Tales of Symphonia....

...sure as heck is AWESOME! I find it to be beautiful, well written and acted and just as engrossing and fun to play as the gound breaking life-altering first game. So in short; the polar opposite of everything Daemon "I hate video games" Hatfield from IGN lol.

Now I know this is only my opinion and someones going to say I don't have the right to complain to complain about one reviewers opinion. To that I say A) you are correct. And B) I really don't care. The game rocks, Dameon's a fool hehe. The bottom line here is sharing how much I love the game with others who i hope feel the same way. The general response seems to be that most of us like it. I'm early on and can't get over how Lloyd "appears" to be evil. CRAZY! I can't wait for the real plot twists to start. What does everyone else think?

So in short; the polar opposite of everything Daemon "I hate video games" Hatfield from IGN lol ... Dameon's a fool heheDarth-Samus

The guy that wrote that IGN review is a total HD hype tool and graphics ho.Bigboi500

[QUOTE="Darth-Samus"] So in short; the polar opposite of everything Daemon "I hate video games" Hatfield from IGN lol ... Dameon's a fool heheclicketyclick

The guy that wrote that IGN review is a total HD hype tool and graphics ho.Bigboi500

 
If you read IGN's review, then you'll notice he's just bashing JRPGs in general, and barely tackles TOS2 as a game.  His review is really no different than the above posts. 

If you read IGN's review, then you'll notice he's just bashing JRPGs in general, and barely tackles TOS2 as a game. His review is really no different than the above posts.zh666

I don't see how you can conclude that. Don't make me look for half an hour in order to produce a bunch of JRPGs that he's given high ratings to in order to disprove you. You know I can, so it's a waste of time.

[QUOTE="zh666"]If you read IGN's review, then you'll notice he's just bashing JRPGs in general, and barely tackles TOS2 as a game. His review is really no different than the above posts.clicketyclick

I don't see how you can conclude that. Don't make me look for half an hour in order to produce a bunch of JRPGs that he's given high ratings to in order to disprove you. You know I can, so it's a waste of time.

How are review scores of JRPGs going to disprove anything? It would probably just prove my point further. 

How many hours does this game take to beat?dylanmcc

I'm 30 hours into the 5th chapter, with 55% of the skits completed (to give you a good idea).  I've done all the sidequests though, so that's why my time is so large.  I'm sure after it's all said and done, it will be a 50-60 hour game for me.  If you don't do sidequests, then it might be a 30-40 hour game maybe. 

[QUOTE="clicketyclick"]

[QUOTE="zh666"]If you read IGN's review, then you'll notice he's just bashing JRPGs in general, and barely tackles TOS2 as a game. His review is really no different than the above posts.zh666

I don't see how you can conclude that. Don't make me look for half an hour in order to produce a bunch of JRPGs that he's given high ratings to in order to disprove you. You know I can, so it's a waste of time.

How are review scores of JRPGs going to disprove anything? It would probably just prove my point further. 

That he likes JRPGs and he's not "just bashing JRPGs in general". It's because of aspects of ToS2 specifically that he gave it a lower score, not because he doesn't like JRPGs.clicketyclick

I could only find three JRPG reviews from him, Tales (6.7), Opoona (6.8) and Away Shuffle Dungeon (6.1). If you can find anymore, go ahead and post them.

Anyways, Daemon Hatfield has never played a Tales of... game in his life. Specifically, he has never played Tales of Symphonia before. Dawn of the New World is aimed for fans of Tales of Symphonia. Would you make someone review Baten Kaitos Origins, Xenosaga II or Final Fantasy X-2 if they didn't play the original Baten Kaitos, Xenosaga or Final Fantasy X? It wouldn't make sense to them.

Daemon Hatfield doesn't know what makes a Tales of.. game great. He doesn't know what people expect and want from a Tales of.. game.

Tales of Symphonia: Dawn of the New World is a run of the mill, standard JRPG without a single original idea in its head.
--- Yet, this is a far more progressive as an RPG than Tales of Vespira which got an 8.2

An awkwardly translated, incomprehensible story? Check.
--- There is nothing awkardly translated about the dialog or story. The story is only incomprehensible because you never played the original game.

The story is some **** about the world falling into ruin and this spineless little coward named Emil is somehow the only one who can set things right.
--- Yeah, he missed the point of the story OR he didn't play past the 5 hour mark.

Players are supposed to keep track of things like the Chosen of Regeneration, a Blood Purge, a Great Tree, the Giant Kharlan Tree, a new World Tree… It's all just fancy window dressing for what is really a mundane adventure.
--- Once again, if he had played the original game then he would know what all of that is. The Blood Purge is the ONLY new term used in this game.

