What is your opinion on the war in Iraq???

I think its dumb, the Iraqi's want to blow eachother up thats fine, but we shouldn't waste our time, resources, and men their.

These groups in Iraq have been fighting eachother for a long time, maybe even hundreds, possibly thousands of years, Saddam was evil and killed millions, but he kept them in check, now that the big bad Daddie is dead, the Children will fight eachother.

I think we need to pull out. Most of our casualties are from suicide bombers, we've taken pretty minimal casualties in actual firefights, so its not like our troops failed, its just that Bush sucks.

However I still support our troops and am completely pro Military, I want to join the Marines myself and my dad wad in the MArines for 4 years and loved it, I even grew up around Camp Lajoune when I was a baby until I was 4.

Also, this war can't be for oil, we've already spent way too much on the war itself to make any money off it, and most of the oil comes from Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Russia, Canada, and South America, and of course Alaska.

So what do you think???

Only partially pertaining to the question at hand:

Iraq Article

Everyone should read and learn a little something.

it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. giton

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

it was a childish fantasy to being with.

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. NicktehImperial

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

My opinion is like most peoples, the war is Fubar. I have been saying that for a very long time, even before it was a cool thing to say. but see I dont think you Americans should leave Iraq (I am Canadian btw) and thats what makes my opinion different. I hate Bush just like every one else but you know what? America is supposed to be the land of the Winners not the land of the occupy a country and when the going gets tough leave. No matter what the cost imo you guys need to stay there.TrailorParkBoy

Well, you can say we screwed up Iraq because now that Saddam's dead, and we more "Compassionate Americans are in charge, the people are fighting eachother, but on the other hand, they'll always fight eachother anyways unless a big bad dictator is in charge.

[QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. giton

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

Yeah but I'm against the war but still love America and am promilitary. you said that you detested US troops and said Americans aren't truly free in another thread, thats different.

the american goverment is just grabing more land for its world domination empire. poor iraq did nothing but got destroyed yet china threatens to goto war with us on a montly basis and north korea wants to nuke other countrys but we do nothing.link_cloud

I'm not so sure we want world domination, but we do police the world. (Ever heard of Marine expiditionary units??? My dad was in one, the 26th MEU.)

If we wanted to rule the world, we'd probably invade a erm, better place, maybe Europe or something.

Well what can you say about the war in Iraq.. The U.S destabilized the government, didn't have a get out plan, now their stuck in the middle of a civil war (or ethnic, tribal war).. See by taking out Saddam I feel they left a power vacuum and now everyone and their dog is trying to be the pack leader..

Saddam did have to go ...I think an illegal darkops team should have just gone in and offered a nice big cash prize to the person that could take out Saddam.

Arn't you glad I'm not in power..

[QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. NicktehImperial

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

Yeah but I'm against the war but still love America and am promilitary. you said that you detested US troops and said Americans aren't truly free in another thread, thats different.

actually no, that's not what I said about US troops. I said that I approve of defensive force to whatever degree is necessary, but that I do not approve of offensive force. I said that i do not respect troops who fight in the iraq war because people are responsible for their actions regardless of orders, and anyone who is old enough to fight is old enough to know that the iraq war is wrong. that they choose to go and fight anyway shows them unworthy of respect.

it is true that Americans are not free. I don't know any country in the world where people are actually free, but my sense is that americans are more ignorant of their status as slaves than most people.

[QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. giton

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

Wow you got some pretty screwed up logic. Do you honestly think that the poor would be college students who cant afford to pay for college. fighting so they can, think for a second that this war is just? There just doing there job, if your going to blame some one blame the president and all the noobs in Washington who started it.TrailorParkBoy

He gets satisfaction in standing out. Truth be told he's prolly 13, Googling up extremest literature on the internet. It's best to just ignore such nonsense.

