"My taste in music is better than yours"

I like most all music but I do have my favorites Metalcore and Glam Rock. The Only music I despise is Gangsta Rap. Some pop I like as Lady Gaga is the **** I was brought up on country and still listen to the classics from time to time. Symphony Choral is pretty epic also.

Actually, I'd be quicker to say that my taste is worse :P At least by popular opinion.

Not that I actually think anyone's taste in music is better or worse, just different.

zeldaluff

Taste is neither here nor there, but I will concede I know many people with a similar taste who are far more knowledgeable than me and whose catalogues are better than my own.

because I like better music, less people know about it, simple as that.

Im sorry then... I am an "elitist: by that definition. Taste in music is regarded to the wide range of styles and context within genres, NOT preference. With that said, I am a strong believer that artists within their field of work can be measured up against one another. Opinions can be formed to think why artist A is better than artist B and examples can be giving. Its silly that we can compare different forms of art like food and literature to form a strong argument but when it comes to music, for the sake of people not bothering to learn about it, the "its my opinion" card is pulled. That imo is more elitist than claiming to know more, and actually proving it with knowledge you have discovered yourself. Its better than being some pretend phony....

Theirs nothing wrong with claiming you have better taste than someone else, however there is a difference when you put someone down for liking it and that is just being rude.

mexicangordo

I don't know. I think saying to somebody "I have better taste than you" would seem pretty douchey. I mean, there's nothing wrong than thinking one has better taste than another person, but to actually go out there and "compare" tastes just seems kind of immature.

I don't think anybody is saying that music can't be compared to eachother within genres (I do believe that some songs are better than others for various reasons) and I like a good musical argument, but I don't think anyone should pretend that there's some kind of objectivity involved. There simply isn't. Yes, one might have a stronger argument for why they think one song is better, but at the end of the day, it is just that, an opinion.

[QUOTE="MrGeezer"]

[QUOTE="FFCYAN"]Why would music somebody else likes be better than what I like? Should I like music I don't enjoy hearing because it's "better" because another person believes what they listen to is best? That's absurd.

mexicangordo

That's only assuming that "liking something" makes it "good".

If you are ever willing to accept that someone can like something that's just plain bad, then it makes perfect sense that you'd be willing to admit that someone else's taste in music is better than yours.

But to take "liking something" out of the equation of something being "good" would be to imply that one can objectively prove something to be good, which doesn't work on any logical level.

because I like better music, less people know about it, simple as that.

iloverikku11

I don't get what "less people know about it" has to do with anything.

Apparently, people think my favorite music is just screaming. I point out that it's not just screaming, but rather a complicated process of aggressive, hard-to-maintain vocalization and range of singing, and complex and mathematical songwriting and instrumentation. They don't listen, which proves that my taste are, indeed, superior.CRS98

[QUOTE="iloverikku11"]

because I like better music, less people know about it, simple as that.

GreySeal9

I don't get what "less people know about it" has to do with anything.

well maybe not, but it shows how passionate I am about music, I am willing to explore everything and looks as hard as I can to find something I really enjoy. It may not make my music objectively better but it does show that I am passionate about music to a level most people aren't.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Im sorry then... I am an "elitist: by that definition. Taste in music is regarded to the wide range of styles and context within genres, NOT preference. With that said, I am a strong believer that artists within their field of work can be measured up against one another. Opinions can be formed to think why artist A is better than artist B and examples can be giving. Its silly that we can compare different forms of art like food and literature to form a strong argument but when it comes to music, for the sake of people not bothering to learn about it, the "its my opinion" card is pulled. That imo is more elitist than claiming to know more, and actually proving it with knowledge you have discovered yourself. Its better than being some pretend phony....

Theirs nothing wrong with claiming you have better taste than someone else, however there is a difference when you put someone down for liking it and that is just being rude.

GreySeal9

I don't know. I think saying to somebody "I have better taste than you" would seem pretty douchey. I mean, there's nothing wrong than thinking one has better taste than another person, but to actually go out there and "compare" tastes just seems kind of immature.