While the script is not that interesting to begin with, it's also been clumsily translated so that dialogue often just barely makes sense. What is this, amateur hour? It's possible that, in many of these instances, there simply isn't an easy translation from the original Japanese. But that doesn't make it any easier to sit through.
--- It's funny out of all the reviews out, most have praised the translastion or localization of TOS:DOTNW. The localization is AMAZING in this game.

Emil has to be the lamest "hero" ever. When in battle he does grow a pair, but for the rest of the game he shuffles around whining and apologizing.
--- I wonder how much he actually played because after the a while Emil starts to struggle with a split persoanlity. One personality is an exatratted wuss, while the other is a straight to the point badass.

Most of the folks you meet along the way suffer from a similar lack of depth.
--- like Richter? Alice? Bullcrap dude.

It's also very linear. The game leads players by the hand from location to location without any choice on their part. We are told where to go next to move the story along -- sure, we could go back to the town we were just at, but there's nothing to do there.
--- Actually, if he played the game for more than a few hours, then he would know if you backtrack to previous towns you can unlock sidequests.

Even weapons and armor is acquired linearly. Each new town will have the next level of equipment in stock, so there isn't any choice of what to use.
--- Sure, I get his point, but he forgot to mention the Synthesis elements to the game. While stores sell basic equipment, you can build even better weapons with loot you gathered from dungeons. This offers a bit of strategy with your weapons or a bit of non-linearity to them, however he puts it. You have complete "freedom" on your choice of weapons and armor.

The "skits" return here, where anime versions of our characters face the player and share a brief conversation. While these provide some good information, they aren't exactly animated.
--- Yeah, they're barely animated in Tales of Vespira, and no one complained, so what? They're alot more animated than the original Tales of Symphonia, or even Legendia and Abyss

If Dawn of the New World had come out 10 years ago, it would have been pretty impressive. But 10-year old gaming conventions don't make for an engrossing RPG today. This game's biggest crime is that it's commonplace.
--- aka "JRPGs are lame now"

Anyways, Daemon Hatfield has never played a Tales of... game in his life. Specifically, he has never played Tales of Symphonia before. Dawn of the New World is aimed for fans of Tales of Symphonia. Would you make someone review Baten Kaitos Origins, Xenosaga II or Final Fantasy X-2 if they didn't play the original Baten Kaitos, Xenosaga or Final Fantasy X? It wouldn't make sense to them.

Daemon Hatfield doesn't know what makes a Tales of.. game great. He doesn't know what people expect and want from a Tales of.. game.zh666

If Dawn of the New World had come out 10 years ago, it would have been pretty impressive. But 10-year old gaming conventions don't make for an engrossing RPG today. This game's biggest crime is that it's commonplace.
--- aka "JRPGs are lame now"

zh666

I agree it rocks. The guy that wrote that IGN review is a total HD hype tool and graphics ho. Hopefully GS will give it a well deserved 8.0 or higher.Bigboi500

At this point if IGN rates a Wii game below a 6 its a first day purchse lol.firefox59

Haha! As much I still ove and (sometimes) trust IGN I tend to think that is hilariously a true statement lol. Well said sir.

Actually this thread has revived my hype for the game, i know that i shouldnt entirely trust on a review or and opinion, but my hype went down with this review, not to much, but enough to let it pass until a price drop, now i really want it for this season.madsnakehhh

Yeah man. It really and truly is a great game. If you enjoyed the first or and jrpgs or the Tales series you'd be a fool not to buy it. It's such a well written and fun game. A great job of continuing the original's great story. And I find it to be a pretty game too. I think the only reason anyone could complain about the graphics is that some of the plot exposition moments are just told through the in-game world instead of movies. the moments told throughan acted out sequence are great and the character models and animations are excellent! Please go buy and enjoy :)

You guys need to stop reviewing peoples reviews of games and get over the fact most people think ToS2 wasn't that good.Wa-Ryan

No. No...we don't.

You guys need to stop reviewing peoples reviews of games and get over the fact most people think ToS2 wasn't that good.Wa-Ryan

If a review was bad and will, unchallenged, turn people away from a game that they would enjoy, people should be aware of that. I see nothing wrong with talking about it.  Far from most people thinking that it wasn't that good, pretty much everyone who's posted here to talk about it has said that the game is way better than the review says.

