Is anyone else confused about the PS5 BC implementation?

Cerny was bleating on about the top 100 PS4 games all being looked at for BC. Does that mean disc or digital or both? And what about the rest of the games?

I've bought a lot of JRPG's and other games from the PSN store a lot of stuff goes for great prices when they have a sale. What happens to all the stuff I bought digitally? Will it transfer over? It's really annoying he brushed over all this and instead prattled on about SSD for 800 hours.

I don't have any interest in a PS5 at this moment in time none of the new exclusives sell me on one but I can absolutely guarantee I won't be going anywhere near one if I lose my entire digital library of games by doing so.

They wouldn't be that stupid. Would they?

Wouldn't know... he didn't say. He spent 30 minutes talking about SSD speeds and another 30 minutes talking about 3D Audio.

Not sure why it's a struggle when MS has figured it out and any PC when you upgrade the components can still play old games. It's X86 architecture so not sure why they struggle so badly.

it's going to be real shitty if it's not fully backwards compatible with the PS4 library

From what I gathered, it's kind of like when Xbox starting doing BC. It started with certain titles and then expanded. But I think in this case, they want to be full compatible (or at least I hope).

Everyone including Sony I think.

i think they are scared to add ps3 compatibility cause then then they will have warhawk and resistance 2 and they would win the entire gen without having games for the current gen.

God knows. That whole showing was just a giant shit show.

Not confuse at all.

Fake on the PS2/3

@davillain- said:

Not confuse at all.

i do like that it has a ps4 and ps4 pro mode.

+1

No controller or system shown. What was the point, other than boasting about some numbers?

Not sure, We still dont know anything about BC because he wouldn't shut up about the fucking SSD..

In his rambling I understood that it was designed to run all PS4 games but for some reason some don't work and they are working on that.

By the way, anyone besides me thought that the public in the conference were mannequins or cardboard silhouettes until one moved?

This is what I don't understand. The PS3 was different architecture so you can see why BC was a problem for the PS4 but we're talking about AMD hardware in the PS4 and PS5 there really shouldn't be any issues.

Like you said, when I put a new CPU or GPU in my PC my games don't suddenly stop working lol. It's all a bit bizarre.

@blueinheaven: Sony’s BC solution is a complete failure.

Is the rumor of PS5 playing ps3, 2 and 1 games now dead? or Still TBA?

It's not happening. They can't even guarantee PS4 games at this point.

The best way to avoid the confusion is to keep your old consoles.

@adsparky:

Yea that's what I got out of it too. I remember the original ps4 released nd almost all games work but some titles here and there would **** up.

Either way sony need to come out and clarify.

PS3 would probably be a bitch to do BC. Emulation is probably easier. Then again, even top-tier PCs struggle to emulate some PS3 games.

PS1 and PS2, however, I dunno. Even potatoes can easily emulate these ones, and for sure Sony can easily do emulation instead of native BC on these games.

Apparently you guys didn't pay attention when Sony said it would be a deep dive into the system architecture and that it was meant as their canceled GDC talk. It was aimed at developers but released to the public.

@r-gamer: Being x86 doesn't guarantee BC when event timings are involved e.g. it breaks the original Windows 95 on fast X86 PCs.

I'm fine with Cerny's "boring" PS5 lecture.

RX 5700 XT's GCN BC mode with different cycle timings can cause driver instability. The GPU driver is just software for the direct hardware interface.

Vega Mobile has caused driver instability due to aggressive clock speed changes and power-saving tricks. It took AMD almost a year to stabilize the mobile Vega driver.

Event timers on PC are part of the C++ programming consideration.

Microsoft has the Hyper V development team to create virtual Xbox machines. If Sony is good at X86 VM, they could branch out to x86 server hypervisor services.

@davillain-: If this was true the PS5 is an automatic buy.

Faster CPU can be an issue for the original Windows 95. PS4 games are the closest "DOS64" hit-the-metal games.

Original Windows 95 breaking on faster X86 CPU is an example of "old school" programming. There's a reason for the turbo switch on 1980s x86 PCs.

PS4 Pro's PS4 BC modes are not new for gen X/gen Y X86 PC users.

