue.

i'm not going to continue this, feel free to read up on this stuff though and maybe next time if you're not so dismissive we'll continue the discussion :) there is no untapped power, that is a myth. if you don't realize that now you'll surely realize when this gen is over.

the cell, outside the PS3, is immensely powerful and amazing things can be done with it. most of these applications don't relate to gaming though.

and FYI there are PCs with Cell processors. It was designed for use with PCs (which just means personal computer) so again - you're misinformed. take care.

and feel free to email developers, or just google about the PS3 ram bottleneck. it's the number one issue currently adversely affecting PS3 development. this is a fact.

Hey buddy I have a degree in computer science so don't talk down to me. Great for you, you work in software; I decided not to pursue that avenue. Went on to work for myself in a more profitable field.

The discussion was about the RAM being a limiting factor, and it's not going to be for this gen. Only time will tell, for Sony this is like water off a duck's back. I think you'll be surprised.

[QUOTE="EVOLV3"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]

 

lmao, no - no it's not.

the 360 is also capable of it - i can't believe you actually said that, or that people still think that. you should spend some time on neogaf or avsforum boards where they pixel count - the PS3 has far more titles upscaled than the 360 :D :D

The_Game21x

I'm guessing someone didn't do his research. If you actually went to the beyond3d forum you'd know the actual number of native 1080p games is much more than 3 on the 360. 

And 3picur3 is right on another count. There are a number of games that are upscaled to 720p on the PS3 that run in native 720p on the 360. So yeah, you'll both be enjoying plenty of upscaled games as well. :D

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=46241

the link to the list just in case other feel like reading up on it. interesting stuff. hopefully this dispels some SW myths that have obviously been hanging around for too long. Like:

- The Cell is untapped power!

- The PS3 is the only system that can do native 1080p

- Lazy dev excuse 

Lets say it true, how long are you going to wait for the PS3 to do amazing things???

Would you buy a car if they told you "it will go fast! but not now, you just have to wait for it.....but for now you have to pay us 100,000$"

here is your cell killer: http://www.guru3d.com/article/intel-core-i7-920-and-965-review/5

fofal

That's a stupid comparison. Cars are different from computer hardwares, which requires a good developer to use its full potential.

 3Picuri3 keeps talking about the bottleneck of the Ram on the PS3. Doesn't he know that the PS3 does have 512MB's of Ram and one 256MB Ram is faster than the 360's.  

Hey buddy I have a degree in computer science so don't talk down to me. Great for you, you work in software; I decided not to pursue that avenue. Went on to work for myself in another field.

The discussion was about the RAM being a limiting factor, and it's not going to be for this gen. Only time will tell, for Sony this is like water off a duck's back. I think you'll be surprised.

chessboxer1

buddy, you can say whatever you want - you're still wrong. did you use google? did you email any of your comp sci profs? do you understand the fundamentals of PC architecture? i find it incredibly hard to believe you have a degree in Comp Sci and can't recognize how limiting the PS3 ram is - and I can't believe you haven't read this elsewhere. Even Kojima talked about it ffs. this isn't something up for debate, it's a solid fact. the PS3 is held back by it's limited RAM, with twice the RAM the PS3 could do insane things.

sorry mate, but i know my stuff. like i said, feel free to do more research then we can continue the discussion. until then it isn't up for argument imo. 

[QUOTE="fofal"]

Lets say it true, how long are you going to wait for the PS3 to do amazing things???

Would you buy a car if they told you "it will go fast! but not now, you just have to wait for it.....but for now you have to pay us 100,000$"

here is your cell killer: http://www.guru3d.com/article/intel-core-i7-920-and-965-review/5

MaximumD

That's a stupid comparison. Cars are different from computer hardwares, which requires a good developer to use its full potential.

 3Picuri3 keeps talking about the bottleneck of the Ram on the PS3. Doesn't he know that the PS3 does have 512MB's of Ram and one 256MB Ram is faster than the 360's.   

this is clearly not the place to be arguing hardware as you all have you ideas and numbers wrong. baffles me, in this day and age, that people can't just google things and find some decent hardware breakdowns for the consoles and some hardware expert insight. 

here guys, start here, it's even a PS3 fan site: 

http://www.ps3news.com/PlayStation3/is-the-ps3-broken-ram-expansion-inevitable/

then you can move on to more technical papers if you like. either way, i'm right.  

do you think Kojima, most cows gaming guru, rendered MGS4 at sub-HD resolutions and upscaled for fun? or do you think it might have something to do with the 'limiting factors' Kojima brought up in interviews more than once. 