I don't think anybody is saying that music can't be compared to eachother within genres (I do believe that some songs are better than others for various reasons) and I like a good musical argument, but I don't think anyone should pretend that there's some kind of objectivity involved. There simply isn't. Yes, one might have a stronger argument for why they think one song is better, but at the end of the day, it is just that, an opinion.

I think thats exactly what it is, a comparison can be made however don't take my words too literal. I am just answering within the context of this thread. The point im trying to make is, taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="iloverikku11"]

because I like better music, less people know about it, simple as that.

iloverikku11

I don't get what "less people know about it" has to do with anything.

well maybe not, but it shows how passionate I am about music, I am willing to explore everything and looks as hard as I can to find something I really enjoy. It may not make my music objectively better but it does show that I am passionate about music to a level most people aren't.

Fair enough.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="MrGeezer"]

That's only assuming that "liking something" makes it "good".

If you are ever willing to accept that someone can like something that's just plain bad, then it makes perfect sense that you'd be willing to admit that someone else's taste in music is better than yours.

GreySeal9

But to take "liking something" out of the equation of something being "good" would be to imply that one can objectively prove something to be good, which doesn't work on any logical level.

taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.mexicangordo

You can't help it, people will have their opinions. I'm pretty open minded and understand what I may like nobody else likes. When I first heard Eminem the only song I heard of his (I didn't listen to the radio that much back then) was "My Name Is." I thought he was some kind ofjoke rapper based on that song and dismissed him until I heard the rest of his work. Some people will do the dismiss part and just leave it at that. I may not like metal but I have enough common sense to know people out there do like it and I'm not going to insult their taste of music. I would hope people wouldn't dismiss my taste in hip hop but the fact of the matter is that people will always act like if they don't like it then it's crap and if somebody does like it they're obviously mentally handicapped.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Im sorry then... I am an "elitist: by that definition. Taste in music is regarded to the wide range of styles and context within genres, NOT preference. With that said, I am a strong believer that artists within their field of work can be measured up against one another. Opinions can be formed to think why artist A is better than artist B and examples can be giving. Its silly that we can compare different forms of art like food and literature to form a strong argument but when it comes to music, for the sake of people not bothering to learn about it, the "its my opinion" card is pulled. That imo is more elitist than claiming to know more, and actually proving it with knowledge you have discovered yourself. Its better than being some pretend phony....

Theirs nothing wrong with claiming you have better taste than someone else, however there is a difference when you put someone down for liking it and that is just being rude.

mexicangordo

I don't know. I think saying to somebody "I have better taste than you" would seem pretty douchey. I mean, there's nothing wrong than thinking one has better taste than another person, but to actually go out there and "compare" tastes just seems kind of immature.

I don't think anybody is saying that music can't be compared to eachother within genres (I do believe that some songs are better than others for various reasons) and I like a good musical argument, but I don't think anyone should pretend that there's some kind of objectivity involved. There simply isn't. Yes, one might have a stronger argument for why they think one song is better, but at the end of the day, it is just that, an opinion.

I think thats exactly what it is, a comparison can be made however don't take my words too literal. I am just answering within the context of this thread. The point im trying to make is, taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.

Well, I assume that standards have something to do with taste, but are standards anything other than a collection of elevated opinions?

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]Im sorry then... I am an "elitist: by that definition. Taste in music is regarded to the wide range of styles and context within genres, NOT preference. With that said, I am a strong believer that artists within their field of work can be measured up against one another. Opinions can be formed to think why artist A is better than artist B and examples can be giving. Its silly that we can compare different forms of art like food and literature to form a strong argument but when it comes to music, for the sake of people not bothering to learn about it, the "its my opinion" card is pulled. That imo is more elitist than claiming to know more, and actually proving it with knowledge you have discovered yourself. Its better than being some pretend phony.... Theirs nothing wrong with claiming you have better taste than someone else, however there is a difference when you put someone down for liking it and that is just being rude.Lonelynight

That was a kinda shallow example, but it was an example as to what i mean. And i would say its one that people can understand. Now someone can come from the other prospective with other facts and "prove" why Miley is better.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"] Very well said and agreed.

mexicangordo

But to take "liking something" out of the equation of something being "good" would be to imply that one can objectively prove something to be good, which doesn't work on any logical level.

