Is the PC really as big as all consoles combined?

So I know for a fact that I have seen data floating around System Wars insisting that the PC as a single platform is almost as big as all consoles combined, making it the single biggest gaming platform out there. A friend of mine who is interning at Disney, however, is saying otherwise. He's a PC gamer himself and a huge Valve/Steam fan but he's gotten rather snooty working for Disney it seems. Now, System Wars, is the PC the single biggest gaming platform or is it not? Do we have the pie charts to back it up? Console gamers are allowed to chime in but unless they produce data to claim otherwise, they best STFU and accept reality: PC gaming ain't dying.

Yes. Think of how many PC games GS does not review.

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

04dcarraher

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

Hexagon_777

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

Need more?

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

dontshackzmii

It's only 2.1 if you ignore PC/Mac download, or 0 if you ignore everything.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

dontshackzmii

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

dontshackzmii

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

Need more?

04dcarraher

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

dontshackzmii

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

Doesn't all PCs have GPU?themajormayor

It's likely talking independant GPU's. Many systems are sold with integrated chips.

Need more?

04dcarraher

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Need more?

themajormayor

[QUOTE="themajormayor"]Doesn't all PCs have GPU?lundy86_4

It's likely talking independant GPU's. Many systems are sold with integrated chips.

[QUOTE="themajormayor"]Doesn't all PCs have GPU?lundy86_4

It's likely talking independant GPU's. Many systems are sold with integrated chips.

[QUOTE="dontshackzmii"]

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]Oooooh, where's that from? Got more of that?

Hexagon_777

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

[QUOTE="themajormayor"][QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Need more?

Hexagon_777

What?themajormayor

Integrated chips are on the motherboard/CPU and run very little. They are essentially there for uses other than gaming (minimal GPU tasks). Independant GPUs are something like this:

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="themajormayor"] Doesn't all PCs have GPU?themajormayor

EDIT: It would appear I'm wrong.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="dontshackzmii"]

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

Rocker6

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]Why shouldn't MMOs be counted again? :?

Hexagon_777

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]Why shouldn't MMOs be counted again? :?

Hexagon_777

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

Many SW consolites aren't familiar with the term "logic"...

When discussing sales,expect a lot of "LOL MMO & RTS"...

Their sad attempt of making PC revenue seem smaller,by trying to remove as many things out of the equation as possible...

Just because MMO and RTS genres barely exists on consoles doesn't mean they're not relevant.PC lacks many JRPG games,yet no consolite tried to dispute their relevance in sales arguments...

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

dontshackzmii

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

dontshackzmii

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

EDIT: It would appear I'm wrong.

Aidenfury19

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

dontshackzmii

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

Not many MMOs today have monthly fees,and I don't see how a monthly fee=sale.

You buy the MMO copy once,that sale counts,monthly fees don't.Very simple...

However,I do agree how "facebook" games shouldn't count...

Also,going by 04dcarraher's 2010 graph,PC/Mac download/retail releases+MMO games=$7.3 million revenue or 30% of the market...

"Facebook" games not counted,but as you can see,PC can easily compete with multiple console platforms...

[QUOTE="dontshackzmii"]

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]But that is illogical. I only wish to utilize logic, otherwise there is no point in winning.

Hexagon_777

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

psn is free and psn plus can save u lots of money. xbox live is a rip off tho.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="dontshackzmii"]

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

dontshackzmii

psn is free and psn plus can save u lots of money. xbox live is a rip off tho.

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

Hexagon_777

It's from a company called Newzoo. Here's a link to the 2010 PDF:NewzooTotalConsumerSpend2010.pdf (application/pdf Object)

They've also released some 2011 data:http://newzoo.com/templates/dispatcher.asp?page_id=1589

I think part of the reason why so many people believe the PC to be far smaller is that the market has been changing rapidly over the last 2-3 years. Consoles have lost about a third of it's revenue between '09 - '11 (aprox 15 Bil to less than 8 bil) period while the PC has grown 25-30% each year. during the same period most of the PC categories have grown dramatically over the last couple of year.

To compound the confusion, the most common numbers are the NDP sales numbers, however they only cover a very small part of the PC market - they don?t include Digital sales, MMO's, Free to play, micro-transaction or Casual website.

If you look only at regular game sales (retail or digital) the PC is smaller than all consoles combined but bigger than anyone console. If you look at all game revenues, the PC is slightly bigger than all consoles added together.

Would still like to know what a guy at Disney thinks he knows....? what job is it ... Disney? really?PC360Wii

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

dontshackzmii

so its onlys 4.6 billion if you dont count all the casual and mmo krap?

[QUOTE="PC360Wii"]Would still like to know what a guy at Disney thinks he knows....? what job is it ... Disney? really?Hexagon_777

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"][QUOTE="PC360Wii"]Would still like to know what a guy at Disney thinks he knows....? what job is it ... Disney? really?PC360Wii

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

dontshackzmii

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

There have been MMOs on consoles. I doubt publishers/developers care where there money is coming from whether sales or subscription fees

Nope.

It's bigger.