I'm a PC Tech at a big firm. I know a lot about hardwares and softwares. Obviously, you have no clue what you talking about because you rely on Google and not actual experience.

MaximumD

you guys could tell me you're magicians from the planet Lekzor III and you can see in to the future with crystal balls. you'd still be wrong. read the article i linked then look for some white papers on the PS3 specs if you are as tech minded as you say you are.  

i suggest google for you people to use, as it's easy and you'd quickly see how wrong you are. i have my knowledge from working in the industry and from reading numerous articles and developer interviews. i don't google my knowledge mate :). 

[QUOTE="chessboxer1"]

Hey buddy I have a degree in computer science so don't talk down to me. Great for you, you work in software; I decided not to pursue that avenue. Went on to work for myself in another field.

The discussion was about the RAM being a limiting factor, and it's not going to be for this gen. Only time will tell, for Sony this is like water off a duck's back. I think you'll be surprised.

3picuri3

buddy, you can say whatever you want - you're still wrong. did you use google? did you email any of your comp sci profs? do you understand the fundamentals of PC architecture? i find it incredibly hard to believe you have a degree in Comp Sci and can't recognize how limiting the PS3 ram is - and I can't believe you haven't read this elsewhere. Even Kojima talked about it ffs. this isn't something up for debate, it's a solid fact. the PS3 is held back by it's limited RAM, with twice the RAM the PS3 could do insane things.

sorry mate, but i know my stuff. like i said, feel free to do more research then we can continue the discussion. until then it isn't up for argument imo.

The RAM issue isn't going to be a limiting factor for the PS3, who are you making these comparisons too, the 360, the wii, the PC?

You are just making some statement, yet the PS3 will go on to be a very successful console regardless of the technicalities. I call BS on your RAM, issue, the end user isn't going to suffer.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"][QUOTE="chessboxer1"]

Hey buddy I have a degree in computer science so don't talk down to me. Great for you, you work in software; I decided not to pursue that avenue. Went on to work for myself in another field.

The discussion was about the RAM being a limiting factor, and it's not going to be for this gen. Only time will tell, for Sony this is like water off a duck's back. I think you'll be surprised.

chessboxer1

buddy, you can say whatever you want - you're still wrong. did you use google? did you email any of your comp sci profs? do you understand the fundamentals of PC architecture? i find it incredibly hard to believe you have a degree in Comp Sci and can't recognize how limiting the PS3 ram is - and I can't believe you haven't read this elsewhere. Even Kojima talked about it ffs. this isn't something up for debate, it's a solid fact. the PS3 is held back by it's limited RAM, with twice the RAM the PS3 could do insane things.

sorry mate, but i know my stuff. like i said, feel free to do more research then we can continue the discussion. until then it isn't up for argument imo.

Hey buddy I have a degree in computer science so don't talk down to me. Great for you, you work in software; I decided not to pursue that avenue. Went on to work for myself in another field.

The discussion was about the RAM being a limiting factor, and it's not going to be for this gen. Only time will tell, for Sony this is like water off a duck's back. I think you'll be surprised.

you just said the exact same thing a second time and put in a weird analogy about a duck. hows about you read the article I linked? 

here guys, start here, it's even a PS3 fan site: 

http://www.ps3news.com/PlayStation3/is-the-ps3-broken-ram-expansion-inevitable/

then you can move on to more technical papers if you like. either way, i'm right.  

do you think Kojima, most cows gaming guru, rendered MGS4 at sub-HD resolutions and upscaled for fun? or do you think it might have something to do with the 'limiting factors' Kojima brought up in interviews more than once. 

3picuri3

If the PS3 has such Ram issue, please explain to me why on earth does Uncharted looks like it can beat all X-box 360's games, except for GeOW2? Have you even seen Killzone 2 Beta yet? Dude, just give up, your articles are just a bunch of crap that spills out nonsense. You quick search it on Google, good job. Anybody can do that. 