It's probably gonna be as many as they can put on there initially, but it's not going to be all of them out of the box. Probably a drip feed of titles. He didn't say anything conclusive on it. As far as the systems before it, I think the dream of the all-in-one Playstation box is dead.

They don't care about the PS1 and 2 because no one is buying those games new anymore. Besides, the PS4 can't even read CDs, so I doubt they'd budget in CD read capability for PS1 games and all the PS2 games that are on CD.

@ezekiel43: Yeah, true. Also, they could always remaster PS1 games so Sony can sell them again :P

Not confused at all.

Sony is basically where MS was in the 360 territory, at least initially. They had to patch games to make the Xbox library work on X360 and they did it based on demand. Sony is doing the same thing now.

That said, it's still immensely frustrating that there was no mention of the older systems or the handhelds. But that's pretty par for the course, traditionally, for Sony.

If its "aimed" at devs when why show it to the general public then? but i'm glad they did as it makes Sony look incompetent and has just confused the public.

The best way to lose people is by word of mouth. The average gamer won't know what to make of this other than not all the games they own on the PS4 will be playable on the PS5 until?????

All i want is games like GoW, TLOU2, Ghost of Sushi to run at 60fps, increased resolution and noticeably better graphical settings. All other bc games don't interest me.

@i_p_daily: We all know it's your personal wet dream to see PS5 fail just like it has been with PS4. Everything with PS5 except what has been fully laid out is conjecture at this point. Let's wait and see until Sony clarifies.

You mean you want to insert your PS4 disc and play them at increased performance?

Or are you willing to buy remasters that run at 4K/60 for 40 bucks a pop?

@hardwenzen: If they do, you'll have to pay for them again.

What's hard to understand about Phony's BC?

Bovine Crap says it all. :P

Most of the top 100 played ps4 games will play at launch.

Others will be added later, but not all.

No ps3, ps2 or ps1 bc.

If that's not the case, then yes...I'm confused.

@blueinheaven:

I don't plan on selling or getting rid of my ps4 so I could honestly care less about backwards compatibility with ps5. I just wanna see what games it'll have to offer.

I don’t have room and my PS4 Pro is loud as hell. I wanted to replace it with the ps5. Sony shit the bed.

Not surprising, when MS announced BC with XB1 they got mocked for their efforts by Sony and gaming community. Sony was fine with their market lead. I understand PS3 BC would not be possible on PS4, their PS1/PS2 classics on other hand, totally doable, and not carrying over library and digital rights wasn't just anti-consumer, now they're playing catch-up on BC as they've not fussed with such a feature in so long. MS on other hand went through rough start with BC on XB1 and took time to improve on it and were well aware of challenges coming. For Sony though, just telling me my digital PS1/PS2 classics I bought on PS3 will be playable on PS5 and rights retained, that'll mean more (to me at least) than full PS4 BC support, probably not going to do it but if they did I would celebrate.

@blueinheaven:

https://blog.us.playstation.com/2020/03/18/unveiling-new-details-of-playstation-5-hardware-technical-specs/

Lastly, we’re excited to confirm that the backwards compatibility features are working well. We recently took a look at the top 100 PS4 titles as ranked by play time, and we’re expecting almost all of them to be playable at launch on PS5. With more than 4000 games published on PS4, we will continue the testing process and expand backwards compatibility coverage over time.

Give Sony QA team the time to play +4000 games on PS5 :P

That's interesting though I still don't see how the PS5 hardware is that different to PS4 it's still all PC parts and from the same company at that. I'm half expecting PS5 'versions' of a lot of games that you have to download and pay for again it seems more a cynical marketing ploy than a genuine incompatibility issue.

The reason MS had all that trouble converting games for BC was they were looking at games from OG Xbox and 360 that's not an issue anymore and lo and behold straight BC for Series X with every single Xbox One title. Isn't it weird how it's not an issue for MS but it is for Sony who are using practically the same hardware.

Not gonna lie, I was hoping for full BC, ps1 thru ps4.

As an example, RDNA may have GCN wave64 compatibility mode, but the instruction retirement clock cycles are different.

PS4 Pro BC mode for PS4 sounds like 1980s PC turbo mode.

https://msfn.org/board/topic/177002-15-ghz-too-fast-for-windows-95/

No PS2 maybe,PS1 impossible the PS4 can't read CD's,and some PS2 games are also CD not DVD.