You can send me a box of Pepperoni Pizza so that I can scientifically verify that. :P

Maybe I'm being overly literal again, but isn't it true that you can't prove that pepperoni pizza is good?

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"]Im sorry then... I am an "elitist: by that definition. Taste in music is regarded to the wide range of styles and context within genres, NOT preference. With that said, I am a strong believer that artists within their field of work can be measured up against one another. Opinions can be formed to think why artist A is better than artist B and examples can be giving. Its silly that we can compare different forms of art like food and literature to form a strong argument but when it comes to music, for the sake of people not bothering to learn about it, the "its my opinion" card is pulled. That imo is more elitist than claiming to know more, and actually proving it with knowledge you have discovered yourself. Its better than being some pretend phony.... Theirs nothing wrong with claiming you have better taste than someone else, however there is a difference when you put someone down for liking it and that is just being rude.mexicangordo

That was a kinda shallow example, but it was an example as to what i mean. And i would say its one that people can understand. Now someone can come from the other prospective with other facts and "prove" why Miley is better.

Screaming, or whatever they want to call it to avoid the fact that it is screaming or growling, sucks, it has been scientifically proven. SF_KiLLaMaN

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.Lonelynight

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"]Can you give an example of how you would compare two different artist and how you determine which is better than which. LJS9502_basic

That was a kinda shallow example, but it was an example as to what i mean. And i would say its one that people can understand. Now someone can come from the other prospective with other facts and "prove" why Miley is better.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

I don't know. I think saying to somebody "I have better taste than you" would seem pretty douchey. I mean, there's nothing wrong than thinking one has better taste than another person, but to actually go out there and "compare" tastes just seems kind of immature.

I don't think anybody is saying that music can't be compared to eachother within genres (I do believe that some songs are better than others for various reasons) and I like a good musical argument, but I don't think anyone should pretend that there's some kind of objectivity involved. There simply isn't. Yes, one might have a stronger argument for why they think one song is better, but at the end of the day, it is just that, an opinion.

GreySeal9

I think thats exactly what it is, a comparison can be made however don't take my words too literal. I am just answering within the context of this thread. The point im trying to make is, taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.

Well, I assume that standards have something to do with taste, but are standards anything other than a collection of elevated opinions?

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"] Sure, Lady Gaga and Miley Cirus are two pop artist that target the same demograph. However, I strongly believe Lady Gaga is far more talented. She writes her own music, and is a classically train pianist. She likes to use 120 BPM disco which is incredible easy to listen too and makes you wanna dance, while giving a pop chorus and hooks. All that stuff is catchy and easy to remember. Aside from that she is a strong singer (you might not like her singing, but she can sing) as opposed to Miley who prefers not to write her own songs with fears of not achieving a hit, has a nasal voice in high pitches, and relies on a pop chorus to uplift her songs.

That was a kinda shallow example, but it was an example as to what i mean. And i would say its one that people can understand. Now someone can come from the other prospective with other facts and "prove" why Miley is better.

mexicangordo

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"]Im sorry then... I am an "elitist: by that definition. Taste in music is regarded to the wide range of styles and context within genres, NOT preference. With that said, I am a strong believer that artists within their field of work can be measured up against one another. Opinions can be formed to think why artist A is better than artist B and examples can be giving. Its silly that we can compare different forms of art like food and literature to form a strong argument but when it comes to music, for the sake of people not bothering to learn about it, the "its my opinion" card is pulled. That imo is more elitist than claiming to know more, and actually proving it with knowledge you have discovered yourself. Its better than being some pretend phony.... Theirs nothing wrong with claiming you have better taste than someone else, however there is a difference when you put someone down for liking it and that is just being rude.mexicangordo

That was a kinda shallow example, but it was an example as to what i mean. And i would say its one that people can understand. Now someone can come from the other prospective with other facts and "prove" why Miley is better.