As everyone has said before, it is really up to Developers to make games the proper way for the PS3. I can agree if you said the PS3 is hard to develop, but to say that it is already at its bottleneck is total nonsense.

[QUOTE="MaximumD"]

I'm a PC Tech at a big firm. I know a lot about hardwares and softwares. Obviously, you have no clue what you talking about because you rely on Google and not actual experience.

3picuri3

you guys could tell me you're magicians from the planet Lekzor III and you can see in to the future with crystal balls. you'd still be wrong. read the article i linked then look for some white papers on the PS3 specs if you are as tech minded as you say you are.  

i suggest google for you people to use, as it's easy and you'd quickly see how wrong you are. i have my knowledge from working in the industry and from reading numerous articles and developer interviews. i don't google my knowledge mate :). 

If you work in Software as you've stated before, then obviously you have no clue about how hardware works. I have tons of programmers and develops right outside of my office and they have no clue about hardware. Please, knowing software doesn't mean you automatically know how hardware runs.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

here guys, start here, it's even a PS3 fan site: 

http://www.ps3news.com/PlayStation3/is-the-ps3-broken-ram-expansion-inevitable/

then you can move on to more technical papers if you like. either way, i'm right.  

do you think Kojima, most cows gaming guru, rendered MGS4 at sub-HD resolutions and upscaled for fun? or do you think it might have something to do with the 'limiting factors' Kojima brought up in interviews more than once. 

MaximumD

If the PS3 has such Ram issue, please explain to me why on earth does Uncharted looks like it can beat all X-box 360's games, except for GeOW2? Have you even seen Killzone 2 Beta yet? Dude, just give up, your articles are just a bunch of crap that spills out nonsense. You quick search it on Google, good job. Anybody can do that. 

As everyone has said before, it is really up to Developers to make games the proper way for the PS3. I can agree if you said the PS3 is hard to develop, but to say that it is already at its bottleneck is total nonsense.

lmao. tell me why MGS4 had to upscale from sub-hd, or look at the long list of other AAA titles for the PS3 that upscaled. your comments are meaningless re: the ram issue though. just because a game looks great doesn't make the bottleneck disappear - it just means one developer made a good looking title with a RAM bottleneck.

i didn't say game can't be made, i said it holds them back - and makes it so PS3 titles can't have anti-aliasing, and often times have to be upscaled from lower resolutions in order to run well enough to play. fact mate.  

even Drake's was only native 720p, not 1080p. and it looks so great because of the small limited closed off environments. the less you have on screen the more resources you have to push higher resolution textures through the RAM bottleneck. 

[QUOTE="3picuri3"][QUOTE="MaximumD"]

I'm a PC Tech at a big firm. I know a lot about hardwares and softwares. Obviously, you have no clue what you talking about because you rely on Google and not actual experience.

MaximumD

you guys could tell me you're magicians from the planet Lekzor III and you can see in to the future with crystal balls. you'd still be wrong. read the article i linked then look for some white papers on the PS3 specs if you are as tech minded as you say you are.  

i suggest google for you people to use, as it's easy and you'd quickly see how wrong you are. i have my knowledge from working in the industry and from reading numerous articles and developer interviews. i don't google my knowledge mate :). 

If you work in Software as you've stated before, then obviously you have no clue about how hardware works. I have tons of programmers and develops right outside of my office and they have no clue about hardware. Please, knowing software doesn't mean you automatically know how hardware runs.

you don't have to be a genius to know how hardware works mate. i've been assembling my own PCs and networks myself since I was about 12 years old. and as a good software developer you sure as hell better know your hardware - you're probably talking about software guys that write corporate or desktop apps, or web stuff, which is totally not the same thing at all.

like i said, continue telling me whatever you like. im stating facts mate.  