Talk to me about been anti consumer when MS stop charging for free to play games which no one does.

Isn't there already a PS2 emulator that works on the PS4. That's how the PS2 classics work on PS4 ?

Couldn't they just expand on that to add nearly full PS2 bc?

I think we got this all wrong,maybe.

I have read in other forums as well and cerny claimed boost mod was to much for some games,but it say nothing about legacy,i think that the PS5 will play all games in Pro mode and normal mode,but boost mode will cause problems for some games,remember that github leak was tested at 911mhz pro,and 800mhz PS4 so why would BC mode need to run at boost clock?

I think boost refer to PS4 games been enhance by the PS5 hardware,in the same way some xbox games got enhance by the xbox one X,i think that all games will be playable at normal settings but if you want to allow for boost mode only some will work.

It would not be a first sony had filters for PS1 games on PS2 and again something like that on PS3 which you can turn on or off.

If they told us all PS4 games would work without enhancements and I could just log on to PSN with the PS5 and download my PS4 library that would be good enough for me. But they haven't said that. The big problem here is a complete lack of clarification as to how BC will work on the PS5.

If Cerny's comments about the top 100 games only refers to enhanced titles he should have made that clear as his comments have done more harm than good. I don't care about boost mode they had something similar on the Pro and it makes almost zero difference, a few extra frames here and there whoop de doo.

They also didn't explain exactly what enhancements some titles will get either. Clearly it's nothing like higher res and more detailed filtering that you get automatically on the X and Series X or I'm sure he would have been harping on about that to a large extent. I'm thinking BC just isn't a big deal with Sony it seems like something they felt forced to implement rather than a genuine desire to compete with what MS are offering.

Yes, it's confusing and not clear but, I would be fine if it were just the top 100 at launch if there's an agreed upon schedule of them releasing more approved games.

@tormentos: not arguing about disc based BC (though also totally doable), the digital library they built on otherhand is just the original game ISOs running in tandem with their respective emulators, so yes, totally doable bringing the games people bought on the PS1/PS2 classics catalog to PS4, but they didn't even try to. And much more anti-consumer not to honor people's purchases and rights than whether one needs XBL to play free to play games online.

Not even MS does that,not all xbox 360 and xbox games run on xbox one,neither on xbox series X,any game that is not supported on xbox one already will not play on xbox series X.

In fact BC on xbox one is not even BC per say,you insert a game if the game is on the list,the store download a digital version of that game,how is that BC? You are downloading a version of the game that was make to work with the xbox one,which is not the same as physically running the game from the disc like the PS2 and PS3 did.

Why would sony claim boost mode break PS4 games,when their chip was tested at 911mhz and 800mhz in legacy?

That conference wasn't for you,and i blame sony for that,it was a conference for developers,i think sony should not have done that,i think they should have done something else even if it was latter one,and clear everything,it is clear the conference wasn't for the average gamer it was for developers,which is why some developers are fun of how the PS5 turn out and somer gamers are not,while other like you will never be happy no matter what sony does or have.

This information should be a surprise. BC has been laughed at by Sony fannies and Sony viewed it as unnecessary. Now, that BC has gained significant traction with Xbox and consumers are demanding it, Sony is unfortunately caught with its pants down and is playing catch up. To make matters worse, the BC doesn't upgrade the games to use the newer hardware like on the Xbox.

I already said I'd be perfectly happy if I could download my PS4 digital games on PS5 with no enhancements which is not much at all to ask so I don't know where you get off claiming I'm difficult to please.

The conference was necessary to explain the hardware and was interesting from that point of view but useless to people who wanted to know what it will do for consumers so yeah you're right they totally messed up.

Let's be clear here I'm talking about PS4 games not PS3/2/1 it's absolutely not unreasonable to expect full support for that and Xbox One titles will have full support on Series X which is what I said in my original post which you don't seem to have read properly. I wasn't talking about 360 titles or OG Xbox.

I'll be honest and say I didn't care two hoots for BC on PS4 because I have no interest in playing games from PS1/2/3. It is relevant for PS5 because we're talking about games people are currently playing and digital is now a much bigger thing so people will have a lot of PS4/Xbox One games they bought online so if you're surprised that people are 'suddenly' now interested in BC, you shouldn't be.