[QUOTE="PC360Wii"][QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]He's an intern and his job title is Sales Planning & Retail Analytics Co-ordinator.Hexagon_777

- Game sales reports tell a different story depending on what report you read. The most common numbers tend to be the numbers that tracks retail sales only. The PC as a platform has almost disappeared from the retail market. Since the bulk of PC Gaming sales and revenues are generated through online services there are no daily numbers that give a complete picture of the games industry. Vendors like STEAM, Impulse and Origin doesn't release their sales figures and they easily account for the majority of PC games sales.

- It depends on what type of product you're looking at as well. Consoles traditionally do very well when it comes to the sales of 'normal' $60 games that are backed up by a high tier marketing and production effort. Normally 'big' titles tend to have an advantage on consoles, especially in the initial month or two post launch. However the PC does far better when it comes to smaller sales: Indie titles (without the marketing budget or ability to command good product placement in retail stores) tend to sell better on the PC, Older titles sell much better on the PC (since digital sales are not limited by the need to conserve shelf space, titles can sell for much longer on online services).

- Subscription and micro transaction revenues are almost non-existent on the consoles, while they generate huge amounts of money on the PC. Same goes for casual and social games. World of Warcraft alone generates more revenue than some small countries. Just like Kinect, Rockband and Nintendogz have generated huge sales for consoles, casual and social games generate billions in revenue for the PC, however, unlike consoles, the PC revenue is not generated through 'traditional' retail channels. Instead PC social and casual games tend to be sold on face book and through micro-transactions.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

dontshackzmii

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

Here's an example from 2010 just in the US, and has grown even more in two years, its all consoles with handhelds vs PC, its takes at least two consoles to try to even match PC's retail and DD

Mazoch

It's from a company called Newzoo. Here's a link to the 2010 PDF:NewzooTotalConsumerSpend2010.pdf (application/pdf Object)

They've also released some 2011 data:http://newzoo.com/templates/dispatcher.asp?page_id=1589

I think part of the reason why so many people believe the PC to be far smaller is that the market has been changing rapidly over the last 2-3 years. Consoles have lost about a third of it's revenue between '09 - '11 (aprox 15 Bil to less than 8 bil) period while the PC has grown 25-30% each year. during the same period most of the PC categories have grown dramatically over the last couple of year.

To compound the confusion, the most common numbers are the NDP sales numbers, however they only cover a very small part of the PC market - they don?t include Digital sales, MMO's, Free to play, micro-transaction or Casual website.

If you look only at regular game sales (retail or digital) the PC is smaller than all consoles combined but bigger than anyone console. If you look at all game revenues, the PC is slightly bigger than all consoles added together.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="Rocker6"]

Damage control,what else?

It's the same thing as if I suddenly said how JRPGs shouldn't count in console sale numbers...

They're just trying to make the PC market look smaller,it's consolite logic...

dontshackzmii

mmos should not be counted because they have monthly fees its not fair to compare it to other platforms as they don't do this. it makes it look like pc is selling more games then it is. I also don't count facebook games as pc gaming they can be done on my tablet no problem.

Whoever said that business has to play fair? It would be like a PC gamer saying that it's not fair to count 1st party exclusives because PC doesn't have this. The fact that money is being spent on the PC platform (no matter for what, MMO, Facebook, porn, etc...) means that it's money not being spent on consoles. So while you can try and say that's not a fair fight, that's just business and business doesn't care about what's fair. It cares about the money and where it's going.

Sales numbers wise? Not really. PC games have the largest potential markets though.

However, gaming revenues on the PC are now higher than on the consoles. Successful games on the PC are far more profitable than on the consoles.

Nope.

It's bigger.

topgunmv

yes, if i empty my old tower... i can squeeze my 360/ps3 in it with ease and possibly a wii as well.campzor

I was wondering when someone would say something like that. Or, "of course not, I game on a laptop".

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]

[QUOTE="PC360Wii"] In a field seperate from the gaming industry...?Mazoch

- Game sales reports tell a different story depending on what report you read. The most common numbers tend to be the numbers that tracks retail sales only. The PC as a platform has almost disappeared from the retail market. Since the bulk of PC Gaming sales and revenues are generated through online services there are no daily numbers that give a complete picture of the games industry. Vendors like STEAM, Impulse and Origin doesn't release their sales figures and they easily account for the majority of PC games sales.

- It depends on what type of product you're looking at as well. Consoles traditionally do very well when it comes to the sales of 'normal' $60 games that are backed up by a high tier marketing and production effort. Normally 'big' titles tend to have an advantage on consoles, especially in the initial month or two post launch. However the PC does far better when it comes to smaller sales: Indie titles (without the marketing budget or ability to command good product placement in retail stores) tend to sell better on the PC, Older titles sell much better on the PC (since digital sales are not limited by the need to conserve shelf space, titles can sell for much longer on online services).

- Subscription and micro transaction revenues are almost non-existent on the consoles, while they generate huge amounts of money on the PC. Same goes for casual and social games. World of Warcraft alone generates more revenue than some small countries. Just like Kinect, Rockband and Nintendogz have generated huge sales for consoles, casual and social games generate billions in revenue for the PC, however, unlike consoles, the PC revenue is not generated through 'traditional' retail channels. Instead PC social and casual games tend to be sold on face book and through micro-transactions.