[QUOTE="chessboxer1"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]

buddy, you can say whatever you want - you're still wrong. did you use google? did you email any of your comp sci profs? do you understand the fundamentals of PC architecture? i find it incredibly hard to believe you have a degree in Comp Sci and can't recognize how limiting the PS3 ram is - and I can't believe you haven't read this elsewhere. Even Kojima talked about it ffs. this isn't something up for debate, it's a solid fact. the PS3 is held back by it's limited RAM, with twice the RAM the PS3 could do insane things.

sorry mate, but i know my stuff. like i said, feel free to do more research then we can continue the discussion. until then it isn't up for argument imo.

3picuri3

Hey buddy I have a degree in computer science so don't talk down to me. Great for you, you work in software; I decided not to pursue that avenue. Went on to work for myself in another field.

The discussion was about the RAM being a limiting factor, and it's not going to be for this gen. Only time will tell, for Sony this is like water off a duck's back. I think you'll be surprised.

you just said the exact same thing a second time and put in a weird analogy about a duck. hows about you read the article I linked?

Yeah sorry GS is really mucked up for me. Really slow and buggy. that post was a mistake.

Yeah sorry GS is really mucked up for me. Really slow and buggy. that post was a mistake.

chessboxer1

no worries, having the same issues - hate the new layout and design and bugs :( 

haha, have you even played uncharted? Small environments and what? lmao@u.MaximumD

yeah, i've played the entire thing. it uses relatively small closed off environments throughout - similar to Gears of War, which is how Epic is able to put so much detail in to the models too.  

[QUOTE="MaximumD"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]

you guys could tell me you're magicians from the planet Lekzor III and you can see in to the future with crystal balls. you'd still be wrong. read the article i linked then look for some white papers on the PS3 specs if you are as tech minded as you say you are.

i suggest google for you people to use, as it's easy and you'd quickly see how wrong you are. i have my knowledge from working in the industry and from reading numerous articles and developer interviews. i don't google my knowledge mate :).

3picuri3

If you work in Software as you've stated before, then obviously you have no clue about how hardware works. I have tons of programmers and develops right outside of my office and they have no clue about hardware. Please, knowing software doesn't mean you automatically know how hardware runs.

you don't have to be a genius to know how hardware works mate. i've been assembling my own PCs and networks myself since I was about 12 years old. and as a good software developer you sure as hell better know your hardware - you're probably talking about software guys that write corporate or desktop apps, or web stuff, which is totally not the same thing at all.

like i said, continue telling me whatever you like. im stating facts mate.

So you are comparing a PS3 to a top of the range PC in 2008?

you don't have to be a genius to know how hardware works mate. i've been assembling my own PCs and networks myself since I was about 12 years old. and as a good software developer you sure as hell better know your hardware - you're probably talking about software guys that write corporate or desktop apps, or web stuff, which is totally not the same thing at all.

like i said, continue telling me whatever you like. im stating facts mate.  

3picuri3

Assembling PCs can be done by babies, we all know that, but understanding how things work is another. lol, whatever dude. Whatever makes you sleep at night. haha

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

you don't have to be a genius to know how hardware works mate. i've been assembling my own PCs and networks myself since I was about 12 years old. and as a good software developer you sure as hell better know your hardware - you're probably talking about software guys that write corporate or desktop apps, or web stuff, which is totally not the same thing at all.

like i said, continue telling me whatever you like. im stating facts mate.

chessboxer1

So you are comparing a PS3 to a top of the range PC in 2008?

He doesn't know anything about the PS3 so he's comparing it to a PC.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

you don't have to be a genius to know how hardware works mate. i've been assembling my own PCs and networks myself since I was about 12 years old. and as a good software developer you sure as hell better know your hardware - you're probably talking about software guys that write corporate or desktop apps, or web stuff, which is totally not the same thing at all.

like i said, continue telling me whatever you like. im stating facts mate.  

MaximumD

Assembling PCs can be done by babies, we all know that, but understanding how things work is another. lol, whatever dude. Whatever makes you sleep at night. haha

well one of us clearly understands and accepts the RAM issues with the PS3 while the other doesn't. I'm sure anyone that can read this thread can figure out who that person is. you can't win an argument with insults and no facts and claims of being a comp sci grad while failing to understand / admit something that has been public knowledge since 2005. something that developers reference, something that has been in numerous articles and white papers, and something that even Hideo Kojima himself referenced.

one day you'll realize i hope, and perhaps apologize :)