I am a huge RPG fan, however, I have never played a Tales game before. Would I have to play the first Tales of Symphonia in order to understand this one?MasonB15

It would probably help with the exact details of what happened (and honestly, I'd recommend it, as the first Tales of Symphonia is an awesome game), but the second one does a pretty good job of summarizing exactly what happened in the first. That said, a lot of characters in the first one reappear in the first, and you won't have the attachment to them formed by playing the first, so I imagine it probably wouldn't quite be the same.

Bottom line, get the first one first if you can. ;)

[QUOTE="MasonB15"]I am a huge RPG fan, however, I have never played a Tales game before. Would I have to play the first Tales of Symphonia in order to understand this one?GabuEx

It would probably help with the exact details of what happened (and honestly, I'd recommend it, as the first Tales of Symphonia is an awesome game), but the second one does a pretty good job of summarizing exactly what happened in the first. That said, a lot of characters in the first one reappear in the first, and you won't have the attachment to them formed by playing the first, so I imagine it probably wouldn't quite be the same.

Bottom line, get the first one first if you can. ;)

 I've been looking for the first one every time I go to Gamestop. I guess I'll wait a little while to see if I can find it. Thanks!

I've been looking for the first one every time I go to Gamestop. I guess I'll wait a little while to see if I can find it. Thanks!

MasonB15

No problem.

You might try somewhere like Amazon - the internet tends to be a much better place than brick-and-mortar stores to find old games from several years ago.

[QUOTE="MasonB15"]

I've been looking for the first one every time I go to Gamestop. I guess I'll wait a little while to see if I can find it. Thanks!

GabuEx

No problem.

You might try somewhere like Amazon - the internet tends to be a much better place than brick-and-mortar stores to find old games from several years ago.

I might have to reluctantly go that option.

Sorry about hijacking this thread ;)

[QUOTE="Wa-Ryan"]You guys need to stop reviewing peoples reviews of games and get over the fact most people think ToS2 wasn't that good.GabuEx

If a review was bad and will, unchallenged, turn people away from a game that they would enjoy, people should be aware of that. I see nothing wrong with talking about it.  Far from most people thinking that it wasn't that good, pretty much everyone who's posted here to talk about it has said that the game is way better than the review says.

"Talking" (most people I've seen have just ripped up the reviewer/organization and complain) about the reviews have not convinced me that ToS2 (or other games) is any better than most critics are saying, but rather leave me disgusted with some of the users mentalities on these forums: "if a game I think will be good gets a bad review the reviewer/website is stupid!" I would never buy a game that gets mediocre reviews on multiple sites, I don't care if I'm missing out on a game that despite the odds is actually great. Games are expensive, I am missing out on tonnes of other amazing games too. If I'm gonna drop 40-60$ on a game it's gonna be one that gets amazing scores on multiple sites (9+ preferably). And this system works great, I've never been dissapointed with a game that gets these great scoresWa-Ryan

Have you played ToS2, or are you just assuming that it's bad and that we're playing sour grapes? I've played the game for quite a while now and I can say in no uncertain terms that I think the IGN reviewer was totally out to lunch, saying things that are, really, as far as I'm concerned factually inaccurate. If a person hears something about a game that is totally false, and that makes the person pass up a game that he or she would have enjoyed, that is bad. The bad part comes in treating game reviews as sacred gospel and elevating the opinions of reviewers above the opinions of everyone else.

I buy games that get mediocre reviews often, on account of the fact that I don't just look at the score; I look at the game itself, its premise, gameplay, and whatnot; I look at what other players are saying; and so on. A review is just one guy's opinion of the game, no better than anyone else's. There isn't anything particularly special about a critic; they just happen to be people who are lucky enough to get paid to really just tell other people what they think about stuff.

I've written over 120+ user reviews, and I only gave 10 games over a 9.0. I plan on reviewing TOS2 when I get done with it (i put 53 hours into it so far). I'll probably give it a soild 8.0. Maybe a 7.8 if the old school scale was in effect. I'm not overhyping this game, I'm not saying this is the greatest RPG ever made. I don't think anyone here is overhyping it. I just think the reviewers are being extra harsh on it for little reason.

Would I put 53+ hours into a game that could be beaten in 30 hours if I didn't enjoy it? That's my biggest endorsement. zh666

I've been playing it since the 15th and I'm 27 years old.  School?