[QUOTE="TrailorParkBoy"]Wow you got some pretty screwed up logic. Do you honestly think that the poor would be college students who cant afford to pay for college. fighting so they can, think for a second that this war is just? There just doing there job, if your going to blame some one blame the president and all the noobs in Washington who started it.LukeAF24

He gets satisfaction in standing out. Truth be told he's prolly 13, Googling up extremest literature on the internet. It's best to just ignore such nonsense.

True, but to Trailorparkboy, the US troops aren't all guys who just can't afford college, many people want to go in the military, like ME!!! And you don't have to go to college before the military either, but they pay for it while your in.

[QUOTE="NicktehImperial"][QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. giton

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

Yeah but I'm against the war but still love America and am promilitary. you said that you detested US troops and said Americans aren't truly free in another thread, thats different.

actually no, that's not what I said about US troops. I said that I approve of defensive force to whatever degree is necessary, but that I do not approve of offensive force. I said that i do not respect troops who fight in the iraq war because people are responsible for their actions regardless of orders, and anyone who is old enough to fight is old enough to know that the iraq war is wrong. that they choose to go and fight anyway shows them unworthy of respect.

it is true that Americans are not free. I don't know any country in the world where people are actually free, but my sense is that americans are more ignorant of their status as slaves than most people.

Many U.S. troops have been killed fighting to give other people the freedoms that you have enjoyed your entire life. I don't agree with Bush's hubris and the justification offered during the preclude to the war, and I'm not so naive as to believe that U.S. soldiers are dying in direct defense of America, but they died because they believed that no man has to bow, that the Iraqis could provide a better future for their children. Anybody can fight to defend their own home, but it takes someone else to fight to try and set others free. I don't think you would ever volunteer for that, you just like to criticize in your climate control room behind your computer while others fight for what they believe in.

[QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. TrailorParkBoy

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

of course I blame the war pigs who started it too. that goes without saying, I hope. still, that doesn't absolve anyone else of personal responsibility.

[QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"][QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. xXBuffJeffXx

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

Yeah but I'm against the war but still love America and am promilitary. you said that you detested US troops and said Americans aren't truly free in another thread, thats different.

actually no, that's not what I said about US troops. I said that I approve of defensive force to whatever degree is necessary, but that I do not approve of offensive force. I said that i do not respect troops who fight in the iraq war because people are responsible for their actions regardless of orders, and anyone who is old enough to fight is old enough to know that the iraq war is wrong. that they choose to go and fight anyway shows them unworthy of respect.

it is true that Americans are not free. I don't know any country in the world where people are actually free, but my sense is that americans are more ignorant of their status as slaves than most people.

Many U.S. troops have been killed fighting to give other people the freedoms that you have enjoyed your entire life. I don't agree with Bush's hubris and the justification offered during the preclude to the war, and I'm not so naive as to believe that U.S. soldiers are dying in direct defense of America, but they died because they believed that no man has to bow, that the Iraqis could provide a better future for their children. Anybody can fight to defend their own home, but it takes someone else to fight to try and set others free. I don't think you would ever volunteer for that, you just like to criticize in your climate control room behind your computer while others fight for what they believe in.

so that is what you think they are doing? fighting to set others free? too bad it is killing so many of them. anyway if you believe that it only means you fell for the 2nd lame lie about the reasons for invading iraq rather than the first one.

First off, i can swear i already posted in this thread.

Anyway, at first i supported the war, as any patriotic person who wasn't already a flaming, anti-Bush liberal would. But then commen sense kinda took over. The war wasn't really improving the world that much, and it only made other countries look hate the US more. I have completely lost trust in my government, and i think that the administration planned the whole thing.

So i think we should take EVERYONE out of there. There is no need for 160k+ troops over there. We were able to completely neutralize Afghanistan with 20k troops, but we need over 160k for Iraq? What???

If anything needs to be accomplished, we should do it the old fasioned way, spying and sending in assassins. Although, at this point, i could care less if they blow themselves up. No country in Europe cares, why should i care?

Iraq is a tragedy. Not only for the exceptional mess in planning and execution but it entirely misplaced the effort of cutting back against the sources of terrorism.