But again, in that argument, you're still relying on opinions.

Like I said, I do think that one can certainly make a stronger argument for their preferred artists or song or album or whatever, but they will pretty much need to engage in tons of subjectivity to do it.

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"]taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.mexicangordo

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Conversely they can say neither is good.....why does it have to be one or the other?LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"] Then how do you determine what is good taste and what is bad? LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"] yea it is douchy, and I wouldnt do it. That is what my last sentence is for, I mean who actually compares taste to one another on a casual basis? Nobody does! (well i do that with my music friends sometimes only cause we are music geeks) :P

I think thats exactly what it is, a comparison can be made however don't take my words too literal. I am just answering within the context of this thread. The point im trying to make is, taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.

mexicangordo

Well, I assume that standards have something to do with taste, but are standards anything other than a collection of elevated opinions?

By "elevated opinion", I mean that musical standards are not objective, but are rather opinions that are given alot of clout. They rely on people getting together subjectively defining said standards. So whle a certain kind of film might be considered good "taste", it's only considered good taste because of very subjective standards.

Beh you took that out of context. I can tell you why I think The Smashing Pumpkins are better than Radiohead (just an example...) but how would we argue that? By stating facts against eachother, and at the end of the day, we will still listen to whatever we enjoy, regardless if its "bad" or not. These are all extream cases i will say. :Pmexicangordo

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"] Beh you took that out of context. I can tell you why I think The Smashing Pumpkins are better than Radiohead (just an example...) but how would we argue that? By stating facts against eachother, and at the end of the day, we will still listen to whatever we enjoy, regardless if its "bad" or not. These are all extream cases i will say. :P

mexicangordo

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"] Then how do you determine what is good taste and what is bad? LJS9502_basic

And it further comes down to preference as one might not find either band to be particularly good at their craft.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

Well, I assume that standards have something to do with taste, but are standards anything other than a collection of elevated opinions?

GreySeal9

By "elevated opinion", I mean that musical standards are not objective, but are rather opinions that are given alot of clout. They rely on people getting together subjectively defining said standards. So whle a certain kind of film might be considered good "taste", it's only considered good taste because of very subjective standards.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] In this example I'd imagine both bands are talented and good at their craft. Which is preferred comes down to preference though....LJS9502_basic

And this phrase exemplifies why I was arguing a while ago that talent is subjective.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]Sure, Lady Gaga and Miley Cirus are two pop artist that target the same demograph. However, I strongly believe Lady Gaga is far more talented. She writes her own music, and is a classically train pianist. She likes to use 120 BPM disco which is incredible easy to listen too and makes you wanna dance, while giving a pop chorus and hooks. All that stuff is catchy and easy to remember. Aside from that she is a strong singer (you might not like her singing, but she can sing) as opposed to Miley who prefers not to write her own songs with fears of not achieving a hit, has a nasal voice in high pitches, and relies on a pop chorus to uplift her songs. That was a kinda shallow example, but it was an example as to what i mean. And i would say its one that people can understand. Now someone can come from the other prospective with other facts and "prove" why Miley is better.Lonelynight

Beh you took that out of context. I can tell you why I think The Smashing Pumpkins are better than Radiohead (just an example...) but how would we argue that? By stating facts against eachother, and at the end of the day, we will still listen to whatever we enjoy, regardless if its "bad" or not. These are all extream cases i will say. :Pmexicangordo

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"] Thats totally fair...BUT again, to answer the things that have been asked within this thread, and give extream cases (which ive been saying all day long) If one were to compare, facts would be provided rather than "my opinon."