Games I scored a 9.0 or over:
Tales of Symphonia
Final Fantasy VII
Final Fantasy XII
Final Fantasy Tactics
Resident Evil 4
Paper Mario
Paper Mario and the Thousand Year Door
Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
Legend of Zelda: Windwaker
Dragon Quest VIII

I was snooping on the IGN's board to see what that community had to say about the review.. they're not the brightest bunch but that thread did bring out the IGN reviewer. This is all he says though.. what the hell...

zh666

I never called the reviewer stupid, but I do question how many hours she put into the game. If you actually played the game, and then read the Gamespot or IGN review, then you'll would see what we see.zh666

I was snooping on the IGN's board to see what that community had to say about the review.. they're not the brightest bunch but that thread did bring out the IGN reviewer. This is all he says though.. what the hell...

zh666

The reviewer is male (Shiva is the Hindu god of destruction and a name given to boys. In the famous book Midnight's Children, a main - male - character is named Shiva.) Your question is pretty much an unfounded accusation. All reviewers play all the way through games. If you have evidence that he didn't, then present it. But just because he tries not to give plot spoilers beyond the beginning of the game doesn't mean he didn't do his job. It's a serious accusation. If it's true, it could get him fired. But you seem to toss it around so lightly and speculatively.clicketyclick

Have you played the game, Clicket? 

But you don't have the proof like the 360 thing, so you can't be sure and you can't compare it to that. And if by the online shooter review you're talking about Socom, the site (IGN I think it was) explained that they gave the game a couple weeks to get the online running, but it didn't get up even then, and the site's policy is to review the game as it is upon release. Standard policy.

I never claimed he played 100%. I said reviewers are supposed to play all the way through, as in, complete the game. If they don't and still write the review, they can be fired. This is what Gerstmann was allegedly fired for doing. I'm going to guess that he spent 30 hours playing the game, because that's the time he says it takes to get through it.

The reason I believe HE didn't play more than a few hours is because HE had to level grind. Only the first few hours of Tales of Symphonia 2 are hard but the game eventually levels out and becomes rather easy.zh666

And even if he only had to grind at the beginning, it still makes the statement true that he had to grind in the game. No problem here.

(By the way, it does depend on your skill level. A bunch of people told me that FFIV doesn't require grinding like FFIII does. Yet I had to grind quite a bit before some of the boss-like fights all the same so as not to just barely survive the fight with only one char left standing. It also depends on whether you want to do all the optional sidequests.)

He also says that the Human characters that join your party are so much stronger than the monsters that join your team, which is false. The human characters are level capped, but your monsters grow at a high speed. If HE put more than 6 hours into the game, then all his monsters should probably have double the level of the humans, with more skills.zh666

And even if he played for 30 hours, it still is true that the party is much stronger than the monsters joining the team, because when they join the team, they are much weaker.

He also complains about the heavy amount of cutscenes. I agree with him, there are a ton of cutscene at the start of the game. My point about the cutscenes though is they're really heavily used at the beginning of the game. They're setting up the characters, you barely do anything in the first chapter because there are a TON of cutscenes. After the 2nd chapter the game starts to put more focus on fighting and dungeon crawling.zh666

And even if he played till the end, it's still true that there's a lot of cutscenes in the game that arguably disrupt the flow of gameplay.

Basically, a flaw in the first part of a game is still a flaw in the game, and warrants mentioning. That he mentions these flaws isn't proof that he didn't play for more than a couple of hours.

I was snooping on the IGN's board to see what that community had to say about the review.. they're not the brightest bunch but that thread did bring out the IGN reviewer. This is all he says though.. what the hell...

zh666

IGN should have been more professional and let someone review the game that understands these differences. And GS should not have used some free-lance reviewer that no one knows anything about and does not even have a GS account for goodness sake. For all we know he could be some Sony pr man lol.

That right there pretty much proves my thoughts about him all along. He's trying to hold niche JRPGs to the technically superior WRPG standard which is a fallacy in and of itself. People that are interested in JRPGs in the first place are not necessarily tech loving WRPG fans that care about graphics and technical prowess.
Bigboi500

Mass Effect's (and other WRPGs) innovations aren't just graphical and technical. In fact, Mass Effect has relatively weak graphics, compared to other games this gen.

Some standards are global, not local to the West or to Japan. For example, regardless of your graphical styIe, try to minimise jaggies and try to show some new ideas. 

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]That right there pretty much proves my thoughts about him all along. He's trying to hold niche JRPGs to the technically superior WRPG standard which is a fallacy in and of itself. People that are interested in JRPGs in the first place are not necessarily tech loving WRPG fans that care about graphics and technical prowess.
clicketyclick

Mass Effect's (and other WRPGs) innovations aren't just graphical and technical. In fact, Mass Effect has relatively weak graphics, compared to other games this gen.

Some standards are global, not local to the West or to Japan. For example, regardless of your graphical styIe, try to minimise jaggies and try to show some new ideas.