The focus should have never left Afganistan for Iraq, and an even greater emphasis should have been placed on Saudi Arabia. A nation of atrocious human rights records and support for Islamism through various channels.

Anybody can fight to defend their own home, but it takes someone else to fight to try and set others free.xXBuffJeffXx

Because destroying a country's infrastructure and leaving its geopolitical setup in ruins is "setting them free".

I don't think you would ever volunteer for that, you just like to criticize in your climate control room behind your computer while others fight for what they believe in.

Is an Appeal to Emotion fallacy the best defense you have?

The focus should have never left Afganistan for Iraq, and an even greater emphasis should have been placed on Saudi Arabia. A nation of atrocious human rights records and support for Islamism through various channels.

If the US is going to do this, it had damn well better pursue the human rights issues Israel has been failing to keep up on as well. And no i'm not talking about the destruction of houses. To this day, Israel has failed to allow Muslims living within the country basic rights such as voting and equal protection under the law. If they were to become a secular democracy, their geopolitical situation would gradually improve.

[QUOTE="xXBuffJeffXx"][QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"][QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. giton

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

Yeah but I'm against the war but still love America and am promilitary. you said that you detested US troops and said Americans aren't truly free in another thread, thats different.

actually no, that's not what I said about US troops. I said that I approve of defensive force to whatever degree is necessary, but that I do not approve of offensive force. I said that i do not respect troops who fight in the iraq war because people are responsible for their actions regardless of orders, and anyone who is old enough to fight is old enough to know that the iraq war is wrong. that they choose to go and fight anyway shows them unworthy of respect.

it is true that Americans are not free. I don't know any country in the world where people are actually free, but my sense is that americans are more ignorant of their status as slaves than most people.

Many U.S. troops have been killed fighting to give other people the freedoms that you have enjoyed your entire life. I don't agree with Bush's hubris and the justification offered during the preclude to the war, and I'm not so naive as to believe that U.S. soldiers are dying in direct defense of America, but they died because they believed that no man has to bow, that the Iraqis could provide a better future for their children. Anybody can fight to defend their own home, but it takes someone else to fight to try and set others free. I don't think you would ever volunteer for that, you just like to criticize in your climate control room behind your computer while others fight for what they believe in.

so that is what you think they are doing? fighting to set others free? too bad it is killing so many of them. anyway if you believe that it only means you fell for the 2nd lame lie about the reasons for invading iraq rather than the first one.

Everybody is fallible. If you truly think the majority of American and coalition forces are killing civilians at will, you are pretty misguided. As much as I dislike Bush and Cheney for various reasons, I think we owe it to the Iraqi people to try and rebuild their country. A complete withdrawal now, something that you seem like you would advocate, would result in the deaths of thousands of Iraqis, and I am not willing to believe that is inevitable. I don't care what the administration says about the war, if I was sent to Iraq today I would be happy knowing that I was TRYING to help somebody else stand up.

I was against invading Iraq in the first place, but now that we've blasted the hell out of the country and sent it spiraling into civil war we do have an obligation to help put things back together. If we pull out any time soon it seems inevitable that the Iraqi government will be unable to hold the country together and a civil war will result. Any blood spilt in such a war will be on our hands.

and I'm not so naive as to believe that U.S. soldiers are dying in direct defense of America, but they died because they believed that no man has to bow, that the Iraqis could provide a better future for their children.

xXBuffJeffXx

Because destroying a country's infrastructure and leaving its geopolitical setup in ruins is "setting them free".

They're the ones who are fighting eachother and blowing EACHOTHER up, we were just dumb enough to try and help.

Everybody is fallible. If you truly think the majority of American and coalition forces are killing civilianat will, you are pretty misguided.

Where did he say that in any of his arguments? This is a strawman attack.

As much as I dislike Bush and Cheney for various reasons, I think we owe it to the Iraqi people to try and rebuild their country

Which we've been doing how well thusfar? Frankly, we oweit to them to LEAVE.