GreySeal9

And this phrase exemplifies why I was arguing a while ago that talent is subjective.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] In this example I'd imagine both bands are talented and good at their craft. Which is preferred comes down to preference though....LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] Oh I don't deny that talent varies amongst musicians...though in this example I'd not say either band was more talented than the other.LJS9502_basic

And this phrase exemplifies why I was arguing a while ago that talent is subjective.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"] Im not so sure what elevated opinion means...Im assuming its the same as our "douche" example, which is a different situation in general.

mexicangordo

By "elevated opinion", I mean that musical standards are not objective, but are rather opinions that are given alot of clout. They rely on people getting together subjectively defining said standards. So whle a certain kind of film might be considered good "taste", it's only considered good taste because of very subjective standards.

I do, on some level, understand what you're saying. I think an intelligent person should, except in extreme cases, be able to figure out why somebody likes something instead of simply write it off because they don't care for it.

On the other hand, while I love The Beatles to death (I have all their records), if somebody said The Beatles are not a good band, I don't see how I could prove them wrong. I could potentially argue with them and make a much better case them them, but I couldn't actually prove their premise that The Beatles are not good wrong.

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"]taste can be determined (if it came down to that) and opinions only go so far.mexicangordo

No, an extreme case would be comparing Vanilla Ice to Mozart.

Or comparing a Big Mac to a Filet Mignon.

It certainly gets HARDER to state which one is objectively better, once the two things start becoming similar in quality. But some things are just plain BAD, period. I might like Hot Pockets, but it's simply bad food regardless of if I like it. Wanna prove that there's objectivity, then compare the WORST of the worst to the BEST of the best.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"] Thats totally fair...BUT again, to answer the things that have been asked within this thread, and give extream cases (which ive been saying all day long) If one were to compare, facts would be provided rather than "my opinon."

mexicangordo

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] Oh I don't deny that talent varies amongst musicians...though in this example I'd not say either band was more talented than the other.LJS9502_basic

But now you are getting at something totally different. I feel like I am being incredible redundant since Ive been reapting the same things over and over so I'll just directly answer that question. Being good is universal isnt it? I mean you might not like The Beatles, but you can still respect what they have done? Right? Or you might not like Pizza ( ) but you might be able to see why others enjoy it, right? Again it might not be the case for everything but...Do you kinda see what im saying?mexicangordo

Lonely Night you like those *** pop bands right? like the Brown Eyed Girls. Do you know what they're saying?Tetrarch9

Thats just being rude. Just to give someone the chance to be better than someone else. I would say that it would be elitism or them being doucheymexicangordo

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

By "elevated opinion", I mean that musical standards are not objective, but are rather opinions that are given alot of clout. They rely on people getting together subjectively defining said standards. So whle a certain kind of film might be considered good "taste", it's only considered good taste because of very subjective standards.

GreySeal9

I do, on some level, understand what you're saying. I think an intelligent person should, except in extreme cases, be able to figure out why somebody likes something instead of simply write it off because they don't care for it.

On the other hand, while I love The Beatles to death (I have all their records), if somebody said The Beatles are not a good band, I don't see how I could prove them wrong. I could potentially argue with them and make a much better case them them, but I couldn't actually prove their premise that The Beatles are not good wrong.

Geezus, finally someone else....mexicangordo

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="mexicangordo"] Yea, maybe a comparision of Queen and Lady Ga Ga would have been better :P

Nibroc420

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] Oh I don't deny that talent varies amongst musicians...though in this example I'd not say either band was more talented than the other.LJS9502_basic

And this phrase exemplifies why I was arguing a while ago that talent is subjective.

But what I'm arguing is that objectivity can't really exist when judging talent because it is ultimately a judgment.

Objectivity can only exist in regard to facts in their purest form, not any kind of judgment.

If talent was objective, you would be able to have some kind of objective process by which to determine which band is more talented.

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] You know how to wound.:x Queen was the more talented.....LJS9502_basic