A complete withdrawal now, something that you seem like you would advocate, would result in the deaths of thousands of Iraqis,

Thousands of Iraqis are going to die regardless of what happens. Why should the US continue to strain its national budget and military power for the sake of this pointless cause?

and I am not willing to believe that is inevitable. I don't care what the administration says about the war, if I was sent to Iraq today I would be happy knowing that I was TRYING to help somebody else stand up.

Would you be happy to know you would be jeopardizing the long term position of your country in the world?

I'm still for the war. I do believe we are fighting terrorism there or at least are thwarting more unified efforts to cause terror upon the free world (Iran and Syria concentrated on insurgency in Iraq rather than funding Al Qaeda operations in the West). We removed a dictator from power which should have been removed from power a number of years ago. Though no WMDs were found in Iraq it is entirely possible they were moved to another nation. But I didn't support the war because they supposedly had WMDs, I supported it because of the monster that was Saddam.

I think you are naive if you believe we should pull out of the Middle East.

If the war were truly for oil then why is Russia still being run by a lunatic and not a US puppet government? I'm not going to defend my position because it'd be just like yelling at my wall on why its wrong to pull out of Iraq.

Everybody is fallible. If you truly think the majority of American and coalition forces are killing civilianat will, you are pretty misguided.

Where did he say that in any of his arguments? This is a strawman attack.

As much as I dislike Bush and Cheney for various reasons, I think we owe it to the Iraqi people to try and rebuild their country

Which we've been doing how well thusfar? Frankly, we oweit to them to LEAVE.

A complete withdrawal now, something that you seem like you would advocate, would result in the deaths of thousands of Iraqis,

Thousands of Iraqis are going to die regardless of what happens. Why should the US continue to strain its national budget and military power for the sake of this pointless cause?

and I am not willing to believe that is inevitable. I don't care what the administration says about the war, if I was sent to Iraq today I would be happy knowing that I was TRYING to help somebody else stand up.

Would you be happy to know you would be jeopardizing the long term position of your country in the world?

CaptHawkeye

You act as though we're the ones responsible for destroying their infrastructure, but like I said, THEY'RE THE ONES KILLING EACHOTHER!!!

Because destroying a country's infrastructure and leaving its geopolitical setup in ruins is "setting them free".

They're the ones who are fighting eachother and blowing EACHOTHER up, we were just dumb enough to try and help.

NicktehImperial

They weren't fighting eachother (or at least on a much lower level) before we came. While it is true that Saddam's regime visited a great amount of terror and violence on Iraq, the situation seems to have improved very little (if not degenerated) since he was overthrown.

Nobody is infallible, mistakes are made. I don't agree with the initial justification for war, as I said, but right now we need to try and help the Iraqis stand up. The soldiers over there today are trying to do just that, whether the strategy is sufficient is another story. As for America's foreign policy in general, don't even get me started because I have plenty of gripes. It made me sick to hear that we have engaged in a multi-billion dollar arms agreement with the Saudis. I'm not a flag beating idiot as many of you have me out to be right now, I just truly believe that the guys over there right now are fighting in an attempt to help another country. The strategy might be detrimental, as you kindly noted about the infrastructure and geopolitical situation, but the soldiers, the guys who implement the tactics, are trying to help others, irregardless of what the politicians are saying.

I think its dumb, the Iraqi's want to blow eachother up thats fine, but we shouldn't waste our time, resources, and men their.

These groups in Iraq have been fighting eachother for a long time, maybe even hundreds, possibly thousands of years, Saddam was evil and killed millions, but he kept them in check, now that the big bad Daddie is dead, the Children will fight eachother.

I think we need to pull out. Most of our casualties are from suicide bombers, we've taken pretty minimal casualties in actual firefights, so its not like our troops failed, its just that Bush sucks.

However I still support our troops and am completely pro Military, I want to join the Marines myself and my dad wad in the MArines for 4 years and loved it, I even grew up around Camp Lajoune when I was a baby until I was 4.

Also, this war can't be for oil, we've already spent way too much on the war itself to make any money off it, and most of the oil comes from Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Russia, Canada, and South America, and of course Alaska.

So what do you think???

NicktehImperial

As much as I agree with you, I also realize the solution isn't as simple as just bringing our troops home.

The Bush administration has put this country in a very sticky situation. Namely, if we pull out of Iraq now, what will stop Iran from gaining influence in the country? Surely you don't want that do you?

[QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

Because destroying a country's infrastructure and leaving its geopolitical setup in ruins is "setting them free".

They're the ones who are fighting eachother and blowing EACHOTHER up, we were just dumb enough to try and help.

morewasabi

They weren't fighting eachother (or at least on a much lower level) before we came. While it is true that Saddam's regime visited a great amount of terror and violence on Iraq, the situation seems to have improved very little (if not degenerated) since he was overthrown.

Its just that these people have been fighting eachother for hundreds, if not thousands of years!!! Saddam was evil and killed millions of his own people, but he kept them all in check.

We removed a dictator from power which should have been removed from power a number of years ago. Though no WMDs were found in Iraq it is entirely possible they were moved to another nation.
cametall

[QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

I think its dumb, the Iraqi's want to blow eachother up thats fine, but we shouldn't waste our time, resources, and men their.

These groups in Iraq have been fighting eachother for a long time, maybe even hundreds, possibly thousands of years, Saddam was evil and killed millions, but he kept them in check, now that the big bad Daddie is dead, the Children will fight eachother.

I think we need to pull out. Most of our casualties are from suicide bombers, we've taken pretty minimal casualties in actual firefights, so its not like our troops failed, its just that Bush sucks.

However I still support our troops and am completely pro Military, I want to join the Marines myself and my dad wad in the MArines for 4 years and loved it, I even grew up around Camp Lajoune when I was a baby until I was 4.

Also, this war can't be for oil, we've already spent way too much on the war itself to make any money off it, and most of the oil comes from Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Russia, Canada, and South America, and of course Alaska.

So what do you think???

PancakesNBacon

As much as I agree with you, I also realize the solution isn't as simple as just bringing our troops home.

The Bush administration has put this country in a very sticky situation. Namely, if we pull out of Iraq now, what will stop Iran from gaining influence in the country? Surely you don't want that do you?

If we pulled out of Iraq now Iran will move right in and slaughter millions of people.

Its obvious the Iranians are getting at something, I mean look at the army they're amassing...

We don't have to go to war with them, but if they are the ones who look like the bad guys, then the USA will gain more support in whatever future conflict.

[QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="xXBuffJeffXx"][QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"][QUOTE="giton"][QUOTE="NicktehImperial"]

[QUOTE="giton"]it is an unjustified invasion of another country supported mainly by flag humpers. xXBuffJeffXx

Hey I recognize you!!! Your that guy who said you detest US troops!!!

Do you detest me??? My dad??? My Grandfather??? My Great Grandfather???

not necessarily, so don't get your panties in a bunch dear. i don't respect anyone who fights in this war in Iraq because it is a sham, and anyone with a conscience and even half a brain should be able to see that without needing someone to point it out to them.

Yeah but I'm against the war but still love America and am promilitary. you said that you detested US troops and said Americans aren't truly free in another thread, thats different.

actually no, that's not what I said about US troops. I said that I approve of defensive force to whatever degree is necessary, but that I do not approve of offensive force. I said that i do not respect troops who fight in the iraq war because people are responsible for their actions regardless of orders, and anyone who is old enough to fight is old enough to know that the iraq war is wrong. that they choose to go and fight anyway shows them unworthy of respect.

it is true that Americans are not free. I don't know any country in the world where people are actually free, but my sense is that americans are more ignorant of their status as slaves than most people.

Many U.S. troops have been killed fighting to give other people the freedoms that you have enjoyed your entire life. I don't agree with Bush's hubris and the justification offered during the preclude to the war, and I'm not so naive as to believe that U.S. soldiers are dying in direct defense of America, but they died because they believed that no man has to bow, that the Iraqis could provide a better future for their children. Anybody can fight to defend their own home, but it takes someone else to fight to try and set others free. I don't think you would ever volunteer for that, you just like to criticize in your climate control room behind your computer while others fight for what they believe in.

so that is what you think they are doing? fighting to set others free? too bad it is killing so many of them. anyway if you believe that it only means you fell for the 2nd lame lie about the reasons for invading iraq rather than the first one.

Everybody is fallible. If you truly think the majority of American and coalition forces are killing civilians at will, you are pretty misguided. As much as I dislike Bush and Cheney for various reasons, I think we owe it to the Iraqi people to try and rebuild their country. A complete withdrawal now, something that you seem like you would advocate, would result in the deaths of thousands of Iraqis, and I am not willing to believe that is inevitable. I don't care what the administration says about the war, if I was sent to Iraq today I would be happy knowing that I was TRYING to help somebody else stand up.

people have a choice whether to do evil or not. initiating force against others (invading iraq) is evil.

yes, i advocate immediate and complete withdrawal. whether this would result in more or less deaths is debatable and beside the point. you don't become responsible for the welfare of others by invading them.

Everybody is fallible. If you truly think the majority of American and coalition forces are killing civilianat will, you are pretty misguided.

Where did he say that in any of his arguments? This is a strawman attack.

As much as I dislike Bush and Cheney for various reasons, I think we owe it to the Iraqi people to try and rebuild their country

Which we've been doing how well thusfar? Frankly, we oweit to them to LEAVE.

A complete withdrawal now, something that you seem like you would advocate, would result in the deaths of thousands of Iraqis,

Thousands of Iraqis are going to die regardless of what happens. Why should the US continue to strain its national budget and military power for the sake of this pointless cause?

and I am not willing to believe that is inevitable. I don't care what the administration says about the war, if I was sent to Iraq today I would be happy knowing that I was TRYING to help somebody else stand up.

Would you be happy to know you would be jeopardizing the long term position of your country in the world?

CaptHawkeye

I'm not advocating staying there indefinitely, we need to see what General Petraeus says in September and make our next move accordingly. A brazen pullout will ruin our strategic posture in the region, prestige, and create an inevitable humanitarian crisis that will, most likely, transcend international lines. That's not to mention the endemic morale loss that would accompany a quick pullout without exhausting all reasonable assets and strategies. We will never eliminate the insurgency, but it isn't impossible to suppress it to a tolerable level by giving the governmental agencies in the country time to gain legitimacy and training/equiping Iraqi forces. With that said, if the surge does fail, we need to begin a phased withdrawal because that, in my view, is the last reasonable strategy we have to offer.

I was against invading Iraq in the first place, but now that we've blasted the hell out of the country and sent it spiraling into civil war we do have an obligation to help put things back together. If we pull out any time soon it seems inevitable that the Iraqi government will be unable to hold the country together and a civil war will result. Any blood spilt in such a war will be on our hands.

morewasabi

no that is not true that any blood spilt in aggressions after pulling out will be on "our" hands. i never killed anyone in iraq. did you? you think you are responsible because your rulers sent troops to iraq?

[QUOTE="cametall"] We removed a dictator from power which should have been removed from power a number of years ago. Though no WMDs were found in Iraq it is entirely possible they were moved to another nation.
Hewkii

I agree he was the lesser of 2 evils (actually probably the lesser of quite a few evils). I still think we did the right thing in removing at least one of the many evils in the world.

Because destroying a country's infrastructure and leaving its geopolitical setup in ruins is "setting them free".

NicktehImperial

They're the ones who are fighting eachother and blowing EACHOTHER up, we were just dumb enough to try and help.

Wellllll, the point is they were not blowing eatch other up before the invasion, even though saddam was an idiot and I'm glad he's out, the place was not that bad, but now that he's out of power we have terrorists flooding in from all directions.